My Friend Quit

Androconium · October 2018

tmbrinks wrote: »

JimmyJuJu wrote: »

Let's compare the personas in high-end, "elitist" trial groups to the animals you might find in the corporate world:
Sharks (who will eat you)

Snakes (who stab you in the back)

Weasels (who take credit for your work)

Lemmings (who do what everyone else is doing)

Eagles (who are better than everyone)

Deer (who have no clue)

Mules (who carry the load)

Take a moment to identify your role in the "team".

P.S. Feel free to add other personas to the list.

That's pretty pessimistic. Where's your animal for the person who are excellent at what they do, encourage their team members, don't steal credit, don't stab you in the back.

dead horse

DPShiro · October 2018

Sounds like a learn 2 play issue to me.

newtinmpls · October 2018

moonio wrote: »

Also how much is the toxicity due to poor server performance making playing at a high level almost impossible, plus the seeming neglect of quality of life upgrades by the developers?

None.

The player is not able to control what the game/server/lag is doing.

The player is able to control what the player is doing.

Toxicity is what the player chooses....or doesn't chose

itehache · October 2018

I am sorry your friend quit but if you just don't enjoy end game vet content you do not have to play it. This game has so many different options

BRogueNZ · October 2018

People who like to excel are passionate and driven and part of that for a few, to a fault, and being less tolerant of or even polite to anyone who doesn't have the same skill level, dedication or attitude. They also like to surrounded by admirers and yes men and fu to anyone outside the circle.

In game as in real life.

I understand how your friend feels, at some point competing can become less fun. The fact that people are driven and passionate etc means they are also prone too completely losing the plot and belittling anything they see as beneath them.. and you're supposed to tolerate that or tolerate seeing other people treated that way. :puzzling:

We all have at some point in time, like at school for example, because it's a means to an end, we need to be motivated to achieve anything thing at all or simply want to be successful and that means tolerating a few um.. backside's

Plenty more games in the sea

Peekachu99 · October 2018

PC Trials community is filled with egomaniacal twits and a few exemplars like Hodor and that’s about it. The grass is not greener, sorry. Bad players are well distributed across all platforms. And no, not everyone uses Discord on PC.

If you want to do away with elitism (somewhat), we need a Trial Finder. The time to even organize a raid is only undertaken by certain personalities—most people don’t have the inclination for that and that doesn’t mean they’re bad or incapable of the content.

sevomd69 · October 2018

tmbrinks wrote: »

There are certainly toxic people in the game (in all facets, pve, pvp, housing, merchants, everything). Just as there are toxic people you will meet in real life. You will work with toxic people, have friends that turn toxic, date people who are toxic. Learning to deal with the OCCASIONAL toxicity from people in your life is an important skill to learn, because you WILL deal with it. How you react will influence how the toxicity moves. For most people, once they see it doesn't affect you, they'll stop. Other, are just jerks and will continue to do so. YOU (ONLY YOU) need to make the choice on if running that content, being in that end-game pve groups, or that structured pvp group, or that housing guild, or that trading guild, or doing that thing is worth what they are saying/doing.

I also agree with what a majority of people have said. As somebody who is probably on the older end of players (certainly above the mean), and somebody who spends his RL job teaching people, most people have a massive issue with taking any sort of criticism, whether it's constructive, or non-constructive. Now, are there people who are bad at giving advice, and helping people out, yes. Most people are BAD at it, because it's an acquired skill, it takes practice, and frankly a lot of the end-game raid community is full of 20 year olds, who don't have a lot of life experience in leadership roles, so you have to give them some leeway if that is the case.

Are there jerks, yes, and you just need to separate the two, and make the choice on what is right for you.

I think the point being...since there are toxic people irl...I would prefer not to interact with toxic people in a video game...

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO · October 2018

you know I dont have a problem with endgame demand and guilds that demand from their players...I have an issue that a lot of people dont want to give anything but complain and quit without even trying...you know what? good thing he left and all others who did...it means they couldn't take it...yes its hard now than 4 years ago to find capable people and complete trial achievements since right now there is only a handful of selected few who are doing it and getting inside those guilds its impossible even if u are a monster player...if you try to start something urself you will want to shoot yourself cuz its almost impossible to find able people who are willing to 1. comprehend the game mechanics and 2. spend some time and try to have fun instead of complaining.

also forgot to say this:
when you walk towards the quitters door, remember me and watch this on your way out.

DanteYoda · October 2018

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

P.S sorry that hear they left. I hope they return one day.

If they made it so everyone and every class could do it more would do it, less epeen more team work..

That is a real issue here in ESO, they need to stop aiming everything to a small minority that do not coincide with the rest of the population..
Just look at these coming nerfs, they had very little to do with the masses which they will hurt the most and and not really hurt the ones they were designed for much at all.. Its insane.

akl77 · October 2018

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

P.S sorry that hear they left. I hope they return one day.

@Tasear
Great suggestions, trial finder will definitely ease the elitist bully in trials, as we no longer need to kiss their xxx to get in a group, which feeds into their bully and dominance elitist behaviour. Given we only have 5 guild slots, which means we might not have space for trials dedicated guild to find people to play with too. Asking in zone is just too much of a pain and people are not in one zone only. It’s not the fault of the design of the trials, any easy dungeon you can meet and get elitist bullying comments.

Tasear · October 2018

akl77 wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

P.S sorry that hear they left. I hope they return one day.

@Tasear
Great suggestions, trial finder will definitely ease the elitist bully in trials, as we no longer need to kiss their xxx to get in a group, which feeds into their bully and dominance elitist behaviour. Given we only have 5 guild slots, which means we might not have space for trials dedicated guild to find people to play with too. Asking in zone is just too much of a pain and people are not in one zone only. It’s not the fault of the design of the trials, any easy dungeon you can meet and get elitist bullying comments.

Understood concerns will be conveyed.

MattT1988 · October 2018

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

I’m a fan of group finder for normal trials and normal Dragonstar. But I don’t want to see it implemented for vet trials or vdsa, you know that if they do this forum will be inundated with nerf posts from people in PUG groups whinging about how the trials are too hard for random groups and from players who can’t be bothered trying to learn and get better. I’d like to see vet content kept difficult for people who like to be challenged so there’s something for everybody to enjoy.

Nebthet78 · October 2018

MattT1988 wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

I’m a fan of group finder for normal trials and normal Dragonstar. But I don’t want to see it implemented for vet trials or vdsa, you know that if they do this forum will be inundated with nerf posts from people in PUG groups whinging about how the trials are too hard for random groups and from players who can’t be bothered trying to learn and get better. I’d like to see vet content kept difficult for people who like to be challenged so there’s something for everybody to enjoy.

The need to make a Moderate Level for Trials. For a lot of players, Normal is too easy and Vet is either too Hard, or you don't meet the Elite players "Requirements" so you can't run with them (even on a progression learning run, {not a Core run}, despite pulling nearly 30k dps). It's rather interesting how few players are actually hitting the leader board these days. It's all the same players in a couple different guilds on their different characters. Rarely do you see a new name.

MattT1988 · October 2018

Nebthet78 wrote: »

MattT1988 wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

I’m a fan of group finder for normal trials and normal Dragonstar. But I don’t want to see it implemented for vet trials or vdsa, you know that if they do this forum will be inundated with nerf posts from people in PUG groups whinging about how the trials are too hard for random groups and from players who can’t be bothered trying to learn and get better. I’d like to see vet content kept difficult for people who like to be challenged so there’s something for everybody to enjoy.

The need to make a Moderate Level for Trials. For a lot of players, Normal is too easy and Vet is either too Hard, or you don't meet the Elite players "Requirements" so you can't run with them (even on a progression learning run, {not a Core run}, despite pulling nearly 30k dps). It's rather interesting how few players are actually hitting the leader board these days. It's all the same players in a couple different guilds on their different characters. Rarely do you see a new name.

Actually a lot of guilds I know set the mark at 25k which is very attainable for just about anybody who wants to put the effort in. If people don’t want to put the effort in then why should people who do put the effort in carry someone who doesn’t?

As for the third level of difficulty for trials, I’d rather they just buff normal myself, so it isn’t a faceroll and folks can learn a thing or two.

spartaxoxo · October 2018

MattT1988 wrote: »

Nebthet78 wrote: »

MattT1988 wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

I’m a fan of group finder for normal trials and normal Dragonstar. But I don’t want to see it implemented for vet trials or vdsa, you know that if they do this forum will be inundated with nerf posts from people in PUG groups whinging about how the trials are too hard for random groups and from players who can’t be bothered trying to learn and get better. I’d like to see vet content kept difficult for people who like to be challenged so there’s something for everybody to enjoy.

The need to make a Moderate Level for Trials. For a lot of players, Normal is too easy and Vet is either too Hard, or you don't meet the Elite players "Requirements" so you can't run with them (even on a progression learning run, {not a Core run}, despite pulling nearly 30k dps). It's rather interesting how few players are actually hitting the leader board these days. It's all the same players in a couple different guilds on their different characters. Rarely do you see a new name.

Actually a lot of guilds I know set the mark at 25k which is very attainable for just about anybody who wants to put the effort in. If people don’t want to put the effort in then why should people who do put the effort in carry someone who doesn’t?

As for the third level of difficulty for trials, I’d rather they just buff normal myself, so it isn’t a faceroll and folks can learn a thing or two.

So your solution to increase accessibility to trials for the rest of the playerbase is to make it even less approachable? Smh.

MattT1988 · October 2018

spartaxoxo wrote: »

MattT1988 wrote: »

Nebthet78 wrote: »

MattT1988 wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Do you think it would be better if their was a trials group finder? Do you think it's the people or design of trials?

I’m a fan of group finder for normal trials and normal Dragonstar. But I don’t want to see it implemented for vet trials or vdsa, you know that if they do this forum will be inundated with nerf posts from people in PUG groups whinging about how the trials are too hard for random groups and from players who can’t be bothered trying to learn and get better. I’d like to see vet content kept difficult for people who like to be challenged so there’s something for everybody to enjoy.

The need to make a Moderate Level for Trials. For a lot of players, Normal is too easy and Vet is either too Hard, or you don't meet the Elite players "Requirements" so you can't run with them (even on a progression learning run, {not a Core run}, despite pulling nearly 30k dps). It's rather interesting how few players are actually hitting the leader board these days. It's all the same players in a couple different guilds on their different characters. Rarely do you see a new name.

Actually a lot of guilds I know set the mark at 25k which is very attainable for just about anybody who wants to put the effort in. If people don’t want to put the effort in then why should people who do put the effort in carry someone who doesn’t?

As for the third level of difficulty for trials, I’d rather they just buff normal myself, so it isn’t a faceroll and folks can learn a thing or two.

So your solution to increase accessibility to trials for the rest of the playerbase is to make it even less approachable? Smh.

Why would it be less approachable?

wolfxspice · October 2018

notorious, addy come back i miss you

plz

ATomiX96 · October 2018

why trial finder i dont get it? usually when im in craglorn the chat is getting spammed by "LFM nAA, LFM nCR+0" and so on. Just rightclick them -> whisper -> invite.
Veteran Trials will never be "Trial Finder" - Content so get that out of your head right away.

Nebthet78 wrote: »

It's rather interesting how few players are actually hitting the leader board these days. It's all the same players in a couple different guilds on their different characters. Rarely do you see a new name.

There is like lets be generous 40 people left who can play on leaderboard-level on EU atm, so many guilds disbanded right before summerset and so many people left the game from the endgame community, there is just no competition in PvE right now, its like 2-3 guilds left (on EU, idk about NA from what i've seen its all MC on NA) that can actually go for #1's right now.

And you know why there is a drought of endgame players, because new people cant get to that level and end up being stuck in casual raiding environent, maybe they even get as far as struggling months through vhof and vmol but they get frustrated and just quit most of the time. There is like no middle ground to climb and learn from, either its super casual or super hardcore. Most of the PvE guilds you see right now recruiting are either:

complete potatoes which struggle through vAA once a decade via signup raid
69k dps on a 50mil dummy selfbuffed without gear and cp, vCR+3, vAS+2 exp, tick-tock, immortal, gryphon heart requirements *

*this example might be a bit overexaggerated but you get the point

dan958 · October 2018

As soon as a game starts to feel like a job/chore, I'm out. It is why I have stopped playing Rainbow Six Siege, I no longer found enjoyment out of chasing the high ranks. Elder Scrolls is my time to just chill out, it will never be anything more for me.

tmbrinks · October 2018

ATomiX96 wrote: »

why trial finder i dont get it? usually when im in craglorn the chat is getting spammed by "LFM nAA, LFM nCR+0" and so on. Just rightclick them -> whisper -> invite.
Veteran Trials will never be "Trial Finder" - Content so get that out of your head right away.

Nebthet78 wrote: »

It's rather interesting how few players are actually hitting the leader board these days. It's all the same players in a couple different guilds on their different characters. Rarely do you see a new name.

There is like lets be generous 40 people left who can play on leaderboard-level on EU atm, so many guilds disbanded right before summerset and so many people left the game from the endgame community, there is just no competition in PvE right now, its like 2-3 guilds left (on EU, idk about NA from what i've seen its all MC on NA) that can actually go for #1's right now.

And you know why there is a drought of endgame players, because new people cant get to that level and end up being stuck in casual raiding environent, maybe they even get as far as struggling months through vhof and vmol but they get frustrated and just quit most of the time. There is like no middle ground to climb and learn from, either its super casual or super hardcore. Most of the PvE guilds you see right now recruiting are either:
complete potatoes which struggle through vAA once a decade via signup raid

69k dps on a 50mil dummy selfbuffed without gear and cp, vCR+3, vAS+2 exp, tick-tock, immortal, gryphon heart requirements *

*this example might be a bit overexaggerated but you get the point

There were at least 15 different guilds on PC/NA to clear vCR +3 this past patch. Granted, some of them have overlap of players, but that's a far cry from MC and everybody else. There are multiple groups to have gotten Gryphon Heart this patch as well, not all of them MC. There are at least a dozen "top-tier" raiding groups, that can clear anything in the game, as well as another dozen more middle of the road groups that can clear most content (short of vAS +2 and vCR +3). Heck, Nightfighters had a training run (of mostly players who are not in a core group players in NF, of which they have 5), clear vHoF HM.

The problem is that the trials necessitate a certain level of dps to complete them without significant issues, where the tank gets overrun, healers run out of resources, and I feel many of the players who are whining about these groups, are simply not at the level they need to be at. It's not elitism, it's facts.

Do I agree that there needs to be more people training people how to do trials? Yes. There's no doubt about that. But don't come in with a 25k dummy parse and expect to join a group that's doing vCR +1/2/3 progression. It just isn't going to happen. Work on your rotation. The "elitists" that you all want to decry so much have spent dozen (if not hundreds) of hours on a dummy practicing their rotation, figuring out gear (so you can just get the gear and not have to do all the testing), don't expect to be at that level after you did 3 parses on a dummy.

There is a large gap in difficulty between the Craglorns, and the DLC trials, yet, I feel like so many people want to just jump into the DLC content (which I get, they're newer), without learning general mechanics from the other "easier" trials. 25k will get you through all the Craglorns, so you can learn how to do your rotation, while staying alive, while blocking, getting that shield in your rotation.

wishlist14 · January 2019

Just like real life ...sad cause I play fantasy games to escape from the problems of rl and have some fun but you cant control people.

Tigerseye · January 2019

It can be like that in a lot of games.

Maybe 1 out of 3 raiding guilds, in WoW, has members who are both nice to each other and competent.

Personally, I can't be bothered with any of that in this game.

Serious, scheduled endgame content, I mean; not being nice. xD

dovakiin5574 · January 2019

This is why I have my own trial group with one or two parses per patch required, no death counters allowed, no loot log allowed, and no bashing. We do alright

Ruinhorn · January 2019

Set a goal to beat vet trial.
Gear up as you can (dungeons, crafting).
Find others who is ready to learn and can gear up as they can too.
Create own guild and start learning vTrials from zero. Yes, use Discord, doh.
*several months passed*
Show off your vet skins.

That's how we made our small guild, that's how we learned, that's how we beat all vTrials, speedruns and some HM before Morrowind patch. There is nothing impossible, just believe me.

But people usually complain about that experienced players don't take them, newbies in vTirals, into trials. It's like "hey, wtf this well-paid job is locked behind so high requirements??". Because. There is A LOT of people who is ready to learn and work for a common result. Find them and make your dreams come true.

Once again, TRUST ME, there is nothing impossible in veteran trials. Team work and tactics beat super-top-meta gear which gives you 5% of damage more. We did it. Yes, we failed a lot, we had disappointments, but is was really funny overall. And everyone got their best gear with some time (I mean, that feeling when you don't know what to do with gold jewelry, because Jewelrycrafting wasn't existed those days) to make speedruns and hardmodes possible.

If you want to get best rewards while doing nothing, i'm sorry for you: that isn't how it works. You can sit and wait a good chance forever.

Kilnerdyne · January 2019

This is absolutely incorrect on PC/EU. The End-game trial guilds here have wonderful people & players in them (hodor, symbolic, blind luck, target dummies).

Painting everyone with the same brush after a bad experience is [snip]

[Edited for profanity]

kylewwefan · January 2019

Wow. It’s been awhile. My friend. Yeah, he’s not coming back. ESO endgame is too all consuming at that level. Sucks. Wish it were more fun or rewarding. It’s just so mello dramatic even scraping the tip of the iceberg.

StarOfElyon · January 2019

kylewwefan wrote: »

Maybe he’ll come back, but taking a hiatus for awhile. I’m sad but not surprised. He joined a high end Trials guild and it just sucked the fun right out of the game.

I joined too. Did one run with them and knew I couldn’t be around that. So I left. Wish he would have too.

But, they’re doing stuff he wanted to do in the game, so he put up with it. I’m sure they wanted him too because he was a DPS Monster.

These are the kind of players you have to align yourself with to do ESO endgame PVE. Sucks.

Try to be a little more excellent to one and other.

Yeah, it might be fun to do trials one day but I would rather continue to play solo than put up with toxic groups. Some of us deal with it fine. I'm just not one of those people. I can do bad by myself.

Anhedonie · January 2019

Sadly, engame pve is complete trash and mostly due to player toxicity. Nothing new here, but I was hoping ESO's playerbase would be better than this.

Suddwrath · January 2019

If there's one thing I have learned about end game PVE it's this:

Don't join a trials guild; join a guild that also runs trials.

From my experience, guilds that label themselves as "trials/score running guilds" are the ones which have the most toxicity since they're full of people just looking for gear and high scores.

But when you join a guild which also just so happens to run trials, then you are more likely to be joining a guild where the players just enjoy doing things together. Will you be making super high scores on the leaderboard? Probably not. Will it be a little harder finding a core group to run vMoL etc? Probably. But at least you will have more fun doing it and will experience much less toxicity.

Princess_Ciri · January 2019

this is such a dumb post.

End game trials guilds are the reason why I still play this game because otherwise I'd be bored out of my mind.