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Calling BS on Incap nerf.
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Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Are you seriously asking for a d.swing nerf?
Oh wait.. I'm on the forums again.. Right. Stamblade weakest class ever guys.. Better nerf take flight while at it.
Oh please. We're not magsorcs; we know we're in a good spot. This is just nitpicking honestly.
I think the Incap change was a good one. I just don't like the green icon lol
Stamblades are not in a ''good'' spot, there is your mistake. Both stam and magblades are simply broken. I think everyone outside of nightblade mains realized it at this point. İnvisibility+invulnerability at your will.... and balance team loses their mind about stam whip...
Mark my words wrobel and his bias will ruin this game one day.
If Cloak is what makes the class OP then by all means nerf it if it's over-performing.
It's a whole package deal. Off of the top of my head NBs have access to everything while most classes have little to no access.
Hell only NBs have access to non-medium evasion >50%4 -
Galarthor✭✭✭✭✭
✭If Cloak is what makes the class OP then by all means nerf it if it's over-performing.
Because many builds lack counters that can intergrated into their builds.
Because it allows NBs to effectively Perma-Dodge.
Because combined with Shade it provides the best escape and kiting tool in the game, with almost no counter - especially when not on open field.0 -
Finviuswe✭✭✭✭Cloak only last 2.5 seconds so it doesn't need to be nerfedEdited by Finviuswe on September 10, 2018 9:36PM0 -
Drakkdjinn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »Are you seriously asking for a d.swing nerf?
Oh wait.. I'm on the forums again.. Right. Stamblade weakest class ever guys.. Better nerf take flight while at it.
Oh please. We're not magsorcs; we know we're in a good spot. This is just nitpicking honestly.
I Lol’d3 -
IZZEFlameLash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Waffennacht wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Are you seriously asking for a d.swing nerf?
Oh wait.. I'm on the forums again.. Right. Stamblade weakest class ever guys.. Better nerf take flight while at it.
Oh please. We're not magsorcs; we know we're in a good spot. This is just nitpicking honestly.
I think the Incap change was a good one. I just don't like the green icon lol
Stamblades are not in a ''good'' spot, there is your mistake. Both stam and magblades are simply broken. I think everyone outside of nightblade mains realized it at this point. İnvisibility+invulnerability at your will.... and balance team loses their mind about stam whip...
Mark my words wrobel and his bias will ruin this game one day.
If Cloak is what makes the class OP then by all means nerf it if it's over-performing.
It's a whole package deal. Off of the top of my head NBs have access to everything while most classes have little to no access.
Hell only NBs have access to non-medium evasion >50%
Yep. NB has the most complete toolkit out of all classes. Warden comes close second but not really. Btw, Incap nerf compared to other nerfs in the past is nothing at all. Why are you even whining about it on the forums?Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel5 -
SquareSausage✭✭✭✭✭ChiknAriseMcFro wrote: »People can dodge it just standing still but somehow this needed a nerf. Did y'all just listen to a few whiney players that don't know how to dodge and kept getting hit by it? The stun doesn't even work about 75% of the time the skill isn't dodged and it's dodged a solid 50%+ of the time.
Oh yea. The opponent tells us when his ulti is up and that we should prepare to roll dodge as we obv don't know how to dodge.
Breakfast KingPS4 EU0 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ChiknAriseMcFro wrote: »This was a pointless nerf. Seriously. Why did it need anything changed when it was already dodgeable? People can dodge it just standing still but somehow this needed a nerf. Did y'all just listen to a few whiney players that don't know how to dodge and kept getting hit by it? The stun doesn't even work about 75% of the time the skill isn't dodged and it's dodged a solid 50%+ of the time. If anything needs fixed its the way that cast time skills getting spammed work. I.e. snipe spam, dizzying swing, etc. Edit because I forgot to mention the resto/lightning staff bug. Yet another MORE important thing to worry about than an underachieving or balanced skill. Even before the nerf it was barely hitting.
What is major evasion?
What is CC immunity?
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Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Cloak only last 2.5 seconds so it doesn't need to be nerfed
I wish hardened ward lasted that long when under attack!
Imho, one of the strongest abilities in the NB toolkit is Surprise Attack - and its largely down to how, being a class ability, it can be used with any weapon.
My stamsorc has to use pierce armour for an instant melee spammable with major breach - but that's tied to SnB so the weapon damage sucks(and SA with SnB does it better). There is no instant high-damage spammable which can be used with DW or 2-H.
StamDK is in the same boat.
My Stamplar has to use sweeps for a spammable if it wants to use 2-hander - which is really buggy in terms of trying to land it - especially when laggy and/or opponent is running swift..
This one ability alone makes stamblade VERY desirable to play.. not to mention it's massively overloaded!
Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.2 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The nerf was fine and as someone who runs his night blade often; we’re lucky that’s all the further it went. There are getting to be more and more NBs who spam cloak in between every weave, and while I find most can be wrecked if you someone bothers with a counter; it’s going to draw attention. Already has but it’s due for more.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
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Its the kind of nerf that runecage got..Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.8 -
KingJ✭✭✭✭✭
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1 counter and you can kill 80-90% of stamblades currently.Use Steel nado break cloak and most don't know what to do or try to cloak again in the same spot.The nerf was fine and as someone who runs his night blade often; we’re lucky that’s all the further it went. There are getting to be more and more NBs who spam cloak in between every weave, and while I find most can be wrecked if you someone bothers with a counter; it’s going to draw attention. Already has but it’s due for more.
Edited by KingJ on September 11, 2018 4:07PM2 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
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1 counter and you can kill 80-90% of stamblades currently.Use Steel nado break cloak and most don't know what to do or try to cloak again in the dame spot.The nerf was fine and as someone who runs his night blade often; we’re lucky that’s all the further it went. There are getting to be more and more NBs who spam cloak in between every weave, and while I find most can be wrecked if you someone bothers with a counter; it’s going to draw attention. Already has but it’s due for more.
Detection pots are also a great way to secure an easy kill against a Stamblade.0 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The nerf changed nothing.
If you weren't fearing or hitting suprise attack from stealth BEFORE incap then you weren't playing NB correctly anyway. Any player worth their salt would just dodge your incap after your opener otherwise.1 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Are you seriously asking for a d.swing nerf?
Oh wait.. I'm on the forums again.. Right. Stamblade weakest class ever guys.. Better nerf take flight while at it.
Oh please. We're not magsorcs; we know we're in a good spot. This is just nitpicking honestly.
I think the Incap change was a good one. I just don't like the green icon lol
Stamblades are not in a ''good'' spot, there is your mistake. Both stam and magblades are simply broken. I think everyone outside of nightblade mains realized it at this point. İnvisibility+invulnerability at your will,easy sustain, best single target damage, ez mode spammable, ez execute, shade.... and meanwhile balance team loses their minds thinking stam whip would be so broken or something..
Mark my words Wrobel and his bias will definitely ruin this game. Lets see how long it takes before people get sick of elder nightblades online.
I have a hard time seeing how magblade is broken when the class has actual HARD counters. If you are a magblade and you come across a mag dk open world it's a good chance you are just going to die. It has everything to completely shut you down between snares, roots and wings. Warden is also pretty annoying to fight because they are almost unkillable by a magblade. Really anything with a counter to projectiles and magblades will do zero damage. Magblade has it's niche in being a great dueling class but open world PvP it leaves alot to be desired.
Melee magblade doesn't have the weaknesses of a ranged magblade but it doesn't have any strengths either. It has the worse sustain of any class and by the time you patch up that weakness you don't have any burst left. It's also squishy with bad healing. There really isn't many magblades is PvP it's probably my least encountered class I see more magwardens that magblades in cyrodiil. Maybe all the magblades are in battlegrounds i don't know.1 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well actually Incap nerf was a suggested change from NB class representative thread. I don't want to say that this skill was some crazy OP (since you could dodge & block that) but some changes were need.
Most impactful Death Stroke & its morphs changes so far:
1. Change cost from 50 ultimate to 70 ultimate: When the game originally launched Death Stroke & its morphs costed 50 ultimate points. This skill was simply designed as a cheap ultimate (keep in mind I am talking about 2014 so back then all classes were much stronger).
2. Fixing Soul Harvest (magicka morph) to be dodge-able: People preferred to use Soul Harvest (magicka morph) as back then all magicka based skills were un-dodge-able (the design thought was: "How can you dodge a magic ? You can't." )
This was fixed in Morrowind update I think.
3. Changing the stun from Incapacitating Strike to only stun when used with 120 ultimate points or more: this was done in Summerset update (current state).
My observation:
Since Summerset (05.21.2018) I have noticed that almost all NB dropped Incapacitating Strike. It was like 3 - 4 months ago. So for the period of that 3 - 4 months I saw maybe like.. 10 - 15 times when some NB was using Incapacitating Strike in PvP. Pretty much every Nightblade swapped it for Dawnbreaker or even Soul Tether.
I don't want to say that it was over-nerfed or something but seeing how almost every NB now is using Dawnbreaker of Smiting (cheaper , undodgeable AOE ultimate with stun.) or even Soul Tether... well... we went from like 90% of stam NB using Incapacitating Strike to like 90% of NB not using Incapacitating Strike at all... hmm...
Edited by Tommy_The_Gun on September 11, 2018 5:10PM1 -
fred4✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Gilliam the Rogue championed this particular way to nerf Incap. I think it was overnerfed a bit. The cost should be more like 100, given that it's single target and Dawnbreaker is available for 125.1 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »I don't want to say that it was over-nerfed or something but seeing how almost every NB now is using Dawnbreaker of Smiting (cheaper , undodgeable AOE ultimate with stun.) or even Soul Tether... well... we went from like 90% of stam NB using Incapacitating Strike to like 90% of NB not using Incapacitating Strike at all... hmm...
PC EU, mainly no cp, both cyro and BGs here, I still see many, many, many stamblades using Incap over DB. Not really a surprise to me since you can still spam it (you have other great CC) + all the other benfits that incap brings. Interesting how observations can differ.4 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
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1 counter and you can kill 80-90% of stamblades currently.Use Steel nado break cloak and most don't know what to do or try to cloak again in the same spot.The nerf was fine and as someone who runs his night blade often; we’re lucky that’s all the further it went. There are getting to be more and more NBs who spam cloak in between every weave, and while I find most can be wrecked if you someone bothers with a counter; it’s going to draw attention. Already has but it’s due for more.
Oh; I know. Ran into a group of 3 or magblades the other night. Or at least I think they were magblades the way they were spamming cloak. They had a few people pinned down trying to figure out what was going on. I walked up and popped a detect pot and had 2 killed before it wore off and the other one I started just jabbing away as he disappeared and all he did was keep trying to cloak again.
I've seen a couple good ones though that are going to wreck someone either way and I imagine the guys I ran into there were trying to copy what they saw.1 -
Finviuswe✭✭✭✭Gilliam the Rogue championed this particular way to nerf Incap. I think it was overnerfed a bit. The cost should be more like 100, given that it's single target and Dawnbreaker is available for 125.
I think upping the cost to 100, other than that keeping everything the way it was would've been appropriate.
Or else just don't change it at all (I know it's too late).
The nerf hardly mattered because a lot of the time the opponent is cc'd beforehand, you're still getting your incap roughly every 8 seconds and it just shreds through people.Edited by Finviuswe on September 11, 2018 9:15PM1 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
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Ye, similar to urs when it comes to sorcs. lol.
Oh you mean when I suggested Frags to be able to proc while on your back bar, to have blast function like frags, to have streak break roots, to have defensive rune be undodgeable, and to have power surge grant minor intellect?
Very well I take it back.2 -
IAVITNI✭✭✭✭✭Stamblades are in a very good spot right now. One of the few if not the only class that has one of the highest pushable PvE dps's, but also the ability to still push the highest burst in PvP while still speccing towards towards two Regen/defensive sets. The Incap change was absolutely necessary albeit a small one. If this change is hindering your gameplay as a stamblade then perhaps you just aren't very good at playing as a stamblade.
In the words of a very good player I once knew: Stamblades carry trash players, but a proficient stamblade? He is unstoppable.
Do you not know that player anymore?
I'd actually argue to buff nightblades (magsorc main myself), but only defensively. It would open the opportunity to balance Cloak. Yes Cloak is a class defining skill but I'm tired of fighting Cloakblades that light attack+poison inject then Cloak until they have Incap. It's annoying to fight. A single skill allows a class to ignore pretty much all combat mechanics. Nightblades need a supplemental tool for survival so a Cloak nerf isn't too damaging.
**That fight I lost was only my own stamblade and I stopped Cloaking because it was literally Cloak Ambush roll dodge for 5 minutes. I don't run Mark or Detect pots because I think they're cheese.1 -
KingJ✭✭✭✭✭
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The Nb i have fought lately just make my shake my head.I fought some that make me think got damn are these magblades perma cloaking and staying out of range of my detection.
1 counter and you can kill 80-90% of stamblades currently.Use Steel nado break cloak and most don't know what to do or try to cloak again in the dame spot.The nerf was fine and as someone who runs his night blade often; we’re lucky that’s all the further it went. There are getting to be more and more NBs who spam cloak in between every weave, and while I find most can be wrecked if you someone bothers with a counter; it’s going to draw attention. Already has but it’s due for more.
Detection pots are also a great way to secure an easy kill against a Stamblade.
1 counter and you can kill 80-90% of stamblades currently.Use Steel nado break cloak and most don't know what to do or try to cloak again in the same spot.The nerf was fine and as someone who runs his night blade often; we’re lucky that’s all the further it went. There are getting to be more and more NBs who spam cloak in between every weave, and while I find most can be wrecked if you someone bothers with a counter; it’s going to draw attention. Already has but it’s due for more.
Oh; I know. Ran into a group of 3 or magblades the other night. Or at least I think they were magblades the way they were spamming cloak. They had a few people pinned down trying to figure out what was going on. I walked up and popped a detect pot and had 2 killed before it wore off and the other one I started just jabbing away as he disappeared and all he did was keep trying to cloak again.
I've seen a couple good ones though that are going to wreck someone either way and I imagine the guys I ran into there were trying to copy what they saw.
My common experience last couple of patchs.Edited by KingJ on September 11, 2018 10:26PM0 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Are you seriously asking for a d.swing nerf?
Oh wait.. I'm on the forums again.. Right. Stamblade weakest class ever guys.. Better nerf take flight while at it.
Careful, even joking about a DK nerf might cause it to really happen!
Who even cares about leap when people can outrun it anyways? Swift sooo balanced lmao.
True. I just move in an arc away from them so that they can't target me either.Dalsinthus wrote: »I agree that the nerf was kind of unnecessary, but it is not a big deal. The skill misses a lot if not timed well as it is and the increased cost for the cc brings it up to the cost of DBoS, which is a better skill in many ways (not dodgeable, AoE, easy to animation cancel, passively buffs weapon damage, etc.). I've debated whether to drop Incap for Dawny, but so far Incap has remained on my bar. I usually use an opener from stealth or fear anyway for CC, so I was not getting the CC effect that often before the nerf.
I also agree that there is a lot of complaining from sorcs and occasionally nightblades on the forums about how terrible their class is. I play both in pvp and pve and think they are in a good place right now, so I find most of the complaining to be over the top. It is true that mNB is king in pve right now, but that's a topic for another thread.
I dodge DB quite often...Trust me. Either that, or people really love cancelling it themselves for me
Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »I don't want to say that it was over-nerfed or something but seeing how almost every NB now is using Dawnbreaker of Smiting (cheaper , undodgeable AOE ultimate with stun.) or even Soul Tether... well... we went from like 90% of stam NB using Incapacitating Strike to like 90% of NB not using Incapacitating Strike at all... hmm...
PC EU, mainly no cp, both cyro and BGs here, I still see many, many, many stamblades using Incap over DB. Not really a surprise to me since you can still spam it (you have other great CC) + all the other benfits that incap brings. Interesting how observations can differ.
These guys are full of it No NB that cloaks is using DBoS, and if they are, they should know that when they use it they are exposing themselves to getting CC'd and destroyed because of Dawnbreaker's animation. Now, they could use it and instantly roll, but by doing that, they still won't be cloaked and a smart person would have them dead before they do. Incap isn't going anywhere. Edited by Kadoin on September 12, 2018 3:05AM1 -
Gorilla✭✭✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Are you seriously asking for a d.swing nerf?
Oh wait.. I'm on the forums again.. Right. Stamblade weakest class ever guys.. Better nerf take flight while at it.
Oh please. We're not magsorcs; we know we're in a good spot. This is just nitpicking honestly.
I think the Incap change was a good one. I just don't like the green icon lol
Stamblades are not in a ''good'' spot, there is your mistake. Both stam and magblades are simply broken. I think everyone outside of nightblade mains realized it at this point. İnvisibility+invulnerability at your will,easy sustain, best single target damage, ez mode spammable, ez execute, shade.... and meanwhile balance team loses their minds thinking stam whip would be so broken or something..
Mark my words Wrobel and his bias will definitely ruin this game. Lets see how long it takes before people get sick of elder nightblades online.
How are Magblades broken (unless you mean they need a revamp -- in which case I agree)? Outside of bombers (a different discussion) effective magblade builds tend to all mirror (and trail) magsorcs. There are some variants, but in PVP they are not in a good spot. Again, bombers are a different breed.
As for cloaking, it is so easy to pull a magblade out its pathetic. Most of the good players I know don't even use it because they have to imitate Sorcs.
Agree on stamblades.0 -
_Salty_✭✭✭✭✭It sounds like a L2F problem.
Learn- to-fear. Us stamblades still have the most broken cc in the game.Psn l---Salty---l
Patiently waiting to make a Stankcromancer.2 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
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Ye, similar to urs when it comes to sorcs. lol.
Oh you mean when I suggested Frags to be able to proc while on your back bar, to have blast function like frags, to have streak break roots, to have defensive rune be undodgeable, and to have power surge grant minor intellect?
Very well I take it back.
No I mean after ur suggestions to nerf curse, nerf wrath, remove shieldstacking, make defile affect healing ward and dots go through shields. Or that other time when u compared curse to incap and actually concluded that curse is better. Or that other time when u compared medium stamblade without cloak with shieldstacking sorcs. Or that other time talking about empirical evidence without even knowing what empirical means. The list goes on and on.7 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭IZZEFlameLash wrote: »Waffennacht wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Are you seriously asking for a d.swing nerf?
Oh wait.. I'm on the forums again.. Right. Stamblade weakest class ever guys.. Better nerf take flight while at it.
Oh please. We're not magsorcs; we know we're in a good spot. This is just nitpicking honestly.
I think the Incap change was a good one. I just don't like the green icon lol
Stamblades are not in a ''good'' spot, there is your mistake. Both stam and magblades are simply broken. I think everyone outside of nightblade mains realized it at this point. İnvisibility+invulnerability at your will.... and balance team loses their mind about stam whip...
Mark my words wrobel and his bias will ruin this game one day.
If Cloak is what makes the class OP then by all means nerf it if it's over-performing.
It's a whole package deal. Off of the top of my head NBs have access to everything while most classes have little to no access.
Hell only NBs have access to non-medium evasion >50%
Yep. NB has the most complete toolkit out of all classes. Warden comes close second but not really. Btw, Incap nerf compared to other nerfs in the past is nothing at all. Why are you even whining about it on the forums?
Wardens have better buffs than nb's.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1
