Medium armor summed up

amir412 · July 2018

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Yeah crying about stamDK and heavy armor and trying to sell it as why medium armor is weak.

Its not like magsorcs and stamblades are one shotting people left and right, but surely its the fault of stamDK. Everything is the fault of SnB stamDks in heavy armor. Erase them out of the game, Its definitely going to solve all your problems.

And 12k low slash? 15k take flight?

I do spent a lot of time in medium armor and let me tell you this video is absolute BS ramblings of a noob, and has nothing to do with why medium armor is weak. A proper medium armor build should have around 18-20k resistances without even building for it, and if you're under that, go learn how to make a build instead of making videos.

This guy is a pretty damn good stamplar. And yeah it's not really factional but more of a hilarious rant. If you can't see that you need to get the stick out of your butt. Let's all agree that medium has issues and those issues will never get resolved if we don't talk about it.

Then talk about medium issues not other stuff.

You realize I'm not the person who made the video right?

I never pointed the argument towards you till you started insulting me personally. Go up there and read what you said, then read what I said.

Go back to my main post and SHOW ME, where did I said that this video is yours or where did I blamed you for any of his ramblings?

But obviously you want to be his advocate otherwise you would not get triggered and insult me because I criticized someone else's video.

Part of the problem with medium is that the other weights are absolutely outperforming it in damage and survivability. Heavy sets should be for tanking only and medium/heavy for dps and healing and because Zos blurs those lines there are huge balance issues. Having heavy sets that give upwards of 600 weapon damage is just asinine.

Try stacking crit chance in med armor and comment here again, the one who made this video player is nothing but a pug killer. His opinion is nothing.

usmguy1234 · July 2018

thankyourat wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Honestly, survival in medium is the problem. Damage is fine with it.

The problem isn't as bad on a stamblade as you have cloak, shade and fear to take pressure off.

Playing anything else open world heavier is just so much easier. Damage is so high right now that you really suffer in medium. Especially with so many undoegeable skills (rune cage and Stella tornado being the biggest issues - dawnbreaker is another one but it's an ultrasound so ok with that being undoegeable) at the moment. Take a big damage spike and try to roll dodge to safety and you still die half the time.

No idea what the answer is though. Shuffle 100% needs a snare immunity buff. Maybe double it to 1 second immunity per piece of medium. That would be a start.

Right damage is good but when heavy hits just as hard as you do that's when the disparity comes up. Heavy should be tanking only.

Tanking in this game is not the only method of survivability, unlike other games where if you aren't a tank, you are a glass cannon, ESO gives light/med builds comparable survivability through shields, rolling and a heavy focus on mobility.

So, which one do you want to give up on med/shield builds, survival or damage?

Not true at all... survivability wise heavy and light are more equal than light is to medium. Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be.

That's not true I actually think medium is stronger than light for open world PvP. A single 7 or 8k damage shield will get taken down so fast. If you play solo the mobility of medium will actually add more survivability than annulment. In a controlled 1v1 light offers good survivability but 1vX light is pretty garbage and it's one of the reason you don't see any solo light armor Magicka builds in cyrodiil (excluding mag sorc)

A lot of factors in play go in to play here. A clarification is you don't see a lot of melee magicka builds in pvp. I guess medium could go bow...That being said, I wonder how most people want to see medium played? I imagine high agility/ mobility with strong damage... basically they can scrap in a fight but can get out when things go south. You only have that ability with a nightblade consistently and that is absolutely frustrating.

Strider__Roshin · July 2018

Figures. I finally have some time to watch the video and it's removed -_-

usmguy1234 · July 2018

Daus wrote: »

Figures. I finally have some time to watch the video and it's removed -_-

@Daus It's called the truth about medium armor by dovetheangry.

Strider__Roshin · July 2018

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Daus wrote: »

Figures. I finally have some time to watch the video and it's removed -_-

@Daus It's called medium armor summed up by dovetheangry.

Lol oh that guy. I'll look it up, thanks for the info

usmguy1234 · July 2018

Daus wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Daus wrote: »

Figures. I finally have some time to watch the video and it's removed -_-

@Daus It's called medium armor summed up by dovetheangry.

Lol oh that guy. I'll look it up, thanks for the info

@Daus I corrected the title please see my edit.

Strider__Roshin · July 2018

So after reviewing the video I would say that those are some solid suggestions.

Snare immunity in conjunction with root immunity following a dodge roll would be a great change. Having 5% damage mitigation for 5 seconds following a dodge roll would be a solid change as well, and would make dodge rolling less useless against undodgeable attacks (which are incredibly plentiful).

With that said I think Major Evasion is bad for the game. There's nothing skillful about RNG auto-dodge and I would love to see it removed and replaced with something strong that supports skillful play.

usmguy1234 · July 2018

Daus wrote: »

So after reviewing the video I would say that those are some solid suggestions.

Snare immunity in conjunction with root immunity following a dodge roll would be a great change. Having 5% damage mitigation for 5% following a dodge roll would be a solid change as well, and would make dodge rolling less useless against undodgeable attacks (which are incredibly plentiful).

With that said I think Major Evasion is bad for the game. There's nothing skillful about RNG auto-dodge and I would love to see it removed and replaced with something strong that supports skillful play.

Agreed 100%.

ak_pvp · July 2018

usmguy1234 wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Honestly, survival in medium is the problem. Damage is fine with it.

The problem isn't as bad on a stamblade as you have cloak, shade and fear to take pressure off.

Playing anything else open world heavier is just so much easier. Damage is so high right now that you really suffer in medium. Especially with so many undoegeable skills (rune cage and Stella tornado being the biggest issues - dawnbreaker is another one but it's an ultrasound so ok with that being undoegeable) at the moment. Take a big damage spike and try to roll dodge to safety and you still die half the time.

No idea what the answer is though. Shuffle 100% needs a snare immunity buff. Maybe double it to 1 second immunity per piece of medium. That would be a start.

Right damage is good but when heavy hits just as hard as you do that's when the disparity comes up. Heavy should be tanking only.

Tanking in this game is not the only method of survivability, unlike other games where if you aren't a tank, you are a glass cannon, ESO gives light/med builds comparable survivability through shields, rolling and a heavy focus on mobility.

So, which one do you want to give up on med/shield builds, survival or damage?

Not true at all... survivability wise heavy and light are more equal than light is to medium. Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be.

I mean, yeah I agree medium needs buffs. Heavy>Med for stam builds . But light>Heavy for mag builds.

But the most survivable build in the game is a stamblade, before it was introduced, and when sloads is fixed again. Stamblades are not tanky at all, but they use roll, and the incredibly strong cloak to make up for the losses of roll. Saying heavy needs to only be tank armour means that you have other 2 types with defense+offence, with heavy as only defence.

And to do that would kill heavy use considerably, unless you buff it substantially in defense. Which most meta players won't like. The mag builds mainly run light because for them, heavy is just tank armour, and a weak one at that.

"Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be." Elaborate please?

usmguy1234 · July 2018

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Honestly, survival in medium is the problem. Damage is fine with it.

The problem isn't as bad on a stamblade as you have cloak, shade and fear to take pressure off.

Playing anything else open world heavier is just so much easier. Damage is so high right now that you really suffer in medium. Especially with so many undoegeable skills (rune cage and Stella tornado being the biggest issues - dawnbreaker is another one but it's an ultrasound so ok with that being undoegeable) at the moment. Take a big damage spike and try to roll dodge to safety and you still die half the time.

No idea what the answer is though. Shuffle 100% needs a snare immunity buff. Maybe double it to 1 second immunity per piece of medium. That would be a start.

Right damage is good but when heavy hits just as hard as you do that's when the disparity comes up. Heavy should be tanking only.

Tanking in this game is not the only method of survivability, unlike other games where if you aren't a tank, you are a glass cannon, ESO gives light/med builds comparable survivability through shields, rolling and a heavy focus on mobility.

So, which one do you want to give up on med/shield builds, survival or damage?

Not true at all... survivability wise heavy and light are more equal than light is to medium. Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be.

I mean, yeah I agree medium needs buffs. Heavy>Med for stam builds . But light>Heavy for mag builds.

But the most survivable build in the game is a stamblade, before it was introduced, and when sloads is fixed again. Stamblades are not tanky at all, but they use roll, and the incredibly strong cloak to make up for the losses of roll. Saying heavy needs to only be tank armour means that you have other 2 types with defense+offence, with heavy as only defence.

And to do that would kill heavy use considerably, unless you buff it substantially in defense. Which most meta players won't like. The mag builds mainly run light because for them, heavy is just tank armour, and a weak one at that.

"Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be." Elaborate please?

There are a lot of ways that tanks can mitigate damage and draw attention from more squishy classes. People basically saying if you nerf heavy it won't be fun anymore....no zos just needs to make heavy armor a threat but not just because it can do a lot of damage.

IZZEFlameLash · July 2018

usmguy1234 wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Honestly, survival in medium is the problem. Damage is fine with it.

The problem isn't as bad on a stamblade as you have cloak, shade and fear to take pressure off.

Playing anything else open world heavier is just so much easier. Damage is so high right now that you really suffer in medium. Especially with so many undoegeable skills (rune cage and Stella tornado being the biggest issues - dawnbreaker is another one but it's an ultrasound so ok with that being undoegeable) at the moment. Take a big damage spike and try to roll dodge to safety and you still die half the time.

No idea what the answer is though. Shuffle 100% needs a snare immunity buff. Maybe double it to 1 second immunity per piece of medium. That would be a start.

Right damage is good but when heavy hits just as hard as you do that's when the disparity comes up. Heavy should be tanking only.

Tanking in this game is not the only method of survivability, unlike other games where if you aren't a tank, you are a glass cannon, ESO gives light/med builds comparable survivability through shields, rolling and a heavy focus on mobility.

So, which one do you want to give up on med/shield builds, survival or damage?

Not true at all... survivability wise heavy and light are more equal than light is to medium. Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be.

I mean, yeah I agree medium needs buffs. Heavy>Med for stam builds . But light>Heavy for mag builds.

But the most survivable build in the game is a stamblade, before it was introduced, and when sloads is fixed again. Stamblades are not tanky at all, but they use roll, and the incredibly strong cloak to make up for the losses of roll. Saying heavy needs to only be tank armour means that you have other 2 types with defense+offence, with heavy as only defence.

And to do that would kill heavy use considerably, unless you buff it substantially in defense. Which most meta players won't like. The mag builds mainly run light because for them, heavy is just tank armour, and a weak one at that.

"Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be." Elaborate please?

There are a lot of ways that tanks can mitigate damage and draw attention from more squishy classes. People basically saying if you nerf heavy it won't be fun anymore....no zos just needs to make heavy armor a threat but not just because it can do a lot of damage.

But think about it, if heavy armored builds cannot dish out damage, in this game, there won't really be a way to be a threat. When tanks were viable, advices were that you ignore the tank because they can't do anything. Not exactly a threat but, if there was a way to be a threatening enough to serve a purpose and make HA viable, I guess I can agree with removing the damage aspects.

usmguy1234 · July 2018

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Honestly, survival in medium is the problem. Damage is fine with it.

The problem isn't as bad on a stamblade as you have cloak, shade and fear to take pressure off.

Playing anything else open world heavier is just so much easier. Damage is so high right now that you really suffer in medium. Especially with so many undoegeable skills (rune cage and Stella tornado being the biggest issues - dawnbreaker is another one but it's an ultrasound so ok with that being undoegeable) at the moment. Take a big damage spike and try to roll dodge to safety and you still die half the time.

No idea what the answer is though. Shuffle 100% needs a snare immunity buff. Maybe double it to 1 second immunity per piece of medium. That would be a start.

Right damage is good but when heavy hits just as hard as you do that's when the disparity comes up. Heavy should be tanking only.

Tanking in this game is not the only method of survivability, unlike other games where if you aren't a tank, you are a glass cannon, ESO gives light/med builds comparable survivability through shields, rolling and a heavy focus on mobility.

So, which one do you want to give up on med/shield builds, survival or damage?

Not true at all... survivability wise heavy and light are more equal than light is to medium. Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be.

I mean, yeah I agree medium needs buffs. Heavy>Med for stam builds . But light>Heavy for mag builds.

But the most survivable build in the game is a stamblade, before it was introduced, and when sloads is fixed again. Stamblades are not tanky at all, but they use roll, and the incredibly strong cloak to make up for the losses of roll. Saying heavy needs to only be tank armour means that you have other 2 types with defense+offence, with heavy as only defence.

And to do that would kill heavy use considerably, unless you buff it substantially in defense. Which most meta players won't like. The mag builds mainly run light because for them, heavy is just tank armour, and a weak one at that.

"Also, tanking is a broader term than you claim it to be." Elaborate please?

There are a lot of ways that tanks can mitigate damage and draw attention from more squishy classes. People basically saying if you nerf heavy it won't be fun anymore....no zos just needs to make heavy armor a threat but not just because it can do a lot of damage.

But think about it, if heavy armored builds cannot dish out damage, in this game, there won't really be a way to be a threat. When tanks were viable, advices were that you ignore the tank because they can't do anything. Not exactly a threat but, if there was a way to be a threatening enough to serve a purpose and make HA viable, I guess I can agree with removing the damage aspects.

I imagine a set like swarm mother but works with multiple people, etc. I don't think it would be hard to make heavy fun and viable without high damage sets that completely outshine anything medium has to offer.

gannicus1389 · August 2018

WHAT IS this thread? medium armor is dominating on bgs because heavy armor passives are just useless

Qbiken · August 2018

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Honestly, survival in medium is the problem. Damage is fine with it.

The problem isn't as bad on a stamblade as you have cloak, shade and fear to take pressure off.

Playing anything else open world heavier is just so much easier. Damage is so high right now that you really suffer in medium. Especially with so many undoegeable skills (rune cage and Stella tornado being the biggest issues - dawnbreaker is another one but it's an ultrasound so ok with that being undoegeable) at the moment. Take a big damage spike and try to roll dodge to safety and you still die half the time.

No idea what the answer is though. Shuffle 100% needs a snare immunity buff. Maybe double it to 1 second immunity per piece of medium. That would be a start.

Right damage is good but when heavy hits just as hard as you do that's when the disparity comes up. Heavy should be tanking only.

Strongly disagree with the bolded part. I like ESO because they´ve moved away from the old MMO standards where light armor = squishy mage, heavy armor = tank etc....

I would like to see shuffle getting it´s cost reduced and increase snare immunity for 1 second/medium piece worn. I think that is a good start.

Maura_Neysa · August 2018

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

Light Armor / Magicka-Users get the 'Concentration' Light Armor Passive for 5k Spell Penetration.
Medium Armor / Stamina-Users get 0 Physical Penetration Passive.....
See the problem -- the imbalance?

@ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_GinaBruno

@Darkmage1337
Medium Armor /Stamina-Users get "Dexterity" Medium Armor Passive for 2.3k Weapon Damage
Light Armor / Magicka-Users get 0 Spell Damage passive.....
See the solution -- the balance?

The imbalance is that I can have all the resistance of Heavy and twice the mobility of Medium at half the cost with Forward Momentum

Darkmage1337 · August 2018

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

Light Armor / Magicka-Users get the 'Concentration' Light Armor Passive for 5k Spell Penetration.
Medium Armor / Stamina-Users get 0 Physical Penetration Passive.....
See the problem -- the imbalance?

@ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_GinaBruno

@Darkmage1337
Medium Armor /Stamina-Users get "Dexterity" Medium Armor Passive for 2.3k Weapon Damage
Light Armor / Magicka-Users get 0 Spell Damage passive.....
See the solution -- the balance?

The imbalance is that I can have all the resistance of Heavy and twice the mobility of Medium at half the cost with Forward Momentum

3/3 Dexterity gives 2,300 Weapon Crit, not Weapon Damage. There is a MAJOR difference. Read up on the actual stats from passives before posting, lol.
At most, you're only getting a measly +12% Weapon Damage from 2/2 Agility. And 12% isn't much, truthfully. It equates to about 200-400ish weapon damage for most builds, depending on your gear, at a loss of what could have been 5k Physical Penetration.
Instead of ZOS constantly making OP sets like SLOADS to counter super-tanky builds (which @ZOS_Wrobel stated on the most recent ESO Live), why not just give Medium-Armor users Physical PENETRATION to count the high-armor ratings of said builds. Instead of, ya'know, breaking the rest of the game's balance over 1 gear set. Lol. #Logic2018

usmguy1234 · August 2018

gannicus1389 wrote: »

WHAT IS this thread? medium armor is dominating on bgs because heavy armor passives are just useless

Medium is dominating bgs because heavy can't sustain in no-cp... or it's a struggle at least.

montiferus · August 2018

usmguy1234 wrote: »

gannicus1389 wrote: »

WHAT IS this thread? medium armor is dominating on bgs because heavy armor passives are just useless

Medium is dominating bgs because heavy can't sustain in no-cp... or it's a struggle at least.

What is your Xbox GT?

usmguy1234 · August 2018

montiferus wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

gannicus1389 wrote: »

WHAT IS this thread? medium armor is dominating on bgs because heavy armor passives are just useless

Medium is dominating bgs because heavy can't sustain in no-cp... or it's a struggle at least.

What is your Xbox GT?

Same as my forum name.

technohic · August 2018

I hit harder on my Stamplar in 5medium than 5 heavy. Of course using ravager with both. Difference is I don’t survive as easily, now have an extra buff to keep up albeit one now heals while I have a different source of snare immunity, but it’s opportunity cost and extra resource cost makes it feel like sustain is the same, and the heal is kind of a wash when considering efficiency of more healing from HOTs in heavy.

I can dodge roll and sprint cheaper but then have to more often.

Maybe the way to buff it without buffing NB would be to add some class focused synergies on their passives that synergies with medium. Like Templar in 5 piece medium HOTs tick faster and stamina recovery increased by X%. Something with some stam class flavor

usmguy1234 · August 2018

technohic wrote: »

I hit harder on my Stamplar in 5medium than 5 heavy. Of course using ravager with both. Difference is I don’t survive as easily, now have an extra buff to keep up albeit one now heals while I have a different source of snare immunity, but it’s opportunity cost and extra resource cost makes it feel like sustain is the same, and the heal is kind of a wash when considering efficiency of more healing from HOTs in heavy.

I can dodge roll and sprint cheaper but then have to more often.

Maybe the way to buff it without buffing NB would be to add some class focused synergies on their passives that synergies with medium. Like Templar in 5 piece medium HOTs tick faster and stamina recovery increased by X%. Something with some stam class flavor

Hell I'd take back major mending on just stamplar. Having a 15k+ vigor tooltip vs 12-13k is a huge difference in survivability.

Swimguy · August 2018

Change the sneak perk to grant shuffle permanently.

Make shuffle remove snares/roots and give immunity to them for 7 seconds.

If you use shuffle when rooted (dk talons, rearming trap, etc) get 2 seconds of stun immunity?

Or just give a decent HoT when using shuffle to cleanse