Proof of no honor in PVP

MasterSpatula · July 2018

If you're gonna fish in Cyrodiil, you need to learn how to do a stealth cast.

Crouch. As soon as the eye starts to close, cast your rod. If you do it too soon or too late, you'll be visible. If you time it right, you'll be stealthed and only visible for a brief time between casts.

Minyassa · July 2018

Blame ZOS for forcing Cyrodiil on us to complete worldwide achievements like Master Angler and the skyshard collection. They wanted this. They just had to make PvP such an integral part of the game that even people who want nothing to do with ESO's PvP community have to choose to either go without major achievement rewards permanently, or tolerate being treated as AP nodes and have to trek across the countryside again and again to get back to the fishing nodes. Ultimately it's on ZOS whenever they ruin play for someone for as long as they are forced to deal with that. Remember that when it comes to giving them money.

VaranisArano · July 2018

Minyassa wrote: »

Blame ZOS for forcing Cyrodiil on us to complete worldwide achievements like Master Angler and the skyshard collection. They wanted this. They just had to make PvP such an integral part of the game that even people who want nothing to do with ESO's PvP community have to choose to either go without major achievement rewards permanently, or tolerate being treated as AP nodes and have to trek across the countryside again and again to get back to the fishing nodes. Ultimately it's on ZOS whenever they ruin play for someone for as long as they are forced to deal with that. Remember that when it comes to giving them money.

Yep! ZOS totally forces PVE only players into Cyrodiil to get those achievements.

It sucks. Its also why my PVE-only Skyrim-single-player-game-loving self became a PVPer.

I hated the very thought of PVP. I hated group content too, for that matter. But I wanted the Master Angler title, and that meant I had to go to Cyrodiil. Got ganked a few times, got my fish, swore I was never coming back.

Then I wanted skyshards. Got them on an emptier campaign. Finally got the gate skyshards. Said I wasnt coming back.

Eventually I decided I wanted to try PVP for reals. Died a lot, found a guild, got a lot better. Now I PVP regularly, several times a week.

ZOS absolutely forces players who want worldwide achievements (among other things) into Cyrodiil. Not everyone likes it. I hated that I had to go into Cyrodiil at the time. But if not for Master Angler, I would not have ever tried or come to enjoy PVP.

LadyLethalla · July 2018

MasterSpatula wrote: »

If you're gonna fish in Cyrodiil, you need to learn how to do a stealth cast.

Crouch. As soon as the eye starts to close, cast your rod. If you do it too soon or too late, you'll be visible. If you time it right, you'll be stealthed and only visible for a brief time between casts.

And here I was thinking I was the only person who knew how to do this!

ArchMikem · July 2018

jwjackson5674 wrote: »

First of, I manly PVE, have only ever stepped into Cyrodiil to get vigor and caltrops for my Stam characters. So I decide to go into Cyrodiil to work on the fishing achievement. I go way out to a remote fishing spot in some far corner of the map, no where near any battle or anything, and proceed to start fishing. After about the 4th cast, I get ganked and killed before I can even blink. So why, way out in the middle of nowhere, did someone find it necessary to kill me? Just goes to prove that PVP'ers are the lowest and they have no honor.

It has nothing to do with Honor, that person was just a donkey. I'm no stranger to attacking anything that moves, however I do pay enough attention to see what their actions are. If it's just one person by themselves and they don't look like they're riding to a keep or fight, or they make an effort to avoid me, then I'll leave them be. Contrary to what many claim, Cyrodiil is more than just a PvP zone, and if I run into an opposing player at say a Quest hub like Cheydinhall or Vlastarus, I'll put up block and approach them slowly to show my intent is friendly, so we can establish we're there to quest and get on with our day in peace.

That said I have encountered players who will immediately attack you at a Quest hub, and for them if I manage to defeat them, they deserve a good dip dip potato chipping.

Sylvermynx · July 2018

If I had a decent connection, I'd do the pvp to get the fish and skyshards, though I don't care about achievements (just not my thing....) but with 1.5 second lag, that's not ever going to happen.

That's okay. There are many things in the MMOs I played in the past that I couldn't do until I got to 90 in WoW and whatever it was in RIFT (don't remember now what level). In WoW, I really loved running the old level 60 instances solo, never did get that fancy pink bird mount from wherever, but that was fine; sometimes I even quad-boxed so some of my lower level toons got cool gear and good XP. Since it was just "I, myself and me" the lag didn't matter....

kargen27 · July 2018

Fishing Imperial City I was being cautious but an enemy player by accident ran up on me. Figured I was dead because I was on what by that time had become my crafter but I wanted the achievement on him. Player looked at me and ran away so I figured cool a few nice guys running around. He then came back with three friends hunted me down at a different hole and they jumped me. I had his name on a sticky note for a long time but never got my revenge. Ah well, I did eventually get the achievement.

Heimpai · July 2018

jwjackson5674 wrote: »

First of, I manly PVE, have only ever stepped into Cyrodiil to get vigor and caltrops for my Stam characters. So I decide to go into Cyrodiil to work on the fishing achievement. I go way out to a remote fishing spot in some far corner of the map, no where near any battle or anything, and proceed to start fishing. After about the 4th cast, I get ganked and killed before I can even blink. So why, way out in the middle of nowhere, did someone find it necessary to kill me? Just goes to prove that PVP'ers are the lowest and they have no honor.

Could say the same about pve‘rs but i don’t clump everyone together, don’t want to get ganked? Go to a dead campaign, most of us wouldn’t bother with you but there’s always that one person

Also if it was that far away from everything then did it ever cross your mind that’s what this person does? Waits for a fisher to show up so he can gank them

Minyassa · July 2018

VaranisArano wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Blame ZOS for forcing Cyrodiil on us to complete worldwide achievements like Master Angler and the skyshard collection. They wanted this. They just had to make PvP such an integral part of the game that even people who want nothing to do with ESO's PvP community have to choose to either go without major achievement rewards permanently, or tolerate being treated as AP nodes and have to trek across the countryside again and again to get back to the fishing nodes. Ultimately it's on ZOS whenever they ruin play for someone for as long as they are forced to deal with that. Remember that when it comes to giving them money.

Yep! ZOS totally forces PVE only players into Cyrodiil to get those achievements.

It sucks. Its also why my PVE-only Skyrim-single-player-game-loving self became a PVPer.

I hated the very thought of PVP. I hated group content too, for that matter. But I wanted the Master Angler title, and that meant I had to go to Cyrodiil. Got ganked a few times, got my fish, swore I was never coming back.

Then I wanted skyshards. Got them on an emptier campaign. Finally got the gate skyshards. Said I wasnt coming back.

Eventually I decided I wanted to try PVP for reals. Died a lot, found a guild, got a lot better. Now I PVP regularly, several times a week.

ZOS absolutely forces players who want worldwide achievements (among other things) into Cyrodiil. Not everyone likes it. I hated that I had to go into Cyrodiil at the time. But if not for Master Angler, I would not have ever tried or come to enjoy PVP.

The sad thing is, I like PvP in non-MMOs. If things were different I'd actually love to get involved in games of strategy and contests of skill with like-minded mature players.

BRogueNZ · July 2018

Conduit0 wrote: »

In war the only honor is victory.

You should write a book... At least quote the guy if you appreciate his writings

SHADOW2KK · July 2018

Fish elsewhere, Cyro is not a place for people who do not know how to survive.

Minyassa · July 2018

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

Fish elsewhere, Cyro is not a place for people who do not know how to survive.

ZOS, I want you to read this and look at the situation you created. PvPers literally do not think that PvEers have any business trying to complete achievements, and respond accordingly. YOU did this to the game, you are the ones creating the divide. Great job causing resentment in your own game system.

Mr_Walker · July 2018

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Well doesn't fishing in a conflict zone instead of fighting for your side's banner feel a bit like a lapse in honor?

Those folk who camp for and gank skyshard hunters and fishers are truly providing invaluable support to their campaign....

akredon_ESO · July 2018

LOL you honestly Expected the wolves to not eat the sheep? come now you clearly have a warped view on humanity if you thought someone wasn't going to kill you in a zone where people kill each other for sport. If you are Blue or Yellow and I see you I'm probably going to try and kill you regardless of what you are doing. I would suggest going to a low pop server and if you died to someone there just assume its a one-off situation and go fish else were.

Sylvermynx · July 2018

My guess is, Minyassa, that they had to come up with something for those who are pvp-centric, or at least not averse to it. I'm not sure now, but I think my granddaughter (who played some in beta) said there wasn't any straight pvp content to start with (I could have that completely wrong btw - it could have been someone else as I know a number of people who played the beta, or I could have the info totally wrong after this amount of time).

This sort of thing is why WoW always had pvp-specific servers. Sure, pvp happened on normal servers too, but if you weren't flagged, it wasn't an issue. In RIFT, if you got too close to an op-fac city or area, you got flagged, and then you had to look out. On pvp servers, well.... I think the assumption is that if you were there, you knew what you were in for.

SteveCampsOut · July 2018

If you want it to be perfectly clear how harmless you are. Fish Naked.

DaveDom · July 2018

The only "no honor" mode is activated in the evening. When servers get packed and people try to stay competetive with 300-400 ping. Fun to watch not really fun to participate in. Such a refined realm Cyrodiil is. Much PvP

Stovahkiin · July 2018

Minyassa wrote: »

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

Fish elsewhere, Cyro is not a place for people who do not know how to survive.

ZOS, I want you to read this and look at the situation you created. PvPers literally do not think that PvEers have any business trying to complete achievements, and respond accordingly. YOU did this to the game, you are the ones creating the divide. Great job causing resentment in your own game system.

So you’re saying that PVE players should go into pvp, have no idea how to survive, and expect to not die? I’d be getting made fun of right now if I went into a PVE zone and got surprised when I found out I had to PVE there.

Your claim that, quote, “PvPers literally do not think that PvEers have any business trying to complete achievement” is just flat out false and unwarranted. Many pvpers (including myself) have helped new players complete Midyear achievements throughout this event. The person that you quoted was simply saying that, if you can’t survive in any fights, then you’re probably better off staying out of Cyrodiil. It’s a pvp zone

DeadlyRecluse · July 2018

You have made an enemy of the fishes.

We do their dark bidding.

Minyassa · July 2018

Stovahkiin wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

Fish elsewhere, Cyro is not a place for people who do not know how to survive.

ZOS, I want you to read this and look at the situation you created. PvPers literally do not think that PvEers have any business trying to complete achievements, and respond accordingly. YOU did this to the game, you are the ones creating the divide. Great job causing resentment in your own game system.

So you’re saying that PVE players should go into pvp, have no idea how to survive, and expect to not die? I’d be getting made fun of right now if I went into a PVE zone and got surprised when I found out I had to PVE there.

Your claim that, quote, “PvPers literally do not think that PvEers have any business trying to complete achievement” is just flat out false and unwarranted. Many pvpers (including myself) have helped new players complete Midyear achievements throughout this event. The person that you quoted was simply saying that, if you can’t survive in any fights, then you’re probably better off staying out of Cyrodiil. It’s a pvp zone

No. I'm saying that ZOS should cut Cyrodiil out of the requirements for Master Angler and Tamriel Skyshard Hunter. That would solve problems on both sides; PvE people would no longer be forced into Cyrodiil, and PvPers would have only prepared opponents to fight all the time. Win-win.

Skoomah · July 2018

PVP in Cyrodiil. What did you expect would happen? It not personal man. It’s just business.

MisterBigglesworth · July 2018

@Minyassa I just want to echo what @VaranisArano said, and I'll add, in my opinion games are already too focused on positive feedback loops like collect-a-thons and achievements, (which certainly has it's place and makes up 90% of ESO overall) and doesn't focus enough on taking people out of their comfort zone so they have the opportunity to overcome adversity and gain a real feeling of accomplishment for having done so.

I think it's fair to have a 10% of the game walled off, exclusively about the experiences, not the XP.

Minyassa · July 2018

MisterBigglesworth wrote: »

@Minyassa I just want to echo what @VaranisArano said, and I'll add, in my opinion games are already too focused on positive feedback loops like collect-a-thons and achievements, (which certainly has it's place and makes up 90% of ESO overall) and doesn't focus enough on taking people out of their comfort zone so they have the opportunity to overcome adversity and gain a real feeling of accomplishment for having done so.

I think it's fair to have a 10% of the game walled off, exclusively about the experiences, not the XP.

The opportunity is there already without forcing people into it. Forcing is not an opportunity. This is not a job, and it's not school, it's a recreational activity. It's something that people are doing to relax and enjoy themselves. Why in the name of all that's holy would anyone want to experience ACTUAL adversity instead of the in-game conflict they signed up for? Real life is all about being forced out of your comfort zone and having to overcome things. Unless you're really into pain (like those electric-shock hot potato games) generally people expect their leisure activities not to deliberately inspire *literal* unhappiness. Stress tolerance is not a twitch skill.

Editing to add: I finished the Cyrodiil fishing and the skyshards and I don't have a feeling of accomplishment, I have the same feeling of relief that one gets knowing that your next prostate exam isn't for another year, and a lingering resentment that I had to spend a couple of weeks of playtime that I paid money for being utterly miserable. It completely ruined the joy of finishing a long achievement in the case of the skyshard hunter, I can't smile at that now, all I think of is "finally over".

ItsNebula · July 2018

jwjackson5674 wrote: »

First of, I manly PVE, have only ever stepped into Cyrodiil to get vigor and caltrops for my Stam characters. So I decide to go into Cyrodiil to work on the fishing achievement. I go way out to a remote fishing spot in some far corner of the map, no where near any battle or anything, and proceed to start fishing. After about the 4th cast, I get ganked and killed before I can even blink. So why, way out in the middle of nowhere, did someone find it necessary to kill me? Just goes to prove that PVP'ers are the lowest and they have no honor.

Welcome to PvP!
Wanna know what PvP stands for? "Player vs. Player" !
Where if you see an enemy, you can kill them!
Pretty cool, isnt it?!
Grow tf up, PvP isnt a safe space for you little PvEers. Dont wanna be killed? I have a VERY simple solution...

DONT COME TO PVP!

Ohtimbar · July 2018

PVP is supposed to be about skill, but plenty of players just want to farm newbs for easy ap. It's lame, turns off potential new players and requires zero skill. Thankfully, not everyone is like that.

NBrookus · July 2018

Heimpai wrote: »

jwjackson5674 wrote: »

First of, I manly PVE, have only ever stepped into Cyrodiil to get vigor and caltrops for my Stam characters. So I decide to go into Cyrodiil to work on the fishing achievement. I go way out to a remote fishing spot in some far corner of the map, no where near any battle or anything, and proceed to start fishing. After about the 4th cast, I get ganked and killed before I can even blink. So why, way out in the middle of nowhere, did someone find it necessary to kill me? Just goes to prove that PVP'ers are the lowest and they have no honor.

Could say the same about pve‘rs but i don’t clump everyone together, don’t want to get ganked? Go to a dead campaign, most of us wouldn’t bother with you but there’s always that one person

Also if it was that far away from everything then did it ever cross your mind that’s what this person does? Waits for a fisher to show up so he can gank them

That's gonna be one very bored ganker. It was probably a PVE'er giving it a try or a PVP'er getting their own PVE achievements in.

This thread is like deliberately going to a strip club and clutching your pearls that you are forced to see naked people there.

webrgesner · July 2018

Thats why its called PVP! Chillout lol everyone gets ganked

vometia · July 2018

Ohtimbar wrote: »

PVP is supposed to be about skill, but plenty of players just want to farm newbs for easy ap. It's lame, turns off potential new players and requires zero skill. Thankfully, not everyone is like that.

Yeah, I'm guessing that's the case. Having tried to find out what's the deal, I noticed that there's two distinct types of PVPer: those who like the challenge of a balanced fight, and the bottom-feeding gankers who prefer an easy kill. The former try to give helpful advice and the latter tend to post snarky comments about "well I'm just doing my quest which is to kill you lol".

Riptide · July 2018

Seriously though, the few PVE players who get so irate at how ugly PVPers are, and show their own immense ego at simply dying. There is virtually no death penalty. All you lose is a smidge of time. It isn’t personal.

If you plan right, do it in an off campaign not during a PVP event, Master Angler is cake there, and I should know. I did it early on when I was not pvp focused. Coldharbor was a much bigger pain, just so ugly, despised that zone.

And seriously here the entire Master Angler achievement is chill, virtually no danger. One single zone where you have to be alert, and run back a few times at worse.

Sure, some PVP players have little “honor”. But a few PVE players seem to be lacking pretty badly in the fortitude department if it makes them rage against the system, and reckon all PVP players are scum. It really is ironic, as few PVPers get so enraged when they die.

And believe me, PVP players die to other players a lot. Its just not painful. It’s the folks that let it trouble their ego that get so upset. Relax, it is not an affront. It is sports, not a true battlefield. And you can avoid all of it besides to fish.

Dojohoda · July 2018

Come back when the event is over.

A lot of us have the achievement; it's doable. Try the stealth casting.

I fished in cyrodiil and in IC with an enemy player who was a pve friend. Good times!