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Improve Servers or More Content?
bethsheba
✭✭✭
Improve Servers or More Content? 161 votes
Improve servers
79%
128 votes
More content
20%
33 votes
3
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Gythral✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Other
Both
not either or
nor would I want the crown store team or the story writers, combat team or any other content artist anywhere near the server/network hardware or any of the code needed for either
They are very very different things...“Be as a tower, that, firmly set,
Shakes not its top for any blast that blows!”
Dante Alighieri, The Divine Comedy13 -
cyx54tc✭✭✭✭dev: improve servers
marketing: more content
general rule of thumb: marketing > player opinion > dev4 -
LordSarevok✭✭✭✭Improve serversThey are indeed very different things. but the parent company gives a single lump sum budget. They then have to decide which area gets those funds/resources. So in effect, putting more hours/people on story/crown items is directly affecting how much money/resources the server/network team gets.2 -
Hurtfan✭✭✭✭✭Improve serversno brainer imoFor the Pact!Keyboard not found, press any key to continue0
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LordSarevok✭✭✭✭Improve serversKind of like how you get paid. You take your yearly salary and have to divvy it up to pay for rent, car, groceries etc. Would you buy a new TV when your car doesn't start?
That's what ZoS is doing... Their car won't start and they have a water leak destroying their homes foundation. So they invest in new landscaping.7 -
Universe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Improve serversWhat is happening now is the following:
ZOS releases new content without sufficiently fixing the old content and/or improving server and client performance.
What should be happening:
Server performance in both PVP and PVE is bad and there is an urgent need for improvement.
Same for Combat balance, ZOS should focus on delivering better gameplay with existing content and only after release more content.Edited by Universe on August 1, 2018 3:26PMSome videos I recorded for fun: Main character:
PC EU main: Universe - AD magicka Sorcerer, Former Emperor, Grand Overlord, The Merciless, Trial Bosses Solo Champion
Top alts: Genius(stamina/sagicka Dragonknight) The Force(stamina Nightblade) and other chars.
PC NA main: The Magic - AD magicka Sorcerer
Started playing ESO in beta & early access
User_ID: Daedric_Prince9 -
DMuehlhausen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭They are all separate teams. None of them work directly with each other either. The content team will keep putting out content and the network/server team will continue to try and improve performance. Neither will stop doing what they are suppose to be doing.2 -
Cerbolt✭✭✭✭Improve serversIt's the games code that's the real issue but improving the servers couldn't hurt.PS EU | AD - For the Queen!
Dar'zhir - Khajiit Sorcerer | Vashirr - Khajiit Dragonknight | Relaryn - Altmer Vampblade | Khahan-ra - Khajiit Templar
Zathril - Altmer Frostden | Runaril -Altmer Necromancer | Ma'zak - Khajiit Arcanist | Gaelhwen - Bosmer Bowden2 -
BigBragg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Not entirely sure these things come from the same department or that one would mutually exclued the other. Issues could also not actually be the servers and be the netcode of part of the engine.0 -
Universe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Improve serversDMuehlhausen wrote: »They are all separate teams. None of them work directly with each other either. The content team will keep putting out content and the network/server team will continue to try and improve performance. Neither will stop doing what they are suppose to be doing.
This is true.
But there is the matter of budgeting and oversight prioritization.
The management can allocate an higher budget to the server/network team if they believe it is a priority.
Same for the combat balance team etc.Some videos I recorded for fun: Main character:
PC EU main: Universe - AD magicka Sorcerer, Former Emperor, Grand Overlord, The Merciless, Trial Bosses Solo Champion
Top alts: Genius(stamina/sagicka Dragonknight) The Force(stamina Nightblade) and other chars.
PC NA main: The Magic - AD magicka Sorcerer
Started playing ESO in beta & early access
User_ID: Daedric_Prince4 -
Narvuntien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Por Quanos Los Dos
(Sorry i don't know Spanish I just know the meme)
So basically the games artists pay the bills for the game. So always making new content means more art which means more crown store (and crate) content basically the game is funded by new content you can't stop the content or the game stalls.
The people that deal with the stability are completely different set of people and I think perhaps they should hire more people to deal with it rather than stopping the content.0 -
LordSarevok✭✭✭✭Improve serversApparently nobody understands how a business like this works. I will try to make it very simple and I apologize if this comes off as harsh or demeaning.
As a person who has run a personal business for many years and other business's for many years. There is a thing called a yearly budget plan. They look at many factors to come up with this plan. It takes into account, user base, advertising, supplies, payroll (the largest expense by far) etc. My monthly plan tracked a total of 41-45 pages of incoming/outgoing expenses and let me know where I stood for each month, quarter, and end of year. Every business does this. EVERY one.
This is a budget approved by the higher ups and the board so they can report properly to investors on what targets they think they will hit. It is tracked to a scathing degree, because it can have a huge impact on stock prices. They call it controllable expenses for a reason.
What ZoS is doing is making a STRATEGIC decision to not invest in more payroll/resources to fix the issues. Don't be fooled. They are investing more on content and cosmetic items because they stand to gain more revenue in the short term. We might *** and moan about lag and all that but we still pay and play. They will only divert more money from new content if revenue from cosmetics and new content start to dip precipitously, with the cause being directly attributed to server/network issues and not a day before.
TLDR; They have a set amount of money each year to use. They are using most of that money on new content/cosmetics. Lets say they have been given a budget of $100. It costs them $93.75 in payroll and resources for new content. That leaves $6.25 for the server/network team. So if we want more people on the IT side it will pull from the content side.
Again I apologize if I offended anybody but its the truth. I lived it for almost 2 decades...4 -
DocFrost72✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭LordSarevok wrote: »Apparently nobody understands how a business like this works. I will try to make it very simple and I apologize if this comes off as harsh or demeaning.
As a person who has run a personal business for many years and other business's for many years. There is a thing called a yearly budget plan. They look at many factors to come up with this plan. It takes into account, user base, advertising, supplies, payroll (the largest expense by far) etc. My monthly plan tracked a total of 41-45 pages of incoming/outgoing expenses and let me know where I stood for each month, quarter, and end of year. Every business does this. EVERY one.
This is a budget approved by the higher ups and the board so they can report properly to investors on what targets they think they will hit. It is tracked to a scathing degree, because it can have a huge impact on stock prices. They call it controllable expenses for a reason.
What ZoS is doing is making a STRATEGIC decision to not invest in more payroll/resources to fix the issues. Don't be fooled. They are investing more on content and cosmetic items because they stand to gain more revenue in the short term. We might *** and moan about lag and all that but we still pay and play. They will only divert more money from new content if revenue from cosmetics and new content start to dip precipitously, with the cause being directly attributed to server/network issues and not a day before.
TLDR; They have a set amount of money each year to use. They are using most of that money on new content/cosmetics. Lets say they have been given a budget of $100. It costs them $93.75 in payroll and resources for new content. That leaves $6.25 for the server/network team. So if we want more people on the IT side it will pull from the content side.
Again I apologize if I offended anybody but its the truth. I lived it for almost 2 decades...
I understand and agree with this, but then wouldn't it be a question of "Should ZOS divert more resources to the bug/lag/issue resolving team?"
Because the way this poll is worded makes it sound like you can only do one or the other, leading to my confusion.1 -
Dagoth_Rac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭More contentLordSarevok wrote: »They are indeed very different things. but the parent company gives a single lump sum budget. They then have to decide which area gets those funds/resources. So in effect, putting more hours/people on story/crown items is directly affecting how much money/resources the server/network team gets.
But cutting back on or cutting out content will hit their revenues hard. And that will affect future budget for server/network teams.
And shifting the budget means laying off the people who design content so you can hire more server/network people. And then likely many months for those new hires to become experts in how ESO is designed so they have enough knowledge to identify and fix performance problems. If this was easy to fix, it would have been fixed by now. It is obviously a difficult fix. And throwing more people at it is not a quick fix for difficult problems. You need people with a deep understanding of how ESO works to help solve difficult issues. And that takes time and training, not just more warm bodies.
The folks who design boss mechanics in Trials? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. The folks who design the new motifs that come with every Update? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. The folks who wrote the Summerset quest lines? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. The folks who came up with the Psijic Order skill line? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. You cannot just move all your current employees onto the server performance team. That means the content people have to be laid off. They will go get jobs with other companies. So even if you do eventually get servers improved, the game will have lost a lot of revenue (and player population) in the process and the people who designed the content that brings in revenue will be gone.2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Different teams do different things. If the server need work then fine, that should be done, although I don't personally have any performance issues although I understand that others do (although those issues may not all be server-related or resolved by the poll option of "more servers"). Content should meanwhile continue to be developed as per the quarterly schedule.2 -
Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
This. The people who manage the servers are not the same one's who develop new content and you couldn't take staff from either and move them around.Different teams do different things. If the server need work then fine, that should be done, although I don't personally have any performance issues although I understand that others do (although those issues may not all be server-related or resolved by the poll option of "more servers"). Content should meanwhile continue to be developed as per the quarterly schedule.
I mean, if you want Wrobel to stop balancing the game and balance the server load instead, I am sure we could try that.
@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."4 -
Undefwun✭✭✭✭✭I've always subbed, but I'd pay separately if they ditched 1 or (even better 2) content DLCs and did nothing but code improvement/bug fix DLCs.
I haven't programmed anything in over 10 years, but I think there is more to this than just throwing more server power at issues.
I wonder how many ppl would agree with me and do the same and how many just need new shiny in their life and then complain about problems anyway.
Maybe it's not the done thing, or ppl think that they should be fixing stuff anyway, but lets be honest here, some issues have persisted for a very long time and extra resources to fixes are unlikely to happen. Maybe if they knew that a "Bug Fix" DLC was financially viable they could divert ALL resources that are in a position to work on fixes to do so for 3 months.
I have always subbed right from when they got rid of required sub and moved to ESO+ model.
I don't buy crates, I don't buy crowns, that kinda stuff holds little interest for me, but I WILL pay for a fix DLC.Drank Sinatra Sr - PvP Magblade - DC
Juggathot - PvP Mag Sorc - DC
Jedi Mind Crits - PvP A-Hole Bowblade - DC
Dollar Store Thor - PvP Stamplar - DC
The Bone Sumpremacy - baby Stamcro - DC
Wârden Freeman - PvP Stamden - DC (on hold)
Lauryn Heal - PvE Magplar DPS - DC
Lil Orc Chop - PvP Stam Sorc - EP
Hamuel L Jackson - PvE DPS & PvP Stam DK - EP
Chandler Bling - PvP Magden - EP
Mahalia Lightborn - exiled crafting toon - cos you know, she's AD1 -
BlackStormX✭✭✭Improve serversWhat's the point of new content, which brings 101 new bug if old content, which has 1001 bug hasn't been fixed? I'd rather see them fix the old content for the next year than bringing more game breaking bugs with each new dlc/expansion...which will never happen, we all know that.1
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kimaeril✭✭✭Improve serversImprove the servers. New content is useless if you can't log on, stay logged on, etc to enjoy it.5
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griffkhalifa✭✭✭✭Serious question: what does it mean to "improve servers" ? Just add more of them? People seem to just throw that concept around without even understanding what it means. I sure as hell don't.PS4 NA2 -
Agenericname✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Dagoth_Rac wrote: »LordSarevok wrote: »They are indeed very different things. but the parent company gives a single lump sum budget. They then have to decide which area gets those funds/resources. So in effect, putting more hours/people on story/crown items is directly affecting how much money/resources the server/network team gets.
But cutting back on or cutting out content will hit their revenues hard. And that will affect future budget for server/network teams.
And shifting the budget means laying off the people who design content so you can hire more server/network people. And then likely many months for those new hires to become experts in how ESO is designed so they have enough knowledge to identify and fix performance problems. If this was easy to fix, it would have been fixed by now. It is obviously a difficult fix. And throwing more people at it is not a quick fix for difficult problems. You need people with a deep understanding of how ESO works to help solve difficult issues. And that takes time and training, not just more warm bodies.
The folks who design boss mechanics in Trials? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. The folks who design the new motifs that come with every Update? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. The folks who wrote the Summerset quest lines? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. The folks who came up with the Psijic Order skill line? They do not have skill set to improve server performance. You cannot just move all your current employees onto the server performance team. That means the content people have to be laid off. They will go get jobs with other companies. So even if you do eventually get servers improved, the game will have lost a lot of revenue (and player population) in the process and the people who designed the content that brings in revenue will be gone.
All of that may be true. I can't be certain if the person(s) that developed the Psijic Order skills lines can effectively work on servers or not, but its irrelevant.
How they deliver their product is up to them. Who works in what department is their buisiness. I give them support by means of money and something infinitely more important to me, my time. If they're not meeting my expectations, then the burden is on them to communicate to me that they're attempting to meet them, otherwise they run the risk of losing it.
Performance is important to me. More so than cosmetics or content, although I wouldn't discount the value of them. If I cant play the game without excessive lag, abnormally long loading screens, or frequent disconnects, then content will not be a priority for me.
0 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Only servers who need improving is the primary pvp servers.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.2 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭Improve serversDocFrost72 wrote: »Why not both?
maybe because just this one is enogh? - improve servers
gw2 had only 1 bigger expansion over few years and game is fine, living and without problem with servers, p[erformance etc
so why not slow down with dlc in every 3 months? its really short time and thats why now almost every 2nd new dlc is only with 2 new dungs without single map, because devs have problem to make it in time
we started with orsinium and now we ending with really small maps or evenw ithout maps but just 2 dungs as dlc
if devs could make dlc jsut once per 6 months then we could have bigger dlc's like orsnium so - single dlc - more worth content it could be instead what we have now, not much worth because poor maked because of not much time + they could get ome time finally for servers to improve game in overall instead of only new very small short content1 -
cyx54tc✭✭✭✭DocFrost72 wrote: »LordSarevok wrote: »Apparently nobody understands how a business like this works. I will try to make it very simple and I apologize if this comes off as harsh or demeaning.
As a person who has run a personal business for many years and other business's for many years. There is a thing called a yearly budget plan. They look at many factors to come up with this plan. It takes into account, user base, advertising, supplies, payroll (the largest expense by far) etc. My monthly plan tracked a total of 41-45 pages of incoming/outgoing expenses and let me know where I stood for each month, quarter, and end of year. Every business does this. EVERY one.
This is a budget approved by the higher ups and the board so they can report properly to investors on what targets they think they will hit. It is tracked to a scathing degree, because it can have a huge impact on stock prices. They call it controllable expenses for a reason.
What ZoS is doing is making a STRATEGIC decision to not invest in more payroll/resources to fix the issues. Don't be fooled. They are investing more on content and cosmetic items because they stand to gain more revenue in the short term. We might *** and moan about lag and all that but we still pay and play. They will only divert more money from new content if revenue from cosmetics and new content start to dip precipitously, with the cause being directly attributed to server/network issues and not a day before.
TLDR; They have a set amount of money each year to use. They are using most of that money on new content/cosmetics. Lets say they have been given a budget of $100. It costs them $93.75 in payroll and resources for new content. That leaves $6.25 for the server/network team. So if we want more people on the IT side it will pull from the content side.
Again I apologize if I offended anybody but its the truth. I lived it for almost 2 decades...
I understand and agree with this, but then wouldn't it be a question of "Should ZOS divert more resources to the bug/lag/issue resolving team?"
Because the way this poll is worded makes it sound like you can only do one or the other, leading to my confusion.
they should, but they won't. Its how business works. fixing bugs will make current players happier but you get almost $0 out of it.
As long as the bugs are not game breaking to a point where massive player base would leave, upper management will always put almost everyone to new content team and leave 1 group of single digit dev to work on bugs. Even if they could afford spending more money on fixing bugs they will never do it. cuz making money is always the only goal of a company. this is my experience with every single company I have been to, no exception.0 -
Sylvermynx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭As for the poll questions, well - my reply falls in "the Other that wasn't included as an option".
I want to see a server cluster in the US and one as well in EU, with at least 10 servers each and with server pods in SA and AU - maybe 2 or 3 each depending on how many players from those areas. Yeah yeah - not happ'nin'. That's what needs to happen though to actually get millions of people to play - and pay. They need to look at how other hugely popular MMOs got there - and fix this megaserver stuff.
Right now, it seems as if the whole thrust of the companies involved is throw content out there no matter if it's good bad or indifferent because it gets people to buy it, or resub for a while - and that fixes their bottom line for a bit. Hmm. I wonder if new content drops just before an earnings call.... That would be interesting to research.
Anyway, I'm firmly in the "more and better servers" camp. I'm a fairly new player, so the content is going to go on for a while for me (um.... not to mention that due to lag, there's just a lot I can't manage to play). So I do understand why those who've played this game forever might not agree with that.0 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭More contentEver since the last patch I never crash anymore. I may still get long loading screens and bad lag but I've learned to deal with that as they resolve themselves and never last indefinitely.
So personally I'm fine with the game stability at the moment. So MOAR CONTENT PLS.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0 -
Stovahkiin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is a pointless poll. There are several “teams” that work on MMOs like this, and each one has its own department. In other words, the teams that work on creating new content have nothing to do with the ones that manage server performance.
You can’t pull a guy from the monetization department and say, “Hey, you’re gonna go write stories and manage servers for us now.”Beware the battle cattle, but don't *fear* the battle cattle!0 -
Elwendryll✭✭✭✭✭
✭More contentIn all honesty, outside of cyrodiil, I don't have any problem except some lag, and it's mostly not on the servers end. I spend half of the year in my engineering school with a network in the top 3% of France, and the other half at home with less than 1 MB/s. I consider myself able to identify when it's because of my network.
And, even in cyrodiil, in no-cp, it's quite stable, except during the event...PC - EU - France - AD
Main character: Qojikrin - Khajiit Sorcerer Tank/Stamina DD - since March 25, 2015.
Guildmaster of Oriflamme: Focus on 4 player endgame content.
Member of Brave Cat Trade, Panda Division and Toadhuggers.
All 4-man trifectas - TTT, IR, GH1
