Out of the skills you listed Prey is the cheapest and now also grants minor berserk/minor evasion just for slotting it. It’s therefore still better then all those others.

MagDen might complain because they don’t have a class gap closer. StamDen doesn’t need it as much and will feel the nerf much less.

As I’ve said a dozen times... Falcons Swiftness with its high expedition uptime is the heart and soul of PvP Magden... Magden needs this constant mobility in order to aim fissures and gain distance to effectively use cliff racer... as Magden is currently bottom tier in PvP, nerfing the uptime on expedition on bird of prey in order to conform it to the arbitrary rule set of having all speed buffs 4s is both unbalanced and highly damaging to the identity and fun factor of Magden... This change is absolutely unacceptable!

casparian wrote: »

Do you play magwarden? The change from Berserk-on-cast to Berserk-while-slotted was a magwarden nerf (since we now only get Berserk while on one bar) and a stamwarden buff, since they now get free Berserk without having to use their magicka pool.

This is true. I play my magwarden only as a crafter. But I don't see why we need to compare stamden to magden, if wardens still lose much, doesn't matter which direction you choose. And in PVE I used to gain minor Berserk from pots or ally buffs, so this doesn't change much for me, still will be half useless passive, even more useless now

Stamsorcs and stamplars are gonna get slowed down big time when they take the nerf bat to speed pots. Stamsorc, the literal mobility class, will have to slot bow for a nerfed passive or rely on a nerfed quick cloak for mobility, same with stamplars. Not really sustainable on either class with a competitive setup. Overall the major changes to expedition will hurt everyone except ball groups with rapids spammers.

Too many changes too quickly, and it's easy to see that this really hurts small scale players. As for Swift, modular 10% speed increase for ~900 resources each was too strong. I enjoyed it but knew it all along. Don't bother with the mental gymnastics on what else those ~900 resources could have been, they were reasonably balanced against the other traits and Swift stuck out like a sore thumb. That said 7% each Swift is fine imo.

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

"Dragonknight
Ardent Flame
Fiery Grip: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 6 seconds."

"Sorcerer
Storm Calling
Boundless Storm: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 7.5."

"Warden
Animal Companions
Falcon’s Swiftness: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 10 seconds."

I am at a loss of words. Balance, smh?

I insist, using the major expedition given by chains as an example is wrong. It is a gap closer, how do you take advantage of the buff?

From the offensive perspective in PVP, as a DK you can't kill an enemy in less than 4 seconds, unless the guy is half dead (and in that case is way better to use ranged attacks). Maybe it helps you to dance around the enemy proven you have used foss, but in the case of stamDKs, using 2 high cost magicka skills instead a stam gapcloser and the stun is kind of stupid. For mDK it is way better to use shield charge, but as you are a magicka based build, you cannot run much.

From the defensive perspective is even more stupid, do I use chains to get the buff and then run away from my enemy? A bow gives you the same buff just by dodge rolling and don't put you in front of the enemy to start running.

6 secs were OK to at least being able to run for 2 secs. So, if you say that Warden got the biggest nerf, think about DKs, who got the buff reduced to 4 secs in theory, but in practice they got the buff technically removed.

RedRook wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

"Dragonknight
Ardent Flame
Fiery Grip: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 6 seconds."

"Sorcerer
Storm Calling
Boundless Storm: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 7.5."

"Warden
Animal Companions
Falcon’s Swiftness: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 10 seconds."

I am at a loss of words. Balance, smh?

I insist, using the major expedition given by chains as an example is wrong. It is a gap closer, how do you take advantage of the buff?

From the offensive perspective in PVP, as a DK you can't kill an enemy in less than 4 seconds, unless the guy is half dead (and in that case is way better to use ranged attacks). Maybe it helps you to dance around the enemy proven you have used foss, but in the case of stamDKs, using 2 high cost magicka skills instead a stam gapcloser and the stun is kind of stupid. For mDK it is way better to use shield charge, but as you are a magicka based build, you cannot run much.

From the defensive perspective is even more stupid, do I use chains to get the buff and then run away from my enemy? A bow gives you the same buff just by dodge rolling and don't put you in front of the enemy to start running.

6 secs were OK to at least being able to run for 2 secs. So, if you say that Warden got the biggest nerf, think about DKs, who got the buff reduced to 4 secs in theory, but in practice they got the buff technically removed.

And this highlights the problem here: they standardized the uptime of major expedition for every class, thinking that would make it all even and fair, but the classes play and should play quite differently. They did this without consideration of context or actual use of each ability.

There was a problem, and I don't know if this will fix it, but now there are a couple more problems that didn't exist before. And this greatly sucks for magden, which really doesn't need to be stuffed down any further, please and thank you.

It's te lazy search for balance without paying attention to the real things that cause imbalance.

No DK will ever use chains outside of combat to get major expedition because no DK can do that.

Cry me a river, did you know shields used to have 30s durations and could be more than 40% of your max health? Who knew losing 6s of major expedition was far worse than 24s of shield duration and a cap based on max health?

weedgenius wrote: »

PathwayM wrote: »

Cry me a river, did you know shields used to have 30s durations and could be more than 40% of your max health? Who knew losing 6s of major expedition was far worse than 24s of shield duration and a cap based on max health?

This is a thread about the speed nerf. You appear to have gotten lost. Kindly redirect yourself to the numerous threads on shield changes.

My point is stamden is already over performing and this is a good time to finally tone down the most powerful buff in the game.

PathwayM wrote: »

Cry me a river, did you know shields used to have 30s durations and could be more than 40% of your max health? Who knew losing 6s of major expedition was far worse than 24s of shield duration and a cap based on max health?

20s.

Shields used to be 20s, just fyi.

Also this change barely effects stamdens, stamdens usually used wings for the berserk buff.

usmguy1234 wrote: »

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

"Dragonknight
Ardent Flame
Fiery Grip: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 6 seconds."

"Sorcerer
Storm Calling
Boundless Storm: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 7.5."

"Warden
Animal Companions
Falcon’s Swiftness: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 10 seconds."

I am at a loss of words. Balance, smh?

Stamwarden needs a nerf in pvp at least. Unpopular opinion I know.

No, it's a factual opinion stamwarden has been one of if not the best class in open world pvp since it was released.

100% a pure p2w class.

usmguy1234 wrote: »

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

"Dragonknight
Ardent Flame
Fiery Grip: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 6 seconds."

"Sorcerer
Storm Calling
Boundless Storm: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 7.5."

"Warden
Animal Companions
Falcon’s Swiftness: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 10 seconds."

I am at a loss of words. Balance, smh?

Stamwarden needs a nerf in pvp at least. Unpopular opinion I know.

They just had to nerf Stamden in a way that hurts the Magden more didn’t they... oh and then make the beserk component into a passive so Stamden doesn’t need to build mag sustain for that powerful effect... they should go back to the drawing board with their Bird of Prey changes

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

On a stamden, you ought to have a bow equipped. Roll Dodge with that. Boom 4 seconds of the buff you want.

and MagDen? -_-

You trade mag for the same 4 seconds. Not sure what is the problem. If you want long lasting major expedition, use rapids. Yes it costs a lot of Stam, 8100 for 33 seconds of major expedition, but with the new passives, mainly the one that drops the cost of sprint by 4% per piece of light armor, meaning you will have at least 20% cost reduction for sprinting, I personally run about that on all my tools from cp, you will have enough to sprint after too. More to the point, I have never used any source of major expedition outside the bow one on my stam toons and the movement speed is just fine for all overland content.

Please keep in mind the op is talking about pve. Farming mats.

For farming just slot rapid maneuver and youre fine

Morgul667 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

On a stamden, you ought to have a bow equipped. Roll Dodge with that. Boom 4 seconds of the buff you want.

and MagDen? -_-

You trade mag for the same 4 seconds. Not sure what is the problem. If you want long lasting major expedition, use rapids. Yes it costs a lot of Stam, 8100 for 33 seconds of major expedition, but with the new passives, mainly the one that drops the cost of sprint by 4% per piece of light armor, meaning you will have at least 20% cost reduction for sprinting, I personally run about that on all my tools from cp, you will have enough to sprint after too. More to the point, I have never used any source of major expedition outside the bow one on my stam toons and the movement speed is just fine for all overland content.

Please keep in mind the op is talking about pve. Farming mats.

For farming just slot rapid maneuver and youre fine

Raipd is too expensive for magicka. Once you cast rapids you cant sprint more than a few steps.