PvP is what brings players together. We had only 1 PvP Update in 4 years.

Zardayne · June 2018

Phage wrote: »

reguvin wrote: »

Imperial City was the only PvP update since release.

We want more updates like Imperial City which only focuses on PvPing.

This is a Great game with alot of content and amazing features. But it really needs to focus on bringing PvP players to play the Game.

Gotta disagree. Group PvE has brought me and my friends together more than any PvP ever has.

I'm going to have to disagree as well. I felt more closer to my guild in Daoc when we banded together and took keeps from the enemy. The pride of seeing your guilds banner flying over a castle was great. It was a group sense of accomplishment. The fights to get into the lord's rooms were intense! I guess everyone has their own things that bring them that feeling of camaraderie. I get that sometimes in PVE too but some of my biggest memories are from PVP in 20+ yrs of MMOs

Pink_Violinz · June 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

G1Countdown wrote: »

I want to see exactly ZERO PVP DLCs or Chapters. ZERO. They need to fix the servers to handle PVP first. It's a disaster. Then we can talk about PVP DLC or Chapters.

I wonder if Timestop is causing lag in Cyrodiil. It's just bubble after bubble after bubble...it's way overused and so many animations on top of all the proc animations can't be good for server stability.

Look at all these bubbles going off...

https://youtu.be/jYZ9o42gwdg

Funny, I was in that fight. Yeah, it was atrocious. I was in Cyrodiil for only that fight today and over half of my team disconnected. I think it might have to do with the new Psijic line, and just how the server can't handle the it. Lag even in PvE zones is pretty bad, but Cyrodiil is unplayable.

Jameliel · June 2018

Heimpai wrote: »

You know what pushed me away from pve? Everyone saying you need 40k+ dps yet my best was 19k...soo i tried pvp and hated it, then went to cyrodil and loved it

Race changed from redguard to woodelf, goodbye pve, once i get better at pvp I’ll try the other types of it again

Yes i was on the verge of quitting the game and would have if not for pvp

PvE is mostly boring in this game...Of all the MMOs I've played, it lacks creativity and replay value. The dungeons are mostly meh. The "trials" are more of the same.

AhPook_Is_Here · June 2018

reguvin wrote: »

Imperial City was the only PvP update since release.

We want more updates like Imperial City which only focuses on PvPing.

This is a Great game with alot of content and amazing features. But it really needs to focus on bringing PvP players to play the Game.

Imperial City wasn't a PVP DLC, it was a DLC with things in it for PVP and PVE. Every DLC since then hasn't been a PVE DLC, they have all been DLCs with things for both PVP and PVE players to enjoy. I am sure there will be more content ahead for PVP just as there is more ahead for PVE.

Kalgert · June 2018

The thing that bothers me most about PvP in MMO's is that it goes like this:

Class, Gear and Abilities consists of 95% of a person's performance, while raw skill is only 5%. This is why I only went in to Battlegrounds to do a daily win and then left to do other stuff (Also the below 50 brackets seem to be the least likely to end with you getting stomped all over by guys having mighty gear).

That being said, I feel like I'm not judged as harshly as I am in PvE, or that it's somehow more enjoyable to do. Considering how my hughest DPS was 12k on a training dummy (And that still is somehow too low for a DPS to do), and I am having a hard time getting past the first arena in Veteran Maelstrom on my Magicka DK, doing a Battleground feels oddly appealing.

But I am not gonna say that it's perfectly fine. Because I would be dishonest if I were to say that an MMO that relies on gear is a good PvP experience.

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Ain' bringin' me together.

Also, no real PVP fallacy.

PVP dont sell. It's why the game quickly abandoned said updates aside from battlegrounds.

If we take a closer looks, most popular games right now are PvP games: League of Legends, CSGO, Dota 2, Fortnite, PUBG, Call of Duty, Battlefield, Overwatch etc

So PvP do sell. League and Dota have both PvE and PvP and if you want to do well in those 2 games you have to be good at both PvE (creeps farming) and PvP (combat against players).

We are living in the era which PvP games dominate. Maybe it's just that no PvP MMO has been done right in the past.

The thrill of competing against another player is something very special and you will have players asking for PvP mode in a lot of games. Even Bioware's new IP Anthem, even when Bioware barely has any history with PvP (Mass Effect, Dragonage), there are people requesting PvP mode for Anthem.

Thing about those games is that they are entirely different beasts to an MMO.

Personally I think they're of a more balanced experience compared to an MMO. There you aren't really compelled to get the best gear ever to do good in PvP. It's more focused on your skill than in an MMO.

Maybe that is what people like more in shooters and MOBA's. Skills are the bigger focus as opposed to how yozr gear is set up.

darkstar2084 · June 2018

someone enlighten me they have cyrodil, imperial city and now battlegrounds. What else do you think they could do for a pvp DLC? I cant really think of anything

idk · June 2018

OP needs a reminder that BGs were added to the game last year and made part of the base game just recently.

So to say only one addition of PvP was added to the game is not correct by any measure.

Further, the game more heavily leans to PvE than PvP which is demonstrated by the efforts and additions that Zos makes. Clearly PvP needs continued attention, but it is not what is most in demand.

Besides that, I certainly do not want more updates such as the failed IC. Worst PvP added to the game to date. Less than a year after it as released it was a dead zone. BGs are still active and going good.

Miswar · June 2018

darkstar2084 wrote: »

someone enlighten me they have cyrodil, imperial city and now battlegrounds. What else do you think they could do for a pvp DLC? I cant really think of anything

Maybe start fixing the refered BROKEN things????

Ofcourse you are propably Doelmen hunting in Alikiri Desert so these do not afffect you.

FloppyTouch · June 2018

darkstar2084 wrote: »

someone enlighten me they have cyrodil, imperial city and now battlegrounds. What else do you think they could do for a pvp DLC? I cant really think of anything

I cant speak for every pvp player but most of the people I know and me included want an update chapter dlc does not matter what you call it that just focuses on the pains of pvp performance. Also an update on how things work like getting emp, no one man should hold emp for 30 days bc he ap farms 24/7. When he loses emp and then ur faction gets it back it should go to the next in line and right down the leader board list.

Ragnarock41 · June 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

reguvin wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Ain' bringin' me together.

Also, no real PVP fallacy.

PVP dont sell. It's why the game quickly abandoned said updates aside from battlegrounds.

Mate, every big MMO has PvP in it's endgame. Saying that PvP doesn't sell is madness if you compare how many MMO's have excellent PvP ingame.

Mate, every big MMO which has prioratized PVP as it's driving force has died. Warhammer Online. Shadowbane. It's just a matter of history.

This game prioratized it up until a year in, when it realized that it just wasn't puting in the numbers needed for content production.

Disbelieve it if you want, call me crazy if you want, but PVP specific MMO's just dont tend to do well.

This reminds me how people in early 2000's called f2p games are trash and all pay to win etc, and People in general said f2p games all should be avoided like a plague. And I used to agree.

Then games like dota 2, league, warframe , guild wars 2, and lately fortnite, changed the gaming world and showed us that making a free to play game that benefits EVERYONE, can still be done, without shady , greedy cash shops and other pay to win elements.

Now why this is important? Cause I believe PvP based MMOs are the same way. It can be done, Its just that developers don't do it correctly. The top 5 most played games on steam right now are all PvP based games for example(ESO is 28th on that same list as of right now.)

https://store.steampowered.com/stats/?

This shows the fact that people actually prefer PvP games. So whats my point?

My point is, PvP isn't the reason why the PvP MMOs are failing. Its something else. But I don't want to throw *** at zenimax so I'll keep it short. One day eventually we will have a proper , PvP based MMO, with great RvR. I don't know which game it will be, but I know if such a game ever comes out, cyrodiil will probably become a ghost town.

DanteYoda · June 2018

Sorry pvp does the opposite for me..

Leogon · June 2018

reguvin wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Ain' bringin' me together.

Also, no real PVP fallacy.

PVP dont sell. It's why the game quickly abandoned said updates aside from battlegrounds.

Mate, every big MMO has PvP in it's endgame. Saying that PvP doesn't sell is madness if you compare how many MMO's have excellent PvP ingame.

It doesn't sell as much as PvE and cosmetics and who do you think buy cosmetics the most? PvErs.

darkstar2084 · June 2018

Miswar wrote: »

darkstar2084 wrote: »

someone enlighten me they have cyrodil, imperial city and now battlegrounds. What else do you think they could do for a pvp DLC? I cant really think of anything

Maybe start fixing the refered BROKEN things????

Ofcourse you are propably Doelmen hunting in Alikiri Desert so these do not afffect you.

lul I play battlegrounds everyday , already played so much cyrodil over the years. Sure some quality of life updates are needed for pvp, but i was talking actual DLC. people say they want a pvp dlc, like what though?

Ragnork · June 2018

MrSensible wrote: »

Healthy MMORPG games require a mixture of pvp and pve focus. PVP should never be the #1 priority in an MMO, as much as I wish it could. It simply isn't economically viable. It costs too many resources to balance and maintain vs. the number of people who are interested in. But that doesn't mean it should be forgotten altogether.

With a small modification I agree with this.

Junvyn · June 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

reguvin wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Ain' bringin' me together.

Also, no real PVP fallacy.

PVP dont sell. It's why the game quickly abandoned said updates aside from battlegrounds.

Mate, every big MMO has PvP in it's endgame. Saying that PvP doesn't sell is madness if you compare how many MMO's have excellent PvP ingame.

Mate, every big MMO which has prioratized PVP as it's driving force has died. Warhammer Online. Shadowbane. It's just a matter of history.

This game prioratized it up until a year in, when it realized that it just wasn't puting in the numbers needed for content production.

Disbelieve it if you want, call me crazy if you want, but PVP specific MMO's just dont tend to do well.

Black Desert Online? Don't like it but it's not dead.

binhao26 · June 2018

RP dead
PVP dead

No wonders why eso doesnt have much players compared to other major mmos.

Junvyn · June 2018

binhao26 wrote: »

RP dead
PVP dead

No wonders why eso doesnt have much players compared to other major mmos.

RP dead?
PVP dead?

Nice joke

Taternater · June 2018

PVE needs lots of updates. Fighting the same dungeon bosses with the same mechanics because they don't adapt to the player's moves gets boring. So they need to keep adding more of those so PVEers don't get bored. In PVP, the PVP is already the content. Players adapt and learn, you adapt and learn hopefully. It's actually active and each fight can be different. In PVE you get the same daily quests with the only variation is which delve or dungeon you have to go to this time again. Actually adding the Warden class might be considered a PVP update because now there's a new type of character to play as or against. When that werewolf dlc gets added, it might be a big change to cirodiil if they change the werewolf skills. Yesterday I saw a few werewolves running amok there. Werewolves might be the new meta depending on what changes they make, if any.

Tonnopesce · June 2018

Miswar wrote: »

darkstar2084 wrote: »

someone enlighten me they have cyrodil, imperial city and now battlegrounds. What else do you think they could do for a pvp DLC? I cant really think of anything

Maybe start fixing the refered BROKEN things????

Ofcourse you are propably Doelmen hunting in Alikiri Desert so these do not afffect you.

Half of the popolation is probably there,
doing "pve"...

Duukar · June 2018

They shelf PvP because they can't balance the game or fix basic issues with performance like CC break and weird lag.

PvP has been in a terrible state for a while now. Proc sets? Unblockables with CC and damage? Double CC or am I just dead a few seconds before the game catches up? Terrible terrible cheese builds allowed to run all over the player base. Had to mention proc garbage twice.

Aesthier · June 2018

reguvin wrote: »

PvP is what one of many things that brings players together. We had only 1 PvP Update in 4 years.

^ fixed for you.

EvilCroc · June 2018

PvP should be removed from game.

THEDKEXPERIENCE · June 2018

PVP is still fun for me. When it’s not, I go pick flowers. That’s ESO for me. Personally I find PVE very boring when I run the same content more than just a few times. I really don’t like playing against the CPU in any games.

Sylosi · June 2018

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Disbelieve it if you want, call me crazy if you want, but PVP specific MMO's just dont tend to do well.

MMORPGs don't really do well full-stop, which is why the genre is in rather a bad state, barely any AAA MMORPG's get released anymore ("new" MMORPGs these days are often some Asian MMO that already exists given a make-over for the western market), things like Titan, EQnext, etc were cancelled, the "biggest" MMORPG has half the numbers it once had and even most "successsful" MMORPGs follow a trend of decline.

Meanwhile over the last decade the number of people playing online games has massively increased, yet very few have gone to MMORPGs, instead they've gone to other genres (often PvP ones) so you have 80 million playing LoL (literally multiple times the playerbase of every major MMORPG combined), 30 million playing Overwatch, 3m concurrent players on Fortnite, etc.

MMORPGs are stuck in the past, with poor gameplay (PvE especially) so are largely left with a niche audience largely of Skinner Box zombies who only care about shiny things (and not really about gameplay) or super casual players, both groups of which are being eaten up by mobile games.

And incidentally on PvP specific MMOs, other than WoW the only western MMORPG that managed to grow its playerbase for years was EVE Online, a PvP MMORPG.

Karivaa · June 2018

We love pvp! I’ve made my best friends in pvp. It is all I have ever done. I am now doing pve because pvp is once again broken. We want a new map!

Integral1900 · June 2018

Elder scrolls was a single player franchise, pvp is not a natural fit for most of its players, it was always going to be a tough sell. Personally I avoid it as I do not enjoy it. I like pve, I like being the big hero and crushing all before me because it means I can forget my job for a few hours. The last thing I want is some gank fest full of angry people

Also ZOS is a business, they supply what sells the best, simple as that, the content is almost all pve because given the audience that is what sells.

Ragnarock41 · June 2018

Sylosi wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Disbelieve it if you want, call me crazy if you want, but PVP specific MMO's just dont tend to do well.

MMORPGs don't really do well full-stop, which is why the genre is in rather a bad state, barely any AAA MMORPG's get released anymore ("new" MMORPGs these days are often some Asian MMO that already exists given a make over for the western market), things like Titan, EQnext, etc were cancelled, the "biggest" MMORPG has half the numbers it once had and even most "successsful" MMORPGs follow a trend of decline.

Meanwhile over the last decade the number of people playing online games has massively increased, yet very few have gone to MMORPGs, instead they've gone to other genres (often PvP ones) so you have 80 million playing LoL (literally multiple times every major MMORPG combined), 30 million playing Overwatch, 3m concurrent players on Fortnite, etc.

MMORPGs are stuck in the past, with poor gameplay (PvE especially) so are largely left with a niche audience largely of Skinner Box zombies who only care about shiny things (and not really about gameplay) or super casual players, both groups of which are being eaten up by mobile games.

And incidentally on PvP specific MMOs, other than WoW the only western MMORPG that managed to grow its playerbase for years was EVE Online, a PvP MMORPG.

I'm suprised, a post that is correct and informative in this trash can that is called eso forums.

MMORPG's certainly aren't really popular anymore, but that is mostly because the genre refuses to innovate. Always the same old wow clones keep getting released, with usually tab target combat, uninsteresting and soulless gameplay, very generic ''tank,healer,dps'' roles.

Now ESO combat acts like its not tab target, but it actually is a tab targeting game, It just acts like its not. You can even press tab to select target. And as you said, the AI is braindead so PvE is boring and repetitive as hell. This is the same in almost all MMOs out there. Compared to wow , there just isn't anything new, no innovation at all, which is a shame.

In the end, mobile gaming will eventually steal all the casual audience, it is inevitable. Only and only then, we might see some innovation in the genre.

THEDKEXPERIENCE · June 2018

Integral1900 wrote: »

Elder scrolls was a single player franchise, pvp is not a natural fit for most of its players, it was always going to be a tough sell. Personally I avoid it as I do not enjoy it. I like pve, I like being the big hero and crushing all before me because it means I can forget my job for a few hours. The last thing I want is some gank fest full of angry people

Also ZOS is a business, they supply what sells the best, simple as that, the content is almost all pve because given the audience that is what sells.

It’s so funny the difference between viewpoints. XBox NA Vivec PVP is actually quite friendly. Almost all of the toxic stuff I’ve seen posted in chat over the last few weeks has been some form of “I just want Vigor! Why am I here! I hate PVP! Why is no one accepting my LFG request! You’re all so mean!” It’s a self fulfilling prophecy.

The every day PVPers are almost universally cool with each other these days.

BaylorCorvette · June 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

G1Countdown wrote: »

I want to see exactly ZERO PVP DLCs or Chapters. ZERO. They need to fix the servers to handle PVP first. It's a disaster. Then we can talk about PVP DLC or Chapters.

I wonder if Timestop is causing lag in Cyrodiil. It's just bubble after bubble after bubble...it's way overused and so many animations on top of all the proc animations can't be good for server stability.

Look at all these bubbles going off...

I don't think that is the main issue. I play on Shor, which has a tiny population compared to Vivec and there are still major performance issues since Summerset.

Bruccius · June 2018

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

reguvin wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Ain' bringin' me together.

Also, no real PVP fallacy.

PVP dont sell. It's why the game quickly abandoned said updates aside from battlegrounds.

Mate, every big MMO has PvP in it's endgame. Saying that PvP doesn't sell is madness if you compare how many MMO's have excellent PvP ingame.

Mate, every big MMO which has prioratized PVP as it's driving force has died. Warhammer Online. Shadowbane. It's just a matter of history.

This game prioratized it up until a year in, when it realized that it just wasn't puting in the numbers needed for content production.

Disbelieve it if you want, call me crazy if you want, but PVP specific MMO's just dont tend to do well.

This reminds me how people in early 2000's called f2p games are trash and all pay to win etc, and People in general said f2p games all should be avoided like a plague. And I used to agree.

Then games like dota 2, league, warframe , guild wars 2, and lately fortnite, changed the gaming world and showed us that making a free to play game that benefits EVERYONE, can still be done, without shady , greedy cash shops and other pay to win elements.

Now why this is important? Cause I believe PvP based MMOs are the same way. It can be done, Its just that developers don't do it correctly. The top 5 most played games on steam right now are all PvP based games for example(ESO is 28th on that same list as of right now.)

https://store.steampowered.com/stats/?

This shows the fact that people actually prefer PvP games. So whats my point?

My point is, PvP isn't the reason why the PvP MMOs are failing. Its something else. But I don't want to throw *** at zenimax so I'll keep it short. One day eventually we will have a proper , PvP based MMO, with great RvR. I don't know which game it will be, but I know if such a game ever comes out, cyrodiil will probably become a ghost town.

Games created solely for PvP cannot be compared to an MMO. The playerbase is entirely different.