Dungeon Rant (from a casual)

AlnilamE · August 2018

Linaleah wrote: »

Krayl wrote: »

Yes. Rewards you absolutely don't need for if your goal in the game is to run the same easy dungeons you are familiar with repeatedly. Rewards you can earn if you wanted to use the random dungeon finder and risk a challenge to earn them. Good point!

rewards that are easily accessible to people who are not subscribers and avoid buying dungeon DLC's! yes, such a wonderful system right there - lets give the same rewards for dungeon that takes 5 minutes and is super relaxing to run, and a place that takes.. a lot longer then 5 minutes and is a pain. rewards that are used for crafting, which generally is a SOLO endeavor. please. not to mention the whole... yes, lets make it suck for everyone, both people who have to keep backfilling their groups and people who are now waiting out their 15 minutes penalty.

LEAVE THE CHALLENGE FOR VETS. (speaking of which, why in a bloody hell random reward for vet is exactly the same as random reward for normal?)

Because City of Ash II and Crypt of Hearts II are so easy? I got put into one of the new dungeons today in my random. Moonhunter Keep? I was already in progress so I probably missed one of the bosses, but it was pretty straightforward, with one fight that has a couple of mechanics. I'll take that over CoA II any day. Same with Falkreath Hold.

BTW, my randoms today were:

- Vaults of Madness (Warden Healer)
- Moonhunter Keep (Templar Healer)
- Selene's Web (Sorc Healer)
- White Gold Tower (NB Healer)
- Direfrost Keep (DK Tank)

I didn't find Moonhunter Keep to be any harder than Selene's (which is my least favourite dungeon) or Direfrost.

FrancisCrawford · August 2018

weg0 wrote: »

@newtinmpls, I didn’t mean to shame you. Sorry bout that.

You don’t need trial gear. Julianos/Hundings + spc/bsw/ms/spriggans/spinners/... is fine. Tank should have Ebon though right? Purple or blue jewelerly is also more than enough.

1. Tank needs to keep aggro and not die. Try to keep boss halfway between entrance and middle statue.

2. Damage the boss with a regular rotation when possible (keep DoTs up, use spammables, maintain resource pools). Stay close for when the chain adds spawn.

3. Just use the normal bash. Roll dodge and sprint to gap close if tank gets pinned down.

4. When center statue starts spewing red flames just step out of the way or block them. When distant adds spawn, send dps to kill them and collect the red essence balls.

Not sure what guide says he dies then a dot comes, but that is not right.

Another thing, eventhough you may not have/ be using BiS gear, check out the slotted skills for your respective roles on alcast’s website (or dottz). Tank shouldn’t be using shield bash (its killer in pvp but unnecessary/inefficient in pve) for example.

Is Crushing Shock a viable alternative to bashing?

weg0 · August 2018

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Is Crushing Shock a viable alternative to bashing?

Gosh. I don’t know. I just got used to bashing for interrupts since I use force pulse only on my magsorc, but you can try it.

newtinmpls · August 2018

GawdSB wrote: »

I don't ever want to do dlc dungeons (especially vet) with a random group of people in the first place.

Mostly I agree, but shortly after the DLC that had Cradle of Shadows, I and two friends were in queue for a random (heal and 2 DPS) and we had the incredible experience of working the frikken best tank I have ever seen. It was only in chat (no teamspeak or skype or whatever), but he would tell us what he was going to do with mobs/groups, would basically say "stand here, I'll do this and then you unleash" it was totally amazing.

So yeah, maybe randoms have their risks, but you also can have really shockingly good experiences.

weg0 · August 2018

That’s what I’m talking about @newtinmpls. Some of my best experiences in the game (apart from finally clearing vMA) have been randomly queueing in over my head and luckily landing with one or more awesome/helpful counterparts who know what they are doing and go over basics of each fight. Now I try to do the same whenever I can. By trying to skip out on that content you really are missing out on some of the best the game has to offer.

DuskMarine · August 2018

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

weg0 wrote: »

@newtinmpls, I didn’t mean to shame you. Sorry bout that.

You don’t need trial gear. Julianos/Hundings + spc/bsw/ms/spriggans/spinners/... is fine. Tank should have Ebon though right? Purple or blue jewelerly is also more than enough.

1. Tank needs to keep aggro and not die. Try to keep boss halfway between entrance and middle statue.

2. Damage the boss with a regular rotation when possible (keep DoTs up, use spammables, maintain resource pools). Stay close for when the chain adds spawn.

3. Just use the normal bash. Roll dodge and sprint to gap close if tank gets pinned down.

4. When center statue starts spewing red flames just step out of the way or block them. When distant adds spawn, send dps to kill them and collect the red essence balls.

Not sure what guide says he dies then a dot comes, but that is not right.

Another thing, eventhough you may not have/ be using BiS gear, check out the slotted skills for your respective roles on alcast’s website (or dottz). Tank shouldn’t be using shield bash (its killer in pvp but unnecessary/inefficient in pve) for example.

Is Crushing Shock a viable alternative to bashing?

yes its viable and actually required for quite a few vet bosses to avoid getting cleaved into oblivion

Yamakaziing · August 2018

5 runs of ICP and got almost identical drops with only leeching set. 3 leeching swords.... I don’t want 3 swords.

Huyen · August 2018

Krayl wrote: »

So ZOS should implement a new system because you spend 2% of your time with a 50% or so chance of drawing a dungeon you don't like even though you're grouped with friends and could likely just communicate and learn the dungeon so the next time you do it, its easy (like it is for everyone else)?

It's amazing to me how many people on this board admit they are complaining about an infinitesimal annoyance but they expect a company to spend the money and time to suit their needs.

and of course someone will chime in and say "ITS JUST ONE SIMPLE LINE OF CODE", because they watched a movie once where someone had to hack the webs.

Lets see if you still enjoy scalecaller peak on normal after getting it as random 8 times in a row with crappy people. Its the main reason that Im gonna drop Eso when the new fallout hits.

Doctordarkspawn · August 2018

AlnilamE wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

Krayl wrote: »

Yes. Rewards you absolutely don't need for if your goal in the game is to run the same easy dungeons you are familiar with repeatedly. Rewards you can earn if you wanted to use the random dungeon finder and risk a challenge to earn them. Good point!

rewards that are easily accessible to people who are not subscribers and avoid buying dungeon DLC's! yes, such a wonderful system right there - lets give the same rewards for dungeon that takes 5 minutes and is super relaxing to run, and a place that takes.. a lot longer then 5 minutes and is a pain. rewards that are used for crafting, which generally is a SOLO endeavor. please. not to mention the whole... yes, lets make it suck for everyone, both people who have to keep backfilling their groups and people who are now waiting out their 15 minutes penalty.

LEAVE THE CHALLENGE FOR VETS. (speaking of which, why in a bloody hell random reward for vet is exactly the same as random reward for normal?)

Because City of Ash II and Crypt of Hearts II are so easy? I got put into one of the new dungeons today in my random. Moonhunter Keep? I was already in progress so I probably missed one of the bosses, but it was pretty straightforward, with one fight that has a couple of mechanics. I'll take that over CoA II any day. Same with Falkreath Hold.

BTW, my randoms today were:

- Vaults of Madness (Warden Healer)
- Moonhunter Keep (Templar Healer)
- Selene's Web (Sorc Healer)
- White Gold Tower (NB Healer)
- Direfrost Keep (DK Tank)

I didn't find Moonhunter Keep to be any harder than Selene's (which is my least favourite dungeon) or Direfrost.

The fact you are running those class and roll combinations with atleast moderate success shows to me you A, know your roll, and B, got good pugs. That's not a good indication of dungeon difficulty so much as it is how lucky you were.

MartiniDaniels · August 2018

I run pugs 90% of the time, and it's usually just a routine in base normals or vet1's.. we usually don't talk with randoms other then hi chest ty bb.. but when we got to vet2 or dlc vets things start to turn interesting, even without one fake healer/dps it requires conversation sometimes like "dps i don't imply anything but maybe you'll try to kill adds first" and dps reply that tank need to keep boss somewhere and healer asks everybody to dodge AOE, that's spirit, that's teamwork and if there is fake healer or tank/dps are not up-to-snuff it is drama and pure challenge, so why remove such fun?

Heimpai · August 2018

Krayl wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

and no, they are not THAT easy, not if you are only casually occasionally doing dungeons and do not run minmaxed builds/rotations

There are delves and group dungeons in zones for 'casual' players.

There are veteran and hard mode dungeons for 'hard core' players.

group dungeons assume you have an interested in at least somewhat coordinated group content - meaning you're actually trying to perform well with a group.

if you're not interested in being effective and actually trying, don't queue up with random people who will be - group with your friends and go run delves and public dungeons.

If vet is for hardcore then shouldn’t monster helms drop from normal too? Only reason i ever do a dungeon is for the gear, i pvp 98% of the time so i don’t have the elitist builds or rotations for pve but some pvp gear is locked behind that HardCore pve wall

Not everyone is going to spend hours perfecting a rotation like you

That being said as a pve casual i do fine in vet dungeons, but im far from great..doesn’t mean I’m not interested in being effective

Linaleah · August 2018

AlnilamE wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

Krayl wrote: »

Yes. Rewards you absolutely don't need for if your goal in the game is to run the same easy dungeons you are familiar with repeatedly. Rewards you can earn if you wanted to use the random dungeon finder and risk a challenge to earn them. Good point!

rewards that are easily accessible to people who are not subscribers and avoid buying dungeon DLC's! yes, such a wonderful system right there - lets give the same rewards for dungeon that takes 5 minutes and is super relaxing to run, and a place that takes.. a lot longer then 5 minutes and is a pain. rewards that are used for crafting, which generally is a SOLO endeavor. please. not to mention the whole... yes, lets make it suck for everyone, both people who have to keep backfilling their groups and people who are now waiting out their 15 minutes penalty.

LEAVE THE CHALLENGE FOR VETS. (speaking of which, why in a bloody hell random reward for vet is exactly the same as random reward for normal?)

Because City of Ash II and Crypt of Hearts II are so easy? I got put into one of the new dungeons today in my random. Moonhunter Keep? I was already in progress so I probably missed one of the bosses, but it was pretty straightforward, with one fight that has a couple of mechanics. I'll take that over CoA II any day. Same with Falkreath Hold.

BTW, my randoms today were:

- Vaults of Madness (Warden Healer)
- Moonhunter Keep (Templar Healer)
- Selene's Web (Sorc Healer)
- White Gold Tower (NB Healer)
- Direfrost Keep (DK Tank)

I didn't find Moonhunter Keep to be any harder than Selene's (which is my least favourite dungeon) or Direfrost.

I have found that the difficulty of the dungeon is a least partly directly proportionate to how good and/or knowledgeable your group is.

Selenes for whatever reason is something I get often as a random. however... as long as you know how to cleverly use your environment, its a pretty forgiving dungeon, that includes the last boss. don't even need high or even mediocre dps for it.

DLC dungeons? are nowhere NEAR that forgiving. I have wiped and died in DLC dungeons with people who are very VERY good, becasue rng was not on our side, becasue of minor derps with one shot mechanics, etc etc. Selene took me one run to learn. I do agree that CoAII sucks, since it has that same issue of "you MUST have good dps in addition to situational awareness" thing. that said, so does Falkreath, sure mechanics are straightforward, but just following mechanics is not enough if I remember correctly (the pillars thing)

so maybe, there should be 3 tiers of rewards rather then 2? or something. I don't know, all I'm saying is that dungeon difficulties wildly vary, but DLC dungeons are steadily, progressively getting less and less accessible for someone like me for instance. in part becasue of one shot mechanics, in part becasue of dps requirements, etc etc.

Yamakaziing · August 2018

Just don’t make us run dungeons 15 time in a row and not a single thing we wanted. Out of the 4 x 15 people that ran it not a single sheer venom ring. So stupid. 100% trying to waste our time.

D0PAMINE · August 2018

You think thats bad? Im stuck 2 maning the damn nDLC dungeons with whatever unlucky friend I pestor because no one wants to run them and im not pugging because it's usually a horrible experience on new mechanics. If I can't find a friend, I try to solo it on a damn Magplar. Sweep sweep sweep. Lol

D0PAMINE · August 2018

Yamakaziing wrote: »

Just don’t make us run dungeons 15 time in a row and not a single thing we wanted. Out of the 4 x 15 people that ran it not a single sheer venom ring. So stupid. 100% trying to waste our time.

You know, one of the things I really hate is that it takes longer to get the gear then it does to get bored of the build in my case. I don't even theorycraft on live much anymore but I still want some fun potent sets I can swap because I did the content to get em.