Shimmering sheild

NyassaV · April 2018

Make it cost as much as wings

Discuss!

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER · April 2018

This skill is a joke. Make it more expensive and remove the magicka return it gives..

Ragnarock41 · April 2018

Just remove the magicka return entirely. There is just no reason for that.

_Ahala_ · April 2018

Speaking as a Magden main from day one of Morrowind... Make shimmering have a higherer health scaling so it’s really only practical for mitigation on 40k health tanks and make slab scale off max mag and have it absorb direct damage so that it’s damage return isn’t useless against some specs... also yes remove the mag return... defensive abilities should be worthy and expensive. Their is no reason that Stam pvp dps build with it’s access to vigor, block, and dodge should have access to a range shutdown hardened ward equivalent with MAJOR heroism for free

Lynx7386 · April 2018

NyassaV wrote: »

Make it cost as much as wings

Discuss!

Make it reflect 120% projectile damage and we'll talk.

Shimmering shield is purely defensive. Wings are an offensive option. Offense always costs more than defense. Working as intended.

NyassaV · April 2018

Lynx7386 wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

Make it cost as much as wings

Discuss!

Make it reflect 120% projectile damage and we'll talk.

It negates the damage and gives you ultimate which can be used to do a lot of damage or a lot of healing. Recycles the energy

Skander · April 2018

Cost of shimmering shield increased: OK

Cost of the base morph increased: NOT OK

Crystalize slab has its value but having a cost increase to it seems uncalled for

_Ahala_ · April 2018

Yes we need more incentives to run slab over shimmering, why not make shimmering the tankden morph and slab the Magden morph and change the shield stat scaling calculations respectively?

ToRelax · April 2018

If it absorbs 3 projectiles it's almost free. Would you be okay with it if it absorbed melee skills instead?
Scales are expensive, and their main purpose is defensive, not offensive. They still work as a hardcounter against heavily projectile based builds. Crystallized Shield is effectively much cheaper and works against a larger amount of different skills.

ak_pvp · April 2018

Lynx7386 wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

Make it cost as much as wings

Discuss!

Make it reflect 120% projectile damage and we'll talk.

Shimmering shield is purely defensive. Wings are an offensive option. Offense always costs more than defense. Working as intended.

Purely defensive. Major ultimate bonus.
Hmm...

I'll trade you wings for shimmering?

jbjondeaueb17_ESO · April 2018

Meanwhile, Templars have Sun Shield, they take the light from the sun in their face, and they die blind with tears in their eyes. :'(

Minno · April 2018

It's fine, with the mag cost increase. Wardens don't have executes, so they need to have strong defenses.

Don't follow the pitfall of the Templar; get an execute to appease pve wardens but strip all PvP defense. That's a situation no one wants.

_Ahala_ · April 2018

Shimmering shield is overtuned, it should only provide its current defense at twice the health and slab should scale off magic for its defense and damage return... and neither should refund their own costs, that’s just ridiculous, imagine if hardened ward scaled off health and refunded it’s cost against certain specs, stamsorcs would be Gods against those builds. But making both morphs mag scaled would hurt Tankdens so shimmering should scale with health, but in a way that it’s effective at 40k not 20k health. And defenses should cost something... that goes without saying

_Ahala_ · April 2018

Maybe we could also rework it to defend against direct damage instead of ranged as well so that slab isn’t useless in some matchups... but that would need to be balanced carefully

_Ahala_ · April 2018

And on another note... yes one morph of sun shield should provide major evasion or a reworked blindness status effect so that it’s actually used

Minalan · April 2018

As others have mentioned, the defense shield needs to scale off of Max Magicka.

I don’t mind shimmering shield on a magwarden, with their high Max Magicka it shouldn’t change.

I DO mind shimmering shield on a stamina warden. It’s *** ridiculous.

_Ahala_ · April 2018

I suppose the shimmering would still find a slot on tanks for major heroism... but I we remove the health scaling on the base ability we will most certainly need to buff arctic wind for Tankdens in order to make up for lost defense... but clearly shimmering on stamden is rediculosly op when you try to fight them as any sort of caster... its just as bad as hardened ward would be on stamsorc if it scaled off health

Jeezye · April 2018

jbjondeaueb17_ESO wrote: »

Meanwhile, Templars have Sun Shield, they take the light from the sun in their face, and they die blind with tears in their eyes. :'(

HAHAHA thx made my day

Vaoh · April 2018

Good point. We need to nerf everything Magden uses in PvP. I saw one Mag Warden after PvPing for 2 hours yesterday and I was disgusted.

So far:
Nerf Dive into uselessness? Check
Nerf Scorch, remove class-based stun? Check
Nerf Fletcher Infection? Not yet, please nerf
Nerf Healing Thicket so Resto Ult is better? Check
Nerf Shimmering Shield? Check, but plz nerf more so they won’t use it
Nerf Ice Cloak? Not yet, please nerf too

Hmm.... what else.

Fr though, this class is like everyone’s beating bag. Mag Wardens crutches on a few skills and qqers have legit nerfed all of those crutches (except Shimmering Shield) without any considerations for buffs. I guess that’s one way to avoid making it P2W

If the intention is solely to nerf Stamden, just make Crystallized Shield scale off Max Magicka. Projectile Damage will barely even get mitigated if that happens, and Stam Warden will essentially slot Shimmering Shield for Ult gen rather than a strong defense. Mag Warden will get to keep this skill.

Arciris · April 2018

Birds nerf: checked
Shalks nerf: checked
Now working on Shimmering Shield, I wonder what ability comes next... mmm Leaching vines? No wait, I know: the Netch!
Netch: free cast, long duration buff, free resource return, free purge (mag version)
Sorry guys, I couldn't resist

Vaoh · April 2018

Arciris wrote: »

Birds nerf: checked
Shalks nerf: checked
Now working on Shimmering Shield, I wonder what ability comes next... mmm Leaching vines? No wait, I know: the Netch!
Netch: free cast, long duration buff, free resource return, free purge (mag version)
Sorry guys, I couldn't resist

It’s kind of crazy how that works lol.
I see some people who want to buff DKs, NB, etc, and then they come here to this thread and want to nerf the weakest class spec across the entire game. They expect their class to get fair treatment, constantly defend it, cry about how it doesn’t make sense why their class would ever get a nerf, but then vehemently support nerfing everyone who isn’t their main. Legit not surprised in the slightest by the hypocrisy - it’s something you see in pretty much any game. They choose a main class and push to get them buffed and everyone else nerfed. Or just as bad, they suggest to nerf one side of a class (Stam) with zero thought towards the other (Mag).

Arciris · April 2018

Vaoh wrote: »

Good point. We need to nerf everything Magden uses in PvP. I saw one Mag Warden after PvPing for 2 hours yesterday and I was disgusted.

So far:
Nerf Dive into uselessness? Check
Nerf Scorch, remove class-based stun? Check
Nerf Fletcher Infection? Not yet, please nerf
Nerf Healing Thicket so Resto Ult is better? Check
Nerf Shimmering Shield? Check, but plz nerf more so they won’t use it
Nerf Ice Cloak? Not yet, please nerf too

Hmm.... what else.

Fr though, this class is like everyone’s beating bag. Mag Wardens crutches on a few skills and qqers have legit nerfed all of those crutches (except Shimmering Shield) without any considerations for buffs. I guess that’s one way to avoid making it P2W If the intention is solely to nerf Stamden, just make Crystallized Shield scale off Max Magicka. Projectile Damage will barely even get mitigated if that happens, and Stam Warden will essentially slot Shimmering Shield for Ult gen rather than a strong defense. Mag Warden will get to keep this skill.

Oh wow, I didn't saw your post as I was still writing mine... what a coincidence!

_Ahala_ · April 2018

Even if it scales off max mag, which it should because stamden has far to much defense against casters even on one shot builds, it shouldn’t refund its cost... mag return leaves it overpowered even if it’s only for us magdens and not stamdens... defenses should be powerful and costly. If it becomes inadequate as a projectile absorption without it being practically free to use, make it absorb direct damage instead.

Major heroism is a powerful buff, so maybe slab should be buffed to be more desirable. I would rather have a good class with many interesting well balanced skills than one that’s severally limited but always on the chopping block because of one or two overpowered skills.

We magdens need serious help as that portion of the class is bottom tier in all damage dealing rolls both pvp and pve, a complete rework or a litany of buffs may be necessary at this point, but until stamden is no longer godly we will never get buffs for magden.

Vaoh · April 2018

_Ahala_ wrote: »

Major heroism is a powerful buff, so maybe slab should be buffed to be more desirable. I would rather have a good class with many interesting well balanced skills than one that’s severally limited but always on the chopping block because of one or two overpowered skills.

I did all of the math recently on a different thread - according to trial leaderboards on PS4 NA, only 1.740% (62 out of 3568) of all Trial entries were Wardens. Also going through the entries themselves, Aetherian Archive had 6 Warden entries and 3 were the same person xD Basically all entries were people using a Warden alt for weeklies. The class is that bad in PvE.

When it comes to PvP they’re significantly worse than their Stam counterparts.

I’d rather keep Shimmering Shield strong on Magden (scale with Max Mag) than make it barely worth casting and utterly kill off the class. Dive and Healing Thicket were the other “crutch” skills which got nerfed into near-uselessness. Deep Fissure is getting nerfed which is absolutely essential for Magdens.

But yeah, I completely agree that this class needs a LOT of changes. Just good luck getting ZOS to actually fix their mess of a class. Likely never going to happen.

ak_pvp · April 2018

Vaoh wrote: »

Good point. We need to nerf everything Magden uses in PvP. I saw one Mag Warden after PvPing for 2 hours yesterday and I was disgusted.

So far:
Nerf Dive into uselessness? Check
Nerf Scorch, remove class-based stun? Check
Nerf Fletcher Infection? Not yet, please nerf
Nerf Healing Thicket so Resto Ult is better? Check
Nerf Shimmering Shield? Check, but plz nerf more so they won’t use it
Nerf Ice Cloak? Not yet, please nerf too

Hmm.... what else.

Fr though, this class is like everyone’s beating bag. Mag Wardens crutches on a few skills and qqers have legit nerfed all of those crutches (except Shimmering Shield) without any considerations for buffs. I guess that’s one way to avoid making it P2W If the intention is solely to nerf Stamden, just make Crystallized Shield scale off Max Magicka. Projectile Damage will barely even get mitigated if that happens, and Stam Warden will essentially slot Shimmering Shield for Ult gen rather than a strong defense. Mag Warden will get to keep this skill.

A class based of crutches is bad design. Magden is pretty bad now however.

Thicket was OP, and is now still pretty good, since it returns, and is a little cheaper.

Dive was OP, but yeah is useless now, just a worse pulse. I liked the combo of beetle, bird, pulse though, and the delay kept it.

Shield is OP, you can't deny that. However the shouldn't nerf it to death; I say give it a similar change to my wings idea, where the mag it returns is lowered, but it absorbs and gives mag from 3 projectiles per person. That way its hard to sustain vs 1, but better, vs X.

Scorch should stay the same, as live, its strong, but easily evadable and telegraphed, and the stun can be dodged.

Everything else is OK.

Lynx7386 · April 2018

As far as scaling - both morphs scale off of max health right now (as far as the damage from each projectile they can absorb). It shouldnt scale off of magicka OR stamina, as it's a tanking ability first and foremost.

_Ahala_ · April 2018

I wonder if they would ever consider having the slab morph auto fire it’s projectiles at the nearest combatant every two seconds so it’s useful against melee or making Arctic blast a ranged dot hard cc so we could actually make cryomancers instead of removing our class stun completely or having fissure set enemies off balance or giving fetcher flies and morphs execute scaling or fixing that eternal guardian auto resummon forced animation bug or make at least one green balance ability do damage, or fixing at accursed stuck in combat warden bug or making our passives more interesting or anything really...

They have a few weeks to set this right...

But if we don’t get anything in summerset I’m with you on the pessimism train... almost half expecting them to come out and say “all morphs are now Stam based on this class to fit with the design that Magden should be extinct. This is a buff if you play a Stamden or need to be forced to play another class for magic”

NyassaV · April 2018

_Ahala_ wrote: »

Maybe we could also rework it to defend against direct damage instead of ranged as well so that slab isn’t useless in some matchups... but that would need to be balanced carefully

terrible idea really

NyassaV · April 2018

Vaoh wrote: »

Good point. We need to nerf everything Magden uses in PvP. I saw one Mag Warden after PvPing for 2 hours yesterday and I was disgusted.

So far:
Nerf Dive into uselessness? Check
Nerf Scorch, remove class-based stun? Check
Nerf Fletcher Infection? Not yet, please nerf
Nerf Healing Thicket so Resto Ult is better? Check
Nerf Shimmering Shield? Check, but plz nerf more so they won’t use it
Nerf Ice Cloak? Not yet, please nerf too

Hmm.... what else.

Fr though, this class is like everyone’s beating bag. Mag Wardens crutches on a few skills and qqers have legit nerfed all of those crutches (except Shimmering Shield) without any considerations for buffs. I guess that’s one way to avoid making it P2W If the intention is solely to nerf Stamden, just make Crystallized Shield scale off Max Magicka. Projectile Damage will barely even get mitigated if that happens, and Stam Warden will essentially slot Shimmering Shield for Ult gen rather than a strong defense. Mag Warden will get to keep this skill.

Those are different issues. Shimmering is still insanely strong any ANY spec

Ragnarock41 · April 2018

I see that I will get hate from magicka wardens for saying that shimmering needs nerfs, but really, shimmering is overtuned. The major heroism is more than worth the cost, and the cost return on hit mechanic is totally unneccessary.

Removing it then buffing magden elsewhere would be a better move.

Like for example ,the warden dot (Forgot the name), could use a buff to its damage output. and the cliff racer animation could be a little less clunky.

IZZEFlameLash · April 2018

Yes, let's turn the Warden into absolute trash like they did with Imperials once they started to nerf things. Stam wardens might not need it but magicka wardens need the shimmering. Maybe making it behave like projectile shield scaling with magicka would be the solution.