PvP in 2019

Zerowaffles · June 2018

After Zenimax is done releasing Murkmire and Wolfhunter this year I hope they have something big in store for PvP and Cyrodiil coming besides performance improvements.

I hope zenimax understands that investing in PvP might not bring them money immediantly like they get by releasing dlc and chapters but it keeps the community alive and brings more players to the game.

In other words PvP will bring zos revenue in the long run by doubling the active player base and bring back all the old players that quit due to PvP being in a very shameful state at the moment.

Stratforge · June 2018

PvP in 2019 is going to be strictly 50k health builds light attacking each other but I like your optimism.

zyk · June 2018

My interpretation of ZOS' actions regarding PVP is that they have tried *extremely* hard to make it attractive to their *extremely* casual PVE audience. I think ZOS believes they need a greater portion of their playerbase active in PVP to justify investment in it.

They did the same to PVE raiding, but with raiding it was a bit easier because they have different modes. Rich Lambert described this effort as Raising the floor and lowering the ceiling. This essentially means limiting how bad and good a player can be.

It's been a disaster in PVP and can't possibly work. Not everyone is mentally equipped to handle PVP. The same is true of sports. Furthermore, the tools they give their casual players to even the odds are always best used by the hardcore PVP players willing to use them, so they end up running around in circles.

They need to invest in making ESO PVP an awesome experience for gamers who already love PVP. They should start by separating PVP and PVE game design. Assign PVP and PVE flags to all sets and abilities.

If this results in fewer sets available to PVP players, I don't think that would be a bad thing. Brian Wheeler has noted that Proc sets have a negative impact on AvA performance. So why are they there? Get rid of them.

The same goes for abilities. If some abilities/ultimates/passives have a disproportionately negative impact on server performance, get rid of them in PVP.

The same goes for cosmetics too. If the huge abundance of art assets from the improved character customization introduced to ESO over the past couple of years has hurt performance -- and I strongly believe it has -- then streamline that too.

Not only do I think it would not be a bad thing to have fewer sets in PVP, I think streamlining PVP would make it more attractive to the greater PVP gaming audience outside of ESO. I know a lot of oldschool players who have come back to ESO PVP for AvA, but then leave shortly after because the PVE grind is too much to bear. Make it easy for players to be competitive in PVP without having to worry about PVE. Find new ways to monetize PVP other than OP sets found only in new DLCs.

In short, ZOS has to focus on making ESO PVP a great experience for PVP players, and not a great experience for PVE players. Build it and they will come.

idk · June 2018

I hope that they get the performance working. Maybe tweak Cyro overall after that, but really do not expect Zos to do any major update there.

Not sure what they can really do DLC wise with PvP. IC is empty after the initial excitement wore off and we do not need another PvP specific open world zone since that would be duplicating Cyro but have to find other objectives to go with it.

Most of the really good PvP players left long ago, like almost 4 years ago and the rest about 2 years ago. I doubt a gimik or something reskinned will bring them back. It would take making Cyro work properly and maybe some will return.

Feanor · June 2018

PvP in 2019 will all be about Dwemer Siege that instakill everything in a 40m radius. Reduces the lag, less calculations needed, and raises the floor significantly.

White wabbit · June 2018

Lol you think there will be a PvP player base left by then

Morgul667 · June 2018

PVP will be closed due to balance and performance issue

Blobsky · June 2018

0fps instead of 1fps

tinythinker · June 2018

zyk wrote: »

Furthermore, the tools they give their casual players to even the odds are always best used by the hardcore PVP players willing to use them, so they end up running around in circles.

In early BWB they balanced out stats more, not to mention the soft caps that existed for the whole game that limited stacking into any one thing too much. That didn't really give the all-day PvPers an advantage. And it doesn't have to "kill" builds that rely on stacking depending on how it would be implemented (the range limits and rate of diminishing returns could be as generous or strict as the devs want). And read on before furiously writing about how "good players already take too long to kill each other" or "But my bow build...".

There are other things that can be done, particularly in terms of expanding the AvA aspect (battlegrounds and dueling in PvE zones offer more pure PvP). Branching out the AvA into more skill lines to support particular role-types or strategies could be a thing. Right now it's Assault and Support, but it could also be something thematically (if not actually named as) "Sieger", "Ganker/Hunter", "Defender", "(Crowd) Controller". The passives would boost the appropriate things but also work on a bane/boon system, so gankers can still do their big hits but have other drawbacks for balance. Siegers could have passives or active abilities not only to boost their own resistance/bonus to damage with siege but also to a few nearby allies. Etc. It could be switchable like class spec talent trees in WoW -- change them back at the base without having to invest skill points in or get all of the buffs and abilities from all AvA skill lines at once. If you just want to do small-group fights go ahead, this gives more strategy. If you want to actually focus on AvA, it gives everyone a chance for a role they can do other than just blob around with AoE/proc damage and AOE/proc heals.

To be clear even if Wheeler and team liked this line of thinking (doubtful), these changes and others of similar scale will never, ever happen. Cyrodiil/AvA isn't going to get some huge rebuild. Not in 2019 or any other year. (I'd be happy if someone quoted this at a later date to prove me wrong.)

zyk wrote: »

They need to invest in making ESO PVP an awesome experience for gamers who already love PVP. They should start by separating PVP and PVE game design.

They currently do this just a little, and seem loathe to push it too far. It would be an incredibly massive about-face in game design. They might add some new objectives, play around with the existing two AvA skill lines, etc., but no massive overhaul.

thankyourat · June 2018

CP will be so high that no one will ever die

CerebralNoise · June 2018

If nothing is done with PvP, I'd be surprised to find 20 people on a server in 2019.

tinythinker · June 2018

CerebralNoise wrote: »

If nothing is done with PvP, I'd be surprised to find 20 people on a server in 2019.

There will always be people in Cyro. Even during the lighting patch debacle there were people in Cyro. There are enough people who like it as it is, even with periods of awful lag, to keep logging in.

Agrippa_Invisus · June 2018

Let me go ahead and post a list of all the good, long term players I know will be playing in 2019:

Done.

grannas211 · June 2018

Stratforge wrote: »

PvP in 2019 is going to be strictly 50k health builds light attacking each other but I like your optimism.

Yes this after the final dungeon dlc of the year drops a Monster set that does oblivion damage on light attacks with no cooldown

Karivaa · June 2018

White wabbit wrote: »

Lol you think there will be a PvP player base left by then

As much as I love this game, I doubt it.

pmn100b16_ESO · June 2018

PVP in 2019

WaltherCarraway · June 2018

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

PVP in 2019

Cyrodiil - middle of nowhere Population: 0

Ankael07 · June 2018

Now Sload's Semblance, next dlc; Werewolf's Semblance, in Murkmire it'll be Wamasu's Semblance.

Proc sets, proc sets never change