Should melee builds do slightly more damage than ranged builds?

Derra · October 2018

The notion is problematic from a pvp pov where range offers no real advantage in small fight situations.
Advantage of range is simply nonexistant in encounters involving less than 4 people per side.

red_emu · October 2018

No

Now you said it, ZOS will look at it and nerf ALL ranged abilities to the ground

SupremeRissole · October 2018

Yes

I definately agree that melee should hit harder in PVE. The solution is simple, revert the changes to NMG and Sunderflame to bring that group support feeling and a little variation from the AY/Relequin build. Obviously there would need to be some minor pve nerfs to stam to avoid power creep.

I agree with the logic that Mag melee should hit harder however stam arent welcome in two of the current trials and if melee mag hit way harder than stam, we'll see stam removed from pve altogether.

Roboplus · October 2018

Not necessarily. In some games, combatants in melee are better able to deal with damage than those at range. More likely to be damaged, but also more capable of surviving it.

If melee were balanced in PvE to be able to take the kind of damage that range can ignore entirely, then one wouldn't need to do more damage than the other.

DanteYoda · October 2018

No

FloppyTouch · October 2018

No

Nope

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · October 2018

Yes

Metafae wrote: »

This order:

Melee Build in Light Armor = Should be doing Highest DPS
Melee Build in Medium Armor = Should be doing less than ^^
Ranged Builds in Light Armor = Should be doing less than ^^
Ranged Builds in Medium Armor = Should be doing less than ^^

Light armor has shields medium does not why should you get shield and more damage? Also magic is magic is the fire cooler 28m away when they move so fast. Cause if you’re in a robe, shirts and a pair of pants. You should make more damage if a sword.

Nicko_Lps · October 2018

No

Special snowflake melee need to do more damage...

What a change!!
Oh wait, thats not new.. They already do more damage, guess they want to do more than the more damage they do atm

ecru · October 2018

Yes

Cillion3117 wrote: »

An arrow to your face would kill you as easy as a sword to your face.

Yeah it's a game though. Risk/reward considered, melee is always more risk, but without any reward. In both vAS and vCR there is no good reason to play melee and every mechanic in those trials doesn't just favor ranged, they actively punish melee.

I main a magblade now (for obvious reasons) but there are a lot of ranged babies in this thread who have never played melee, and probably never will. Go play a stamdk in vCR+3 and get back to me on how melee should do equal damage to ranged in melee range, which you hardly ever will be.

MourncallerTV · October 2018

No

I voted no and this is for a reason. I do pvp and am new to pvp in cyrodil. And from my experience melee weapons, in general are always used with either magicka or stamina to begin with.

I think honestly at this rate what needs to be done is balance of damage between melee and magicka period. Let the paramedics sort them out. I do see alot of in your face action in cyrodil, and it's the distance ranged magic user that unless in the right gear I guess is rather squishy and is quickly targetted.

I think what the main concern here isn't about magacka users as it is about the specific skills.

My first time ever using soul shatter ultimate ability shocked me at how much damage it does and it can only be used when you have the ultimate points up..
For a magplar I would say they don't need to use the soul shatter with the radiant destruction. My first time using radiant destruction was amazing but only if it is used at the right time and preparing for the magicka drain for its cost.
IN your face combat is where most of the damage is coming from with the extra stuff added in. Swords, like crazy flying every where. Very rarely do I see a ranged user do much killing other than an archer with the right build.

MashmalloMan · October 2018

Yes

So most people voting no are talking about pvp and most people voting yes are talking about pve.

In pvp, range doesn't really make a difference with gap closers, but it still helps.

In pve, I don't see any reason for ranged builds to get equal dps to melee builds. Risk vs reward. Even 5-15% extra dps in melee range would make a difference, judging by Liko's dps tests, every build is within 58k dps range on a stationary target. Ranged doesn't need to worry about positioning themselves. Melee constantly has to disengage a dps rotation.

Mag DK and magplar count as melee builds, melee does not only mean stamina.

Nicko_Lps · October 2018

No

Marshall1289 wrote: »

So most people voting no are talking about pvp and most people voting yes are talking about pve.

In pvp, range doesn't really make a difference with gap closers, but it still helps.

In pve, I don't see any reason for ranged builds to get equal dps to melee builds. Risk vs reward. Even 5-15% extra dps in melee range would make a difference, judging by Liko's dps tests, every build is within 58k dps range on a stationary target. Ranged doesn't need to worry about positioning themselves. Melee constantly has to disengage a dps rotation.

Mag DK and magplar count as melee builds, melee does not only mean stamina.

In nerfmire according to LiKo builds + Vids MagDK+MagPlar are dps kings in melee mode.

Now what you fail to realize is all magica builds to be CLOSE to melee builds dps atm in pve they have to use ZAAN and be melee as well. Outside Zaan no ranged dps can get even close to melee dps output.

Why you have to whine since melee dps is already better?
What will please you guys when melee dps "RISK" will output 50% more pve dps?

Guys thats not skyrim, its ESO.

Mayrael · October 2018

No

PvP perspective only:
1. Melee builds already deal more damage, that can't be reflected and in many cases dodged. Sword and board has also passive dedicated to lower projectile damage when blocking.
2. In PvP ranged fight exists only from walls of a keep, any open-field fight ends with melee gapclosing on ranged toon, with nerfs to speed opening the gap will be even harder.

PvE:
I don't think that increasing melee damage is the solution, it would be better to introduce mechanics that would allow both ranged and melee to be viable with the same DPS.

MashmalloMan · October 2018

Yes

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

So most people voting no are talking about pvp and most people voting yes are talking about pve.

In pvp, range doesn't really make a difference with gap closers, but it still helps.

In pve, I don't see any reason for ranged builds to get equal dps to melee builds. Risk vs reward. Even 5-15% extra dps in melee range would make a difference, judging by Liko's dps tests, every build is within 58k dps range on a stationary target. Ranged doesn't need to worry about positioning themselves. Melee constantly has to disengage a dps rotation.

Mag DK and magplar count as melee builds, melee does not only mean stamina.

In nerfmire according to LiKo builds + Vids MagDK+MagPlar are dps kings in melee mode.

Now what you fail to realize is all magica builds to be CLOSE to melee builds dps atm in pve they have to use ZAAN and be melee as well. Outside Zaan no ranged dps can get even close to melee dps output.

Why you have to whine since melee dps is already better?
What will please you guys when melee dps "RISK" will output 50% more pve dps?

Guys thats not skyrim, its ESO.

Sorry, what I fail to realize? My point was that in the dps parses every class is very much the same in melee range for dps, Zaan is what? 1-3k+ more than another monster set that's ranged on a 60k parse, that's what.. 7% less dps to be ranged? When you are at range you can continue to dps in fights where the boss moves or uses a strong attack. When you are at melee you need to disengage dps.

Even if you had a mag build parse at range, that is WAY more reliable for less dps then a high parse in melee range, that's why melee should have more dmg to equalize for the fact that melee classes can NOT fight 100% of the time. Obviously it depends on the boss, some npc's you can wail on in melee range with 100% uptime.

Also those stamina parses are using relequen + ravager + selene for high uptime on ravager and selene and only then are they able to parse that high. Relequen is no longer melee dmg, so selene and ravager uptime is no more.

I don't think anyone here is whining either. Merely stating their opinion based on the question of the thread.

Nicko_Lps · October 2018

No

Marshall1289 wrote: »

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

So most people voting no are talking about pvp and most people voting yes are talking about pve.

In pvp, range doesn't really make a difference with gap closers, but it still helps.

In pve, I don't see any reason for ranged builds to get equal dps to melee builds. Risk vs reward. Even 5-15% extra dps in melee range would make a difference, judging by Liko's dps tests, every build is within 58k dps range on a stationary target. Ranged doesn't need to worry about positioning themselves. Melee constantly has to disengage a dps rotation.

Mag DK and magplar count as melee builds, melee does not only mean stamina.

In nerfmire according to LiKo builds + Vids MagDK+MagPlar are dps kings in melee mode.

Now what you fail to realize is all magica builds to be CLOSE to melee builds dps atm in pve they have to use ZAAN and be melee as well. Outside Zaan no ranged dps can get even close to melee dps output.

Why you have to whine since melee dps is already better?
What will please you guys when melee dps "RISK" will output 50% more pve dps?

Guys thats not skyrim, its ESO.

Sorry, what I fail to realize? My point was that in the dps parses every class is very much the same in melee range for dps, Zaan is what? 1-3k+ more than another monster set that's ranged on a 60k parse, that's what.. 7% less dps to be ranged? When you are at range you can continue to dps in fights where the boss moves or uses a strong attack. When you are at melee you need to disengage dps.

Even if you had a mag build parse at range, that is WAY more reliable for less dps then a high parse in melee range, that's why melee should have more dmg to equalize for the fact that melee classes can NOT fight 100% of the time. Obviously it depends on the boss, some npc's you can wail on in melee range with 100% uptime.

Also those stamina parses are using relequen + ravager + selene for high uptime on ravager and selene and only then are they able to parse that high. Relequen is no longer melee dmg, so selene and ravager uptime is no more.

I don't think anyone here is whining either. Merely stating their opinion based on the question of the thread.

If you claim zaan adds 1-3k dps more, here is the time i stop replying to you because we cant have a serious conversation.

Have fun.

Cry more, The Elder Scrolls Online way.

MashmalloMan · October 2018

Yes

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

So most people voting no are talking about pvp and most people voting yes are talking about pve.

In pvp, range doesn't really make a difference with gap closers, but it still helps.

In pve, I don't see any reason for ranged builds to get equal dps to melee builds. Risk vs reward. Even 5-15% extra dps in melee range would make a difference, judging by Liko's dps tests, every build is within 58k dps range on a stationary target. Ranged doesn't need to worry about positioning themselves. Melee constantly has to disengage a dps rotation.

Mag DK and magplar count as melee builds, melee does not only mean stamina.

In nerfmire according to LiKo builds + Vids MagDK+MagPlar are dps kings in melee mode.

Now what you fail to realize is all magica builds to be CLOSE to melee builds dps atm in pve they have to use ZAAN and be melee as well. Outside Zaan no ranged dps can get even close to melee dps output.

Why you have to whine since melee dps is already better?
What will please you guys when melee dps "RISK" will output 50% more pve dps?

Guys thats not skyrim, its ESO.

Sorry, what I fail to realize? My point was that in the dps parses every class is very much the same in melee range for dps, Zaan is what? 1-3k+ more than another monster set that's ranged on a 60k parse, that's what.. 7% less dps to be ranged? When you are at range you can continue to dps in fights where the boss moves or uses a strong attack. When you are at melee you need to disengage dps.

Even if you had a mag build parse at range, that is WAY more reliable for less dps then a high parse in melee range, that's why melee should have more dmg to equalize for the fact that melee classes can NOT fight 100% of the time. Obviously it depends on the boss, some npc's you can wail on in melee range with 100% uptime.

Also those stamina parses are using relequen + ravager + selene for high uptime on ravager and selene and only then are they able to parse that high. Relequen is no longer melee dmg, so selene and ravager uptime is no more.

I don't think anyone here is whining either. Merely stating their opinion based on the question of the thread.

If you claim zaan adds 1-3k dps more, here is the time i stop replying to you because we cant have a serious conversation.

Have fun.

Cry more, The Elder Scrolls Online way.

No one is crying here and I clearly said that as a question in comparison to other ranged monster set options you have available. You completely avoided everything else I said in the discussion and focused on a strong melee ranged monster set such as Zaan when I just stated melee stam builds are losing their over performing monster set and ravager too.

Point still stands, ranged doesn't need to disengage a pve fight as often as melee does. Period.

Honestly I was curious so I checked Zaan's dmg in Liko's video parse for magplar, wow, big surprise, it does 2.5k on a 63k parse, please tell me again how Zaan is apparently a crutch to those parses? Even if it was, it should do more dmg because it's melee range.

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Now what you fail to realize is all magica builds to be CLOSE to melee builds dps atm in pve they have to use ZAAN and be melee as well. Outside Zaan no ranged dps can get even close to melee dps output.

With a statement like that ^ I would think Zaan would be 3-5k dps.

Nicko_Lps · October 2018

No

Marshall1289 wrote: »

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

So most people voting no are talking about pvp and most people voting yes are talking about pve.

In pvp, range doesn't really make a difference with gap closers, but it still helps.

In pve, I don't see any reason for ranged builds to get equal dps to melee builds. Risk vs reward. Even 5-15% extra dps in melee range would make a difference, judging by Liko's dps tests, every build is within 58k dps range on a stationary target. Ranged doesn't need to worry about positioning themselves. Melee constantly has to disengage a dps rotation.

Mag DK and magplar count as melee builds, melee does not only mean stamina.

In nerfmire according to LiKo builds + Vids MagDK+MagPlar are dps kings in melee mode.

Now what you fail to realize is all magica builds to be CLOSE to melee builds dps atm in pve they have to use ZAAN and be melee as well. Outside Zaan no ranged dps can get even close to melee dps output.

Why you have to whine since melee dps is already better?
What will please you guys when melee dps "RISK" will output 50% more pve dps?

Guys thats not skyrim, its ESO.

Sorry, what I fail to realize? My point was that in the dps parses every class is very much the same in melee range for dps, Zaan is what? 1-3k+ more than another monster set that's ranged on a 60k parse, that's what.. 7% less dps to be ranged? When you are at range you can continue to dps in fights where the boss moves or uses a strong attack. When you are at melee you need to disengage dps.

Even if you had a mag build parse at range, that is WAY more reliable for less dps then a high parse in melee range, that's why melee should have more dmg to equalize for the fact that melee classes can NOT fight 100% of the time. Obviously it depends on the boss, some npc's you can wail on in melee range with 100% uptime.

Also those stamina parses are using relequen + ravager + selene for high uptime on ravager and selene and only then are they able to parse that high. Relequen is no longer melee dmg, so selene and ravager uptime is no more.

I don't think anyone here is whining either. Merely stating their opinion based on the question of the thread.

If you claim zaan adds 1-3k dps more, here is the time i stop replying to you because we cant have a serious conversation.

Have fun.

Cry more, The Elder Scrolls Online way.

No one is crying here and I clearly said that as a question in comparison to other ranged monster set options you have available. You completely avoided everything else I said in the discussion and focused on a strong melee ranged monster set such as Zaan when I just stated melee stam builds are losing their over performing monster set and ravager too.

Point still stands, ranged doesn't need to disengage a pve fight as often as melee does. Period.

Honestly I was curious so I checked Zaan's dmg in Liko's video parse for magplar, wow, big surprise, it does 2.5k on a 63k parse, please tell me again how Zaan is apparently a crutch to those parses? Even if it was, it should do more dmg because it's melee range.

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

Now what you fail to realize is all magica builds to be CLOSE to melee builds dps atm in pve they have to use ZAAN and be melee as well. Outside Zaan no ranged dps can get even close to melee dps output.

With a statement like that ^ I would think Zaan would be 3-5k dps.

Good, as ive said: we cant have a serious conversation

Have fun again.

Keep crying, its the ESO META for buffs.

Morgul667 · October 2018

Yes

Obviously

Didgerion · October 2018

No

As long as there is a gap closing mechanics in the game the range don't give much advantage.

MashmalloMan · October 2018

Yes

The question raised by OP was directed at pve, most answers of "no" have to do with pvp. They can be separately balanced via skills that only work in pve. The poll doesn't really seem accurate.

lucky_dutch · October 2018

No

Obviously not. Kiting is not a practical possibility in this game so giving melee better DPS would instantly destroy PvP.

This is a PvE issue that can be managed with better boss mechanics.