3-4 dd meta...

LadyNalcarya · March 2018

Does anyone have an impression that healers arent really needed anymore (except for trials and pvp groups, of course) or is it just me?
I mean, even in the first week after dlc release, most of lfg's in my guild were for 3 dds+1 tank setup.
As someone who really enjoys healing, I would say its sad to see this. Of course, I can find a group that wants to play safely but it still sucks that they would do the dungeon faster if they took a magblade instead of me.

Peekachu99 · March 2018

For speedruns, many HM and No Deaths (believe it or not), 3 DDs with shields and 1 self-sustaining tank will always be the most efficient. Most healers can just stack their bars with attack skills, though, since their spelldamage is usually okay.

Feanor · March 2018

Dungeon design is one reason. As you can’t heal one shots anyway, but these tend to be more and more prevalent for making a dungeon „hard“, you might as well use a 3rd DD and burn stuff down quicker. I’d say that’s only viable for guild groups though. Pugs without a healer are not a great idea in most cases.

LadyNalcarya · March 2018

Peekachu99 wrote: »

For speedruns, many HM and No Deaths (believe it or not), 3 DDs with shields and 1 self-sustaining tank will always be the most efficient. Most healers can just stack their bars with attack skills, though, since their spelldamage is usually okay.

I do believe that and I know that for sure as I did that on my tank.
And on a healer my dps is still subpar compared to a full time dd so it still sucks

casparian · March 2018

It's been this way for a while.

I hate to say this, but Funnel Health needs to go. Swallow Soul is fine, as it doesn't provide any ally healing. Funnel can be changed to give the group 3% healing received or something, or else it can be changed to favor Nightblade healers instead of DPS (so drop the damage and up the healing).

Even then, an experienced team of 3 DPS + 1 tank will still always be preferable to taking a healer in most DLC dungeons, once the team has learned the mechanics. ZOS would have to change something major to alter that.

Voxicity · March 2018

Yeah 3 dd 1 tank is definitely superior to having a healer in the group. Especially with the new dungeons since the damage is either not that much (shieldable) or a 1 shot which a healer would have no control over either

Peekachu99 · March 2018

Oh, also—and one of Alcasts’ tips, I believe—use the Pheonix set on your DDs if you’re going for No Death runs.

Iselin · March 2018

I only play my real healer on special occasions by appointment only. For pugs I use my DPS/healer hybrid with the idea I'll be pumping out the damage but I'll throw a heal your way if you screw up... it's my job after all.

jakeedmundson · March 2018

we did 3 DD/1 tank last night on scalecaller peak.
Could have probably done hardmode with that group but kept getting one-shot by the crap-chanics.

Us - "...but i was IN the shield aoe and hit the synergy"
Game - "Nope, you're dead"

Us - "I wasn't even in the poison cone and i died, look where my body is..."
Game - "Nope, you're dead again"

White wabbit · March 2018

Voxicity wrote: »

Yeah 3 dd 1 tank is definitely superior to having a healer in the group. Especially with the new dungeons since the damage is either not that much (shieldable) or a 1 shot which a healer would have no control over either

Especially when it's a warden tank with heals for days

LadyNalcarya · March 2018

Feanor wrote: »

Dungeon design is one reason. As you can’t heal one shots anyway, but these tend to be more and more prevalent for making a dungeon „hard“, you might as well use a 3rd DD and burn stuff down quicker. I’d say that’s only viable for guild groups though. Pugs without a healer are not a great idea in most cases.

Yeah but on the other hand, pugging as a healer isnt a good idea, too XD

Anrose · March 2018

Maybe the one shot mechanics should be changed to take a character down to 3% if its health. That still makes it important to get out of it while making it advantageous to have a healer. Not to mention being slightly more forgiving when lag happens and for less skilled players.

Carbonised · March 2018

Since DPS is king, and most things in DLC dungs are one-shots, healers are becomming quite superfluous.

Bad dungeon design, really. Making DPS less overwhelming so you can't just burn through every mechanic (whatever happened to lowering the ceiling as well), and make damage less about just using mechanics to avoid 1-shots, and actually require a healer, and things might turn around.

Unfortunately the game seems to move ever further into the pigeonhole of 1-shot mechanics and moar DPS requirements.

badmojo · March 2018

Scaling heals off of damage numbers was doomed from the start.

Ratzkifal · March 2018

Since ZOS wants every class to perform every role, magDDs only need to switch out one skill to become healers (e.g. Winged Twilight). While it's good that every class should be able to perform every role, 3DDs with one skill less simply finish a dungeon faster than two DDs with a healer. I wouldn't even want to go into vDSA without three DDs because it takes too long.
Perhaps the main problem here is the dungeon design itself. New dungeons shouldn't take ages to complete, bosses shouldn't be able to get melted through their mechanics and DDs shouldn't pull the same healing numbers as healers without healing equipment.

LadyNalcarya · March 2018

Carbonised wrote: »

Since DPS is king, and most things in DLC dungs are one-shots, healers are becomming quite superfluous.

Bad dungeon design, really. Making DPS less overwhelming so you can't just burn through every mechanic (whatever happened to lowering the ceiling as well), and make damage less about just using mechanics to avoid 1-shots, and actually require a healer, and things might turn around.

Unfortunately the game seems to move ever further into the pigeonhole of 1-shot mechanics and moar DPS requirements.

Thats true... For example, the last phase of vFang Lair hardmode is much easier when you can just burst the boss down as soon as he heals. Or Bloodroot hardmode where you have to burst the splitting boss asap.
Its really not a good design when having a healer makes things harder in some of the most difficult dungeons in game.

The_Brosteen · March 2018

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

Does anyone have an impression that healers arent really needed anymore (except for trials and pvp groups, of course) or is it just me?
I mean, even in the first week after dlc release, most of lfg's in my guild were for 3 dds+1 tank setup.
As someone who really enjoys healing, I would say its sad to see this. Of course, I can find a group that wants to play safely but it still sucks that they would do the dungeon faster if they took a magblade instead of me.

Move to pc, you will find plenty opportunity to heal.

LadyNalcarya · March 2018

The_Brosteen wrote: »

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

Does anyone have an impression that healers arent really needed anymore (except for trials and pvp groups, of course) or is it just me?
I mean, even in the first week after dlc release, most of lfg's in my guild were for 3 dds+1 tank setup.
As someone who really enjoys healing, I would say its sad to see this. Of course, I can find a group that wants to play safely but it still sucks that they would do the dungeon faster if they took a magblade instead of me.

Move to pc, you will find plenty opportunity to heal.

Im on PC/EU.

And at this point I only heal in trials.