Updated: When was the last pug friendly dungeon added to the game?

Guppet · August 2018

Update: The new DLC dungeons are just about right. Quite puggable in fact. Depends on your pug I guess.

I guess this answers my question lol. Just nice to see them going this route.

Maybe a little long though.

Emma_Overload · August 2018

Hear, hear!

ZOS, I refuse to pay for more content that NOBODY in group finder wants to play. Why is it so hard for you guys to make more content like the original 2014 dungeons?

erlewine · August 2018

what exactly is the problem? Normal difficulties are extremely easy, completed by any dungeon finder group with little issue. Veteran is moderately difficult, yet still beatable in guild finder groups. In fact, every time I've gotten vet MHK/MoS in solo queue, we've completed it, but it did take some doing and we had a few people familiar with the dungeon. Then Hardmodes are for experienced groups looking for a challenge.

madchuska83 · August 2018

Odd, I was able to run one of the new dungeons with a PUG last night. Granted, we had to kick a fake tank at the Hedge Maze boss, but we got it done.

Normal is not hard. It may be a challenge for "casual" players but do you really want enemies that die in two hits? And the mechanics part, there is normally an NPC screaming them at you during the fight.

FakeFox · August 2018

Normal difficulty?

And why I don't like dungeon DLC? Because it is boring. You do each dungeon a few times and it's over, nothing more to do. Apart from that the more recent dungeons are pretty boring if you ask me. Too much unnecessary waiting and running in circles. Mechanics have only one way to play them or you are one shot and ZOS seems to be so afraid of players skipping phases now that good groups spent half the fights with DPS stops, waiting for the boss. Oh, and did I mention bugs? The last three dungeon DLCs where so buggy on release that either you got everything for free or progression was pretty much impossible.

Tasear · August 2018

Personally I have no issues pugging dungeons. Usually all it takes for success is a leader and someone to share experience.

Merlin13KAGL · August 2018

On normal, every single one is PuGable.

On Vet, there are non-DLC dungeons some groups still have issue clearing.

The issue doesn't lay so much in the difficulty as it does in the lack of requirement to actually improve skill via what used to be dungeon progression.

Normal requires almost nothing of you. That isn't the solution, it's the problem.

acw37162 · August 2018

I prefer to run veteran dungeons.

When I am able to log on where other players and guildies I know are available there are zero issue.

The ability to use group finder (PUG) vet dungeons is an exercise in futility most days.

I don’t know what the fix is for this but I would venture this effects quite a few people.

WrathOfInnos · August 2018

August 13, 2018.

Nestor · August 2018

When a game has players of different interests, it is very hard to please all of them.

Personally I like having content that is too difficult to PUG, as long as it can be cleared by a good group with comms. It gives me something to work for.

So, what is ZOS to do when bringing in new content? They are pretty much left with no choice but to make it hard simply because so much content is easy. These dungeons do tend to get nerfed overtime. However, I do need something to shoot for.

karekiz · August 2018

March of Sacrifices <Non HM> is much easier than Horn/Dragon bones. I am talking MUCH easier. Trash bosses etc. You can even have trash heavy attack you <dps blocking> and it won't instantly kill you. Try that with a mino or golem.

AsheronRealaidain · August 2018

Guppet wrote: »

But people who enjoy more casual dungeons have gone even longer with no new content.

How is normal difficulty not a casual option? I'm confused. I got Moon Hunter Keep doing the random normal yesterday. We wiped one time on the last boss, and I died one other time to those big ass werewolves throughout the dungeon (damn they hit hard!) I had no prior knowledge of the dungeon and I PvP 80% of the time. How much more casual should normal difficulty be? Mobs should just fall over dead as you walk by them? Normal in any dungeon should be PUGable unless you are matched up with truly bad or under geared players.

redspecter23 · August 2018

I agree completely with this. DLC dungeons are basically hard and harder as you say. There is no option for casual players to enjoy the content being presented which alienates a large amount of players.

LadyNalcarya · August 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

I agree completely with this. DLC dungeons are basically hard and harder as you say. There is no option for casual players to enjoy the content being presented which alienates a large amount of players.

Normal mode exists.
Veteran mode is basically an equivalent of "hard mode" in a single-player game.

redspecter23 · August 2018

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

I agree completely with this. DLC dungeons are basically hard and harder as you say. There is no option for casual players to enjoy the content being presented which alienates a large amount of players.

Normal mode exists.
Veteran mode is basically an equivalent of "hard mode" in a single-player game.

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Yes, normal is just fine for many players, but there are quite a few out there that will find it out of reach when 3 others of their skill level get grouped together.

You could just tell them to "git gud" but they don't want to. They want to play in their own way at their own pace and anyone telling them what to do will just be an elitist in their minds.

For these types of players, they hit a wall once they do a DLC dungeon on normal. The difficulty of DLC dungeons on normal is out of line compared to non DLC dungeons on normal and it is an issue for many, even if it's not an issue to others.

jypcy · August 2018

Even if you can’t successfully pug a dungeon on the first go, maybe make friends with those people and plan a time to come back in together and have another go at it.

LadyNalcarya · August 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

I agree completely with this. DLC dungeons are basically hard and harder as you say. There is no option for casual players to enjoy the content being presented which alienates a large amount of players.

Normal mode exists.
Veteran mode is basically an equivalent of "hard mode" in a single-player game.

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Yes, normal is just fine for many players, but there are quite a few out there that will find it out of reach when 3 others of their skill level get grouped together.

You could just tell them to "git gud" but they don't want to. They want to play in their own way at their own pace and anyone telling them what to do will just be an elitist in their minds.

For these types of players, they hit a wall once they do a DLC dungeon on normal. The difficulty of DLC dungeons on normal is out of line compared to non DLC dungeons on normal and it is an issue for many, even if it's not an issue to others.

4k? I mean, you will get more by spamming light attacks. And there was a vid of people clearing veteran White-Gold tower with just light attack spam...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eACSnaI1gFY
No matter how casual you are, you can figure out how to light attack and understand that spamming emotes on mobs doesnt really help.
You're kinda insulting the intelligence of casual players tbh.

Jinchuu · August 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Yes, normal is just fine for many players, but there are quite a few out there that will find it out of reach when 3 others of their skill level get grouped together.

You could just tell them to "git gud" but they don't want to. They want to play in their own way at their own pace and anyone telling them what to do will just be an elitist in their minds.

For these types of players, they hit a wall once they do a DLC dungeon on normal. The difficulty of DLC dungeons on normal is out of line compared to non DLC dungeons on normal and it is an issue for many, even if it's not an issue to others.

You seem to be confusing trash players with casual players, there's a huge gulf separating the two.

karekiz · August 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Meta isn't as defining as you think.

The NB I play with can use Warmaiden + Mother's Sorrow and still complete things like Mazz/Bloodroot HM. Both of which are harder DPS checks that count on both <not just one> DPS to do their job.

Players that play their character totally wrong <DPS in full heavy etc> should stick to NON dlc. As its obvious they haven't learned their role yet. They are probably sub 160. If you meet one of these simply do this:

Craft them a 5/5/2 set. Done. Here is an example.

New Tank Setup:
Fortified Brass - 5
Hist Bark - 5
Arena - 2

New Healer Setup:
Julianos - 5
Krag - 5
Willow Path - 2

New Stam DPS Setup:
Night Mother Gaze - 5
Hunding Rage - 5
Shacklebreaker - 2

New Mag DPS Setup:
Julianos - 5
Magnus - 5
Torug - 2

Is it the best? Of course not. Is it workable for non vet dlc? Of course. That is just pure crafted. If you wanted better you could easily buy overworld stuff. Swap out magnus for tinker gear and bam your set for very cheap.

I think people often either often do extremes:

Totally ignore anything regarding role: DPS using full heavy in dungeon based content, with zero HP.

Only try to get BIS RAID NEW BUILD: Players that just hit 160 - refuse to get a set that isn't listed as "Best" as filler slots until they get the BIS, which just makes doing everything twice as hard for them. Then with their 160-200 CP and no idea of mechanics go full glass cannon cause "My DPS will lower if I add HP", and get killed by the first AoE anyway causing any DPS to basically hit the brakes.

LadyNalcarya · August 2018

Jinchuu wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Yes, normal is just fine for many players, but there are quite a few out there that will find it out of reach when 3 others of their skill level get grouped together.

You could just tell them to "git gud" but they don't want to. They want to play in their own way at their own pace and anyone telling them what to do will just be an elitist in their minds.

For these types of players, they hit a wall once they do a DLC dungeon on normal. The difficulty of DLC dungeons on normal is out of line compared to non DLC dungeons on normal and it is an issue for many, even if it's not an issue to others.

You seem to be confusing trash players with casual players, there's a huge gulf separating the two.

Exactly! "Casual" doesnt mean "lazy and dumb".
And trying to defend someone by saying theyre too dumb to spam attacks of any kind? I would be offended tbh.

Apache_Kid · August 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

I agree completely with this. DLC dungeons are basically hard and harder as you say. There is no option for casual players to enjoy the content being presented which alienates a large amount of players.

Normal mode exists.
Veteran mode is basically an equivalent of "hard mode" in a single-player game.

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Yes, normal is just fine for many players, but there are quite a few out there that will find it out of reach when 3 others of their skill level get grouped together.

You could just tell them to "git gud" but they don't want to. They want to play in their own way at their own pace and anyone telling them what to do will just be an elitist in their minds.

For these types of players, they hit a wall once they do a DLC dungeon on normal. The difficulty of DLC dungeons on normal is out of line compared to non DLC dungeons on normal and it is an issue for many, even if it's not an issue to others.

If they don't want to improve or change why should content be catered to them? This is honestly ridiculous. If you're doing 4k dps then you need to not queue up for group content at all. And even if you do 4k dps, all of the dungeons are do-able on normal if you follow the mechanics and stay out of stuff you shouldn't stand it. You're not asking for a normal difficultly you're asking for a brainless difficulty. As someone said above, what you're describing isn't a casual player it's a garbage player who simply does not care.

Starlock · August 2018

Jinchuu wrote: »

You seem to be confusing trash players with casual players, there's a huge gulf separating the two.

It seems to me "casual player" doesn't have any standard meaning. I've taken to avoiding the term entirely because of that.

Guppet · August 2018

karekiz wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Meta isn't as defining as you think.

The NB I play with can use Warmaiden + Mother's Sorrow and still complete things like Mazz/Bloodroot HM. Both of which are harder DPS checks that count on both <not just one> DPS to do their job.

Players that play their character totally wrong <DPS in full heavy etc> should stick to NON dlc. As its obvious they haven't learned their role yet. They are probably sub 160. If you meet one of these simply do this:

Craft them a 5/5/2 set. Done. Here is an example.

New Tank Setup:
Fortified Brass - 5
Hist Bark - 5
Arena - 2

New Healer Setup:
Julianos - 5
Krag - 5
Willow Path - 2

New Stam DPS Setup:
Night Mother Gaze - 5
Hunding Rage - 5
Shacklebreaker - 2

New Mag DPS Setup:
Julianos - 5
Magnus - 5
Torug - 2

Is it the best? Of course not. Is it workable for non vet dlc? Of course. That is just pure crafted. If you wanted better you could easily buy overworld stuff. Swap out magnus for tinker gear and bam your set for very cheap. I think people either often do extremes:

Totally ignore anything regarding role: DPS using full heavy in dungeon based content, with zero HP.
Only try to get BIS RAID NEW BUILD: Players that just hit 160 - refuse to get a set that isn't listed as "Best" as filler slots until they get the BIS, which just makes doing everything twice as hard for them.

Are you honestly suggesting you should spend thousands of gold and spend time leaving and comming back into the dungeon to make gear for players that don’t want to improve?

I started the thread and I’d rather just add attunment or dps checks than think crafting gear for strangers would ever be the solution.

That very literally would b just handing them gear for entering the instance.

Crafts_Many_Boxes · August 2018

I appreciate the effort, OP, but you're wasting your time here. The forums are 99% filled with dedicated players who do follow the meta and play 10-20+ hours a week.

For them, of course DLC dungeons aren't hard on normal. Of course they are going to assert it isn't hard. I'm part of that camp as well, but I still avoid pugging them because of how painful they can get.

The other day an IRL friend of mine picked up the game and started playing. Talking to them, I realized I myself had gotten pretty out of touch with the truly casual playerbase (which is significant, proportionally speaking). These players aren't even all level 50, let alone following the metas or having set bonuses. Vanilla dungeons are easy enough for them to complete, but they have no hope in DLC dungeons.

I hate to bring things back to WoW, but the hardest WoW dungeons were nowhere near as difficult as the DLC dungeons are in ESO. And you know what? They were popular. They had broad appeal. Blizzard understands that you can keep difficult content in raids, and let your dungeons be relatively fun and easy.

When you try and integrate raid-level difficulty into dungeons, you just make large swathes of your playerbase unhappy, possibly larger than the hardcores you DO make happy. This is what we're seeing in ESO in the last few content releases.

redspecter23 · August 2018

The type of players I'm talking to aren't locked out of the queue. I was tanking vet EH2 the other day. I pulled 6k dps and that was good enough for 50% of the group damage throughout the dungeon, including the end boss. Yes this was vet and yes we completed, but these players queue all the time. Had this been a normal DLC dungeon, we likely would have just disbanded the group at some point. I suppose my thought is that normal should be faceroll easy for adequate players and still quite easy for the lowest caliber players. That's where I'd personally balance normal dungeons. I'd just like to see a similar difficulty level across all normals and an increased difficulty level across all veteran content, but still similar within that group. Add more difficulty levels on top of that if necessary. I want consistency. What we have now is people queueing for random and then potentially still dropping and taking the penalty on DLC dungeons due to pugs not being able to complete. You can make an argument that any content is too easy or too hard. That's subjective. I just want all content that is defined as "normal" to be of similar difficulty levels so players know what they're in for. The label "DLC" shouldn't automatically mean the difficulty is bumped up compared to other content in the same group.

LadyNalcarya · August 2018

Guppet wrote: »

karekiz wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Meta isn't as defining as you think.

The NB I play with can use Warmaiden + Mother's Sorrow and still complete things like Mazz/Bloodroot HM. Both of which are harder DPS checks that count on both <not just one> DPS to do their job.

Players that play their character totally wrong <DPS in full heavy etc> should stick to NON dlc. As its obvious they haven't learned their role yet. They are probably sub 160. If you meet one of these simply do this:

Craft them a 5/5/2 set. Done. Here is an example.

New Tank Setup:
Fortified Brass - 5
Hist Bark - 5
Arena - 2

New Healer Setup:
Julianos - 5
Krag - 5
Willow Path - 2

New Stam DPS Setup:
Night Mother Gaze - 5
Hunding Rage - 5
Shacklebreaker - 2

New Mag DPS Setup:
Julianos - 5
Magnus - 5
Torug - 2

Is it the best? Of course not. Is it workable for non vet dlc? Of course. That is just pure crafted. If you wanted better you could easily buy overworld stuff. Swap out magnus for tinker gear and bam your set for very cheap. I think people either often do extremes:

Totally ignore anything regarding role: DPS using full heavy in dungeon based content, with zero HP.
Only try to get BIS RAID NEW BUILD: Players that just hit 160 - refuse to get a set that isn't listed as "Best" as filler slots until they get the BIS, which just makes doing everything twice as hard for them.

Are you honestly suggesting you should spend thousands of gold and spend time leaving and comming back into the dungeon to make gear for players that don’t want to improve?

I started the thread and I’d rather just add attunment or dps checks than think crafting gear for strangers would ever be the solution.

That very literally would b just handing them gear for entering the instance.

Thousands of gold might sound cool and all, but you're getting thousands of gold just by leveling (level up rewards). I got about 200k just by clearing Cadwell's silver zones (quests+delves+selling trash drops).
Alternatively, you can decon the loot and ask someone to craft the gear for you.
And again, what you are saying is borderline offensive. It's almost like you're implying that casual players are mentally impaired to the point they cannot spam one button and cant even do the quests (to earn gold). Of course, some people are actually incapable of that, but they usually dont play video games and need special care. Your typical gamer certainly doesnt fall into this category.
Those 4k dps dds you are talking about arent "poor casuals". They are jsut arrogant and self-centered people who think that their dungeon party is here to carry them. This is a toxic attitude, and I dont see why you want to support it.

karekiz · August 2018

Guppet wrote: »

Are you honestly suggesting you should spend thousands of gold and spend time leaving and comming back into the dungeon to make gear for players that don’t want to improve?

I started the thread and I’d rather just add attunment or dps checks than think crafting gear for strangers would ever be the solution.

That very literally would b just handing them gear for entering the instance.

1. Yes I have given fresh new characters starting equipment. I'm sorry if thats mind boggling for you, I am unsure why. But its quite easy to tell from two runs if a player really wants to improve, and is just new. Maybe I can tell it better than you can, I dunno. It doesn't cost much to make it.

2. The title of the thread is: "When was the last pug friendly dungeon added to the game?" - I replied, you didn't listen. March of sacrifices is easier than Horns/Dragon bones. Period. Mobs hit FAR less, and mechanics are far more forgiving <Again excluding HM, which pugs won't often do anyway>. I guess the sneak fight can confuse people, but thats about all I can think of. Poison statues and atro's are easy Pug Killers in vet with little chance of recovery <Ever been in low DPS bloodroot where the DPS can't get atro's down? Or low DPS + Bad mechanics in fang lair. Yeah, good luck with the 2nd boss. Let alone people constantly running into poison over and over.

March of sacs final boss: Water bad -> Move to island -> water good -> move to water -> Rinse and repeat -> Hunt phase -> find blue light -> move there.

Rinse and repeat till dead. Burn at execute 20% as hunt goes on timer <Hint: Save ults>

Yeah....i'll take that over random poison statues any day.

*Edit:

Change your title to: Should they make a DPS/Tank/Heal <cause it ain't just DPS pal> to que <You can still enter free> for DLC dungoens - For which yes I agree, they should.

Guppet · August 2018

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

karekiz wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Meta isn't as defining as you think.

The NB I play with can use Warmaiden + Mother's Sorrow and still complete things like Mazz/Bloodroot HM. Both of which are harder DPS checks that count on both <not just one> DPS to do their job.

Players that play their character totally wrong <DPS in full heavy etc> should stick to NON dlc. As its obvious they haven't learned their role yet. They are probably sub 160. If you meet one of these simply do this:

Craft them a 5/5/2 set. Done. Here is an example.

New Tank Setup:
Fortified Brass - 5
Hist Bark - 5
Arena - 2

New Healer Setup:
Julianos - 5
Krag - 5
Willow Path - 2

New Stam DPS Setup:
Night Mother Gaze - 5
Hunding Rage - 5
Shacklebreaker - 2

New Mag DPS Setup:
Julianos - 5
Magnus - 5
Torug - 2

Is it the best? Of course not. Is it workable for non vet dlc? Of course. That is just pure crafted. If you wanted better you could easily buy overworld stuff. Swap out magnus for tinker gear and bam your set for very cheap. I think people either often do extremes:

Totally ignore anything regarding role: DPS using full heavy in dungeon based content, with zero HP.
Only try to get BIS RAID NEW BUILD: Players that just hit 160 - refuse to get a set that isn't listed as "Best" as filler slots until they get the BIS, which just makes doing everything twice as hard for them.

Are you honestly suggesting you should spend thousands of gold and spend time leaving and comming back into the dungeon to make gear for players that don’t want to improve?

I started the thread and I’d rather just add attunment or dps checks than think crafting gear for strangers would ever be the solution.

That very literally would b just handing them gear for entering the instance.

Thousands of gold might sound cool and all, but you're getting thousands of gold just by leveling (level up rewards). I got about 200k just by clearing Cadwell's silver zones (quests+delves+selling trash drops).
Alternatively, you can decon the loot and ask someone to craft the gear for you.
And again, what you are saying is borderline offensive. It's almost like you're implying that casual players are mentally impaired to the point they cannot spam one button and cant even do the quests (to earn gold).

I think your a bit confused. I never suggested any such thing. I responded to somone saying craft players gear. Which would cost the crafter thousands in mats. That’s not something you should expect of people.

Apache_Kid · August 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

The type of players I'm talking to aren't locked out of the queue. I was tanking vet EH2 the other day. I pulled 6k dps and that was good enough for 50% of the group damage throughout the dungeon, including the end boss. Yes this was vet and yes we completed, but these players queue all the time. Had this been a normal DLC dungeon, we likely would have just disbanded the group at some point. I suppose my thought is that normal should be faceroll easy for adequate players and still quite easy for the lowest caliber players. That's where I'd personally balance normal dungeons. I'd just like to see a similar difficulty level across all normals and an increased difficulty level across all veteran content, but still similar within that group. Add more difficulty levels on top of that if necessary. I want consistency. What we have now is people queueing for random and then potentially still dropping and taking the penalty on DLC dungeons due to pugs not being able to complete. You can make an argument that any content is too easy or too hard. That's subjective. I just want all content that is defined as "normal" to be of similar difficulty levels so players know what they're in for. The label "DLC" shouldn't automatically mean the difficulty is bumped up compared to other content in the same group.

Good, people that do 4-6k Dps and queue as a DD should not be using the group finder period. Their laziness causes the time of other people to be wasted by them queuing up for a dungeon with their no dps and asking for carry. Hopefully they queue up and get discouraged and leave and never queue again until they improve their DPS.

Your solution of making normal even easier and vet even more difficult will give these fools a false sense of security when they actually try to do the vet dungeons. Base-game normal dungeons are faceroll easy and no one learns anything form them. At least the normal DLC dungeons are idiot-proofed and attempt to teach mechanics and situational awareness to some extent.

AsheronRealaidain · August 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Then guess what, it's on those players to get better at that point. The game can't hold your hand at every turn, that's just crazy.

LadyNalcarya · August 2018

Guppet wrote: »

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

karekiz wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

Normal mode DLC is too hard for very casual players. I'm talking about 4k dps on a good day. Players that log in for a few hours a week. Players that don't follow the meta... or even use appropriate gear to their role. DPS in full heavy. Healers that spam mutagen and nothing else.

Meta isn't as defining as you think.

The NB I play with can use Warmaiden + Mother's Sorrow and still complete things like Mazz/Bloodroot HM. Both of which are harder DPS checks that count on both <not just one> DPS to do their job.

Players that play their character totally wrong <DPS in full heavy etc> should stick to NON dlc. As its obvious they haven't learned their role yet. They are probably sub 160. If you meet one of these simply do this:

Craft them a 5/5/2 set. Done. Here is an example.

New Tank Setup:
Fortified Brass - 5
Hist Bark - 5
Arena - 2

New Healer Setup:
Julianos - 5
Krag - 5
Willow Path - 2

New Stam DPS Setup:
Night Mother Gaze - 5
Hunding Rage - 5
Shacklebreaker - 2

New Mag DPS Setup:
Julianos - 5
Magnus - 5
Torug - 2

Is it the best? Of course not. Is it workable for non vet dlc? Of course. That is just pure crafted. If you wanted better you could easily buy overworld stuff. Swap out magnus for tinker gear and bam your set for very cheap. I think people either often do extremes:

Totally ignore anything regarding role: DPS using full heavy in dungeon based content, with zero HP.
Only try to get BIS RAID NEW BUILD: Players that just hit 160 - refuse to get a set that isn't listed as "Best" as filler slots until they get the BIS, which just makes doing everything twice as hard for them.

Are you honestly suggesting you should spend thousands of gold and spend time leaving and comming back into the dungeon to make gear for players that don’t want to improve?

I started the thread and I’d rather just add attunment or dps checks than think crafting gear for strangers would ever be the solution.

That very literally would b just handing them gear for entering the instance.

Thousands of gold might sound cool and all, but you're getting thousands of gold just by leveling (level up rewards). I got about 200k just by clearing Cadwell's silver zones (quests+delves+selling trash drops).
Alternatively, you can decon the loot and ask someone to craft the gear for you.
And again, what you are saying is borderline offensive. It's almost like you're implying that casual players are mentally impaired to the point they cannot spam one button and cant even do the quests (to earn gold).

I think your a bit confused. I never suggested any such thing. I responded to somone saying craft players gear. Which would cost the crafter thousands in mats. That’s not something you should expect of people.

Like I said, casual activities actually give you enough gold to afford the gear. And even though no one is forced to help newbies with crafting, many of us do (myself included). Implying that casual players are incapable of doing so ("4k dps in a good day", "cannot afford gear") is kinda rude for the reasons I stated above.