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This is why Restoration skill line MUST have a DOT: Weapon Enchants!
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Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »It would be nice if AoE heals damaged enemies in the radius. That way healers could become more relevant. I'm already healing for stupidly large numbers so why not have it harm the enemy?
Because giving chochoo-trains in Cyro both defense and offense via just spamming springs is a bad idea?4 -
ZarkingFrued✭✭✭✭✭
✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Alcast recently posted a video about the new weapon enchant mechanics:
https://youtu.be/-R38vrBfYSY
There are many reasons these changes are a huge buff to Stamina builds (as usual), but the biggest problem, in my opinion, is that Magicka builds don't have a way to "perma-proc" enchants off of a Resto back bar. This is just wrong and very unfair.
My suggestion is that Quick Siphon (and morphs) be recognized as a Damage-over-Time effect for the purpose of proccing weapon enchants. What do you guys think is the best solution?
UPDATE: I want to make absolutely clear that I'm NOT asking for enchant NERFS, I'm simply asking for Resto line to be adjusted to accommodate enchants in a fair way.
Resto is clearly not a damage weapon, that is the trade off, massive healing ability on that bar in exchange for damage. Conversation over lol.0 -
paulsimonps✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I do agree that resto staff users, both in PvP and for Healers in PvE, have a lot harder time to use their enchantment on their resto staff. Its light attacks or nothing, so up time suffer. My suggestion is not to specifically add damage to the restoration skills nor give heals the ability to proc them(as people have said that would only work on like 2 enchantments), but what I suggest is to redesign Minor Lifesteal. Make it damage as much as it gives in healing, but only a max of 1 tick per target. This means that if I apply Minor Lifesteal to say a PvE Trial boss then all my allies can get the heal if they attack the boss but the boss will not get hit by 12 minor lifesteal ticks per second, just 1 tick per second. Minor Lifesteal is not overpowered in anyway in either PvE nor PvP, especially not in PvP and adding such a low damage tick to the minor lifesteal gives people more options. Right now a lot of people use Blood altar to proc Minor Lifesteal, and they can continue to do so, but if you want that weapon enchantment up time support then you can instead chose to run Force Siphon. Force Siphon would be a single target Minor Lifesteal that is a weapon skill, meaning it would with my suggested changes proc the weapon enchantment.
Thoughts?3 -
Lightspeedflashb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭paulsimonps wrote: »I do agree that resto staff users, both in PvP and for Healers in PvE, have a lot harder time to use their enchantment on their resto staff. Its light attacks or nothing, so up time suffer. My suggestion is not to specifically add damage to the restoration skills nor give heals the ability to proc them(as people have said that would only work on like 2 enchantments), but what I suggest is to redesign Minor Lifesteal. Make it damage as much as it gives in healing, but only a max of 1 tick per target. This means that if I apply Minor Lifesteal to say a PvE Trial boss then all my allies can get the heal if they attack the boss but the boss will not get hit by 12 minor lifesteal ticks per second, just 1 tick per second. Minor Lifesteal is not overpowered in anyway in either PvE nor PvP, especially not in PvP and adding such a low damage tick to the minor lifesteal gives people more options. Right now a lot of people use Blood altar to proc Minor Lifesteal, and they can continue to do so, but if you want that weapon enchantment up time support then you can instead chose to run Force Siphon. Force Siphon would be a single target Minor Lifesteal that is a weapon skill, meaning it would with my suggested changes proc the weapon enchantment.
Thoughts?
+1, it is called lifesteal after all, so it makes sense.Edited by Lightspeedflashb14_ESO on October 16, 2018 12:10PM0 -
TheGreatBlackBear✭✭✭✭✭
✭TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »It would be nice if AoE heals damaged enemies in the radius. That way healers could become more relevant. I'm already healing for stupidly large numbers so why not have it harm the enemy?
Because giving chochoo-trains in Cyro both defense and offense via just spamming springs is a bad idea?
Don't play PvP so I didn't consider that. And besides all healing is cut in half in Cyro so how much damage would you really be eating?1 -
ZarkingFrued✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »Carbonised wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Top healing builds are pretty much Resto/Destro (lightning) iirc. Healers can and do run WoE which gives them the DoT OP is asking for.
With that, Alcast is probably speaking to the infused trait and my guess is OP sees how much the enchant procs with that triat. For healing Power trait seems to be superior with Precise likely being a second best choice. Even with the destroy bar Charged is likely a better trait for the healer than infused since the purpose of them running WoE is for putting the effects on the boss/mobs.
I'm not really talking about healing builds, although they deserve justice, too. I'm talking from the perspective of PvP builds that are forced to run Resto back bars for whatever reason. Stamina PvP builds typically run Weapon lines on BOTH bars, which would allow them to proc Infused enchants off of both bars. There are also a few Magicka builds that can get away with dual Destro, like Templars.
No DPS is forced to run a Resto for any reason.
You really have no idea, do you.
PvP players are not DPS. DPS in pve ought never have a resto.
*cough* vMA *cough*
Need a cough drop? Lol, Jk, I agree entirelyEdited by ZarkingFrued on October 16, 2018 12:15PM0 -
John_Falstaff✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@TheGreatBlackBear , I can't say precisely from healer's standpoint, but I wonder if there are certain corner cases in PvE content when it would be undesirable to have both healing and damage (like accidentally dealing damage to Assembly General while healing the lined-up group and causing him to start one-shotting you in retaliation, or healing people on a bridge in VoM). I suppose it can be worked around without big trouble, but I just wanted to say that it may not be a localized change without any side effects.0 -
TheGreatBlackBear✭✭✭✭✭
✭Good point. In that case a smart healer would use something like rapid regen or another skill that targets players specifically and not just blindly spam AoE heals like springs which would cause undesired damage.0 -
susmitds✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »Good point. In that case a smart healer would use something like rapid regen or another skill that targets players specifically and not just blindly spam AoE heals like springs which would cause undesired damage.
Rapid regen is not enough outheal most things. Also, some classes need to spam Springs to be effective healers.2 -
Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »It would be nice if AoE heals damaged enemies in the radius. That way healers could become more relevant. I'm already healing for stupidly large numbers so why not have it harm the enemy?
Because giving chochoo-trains in Cyro both defense and offense via just spamming springs is a bad idea?
Don't play PvP so I didn't consider that. And besides all healing is cut in half in Cyro so how much damage would you really be eating?
Considering there will be like 10 or so wardens/templars spamming it? Quite a lot. Especially since you can stack springs. Just 4 people can have 12 springs on the ground.
And I'm not even one of the crazy 1vX guys who wants all "zergs" to bow before their "skill" but adding a damage component to one of the strongest heals in the game is a bad idea.
0 -
TheGreatBlackBear✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well speaking from a templar point of view, with almost maxed out bonus from the Blessed star my rapid regen heals for about 2k a tick. With a crit it's much higher. I don't know how much more effective springs would be. I won't comment on needing springs to be an effective healer.0 -
Olquorron✭✭✭Why would the team see fit to bestow yet ANOTHER huge advantage on stamina PvP setups in a patch that already continues the year-long string of patches doing just that? @ZOS_GinaBruno, can you confirm whether the dev team is aware of how problematic this change is in the context of PvP dual wield setups?1 -
TheGreatBlackBear✭✭✭✭✭
✭TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »It would be nice if AoE heals damaged enemies in the radius. That way healers could become more relevant. I'm already healing for stupidly large numbers so why not have it harm the enemy?
Because giving chochoo-trains in Cyro both defense and offense via just spamming springs is a bad idea?
Don't play PvP so I didn't consider that. And besides all healing is cut in half in Cyro so how much damage would you really be eating?
Considering there will be like 10 or so wardens/templars spamming it? Quite a lot. Especially since you can stack springs. Just 4 people can have 12 springs on the ground.
And I'm not even one of the crazy 1vX guys who wants all "zergs" to bow before their "skill" but adding a damage component to one of the strongest heals in the game is a bad idea.
Let's say i was in Cyro, and my springs usually heals for 2k per tick . It'd be cut to 1k right? Lets say half if that which is 500 per tick is done as damage . This is before you factor in armour, CP and all those other things. Surely you're more likely to be killed by something else? As I said I'm not a PvP player so I dunno. I could foresee dire situtations where Earthgore stacks becomes massive 18K DoTs piling on from all sides but maybe it could be coded where Monster Helms don't do damage from healing?Edited by TheGreatBlackBear on October 16, 2018 1:19PM0 -
Nicko_Lps✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Alcast recently posted a video about the new weapon enchant mechanics:https://youtu.be/-R38vrBfYSY
There are many reasons these changes are a huge buff to Stamina builds (as usual), but the biggest problem, in my opinion, is that Magicka builds don't have a way to "perma-proc" enchants off of a Resto back bar. This is just wrong and very unfair.
My suggestion is that Quick Siphon (and morphs) be recognized as a Damage-over-Time effect for the purpose of proccing weapon enchants. What do you guys think is the best solution?
UPDATE: I want to make absolutely clear that I'm NOT asking for enchant NERFS, I'm simply asking for Resto line to be adjusted to accommodate enchants in a fair way.
Because you play Elder Stamina Online.
2 shields are broken and OP
While Stacking vigor+rally+rally burst heal+ class heal+ endless roll dodge+ block and more depending the class IS BALANCED3 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Alcast recently posted a video about the new weapon enchant mechanics:https://youtu.be/-R38vrBfYSY
There are many reasons these changes are a huge buff to Stamina builds (as usual), but the biggest problem, in my opinion, is that Magicka builds don't have a way to "perma-proc" enchants off of a Resto back bar. This is just wrong and very unfair.
My suggestion is that Quick Siphon (and morphs) be recognized as a Damage-over-Time effect for the purpose of proccing weapon enchants. What do you guys think is the best solution?
UPDATE: I want to make absolutely clear that I'm NOT asking for enchant NERFS, I'm simply asking for Resto line to be adjusted to accommodate enchants in a fair way.
Because you play Elder Stamina Online.
2 shields are broken and OP
While Stacking vigor+rally+rally burst heal+ class heal+ endless roll dodge+ block and more depending the class IS BALANCED
It's been Elder Staves Online. I'm not going to shed any tears for a defense mechanic that needed to get nerfed.0 -
_Salty_✭✭✭✭✭Why would a healing staff have a Damage over time?Psn l---Salty---l
Patiently waiting to make a Stankcromancer.0 -
Danksta✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭paulsimonps wrote: »I do agree that resto staff users, both in PvP and for Healers in PvE, have a lot harder time to use their enchantment on their resto staff. Its light attacks or nothing, so up time suffer. My suggestion is not to specifically add damage to the restoration skills nor give heals the ability to proc them(as people have said that would only work on like 2 enchantments), but what I suggest is to redesign Minor Lifesteal. Make it damage as much as it gives in healing, but only a max of 1 tick per target. This means that if I apply Minor Lifesteal to say a PvE Trial boss then all my allies can get the heal if they attack the boss but the boss will not get hit by 12 minor lifesteal ticks per second, just 1 tick per second. Minor Lifesteal is not overpowered in anyway in either PvE nor PvP, especially not in PvP and adding such a low damage tick to the minor lifesteal gives people more options. Right now a lot of people use Blood altar to proc Minor Lifesteal, and they can continue to do so, but if you want that weapon enchantment up time support then you can instead chose to run Force Siphon. Force Siphon would be a single target Minor Lifesteal that is a weapon skill, meaning it would with my suggested changes proc the weapon enchantment.
Thoughts?
That actually makes a lot of sense if you actually think of the name of the debuff, Minor Lifesteal. This would make it so it would be actually stealing the life (health) from your opponent.BawKinTackWarDs PS4/NA0 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Alcast recently posted a video about the new weapon enchant mechanics:https://youtu.be/-R38vrBfYSY
There are many reasons these changes are a huge buff to Stamina builds (as usual), but the biggest problem, in my opinion, is that Magicka builds don't have a way to "perma-proc" enchants off of a Resto back bar. This is just wrong and very unfair.
My suggestion is that Quick Siphon (and morphs) be recognized as a Damage-over-Time effect for the purpose of proccing weapon enchants. What do you guys think is the best solution?
UPDATE: I want to make absolutely clear that I'm NOT asking for enchant NERFS, I'm simply asking for Resto line to be adjusted to accommodate enchants in a fair way.
Resto staves and healers ought have something.
They could create defensive type enchants that proc off heals.2 -
TheGreatBlackBear✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I think resto abilities (not vigor or class heals) could logically have a damage component. Because magic.Why would a healing staff have a Damage over time?
Nah but seriously, you could reason out as the magic that heals and protects your allies also harms your enemies. Whether or not this means stealing HP from enemies is up for debate. Even in real life, taking someone else's medication can seriously harm you right? Plus doing damage with a heavy attack from my resto (somehow) heals me and my allies, so it's not a far stretch to think that my heals can damage those in its area who are not my allies. A point of reference could be in Maw with the twins where people of the opposite colour can damage you with their healing abilities.0 -
Nicko_Lps✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Alcast recently posted a video about the new weapon enchant mechanics:https://youtu.be/-R38vrBfYSY
There are many reasons these changes are a huge buff to Stamina builds (as usual), but the biggest problem, in my opinion, is that Magicka builds don't have a way to "perma-proc" enchants off of a Resto back bar. This is just wrong and very unfair.
My suggestion is that Quick Siphon (and morphs) be recognized as a Damage-over-Time effect for the purpose of proccing weapon enchants. What do you guys think is the best solution?
UPDATE: I want to make absolutely clear that I'm NOT asking for enchant NERFS, I'm simply asking for Resto line to be adjusted to accommodate enchants in a fair way.
Because you play Elder Stamina Online.
2 shields are broken and OP
While Stacking vigor+rally+rally burst heal+ class heal+ endless roll dodge+ block and more depending the class IS BALANCED
It's been Elder Staves Online. I'm not going to shed any tears for a defense mechanic that needed to get nerfed.
It was Elder Staves Online @ 2014. For a few months.
You still live after beta?
You should not.1 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭If Resto Staff line needs to be strictly heals, all other weapon lines need to be strictly damage.1 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'd like to remind everyone that the Restoration School in Elder Scrolls games has historically featured an "Absorb Health" spell that simultaneously healed the caster while damaging the target:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Health
There is no reason whatsoever that ZOS can't add functionality like this to the Restoration skill line in ESO. In fact, it's a bit surprising that Major Lifesteal doesn't already work this way. That's why I suggested Siphon as a likely candidate to be turned into a DOT.
#CAREBEARMASTERRACE4