Give more classes the option to remove snares/immobilization

TimeDazzler · April 2018

Shuffle requires that you wear 5 pieces of medium armor and removes snares/immobilizations for 2.5 seconds, pretty much the same as dodge roll. So please explain why forward momentum grants removal of all snares and immobilizations and grants immunity to them for 8 seconds. Either buff shuffle or nerf forward momentum to 5 seconds, even that is still a generous amount. Also, give magicka classes snare removal that doesn't require them to be a vampire. The DK wings change was a start but snares can be reapplied right after. Give wings 3 seconds snare and immobilization immunity, and give streak the DK treatment which will remove snares/immobilizations but doesn't give immunity.

BaylorCorvette · April 2018

Agree with this. I've been saying for a while now that Streak should remove snares. The class identity of Sorc (Stam & Mag) is mobility, it would only make sense if Sorc had a way to cleanse snares & immobilizations on them via their class skill tree. I Was really hoping that the Psijic order skill line might have something that would give everyone access, instead they make another snare ability...

Checkmath · April 2018

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

FlamingBeard · April 2018

BaylorCorvette wrote: »

Agree with this. I've been saying for a while now that Streak should remove snares. The class identity of Sorc (Stam & Mag) is mobility, it would only make sense if Sorc had a way to cleanse snares & immobilizations on them via their class skill tree. I Was really hoping that the Psijic order skill line might have something that would give everyone access, instead they make another snare ability...

Dragonknight and Templar have snare removal mechanics because they have no mobility of their own.

Sorcerer, Nightblade, and Warden have their own special movement buffs or skills.

BaylorCorvette · April 2018

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

The problem with StamSorc being 100% tied to weapon line abilities for damage is that they're pigeon holed into running 2h forward momentum in heavy armor and if they don't want to run 2h forward momentum then they have to run medium armor. Streak isn't exactly something a StamSorc can spam.

Checkmath · April 2018

stamsorcs have uncoditional minor expedition tied to their resistance buff, isnt that enough? anyway running 2h on a stamina char is the same for all classes. look at dks, they pretty much are bound to weapon abilities too and have no expedition buff at all, nothing to just port away.

TimeDazzler · April 2018

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

ManDraKE · April 2018

Checkmath wrote: »

stamsorcs have uncoditional minor expedition tied to their resistance buff, isnt that enough? anyway running 2h on a stamina char is the same for all classes. look at dks, they pretty much are bound to weapon abilities too and have no expedition buff at all, nothing to just port away.

speed bonuses are not counter to snares. If you are snared with a powerful snare, minor expedition won't change anything

TimeDazzler · April 2018

ManDraKE wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

stamsorcs have uncoditional minor expedition tied to their resistance buff, isnt that enough? anyway running 2h on a stamina char is the same for all classes. look at dks, they pretty much are bound to weapon abilities too and have no expedition buff at all, nothing to just port away.

speed bonuses are not counter to snares. If you are snared with a powerful snare, minor expedition won't change anything

Agreed, the only counter to snares is immunity. Having streak give removal but not immunity would not be an over-tuned change.

Checkmath · April 2018

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

right wardens have that for 10 seconds, so double the length or your example of quick cloak. btw the magicka morph of boundless storm also gives major expedition for 6-7 seconds or somewhat. and still sorc has streak, both combined makes them more mobile than wardens. and dont tell me, that you cant streak twice with your stamsorc.

TimeDazzler · April 2018

ManDraKE wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

stamsorcs have uncoditional minor expedition tied to their resistance buff, isnt that enough? anyway running 2h on a stamina char is the same for all classes. look at dks, they pretty much are bound to weapon abilities too and have no expedition buff at all, nothing to just port away.

speed bonuses are not counter to snares. If you are snared with a powerful snare, minor expedition won't change anything

Agreed, the only counter to snares is immunity. Having streak give removal but not immunity not be an over-tuned change.

Checkmath wrote: »

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

right wardens have that for 10 seconds, so double the length or your example of quick cloak. btw the magicka morph of boundless storm also gives major expedition for 6-7 seconds or somewhat. and still sorc has streak, both combined makes them more mobile than wardens. and dont tell me, that you cant streak twice with your stamsorc.

I can but only in 4 second intervals, otherwise, we have no magicka left for dark deal.

BaylorCorvette · April 2018

10% speed buff is nothing, especially when you have snares that can reduce speed up to 70% in the game. I agree DK's have less mobility. However, with every class in the game having easy access to snares (especially after Summerset) I think every class having better access to snare removal is justifiable.

Yeah any stam toon can run 2h and get forward momentum. However, aside from the execute 2h is a pretty terrible damage line against skilled players. I love it when I see my opponent trying to run dizzying swings / wrecking blows, it's so easy to counter. Dual Wield provides more pressure (snares, bleeds ignoring resistances, AoE execute, AoE Damage Reduction, etc). Bow is decent back bar pressure with poison injection, the skill line even provides some utility with a stun, immobilization and defile. Heck even Sword & Board can do decent damage with the LA + Heroic Slash + Bash combo and that weapon line gives fantastic utilization too. I guess my point is 2h is really an execute and snare cleanse bar and nothing more.

I don't see the harm in adding a snare cleanse via some world tree (like Psijic Order), if people want to use that it is one less area to slot a skill.

NyassaV · April 2018

DK sorta OP next patch

Checkmath · April 2018

ZoS once stated, that they want to have counters for everything in the game.
the problem here actually is not, that only afew classes have access to snare removal, rather the problem is this non balanced counters of everything. as example we have major and minor mending (25% and 8% more healing), which is countered by defile (15% for minor, 30% for major). this results into an imbalance. and there is the same problem with expedition buffs and snares: they actually are meant to counter each otheer, but ZoS again didnt do it properly. snares should be categorized into major and minor snares, where as major snare would be 30% speed reduction and minor snare 10%. changing this would result in actually nobody complaining about snares, since 10% and 30% arent that much and can be countered by using expedition buffs. no warden and no sorc would have to complain, since they would have a class skill to counter the snare. also nightblades have several option to have major expedition, only dks are pretty much left without something real (ok there are the chains...), therefore snare removel on wings would be fine. and templars have cleanse.

ezeepeezee · April 2018

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

I use major expedition potions for speed.

I don't even need them on stam warden though ...

Vaoh · April 2018

Would rather they remove snares from almost all skills than bandaid fix the issue with a few sources of snare immunity (meaning some builds are safe, others are screwed).

Why does a skill like Lotus Fan need a snare? Crippling Grasp? Sun Fire? All Ardent Flame Skills?

It wasn’t so problematic in the past, but the meta has changed drastically over the course of this game’s lifecycle. If you can’t remove snares you are absolutely dead vs any decent players. Snares should not be nearly as plentiful and “free” on skills as they are now.

That’s not to say to remove all of them ofc. Ice skills should all still snare. Ardent Flame skills should probably still snare as well. It’s the tons of other great skills that would be used no matter what which should have their snares removed.

Chilly-McFreeze · April 2018

Checkmath wrote: »

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

right wardens have that for 10 seconds, so double the length or your example of quick cloak. btw the magicka morph of boundless storm also gives major expedition for 6-7 seconds or somewhat. and still sorc has streak, both combined makes them more mobile than wardens. and dont tell me, that you cant streak twice with your stamsorc.

Streak once and every competent player with a gap closer (hello there, universal, unbound silver leash) is immediately on you again.
Streak twice in a row and you won't have enough mag for your other utility (surge, dark deal).
Streak thrice (given you start at 100% mag with a lot of mag investment - no, 9% dunmer passive + 1 set boni isn't even enough) and you run completely dry.
And then you stillhave to deal with the snare, roots and CCs.

Thing is, you can't spam streak on a stam sorc. Adding a removal without an immunity wouldn't break anything. People still had to run shuffle (yet alone for the evasion) or FM (for the HoT) as well.

Mag sorcs could indeed use it more often. But then again, they have no other means besides mist form to remove snares. And that requires being a vamp (which also has a few drawbacks and advantages) and another bar slot (which is already tight). Not to mention that mist form has it's mechanical downsides as well.

The status quo doesn't add up for the "most mobile class in the game". If mobility is the key element of the class and it's defense, zos did an awful work. It doesn't work with all the snares and gap closers. The key component is nearly useless. Just like the "build your house and wreck intruders" thingy for templars. Instead it forces sorcs into cheesy sets (7th legion, troll king) or shield stacking.

Would a removal on streak be enough to turn that around? Probably not. But it would be a start. Might as well add gap closer immunity to the other morph for the absorb duration.

FlamingBeard · April 2018

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

right wardens have that for 10 seconds, so double the length or your example of quick cloak. btw the magicka morph of boundless storm also gives major expedition for 6-7 seconds or somewhat. and still sorc has streak, both combined makes them more mobile than wardens. and dont tell me, that you cant streak twice with your stamsorc.

Streak once and every competent player with a gap closer (hello there, universal, unbound silver leash) is immediately on you again.
Streak twice in a row and you won't have enough mag for your other utility (surge, dark deal).
Streak thrice (given you start at 100% mag with a lot of mag investment - no, 9% dunmer passive + 1 set boni isn't even enough) and you run completely dry.
And then you stillhave to deal with the snare, roots and CCs.

Thing is, you can't spam streak on a stam sorc. Adding a removal without an immunity wouldn't break anything. People still had to run shuffle (yet alone for the evasion) or FM (for the HoT) as well.

Mag sorcs could indeed use it more often. But then again, they have no other means besides mist form to remove snares. And that requires being a vamp (which also has a few drawbacks and advantages) and another bar slot (which is already tight). Not to mention that mist form has it's mechanical downsides as well.

The status quo doesn't add up for the "most mobile class in the game". If mobility is the key element of the class and it's defense, zos did an awful work. It doesn't work with all the snares and gap closers. The key component is nearly useless. Just like the "build your house and wreck intruders" thingy for templars. Instead it forces sorcs into cheesy sets (7th legion, troll king) or shield stacking.

Would a removal on streak be enough to turn that around? Probably not. But it would be a start. Might as well add gap closer immunity to the other morph for the absorb duration.

All the nastiest snares are melee range except for snare poisons (which can't be removed by anything other than cleanse or purge so the DK wings snare removal won't work against it, same as Forward Momentum and Shuffle).

If a magSorcerer is close enough to be snared by Rending Slashes or Puncturing Strikes (skills known for their snares), they're playing magSorcerer inefficiently.

As for stamSorcerers, they have Shuffle.

The thing about "status quo" is that Sorcerer and Nightblade are the closest to what they used to be compared to Templar and Dragonknight.

You won't see many Templars sitting in their "house" anymore because the "house" was torn down and replaced with a toolshed by repeated nerfs over the years.

Sorcerer retains all of its mobility and now the nastiest snares (such as Templar's) are receiving shorter uptimes, meaning that Templars who had trouble keeping Sorcerers near them before will have even more trouble with it now.

Chilly-McFreeze · April 2018

Being lazy so I just write my respones in the quote.

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

right wardens have that for 10 seconds, so double the length or your example of quick cloak. btw the magicka morph of boundless storm also gives major expedition for 6-7 seconds or somewhat. and still sorc has streak, both combined makes them more mobile than wardens. and dont tell me, that you cant streak twice with your stamsorc.

Streak once and every competent player with a gap closer (hello there, universal, unbound silver leash) is immediately on you again.
Streak twice in a row and you won't have enough mag for your other utility (surge, dark deal).
Streak thrice (given you start at 100% mag with a lot of mag investment - no, 9% dunmer passive + 1 set boni isn't even enough) and you run completely dry.
And then you stillhave to deal with the snare, roots and CCs.

Thing is, you can't spam streak on a stam sorc. Adding a removal without an immunity wouldn't break anything. People still had to run shuffle (yet alone for the evasion) or FM (for the HoT) as well.

Mag sorcs could indeed use it more often. But then again, they have no other means besides mist form to remove snares. And that requires being a vamp (which also has a few drawbacks and advantages) and another bar slot (which is already tight). Not to mention that mist form has it's mechanical downsides as well.

The status quo doesn't add up for the "most mobile class in the game". If mobility is the key element of the class and it's defense, zos did an awful work. It doesn't work with all the snares and gap closers. The key component is nearly useless. Just like the "build your house and wreck intruders" thingy for templars. Instead it forces sorcs into cheesy sets (7th legion, troll king) or shield stacking.

Would a removal on streak be enough to turn that around? Probably not. But it would be a start. Might as well add gap closer immunity to the other morph for the absorb duration.

All the nastiest snares are melee range except for snare poisons (which can't be removed by anything other than cleanse or purge so the DK wings snare removal won't work against it, same as Forward Momentum and Shuffle).

If a magSorcerer is close enough to be snared by Rending Slashes or Puncturing Strikes (skills known for their snares), they're playing magSorcerer inefficiently.

With all the gap closers, snares, ranged stuns, roots etc. being always at range and kiting is nearly impossible. Also, once you're in melee range (what will happen eventually) and snared you won't get out of it any more. Begin streaking from afar and you're good. But you know, you have to set up that damage over 3.5s. Or even be in melee range if you're stam.

As for stamSorcerers, they have Shuffle.

see my original comment

The thing about "status quo" is that Sorcerer and Nightblade are the closest to what they used to be compared to Templar and Dragonknight.

You won't see many Templars sitting in their "house" anymore because the "house" was torn down and replaced with a toolshed by repeated nerfs over the years.

I honestly don't know how it was before I started in feb '16. But I agree, the templar's house won't work (anymore).

Sorcerer retains all of its mobility and now the nastiest snares (such as Templar's) are receiving shorter uptimes, meaning that Templars who had trouble keeping Sorcerers near them before will have even more trouble with it now.

FlamingBeard · April 2018

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Being lazy so I just write my respones in the quote.

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

right wardens have that for 10 seconds, so double the length or your example of quick cloak. btw the magicka morph of boundless storm also gives major expedition for 6-7 seconds or somewhat. and still sorc has streak, both combined makes them more mobile than wardens. and dont tell me, that you cant streak twice with your stamsorc.

Streak once and every competent player with a gap closer (hello there, universal, unbound silver leash) is immediately on you again.
Streak twice in a row and you won't have enough mag for your other utility (surge, dark deal).
Streak thrice (given you start at 100% mag with a lot of mag investment - no, 9% dunmer passive + 1 set boni isn't even enough) and you run completely dry.
And then you stillhave to deal with the snare, roots and CCs.

Thing is, you can't spam streak on a stam sorc. Adding a removal without an immunity wouldn't break anything. People still had to run shuffle (yet alone for the evasion) or FM (for the HoT) as well.

Mag sorcs could indeed use it more often. But then again, they have no other means besides mist form to remove snares. And that requires being a vamp (which also has a few drawbacks and advantages) and another bar slot (which is already tight). Not to mention that mist form has it's mechanical downsides as well.

The status quo doesn't add up for the "most mobile class in the game". If mobility is the key element of the class and it's defense, zos did an awful work. It doesn't work with all the snares and gap closers. The key component is nearly useless. Just like the "build your house and wreck intruders" thingy for templars. Instead it forces sorcs into cheesy sets (7th legion, troll king) or shield stacking.

Would a removal on streak be enough to turn that around? Probably not. But it would be a start. Might as well add gap closer immunity to the other morph for the absorb duration.

All the nastiest snares are melee range except for snare poisons (which can't be removed by anything other than cleanse or purge so the DK wings snare removal won't work against it, same as Forward Momentum and Shuffle).

If a magSorcerer is close enough to be snared by Rending Slashes or Puncturing Strikes (skills known for their snares), they're playing magSorcerer inefficiently.

With all the gap closers, snares, ranged stuns, roots etc. being always at range and kiting is nearly impossible. Also, once you're in melee range (what will happen eventually) and snared you won't get out of it any more. Begin streaking from afar and you're good. But you know, you have to set up that damage over 3.5s. Or even be in melee range if you're stam.

As for stamSorcerers, they have Shuffle.

see my original comment

The thing about "status quo" is that Sorcerer and Nightblade are the closest to what they used to be compared to Templar and Dragonknight.

You won't see many Templars sitting in their "house" anymore because the "house" was torn down and replaced with a toolshed by repeated nerfs over the years.

I honestly don't know how it was before I started in feb '16. But I agree, the templar's house won't work (anymore).

Sorcerer retains all of its mobility and now the nastiest snares (such as Templar's) are receiving shorter uptimes, meaning that Templars who had trouble keeping Sorcerers near them before will have even more trouble with it now.

My statement still stands that the worst snares are being nerfed, so if anything, anyone who invests in classes that can remove snares are technically being made less useful in Summerset Update, compared to classes which are mobile by default.

Chilly-McFreeze · April 2018

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Being lazy so I just write my respones in the quote.

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Cries wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

yes to shuffle buff.
snare immunity to wings....maybe.
no to snare removel for streak.
its already the most mobile class, sorcerer doesnt need more of that mobility.

I disagree with this, especially with the 4 seconds of 50% increased magicka cost on streak. As for minor expedition on stamsorc's armor buff, that's only 10% movement speed. May I remind you that stam wardens get minor brutality, major expedition, and major endurance on a single skill? Honestly, stamwardens are faster than stam sorcs nowadays. The only way a stam sorc is faster is if they are using quick cloak which gives major expedition for what 5 seconds?

right wardens have that for 10 seconds, so double the length or your example of quick cloak. btw the magicka morph of boundless storm also gives major expedition for 6-7 seconds or somewhat. and still sorc has streak, both combined makes them more mobile than wardens. and dont tell me, that you cant streak twice with your stamsorc.

Streak once and every competent player with a gap closer (hello there, universal, unbound silver leash) is immediately on you again.
Streak twice in a row and you won't have enough mag for your other utility (surge, dark deal).
Streak thrice (given you start at 100% mag with a lot of mag investment - no, 9% dunmer passive + 1 set boni isn't even enough) and you run completely dry.
And then you stillhave to deal with the snare, roots and CCs.

Thing is, you can't spam streak on a stam sorc. Adding a removal without an immunity wouldn't break anything. People still had to run shuffle (yet alone for the evasion) or FM (for the HoT) as well.

Mag sorcs could indeed use it more often. But then again, they have no other means besides mist form to remove snares. And that requires being a vamp (which also has a few drawbacks and advantages) and another bar slot (which is already tight). Not to mention that mist form has it's mechanical downsides as well.

The status quo doesn't add up for the "most mobile class in the game". If mobility is the key element of the class and it's defense, zos did an awful work. It doesn't work with all the snares and gap closers. The key component is nearly useless. Just like the "build your house and wreck intruders" thingy for templars. Instead it forces sorcs into cheesy sets (7th legion, troll king) or shield stacking.

Would a removal on streak be enough to turn that around? Probably not. But it would be a start. Might as well add gap closer immunity to the other morph for the absorb duration.

All the nastiest snares are melee range except for snare poisons (which can't be removed by anything other than cleanse or purge so the DK wings snare removal won't work against it, same as Forward Momentum and Shuffle).

If a magSorcerer is close enough to be snared by Rending Slashes or Puncturing Strikes (skills known for their snares), they're playing magSorcerer inefficiently.

With all the gap closers, snares, ranged stuns, roots etc. being always at range and kiting is nearly impossible. Also, once you're in melee range (what will happen eventually) and snared you won't get out of it any more. Begin streaking from afar and you're good. But you know, you have to set up that damage over 3.5s. Or even be in melee range if you're stam.

As for stamSorcerers, they have Shuffle.

see my original comment

The thing about "status quo" is that Sorcerer and Nightblade are the closest to what they used to be compared to Templar and Dragonknight.

You won't see many Templars sitting in their "house" anymore because the "house" was torn down and replaced with a toolshed by repeated nerfs over the years.

I honestly don't know how it was before I started in feb '16. But I agree, the templar's house won't work (anymore).

Sorcerer retains all of its mobility and now the nastiest snares (such as Templar's) are receiving shorter uptimes, meaning that Templars who had trouble keeping Sorcerers near them before will have even more trouble with it now.

My statement still stands that the worst snares are being nerfed, so if anything, anyone who invests in classes that can remove snares are technically being made less useful in Summerset Update, compared to classes which are mobile by default.

Shortening the extremely potent snares does nothing when they are attached to a spammable. But theoretically, from an standpoint that only compares how things are relative to each other on paper, you are correct. But then again, in practice snares will still be an issue you can't overlook just because investment costs are higher on templars than on NBs. We will see how that turns out.

ak_pvp · April 2018

+To snare removal but not immunity to sorcs. They should be the most mobile class and that should be its defense.

Snares should be 30+10% so that mobile classes can outpace them. Whilst slow classes can remove/resist them. Sorcs should be the most mobile, so be able to remove and outpace them.

Chilly-McFreeze · April 2018

ak_pvp wrote: »

+To snare removal but not immunity to sorcs. They should be the most mobile class and that should be its defense.

Snares should be 30+10% so that mobile classes can outpace them. Whilst slow classes can remove/resist them. Sorcs should be the most mobile, so be able to remove and outpace them.

This. When mobility becomes viable again as main defense one might be less compelled to stack shields.