New Motifs in the Crown Store Ruining The Market

SupremeRissole · July 2018

I have no issue with motifs being purchasable for crowns. I have no issue with crowns being sold for in game gold. What I do have an issue with is fresh motifs being gifted.
As someone who's main income is farming DLC dungeon motifs, it's pretty upsetting seeing the new Fang Lair and Scalecaller motifs available in the store the same day they become available to farmers. When the bloodroot motifs became farmable, they sold in trader for 80k-200k. But with the addition of crown gifting with the average crown-gold conversion of 100g/crown, people are paying only 600k for the whole Fang/Scale book, where realisticly if they weren't in the store the trader price would be close to 1mil. Judging by the upcoming Weklynar farm, those motifs would sell for quite a price, except it's been datamined they will be in the crown store so hopefully it will be a while till that happens.
My proposal to ZOS is simple, give us a whole update (or longer) to farm and sell these motifs before you add them into the crown store. Just like you did with Mazzatun, Silken Ring, Bloodforge, Dreadhorn, Dro-Mathra etc.

Edited for spelling

Doctordarkspawn · July 2018

Good, screw the market.

If it were anything else then a video game economy then quite frankly I'd be against it because economy's are necessary things but quite frankly, these styles, are not that great, and charging insane ammounts for them was dumb anyway.

It's cosmetics, not gear. And the value decreased drastically because of the outfit system anyway, because of ease of access.

Kikke · July 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Good, screw the market.

Lol? Time for someone too go back to their singelplayer game I hear.

Doctordarkspawn · July 2018

kikkehs wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Good, screw the market.

Lol? Time for someone too go back to their singelplayer game I hear.

For having a opinion? Are you truely so fragile?

With the outfit system released, all we need is the motif and a costume slot. This ease of access changes expectation of price. IE, before, it was such a status symbol that it was essentially a luxury, you went the entire mile and crafted the gear. Now? It's applicable to anyone, and the price is ajusted to meet that.

And the rise of the crownstore motif is there because of ZOS seeing money to be made off players who simply dont run these dungeons on vet, which is a large portion of the populace.

It's just the way of things. Gonna have to get used to it.

OutLaw_Nynx · July 2018

I’d rather just buy them from the crown store.

Lake · July 2018

Good.

The more accessibility, the better.

Cpt_Teemo · July 2018

OutLaw_Nynx wrote: »

I’d rather just buy them from the crown store.

Tbh, the prices of certain motifs on the crown store are beyond the price which you can buy in game, celestial motif was 5k crowns, 40$ for a 50k full set motif in game isn't a good deal.

SydneyGrey · July 2018

I really doubt that gifting motifs is such a common occurrence that it would do a dang thing to change the economy, or motif pricing. Seems like a silly thing to worry about.

I'm more concerned about walls and floors disappearing when I go into a delve/dungeon.

max_only · July 2018

SydneyGrey wrote: »

I really doubt that gifting motifs is such a common occurrence that it would do a dang thing to change the economy, or motif pricing. Seems like a silly thing to worry about.

I'm more concerned about walls and floors disappearing when I go into a delve/dungeon.

This

EvilCroc · July 2018

Hmm... Isn't it better to make ZOS happy with buying motif in crown store than to make happy some unknown player (your native enemy)?
I think it is.

Kiralyn2000 · July 2018

Yeah, the crown store versions of farmable motifs are priced crazy high (because it's a convenience/skip-the-farming thing). I seriously doubt that people are buying enough 5k Crown motif books to depress the market.

(Checking TTT, the Fang Lair chest motif is still running 250-400k. Yep, those prices are tanking. /sarcasm)

Iluvrien · July 2018

You accept the placement of crafting items (motifs) in the Crown Store at all.

All sympathy for your position is forfeit.

Sylvermynx · July 2018

Eh.... a listed price isn't what the item might actually sell for. It makes a lot more sense to show how many of which items sold for how much.

Katahdin · July 2018

Cpt_Teemo wrote: »

OutLaw_Nynx wrote: »

I’d rather just buy them from the crown store.

Tbh, the prices of certain motifs on the crown store are beyond the price which you can buy in game, celestial motif was 5k crowns, 40$ for a 50k full set motif in game isn't a good deal.

Time = Money

If you consider how much time it will take for you to farm all those pages if you can even complete vet HM or farm the gold to buy all those pages compared to how many hours you have to work in real life to get $40, you might find its actually cheaper to buy it on the crown store.

If they continue to make motifs next to impossible to get because most of the player base cant complete vet HM on those dungeons or stack RNG onto RNG (upcoming Cloudrest Motif), people willl buy from the crown store instead of grinding for weeks.

So Id say its working as intended (crown store sales)

.

Slick_007 · July 2018

SupremeRissole wrote: »

As someone who's main income is farming DLC dungeon motifs, it's pretty upsetting seeing the new Fang Lair and Scalecaller motifs available in the store the same day they become available to farmers.

your farming is not and should not be a consideration as to how and when they release items for the general population. Its about getting items to players, not whether or not they'll impact someones sales. you need to realise you just arent that important in the scheme of things. its not about you.

White wabbit · July 2018

Yep don't care about the market I never sell anything

Androconium · July 2018

SupremeRissole wrote: »

I have no issue with motifs being purchasable for crowns. I have no issue with crowns being sold for in game gold. What I do have an issue with is fresh motifs being gifted.
As someone who's main income is farming DLC dungeon motifs, it's pretty upsetting seeing the new Fang Lair and Scalecaller motifs available in the store the same day they become available to farmers. When the bloodroot motifs became farmable, they sold in trader for 80k-200k. But with the addition of crown gifting with the average crown-gold conversion of 100g/crown, people are paying only 600k for the whole Fang/Scale book, where realisticly if they weren't in the store the trader price would be close to 1mil. Judging by the upcoming Weklynar farm, those motifs would sell for quite a price, except it's been datamined they will be in the crown store so hopefully it will be a while till that happens.
My proposal to ZOS is simple, give us a whole update (or longer) to farm and sell these motifs before you add them into the crown store. Just like you did with Mazzatun, Silken Ring, Bloodforge, Dreadhorn, Dro-Mathra etc.

Edited for spelling

My. That went well for you.

p.s. I think you'll find that this was exactly what they (ZOS) were hoping for.

drjokepu · July 2018

Malacthulhu · July 2018

I find it interesting that any good master writs I happen to get require a new motif that I do not have and convienent that it is also in the crown shop. Like awesome, I wonder how of all the motifs out now, and the fact that I have bought crowns before the games rng just magically knows how to hook me up.

NupidStoob · July 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

It's cosmetics, not gear. And the value decreased drastically because of the outfit system anyway, because of ease of access.

No it didn't. In fact it even skyrocketed the price of many motifs such as Minotaur chests from avg 15-20k to 80k. What destroyed the prices was the anniversary event where everyone was getting tons of chapters daily.

Facefister · July 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Good, screw the market.

If it were anything else then a video game economy then quite frankly I'd be against it because economy's are necessary things but quite frankly, these styles, are not that great, and charging insane ammounts for them was dumb anyway.

It's cosmetics, not gear. And the value decreased drastically because of the outfit system anyway, because of ease of access.

This. Any videogame market can crash and burn. I want to play the game, and not pay some botter 60k gold/200 corn flower.

Cryptical · July 2018

SupremeRissole wrote: »

I have no issue with motifs being purchasable for crowns. I have no issue with crowns being sold for in game gold. What I do have an issue with is fresh motifs being gifted.
As someone who's main income is farming DLC dungeon motifs, it's pretty upsetting seeing the new Fang Lair and Scalecaller motifs available in the store the same day they become available to farmers. When the bloodroot motifs became farmable, they sold in trader for 80k-200k. But with the addition of crown gifting with the average crown-gold conversion of 100g/crown, people are paying only 600k for the whole Fang/Scale book, where realisticly if they weren't in the store the trader price would be close to 1mil. Judging by the upcoming Weklynar farm, those motifs would sell for quite a price, except it's been datamined they will be in the crown store so hopefully it will be a while till that happens.
My proposal to ZOS is simple, give us a whole update (or longer) to farm and sell these motifs before you add them into the crown store. Just like you did with Mazzatun, Silken Ring, Bloodforge, Dreadhorn, Dro-Mathra etc.

Edited for spelling

It’s not just the exclusivity, it’s also the motivation for more people to venture into those dungeons at all.

For that short time they were pulled from the store, a much larger number of people felt the drive to learn the mechanics and make the attempt. Now, I’ve seen 5 and 10 minute queue times as a healer. Zeni can look at their own logs and see the number of people choosing those dungeons has plummeted, and the number of people quitting group when they get those dungeons has gone up.

Having motifs exclusive to a dungeon for a significant period is a targeted incentive. They have hard data on how well the targeted incentive of the pyandonean bottles have affected fishing. They have years of hard data on the impact of the targeted incentives tied to the anniversary events - how farming spikes during targeted double mats event in wrothgar, how imperial city participation spikes during IC anniversary, how defeating Bal in the center rises even when they bump the rng of the rewards from very very rare to merely very rare. And so on with plunder skulls, etc.

Zeni doesn’t care much about the economy as you think of it. Prices rise and fall according to their set drop rates. Look at how they set the champ point xp progression curve - they want people to get enough of a reward quickly enough to be contenders, but want the pinnacle to be a real stretch effort. That is echoed in how they set the jewelry system of grains and platings.

The complicated dungeon mechanics could use a bit of targeted incentive to get people to reach beyond their comfort zone and make a go of it at all. Motif exclusivity is a possible incentive to draw those merely interested in the outfits they want, and keeps them coming back to that content long enough to become more than simple completion-grabbers that show up once or twice for the trophy and never return.

Zeni should make a significant period of motif exclusivity simply because it is a driver of more people into participating more fully in the content they create.

In an oversimplified nutshell:more people would be knocking on fang lair’s doors if that was the only place they could get that motif. Instead, as a healer I can queue for that place and experience the typical length of a dps queue.

bellatrixed · July 2018

There's no way people en masse are buying the 5k crown version with gold anyway. For one, you have to find someone willing to spend $50 for some gold, and for two, you have to find someone you're willing to trust, and someone willing to trust you...

It's more likely that the drop rate is pretty good and that's why the prices are dropping regularly. I always wait a few months to buy the new motifs rather than paying premium price and these are about on the same track as Mazzatun as far as price goes.

Woeler · July 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Good, screw the market.

Lol? Time for someone too go back to their singelplayer game I hear.

For having a opinion? Are you truely so fragile?

There is a difference between an opinion and ignorant, uninformed temper tantrum.

Mayrael · July 2018

I think that prices of that motifs went down not because of crown store but because these motfis are not as good looking as people thought. I buy just the parts of the motifs that I think are looking good or unique, new motifs are not on my wish list definitely.

Prof_Bawbag · July 2018

I'd be more worried if i was selling 5k crowns for 600k. Saying that, maybe not as that would mean i was in a position to wipe my ass with £10 notes and light my ciggies with £20 notes.

starkerealm · July 2018

Cryptical wrote: »

For that short time they were pulled from the store, a much larger number of people felt the drive to learn the mechanics and make the attempt. Now, I’ve seen 5 and 10 minute queue times as a healer. Zeni can look at their own logs and see the number of people choosing those dungeons has plummeted, and the number of people quitting group when they get those dungeons has gone up.

And I've seen 45m-1h queues as a DPS, so clearly there are no DPS in the game. Wait, no, that's not the issue at all. There's way too many DPS, even DPS picking Tank as their role for quick queues.

A longer queue may simply mean there's fewer tanks running the content. They're the gate keepers you need to worry about. And those Battleground queues back before Morrowind went base game were pretty snappy, even though you'd see the same names over, and over, and over, because no one else was playing. Actual queue times say shockingly little.

Here's the thing. The Crown motifs may have undercut the initial release price surge. You're not going to see a lot of people paying 600k for books, because the actual motifs will be under 20k a page within the next few months. Also, the price dip for motifs across the board came before Summerset and gifting became a thing. Those prices tanked as a result of the anniversary event. I mean, I love that event, but I was pulling down over 100 boxes per day. I watched motif prices crumble for most things.

You might have missed out on the day 1 price surge because of it. Okay, cool, whatever. So what? Those are still going to be expensive motifs for awhile.

VilniusNastavnik · July 2018

I got 30K Crowns from the outfit comp.. I have nothing to spend it on. If me spending the free crowns I won on motifs that I cant be bothered to farm destroys the market.. good.

jaschacasadiob16_ESO · July 2018

The simple fact that there is a 100g/crown conversion should tell you that something is really wrong.

zaria · July 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Good, screw the market.

Lol? Time for someone too go back to their singelplayer game I hear.

For having a opinion? Are you truely so fragile?

With the outfit system released, all we need is the motif and a costume slot. This ease of access changes expectation of price. IE, before, it was such a status symbol that it was essentially a luxury, you went the entire mile and crafted the gear. Now? It's applicable to anyone, and the price is ajusted to meet that.

And the rise of the crownstore motif is there because of ZOS seeing money to be made off players who simply dont run these dungeons on vet, which is a large portion of the populace.

It's just the way of things. Gonna have to get used to it.

The outfit system raised motif prices a lot since you could now use it on dropped gear and you could mix weights.
The anniversary event dropped prices a lot obviously.

MattT1988 · July 2018

The motif market needed a bit of a crash anyway. Whenever new motifs come out the prices that people put on them were outrageous and this is coming from someone who farms them and flips my doubles at the guild trader. Your still going to earn plenty of gold from them just not 100,000 freakin gold for a daggers page. You’ll still make a bucket load of gold from the motif, just not an outrageous amount. Don’t be greedy.