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Shield Nerfs Are For Real This Time
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Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭"Finally, we have made a series of broad changes to ESO’s combat that are designed to help balance sustain across all Classes, provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities, and improve the effectiveness of Light and Medium Armor Passives."
"provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities"
"counterplay...Damage Shield"
GG, ZOS. Time to finally reroll Stam Sorc after 4.5 years, seeing as they somehow believe shields can't be countered already.
https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/54803
Wtf. Already told to abandon magic sorc long before and switch to meta classes. Why people are crying now ?Edited by Priyasekarssk on September 13, 2018 5:21PM5 -
DocFrost72✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭"... to help balance sustain across all Classes,..."
I'm getting Morrowind flashbacks...
I was legitimately just yesterday discussing how the effects of the morrowind changes make no sense to the current state of the game.
ZOS's stance was they wanted to make a meaningful choice between damage and sustain, and I agree with that vision.
What actually happened is we replaced warlord and magician (iirc that's the name) with heavy attacks right along with a cp star that increases heavy attack damage complete with heavy attacks that splash and allow you to forgo aoe (lightning, 2h). We'd come full circle, and I made a bet we'd see more sustain changes soon.
I just really hope magblades aren't about to get the business end of the nerf stick: they're a strong pve spec all classes should be built like.Edited by DocFrost72 on September 13, 2018 5:26PM1 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I am happy for this.
I've quit ESO for 2 years, when they made sorcs crap and unwanted in trials in the past.
I'll quit ESO for another 2 years.
ZOS will have to stay without my ESO+ subscription and 30k crowns bought a year. Their bad. And my wallet's good.Edited by Vahrokh on September 13, 2018 5:30PMVaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO17 -
Kanar✭✭✭✭✭
✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Oh no! Now you might actually have to put a heal on your bar like everyone else!
I'm looking forward to see how they intend on improving everyone's sustain. I'm curious to see what kind of changes they're doing to light and medium armor as well.
It's not about healing, it's about avoiding damage.
Magicka characters can only block or dodge 2x before hitting 0 stamina, and with no stamina regen, it's a while before they can do either again. They also don't have evasion for passive damage mitigation.
Shields are the only thing that lets magicka characters survive in endgame content.
No stam DD uses evasion in endgame content (trials). Unless you are talking about PvP? Even there evasion is only minorly useful.
Funny to hear all the mag DDs crying about how trials will be impossible. Welcome to the stam world! About time. And don't bring up roll dodge; it is barely used to avoid damage in any trial. Maybe you can name one? You can't because pretty much all PvE dungeon and trial damage is undodgeable AoEs except for the heavy attacks.Edited by Kanar on September 13, 2018 5:36PM10 -
Valrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Oh no! Now you might actually have to put a heal on your bar like everyone else!
I'm looking forward to see how they intend on improving everyone's sustain. I'm curious to see what kind of changes they're doing to light and medium armor as well.
It's not about healing, it's about avoiding damage.
Magicka characters can only block or dodge 2x before hitting 0 stamina, and with no stamina regen, it's a while before they can do either again. They also don't have evasion for passive damage mitigation.
Shields are the only thing that lets magicka characters survive in endgame content.
No stam DD uses evasion in endgame content (trials). Unless you are talking about PvP? Even there evasion is only minorly useful.
Funny to hear all the mag DDs crying about how trials will be impossible. Welcome to the stam world! About time. And don't bring up roll dodge; it is barely used to avoid damage in any trial. Maybe you can name one? You can't because pretty much all PvE dungeon and trial damage is undodgeable AoEs except for the heavy attacks.
How about all those RaidNotifier messages that say "DODGE. SPRINT. BLOCK"?Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake3 -
Integral1900✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭... sigh... so roughly translated “we are going to make sure the trials scene is even smaller by stripping the meat of all the shields”....... this kind of nonsense is why trials is so toxic, they create a razor thin build bottleneck and then wonder why everyone ends up screaming at each other
16 -
Moonsorrow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭"... to help balance sustain across all Classes,..."
I'm getting Morrowind flashbacks...
I`m scared too. Especially since we are rather close to a good balance now, only needing small tweaks and buffs here and there so all classes at the same level both in pve and pvp, just small tweaks needed anymore.. so i fear all goes totally bonkers again, but.. you hear it first now:
- Mag warden gonna be buffed to OP
- #nerfsorc threads still pop up daily even shields got nerfed hard
- after other classes got buffs and nb did not get any changes, suddenly all other classes do 0,1% better dps than NB
Also, i really hope the shield change is something minor and not gamebreaking for sorcs, so that sorc remains fun and effective to play both at pvp and pve. I REALLY hope its not some overkill change.Edited by Moonsorrow on September 13, 2018 5:46PM1 -
Kanar✭✭✭✭✭
✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Oh no! Now you might actually have to put a heal on your bar like everyone else!
I'm looking forward to see how they intend on improving everyone's sustain. I'm curious to see what kind of changes they're doing to light and medium armor as well.
It's not about healing, it's about avoiding damage.
Magicka characters can only block or dodge 2x before hitting 0 stamina, and with no stamina regen, it's a while before they can do either again. They also don't have evasion for passive damage mitigation.
Shields are the only thing that lets magicka characters survive in endgame content.
No stam DD uses evasion in endgame content (trials). Unless you are talking about PvP? Even there evasion is only minorly useful.
Funny to hear all the mag DDs crying about how trials will be impossible. Welcome to the stam world! About time. And don't bring up roll dodge; it is barely used to avoid damage in any trial. Maybe you can name one? You can't because pretty much all PvE dungeon and trial damage is undodgeable AoEs except for the heavy attacks.
How about all those RaidNotifier messages that say "DODGE. SPRINT. BLOCK"?
Your post is so vague, all it tells me is that you need your hand held by an add-on.4 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Oh no! Now you might actually have to put a heal on your bar like everyone else!
I'm looking forward to see how they intend on improving everyone's sustain. I'm curious to see what kind of changes they're doing to light and medium armor as well.
It's not about healing, it's about avoiding damage.
Magicka characters can only block or dodge 2x before hitting 0 stamina, and with no stamina regen, it's a while before they can do either again. They also don't have evasion for passive damage mitigation.
Shields are the only thing that lets magicka characters survive in endgame content.
No stam DD uses evasion in endgame content (trials). Unless you are talking about PvP? Even there evasion is only minorly useful.
Funny to hear all the mag DDs crying about how trials will be impossible. Welcome to the stam world! About time. And don't bring up roll dodge; it is barely used to avoid damage in any trial. Maybe you can name one? You can't because pretty much all PvE dungeon and trial damage is undodgeable AoEs except for the heavy attacks.
The problem with stam in end game has nothing to do with shields. Its the recent trial design that is causing issues. The last two trials essentially amount to one encounter in a room the size of a football field. The primary problem is not survival, it's that melee doesnt work when there is a constant need to damage things that are 20 meters away. In the first 5 trials, people stack as many stamina as possible because the damage is vastly superior, and healers are more than capable of keeping everyone alive. Even in the last two trials, we are already starting to see 1-2 stamina players doing nothing but parse on the boss. Most high end magic DPS, aka nightblades, dont even slot a shield in the first 5 trials. They slot minor force.Edited by Oreyn_Bearclaw on September 13, 2018 6:02PM4 -
Valrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Oh no! Now you might actually have to put a heal on your bar like everyone else!
I'm looking forward to see how they intend on improving everyone's sustain. I'm curious to see what kind of changes they're doing to light and medium armor as well.
It's not about healing, it's about avoiding damage.
Magicka characters can only block or dodge 2x before hitting 0 stamina, and with no stamina regen, it's a while before they can do either again. They also don't have evasion for passive damage mitigation.
Shields are the only thing that lets magicka characters survive in endgame content.
No stam DD uses evasion in endgame content (trials). Unless you are talking about PvP? Even there evasion is only minorly useful.
Funny to hear all the mag DDs crying about how trials will be impossible. Welcome to the stam world! About time. And don't bring up roll dodge; it is barely used to avoid damage in any trial. Maybe you can name one? You can't because pretty much all PvE dungeon and trial damage is undodgeable AoEs except for the heavy attacks.
How about all those RaidNotifier messages that say "DODGE. SPRINT. BLOCK"?
Your post is so vague, all it tells me is that you need your hand held by an add-on.
You effectively say that dodge is useless in Trials and that damage shields carry magicka builds.
I say you're wrong when the accepted "right" way involves a fair about of dodging blocking and sprinting...which Stam can do more of.Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake1 -
Zer0oo✭✭✭✭✭
✭I am scared. PLS do not be a morrowind disaster
- Update 23Ice Furnace: This item set now grants Spell Damage, rather than Weapon Damage for the 4 piece bonus4 -
Universe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Although it is really an unnecessary nerf, I have expected this.
I don't know what the combat team has against the sorcerer class but it is clear there is some agenda to make it lesser each update.
As I posted in the past, I was expecting this:Sadly, given the past nerfs to sorcerer and damage shields we can expect a nerf to shields, like 1 or more of the following(examples):
1. Reduce damage shields effectiveness by 30%-50%.
2. Damage shields will be critable.
3. Damage shields can't stack.
4. Damage shields reduce the damage of the player by 10%-20%.
5. Damage shields will reduce self healing by 30%-50% - that way zos may make the healers more viable.
There is no need to nerf damage shields.
The current damage output of different abilities/sets far outweigh the strength of the damage shields and they offer much less protection than they used to.
I guess some healers will get what they wish, but sorcerers will have an harder time.
It's illogical that while there are so many issues with sorcerer they decide to nerf the damage shields.
It's seems like that the players who have opened countless discussions about "Sorcerer is OP" nonsense got what they wanted.Edited by Universe on September 13, 2018 6:00PMSome videos I recorded for fun: Main character:
PC EU main: Universe - AD magicka Sorcerer, Former Emperor, Grand Overlord, The Merciless, Trial Bosses Solo Champion
Top alts: Genius(stamina/sagicka Dragonknight) The Force(stamina Nightblade) and other chars.
PC NA main: The Magic - AD magicka Sorcerer
Started playing ESO in beta & early access
User_ID: Daedric_Prince9 -
Jake1576✭✭✭✭✭All i ever wanted was for Shields to be critable if they did that i would be happy there is no need to make any changes to shields directly just to how they take damage if they was critable i would definitely stand a better chance against a sorcerer that does nothing but stack shields my problem is being a ganker and my damage is crit and i end up hitting a shield i do crap damage to get their shield down if shields was to be made critable i would have a better opportunity against a shield stacker there is no reason why someone should have all that defense and take hardly any damage this also goes for people who hold block on stamina builds i don't understand why my damage i do to them is so little if you want to just hold block fine but i should be able to do more damage to themEdited by Jake1576 on September 13, 2018 5:59PM1
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_Ahala_✭✭✭✭✭
✭Pls tell me that they aren’t just gonna buff the blue Betty mag return and consider that the Magden rework... Also how exactly does nerfing shields in general help the state of Magden in PvP?Edited by _Ahala_ on September 13, 2018 5:59PM4 -
Bergzorn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Let's just wait for the PTS.Jk, I'm scared too!no CP PvP PC/EU
EP Zergborn
DC Zerg Beacon
guild master, raid leader, janitor, and only member of Zergbored6 -
Haashhtaag✭✭✭✭✭
✭All i ever wanted was for Shields to be critable if they did that i would be happy there is no need to make any changes to shields directly just to how they take damage if they was critable i would definitely stand a better chance against a sorcerer that does nothing but stack shields my problem is being a ganker and my damage is crit and i end up hitting a shield i do crap damage to get their shield down if shields was to be made critable i would have a better opportunity against a shield stacker there is no reason why someone should have all that defense and take hardly any damage this also goes for people who hold block on stamina builds i don't understand why my damage i do to them is so little if you want to just hold block fine but i should be able to do more damage to them
Critting shields would be disastrous10 -
Kanar✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Oh no! Now you might actually have to put a heal on your bar like everyone else!
I'm looking forward to see how they intend on improving everyone's sustain. I'm curious to see what kind of changes they're doing to light and medium armor as well.
It's not about healing, it's about avoiding damage.
Magicka characters can only block or dodge 2x before hitting 0 stamina, and with no stamina regen, it's a while before they can do either again. They also don't have evasion for passive damage mitigation.
Shields are the only thing that lets magicka characters survive in endgame content.
No stam DD uses evasion in endgame content (trials). Unless you are talking about PvP? Even there evasion is only minorly useful.
Funny to hear all the mag DDs crying about how trials will be impossible. Welcome to the stam world! About time. And don't bring up roll dodge; it is barely used to avoid damage in any trial. Maybe you can name one? You can't because pretty much all PvE dungeon and trial damage is undodgeable AoEs except for the heavy attacks.
The problem with stam in end game has nothing to do with shields. Its the recent trial design that is causing issues. The last two trials essentially amount to one encounter in a room the size of a football field. The primary problem is not survival, it's that melee doesnt work when their is a constant need to damage things that are 20 meters away. In the first 5 trials, people stack as many stamina as possible because the damage is vastly superior, and healers are more than capable of keeping everyone alive. Even in the last two trials, we are already starting to see 1-2 stamina players doing nothing but parse on the boss. Most high end magic DPS, aka nightblades, dont even slot a shield in the first 5 trials. They slot minor force.
What stops stamNB bow/bow builds from joing AS and CR? They parse similar to magicka classes. The reason is their lack of survivability (shields). I mean, you even indirectly admitted this by saying magNB don't slot shields in first 5 trials (ie they do slot and rely on shields in the most recent two).0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Like shield builds aren't already the lowest and worst form of surviving im open world.
Time to kill off light armour users in pvp i guess. Either go heavy build a light block build.
I've yet to lose to a mag sorc in a 1v1 in open world this patch, too easy to counter and it's not hard to time burst on them.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...8 -
FlyingSwan✭✭✭✭✭Wow. Left the game at Morrowind because of the complete shambles ZOS made of that rebalance, came back a week ago only to find they are still meddling.
Someone should tell ZOS that even chimpanzees learn from their mistakes.Edited by FlyingSwan on September 13, 2018 6:08PM20 -
Kanar✭✭✭✭✭
✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Oh no! Now you might actually have to put a heal on your bar like everyone else!
I'm looking forward to see how they intend on improving everyone's sustain. I'm curious to see what kind of changes they're doing to light and medium armor as well.
It's not about healing, it's about avoiding damage.
Magicka characters can only block or dodge 2x before hitting 0 stamina, and with no stamina regen, it's a while before they can do either again. They also don't have evasion for passive damage mitigation.
Shields are the only thing that lets magicka characters survive in endgame content.
No stam DD uses evasion in endgame content (trials). Unless you are talking about PvP? Even there evasion is only minorly useful.
Funny to hear all the mag DDs crying about how trials will be impossible. Welcome to the stam world! About time. And don't bring up roll dodge; it is barely used to avoid damage in any trial. Maybe you can name one? You can't because pretty much all PvE dungeon and trial damage is undodgeable AoEs except for the heavy attacks.
How about all those RaidNotifier messages that say "DODGE. SPRINT. BLOCK"?
Your post is so vague, all it tells me is that you need your hand held by an add-on.
You effectively say that dodge is useless in Trials and that damage shields carry magicka builds.
I say you're wrong when the accepted "right" way involves a fair about of dodging blocking and sprinting...which Stam can do more of.
Right. Magicka DDs 9-10k stam pool and 400 regen which they don't use for anything but blocking or sprinting, is insufficient to block the occasional mechanic.
And that has nothing to do with roll dodge. Most AoEs and ground placed AoEs are undodgeable, and that is what trial mechanics are.0 -
Crafts_Many_Boxes✭✭✭✭✭My mag sorc can just barely complete VMA right now. If they nerf shields, I won't be able to complete VMA anymore. That's some value added there, lemme tell ya! *sarcasm*
Stop nerfing PvE for PvP. Stop making the same mistakes every other MMO in the past has, and separate PvE from PvP. It's hard, and it'll take along time, but literally half of the complaints about your game will go away. Just do it already.29 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭All i ever wanted was for Shields to be critable if they did that i would be happy there is no need to make any changes to shields directly just to how they take damage if they was critable i would definitely stand a better chance against a sorcerer that does nothing but stack shields my problem is being a ganker and my damage is crit and i end up hitting a shield i do crap damage to get their shield down if shields was to be made critable i would have a better opportunity against a shield stacker there is no reason why someone should have all that defense and take hardly any damage this also goes for people who hold block on stamina builds i don't understand why my damage i do to them is so little if you want to just hold block fine but i should be able to do more damage to them
You're a ganker... wait until their shields drop because they don't know you are there and they only last 6 seconds?
Critting against shields is a terrible idea. Shields would also have to be able to crit for higher values to be fair, and then sorcs are left with a defense that varies too widely to be reward skillful play.6 -
Alaztor91✭✭✭✭✭
✭''provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities''
The wording makes me think that it is probably a change aimed for PvP, maybe ZOS will allow them to receive crit damage but also benefit from your resistances, maybe they will change them to only absorb 90% of the damage received but increase their duration/reduce cost. Whatever it is that they do I just hope that they don't gut mag sorcs only defensive mechanic.4 -
Jhalin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I’m cautiously optimistic about improving sustain. I’d really like to be able to level my Stam Sorc without having to dread the inevitable “you’re out of stam” sound once he dings 501 -
IcyDeadPeople✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Interested to see what they do.
Currently it's relatively easy to get up to around 30-40k shield PVE / 15-20k PVP with either hardened ward or dampen magic by stacking the offensive stat (max magicka), so we are not sacrificing damage output. For the other types of damage mitigation (high resistances, frequent blocking, frequent dodge rolling, etc) there is more of a trade off for the player.
Maybe they will adjust so damage shield size scales based on max health, more of a difficult choice to spec either into defensive magicka tank vs high damage output? Or by counterplay maybe they mean some sort of new set like shield breaker?
maybe ZOS will allow them to receive crit damage but also benefit from your resistances
Hmm, could be right
Edited by IcyDeadPeople on September 13, 2018 6:31PM1 -
Didgerion✭✭✭✭✭
✭"Finally, we have made a series of broad changes to ESO’s combat that are designed to help balance sustain across all Classes, provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities, and improve the effectiveness of Light and Medium Armor Passives."
"provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities"
"counterplay...Damage Shield"
GG, ZOS. Time to finally reroll Stam Sorc after 4.5 years, seeing as they somehow believe shields can't be countered already.
https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/54803
Why stam sorc?
You won't connect your Dizzying Swing with anything that knows how to PVP.
I'd say roll a stam sorc only if ZOS adds a surprise attack equivalent to sorc class.
Then...don't use Dizzy?
A lot of Stam Sorcs use DoT builds and spam Steel Tornado or...more rarely, Rapid Strikes.
Rapid Strikes has the same problem as Dizzy. And a DoT build will always be stronger on a Stam-DK.
Also Templars became very strong lately and all of them use purge in their builds - so good luck with the DoT build in PVP.
The only strong skill the stam sorc has is the Dark-Exchange - as it got CC immunity now and really easy to convert resources - even in the enemy's face - which I find broken.
Other than that the class is a joke imo - a really fast running joke.Edited by Didgerion on September 13, 2018 6:31PM0 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Im really trying hard rn not to just rage at this.......
Shields do not need counter play... there are enough counter plays for shields with cc, shield breaker, sloads, shattering blows, res drain poisons
Light armor cant work without shields.... would you expect stam to survive if you dropped there resist to 5k and what is the point of playing mag if you dont have shields, stam already pulls higher dps
@ZOS_Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert
Yall touch shield.... shield changes so up in patch notes.... and im DONE17 -
firedrgn✭✭✭✭✭Once again pvp changes so pve player going tonget rekt. Just make pvp morph and pve morphs.
Its like they act like its illegal to make 4 morphs for some of the skills. Give 2 pvp morphs and 2 pve morphs .8
This discussion has been closed.