Should there be a CP catch up mechanic? Should we be able to buy them?

SilverIce58 · February 2018

Arthur_Spoonfondle wrote: »

SilverIce58 wrote: »

Elder Scrolls Online has nothing to do with Bethesda developing ESVI, two separate studios. And besides, Bethesda won't release ESVI until they release two major, big games first.

Phage wrote: »

ZOS isn't hindering ES6 development in any way. Anything else you hear is misinformation.

If you want to blame someone, blame Bethesda and Zenimax Media, and their business sense. In addition to letting an unknown, new IP take development priority over ES6, they've decided rereleasing Skyrim again and again is more profitable than developing a new Elder Scrolls title.

Believe that if you want to but, Zenimax doesn't want TESO players, many of whom are paying to play and/or spending money repeatedly on fluff, to leave TESO and play ES six, as long as TESO is nicely profitable. The Skyrim titbits are just to keep ES players interested in the meantime.

Wow, way to be a complete conspiracy theorist, nevermind that Pete Hines tweeted about the reason on Feb 2nd.

https://twitter.com/DCDeacon/status/959510977682333696?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

You're probably just going to believe whatever you want anyways.

VaranisArano · February 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

Back in my day, we had to earn VR/CP walking uphill both ways in a snowstorm with bees chasing us!

^ This thread, in a nutshell.

There's an interesting real-life parallel here because it shows just how common it is for people who already got theirs to selfishly resist any sort of progress that might help other people get theirs, too.

"OMG it would ruin the game, OMG you might as well just sell gold and Maelstrom weapons in the Crown Store, OMGeezy this isn't WoW" blah blah blah.

Just strong opinions masquerading as reasons.

Why do you care if it becomes easier for someone else to get to max CP? Does that somehow diminish your meaningless achievement of reaching max CP?

We also have threads complaining about max level, high CP players who don't know how to do more than spam a couple (useless) skills running around in Vet dungeons.

High CP =/= player experience

In fact, the easier you make it to gain high CP, the more likely it is that high CP will not equal player experience.

DDemon · February 2018

I'm well over the CP cap and really never had to farm for them. If people want to buy CP to get to the new cap, meh, why not, just make it really expensive.

Alternatively they could add a one time boost that could add like 30 or 60 CP whenever the cap increases?

AlienatedGoat · February 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

Back in my day, we had to earn VR/CP walking uphill both ways in a snowstorm with bees chasing us!

^ This thread, in a nutshell.

There's an interesting real-life parallel here because it shows just how common it is for people who already got theirs to selfishly resist any sort of progress that might help other people get theirs, too.

"OMG it would ruin the game, OMG you might as well just sell gold and Maelstrom weapons in the Crown Store, OMGeezy this isn't WoW" blah blah blah.

Just strong opinions masquerading as reasons.

Why do you care if it becomes easier for someone else to get to max CP? Does that somehow diminish your meaningless achievement of reaching max CP?

Has nothing to do with achievement at all. If you'd bothered to actually read my posts in this thread you'd know that.

Not going to bother retyping it all. It's there if you want to read it, and the reason is sound.

AlienatedGoat · February 2018

DoctorESO wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Those of you asking for more enlightenment, do you seriously play enough to be constantly running out? It accrues every day. The only times I've ever run out was during double exp events when I was questing constantly.

Well, the day's allowance does run out in a single random normal dungeon, which can take as little as 10 minutes.

Enlightenment is a great catch-up, but it isn't for grinders. If you grind (or quest) out your enlightenment every single day, then you don't need the catch-up as much as someone who only plays for a couple days a week, and thus benefits from having the enlightenment accrue.

If you want more enlightenment total, take a break.

If you want more daily enlightenment, well, that you can ask ZOS for. I doubt they'll do it, since they've already frontloaded CP value and lowered the exp necessary for early CP.

Someone can be trying to catch up from, say, CP 400 after being away for a while to CP 720 so they can do end-game trials. The 400k/day (4 mil pool max) will not help them catch up very quickly. Otherwise, what are people catching up to?

Out of curiosity, how much do you think the daily enlightenment should be so that this hypothetical player can reach CP 720 "quickly" while also theoretically gaining the player experience to complete end-game trials?

Because, after all, they could merely grind in Skyreach with their increased daily enlightenment, but that's unlikely to prepare a player for end-game trials.

Haven't that about that. I'm just commenting on all the people saying CP is a catch-up mechanic. 400k/day enlightenment is really enough to catch up.

That's because its aimed more at catching up players who can't play every day than it is aimed at making up a huge deficit like someone at CP 400 who wants to be CP 720 instead and fast. That's what EXP scrolls and skyreach grinding is for. That's what double EXP events (of which ZOS has added more to the game as its progressed, no coincidence there) are for.

They will never catch up.

If they play consistently for 9-12 months (about 3-4 months actual playtime), they will go from zero to max. That's not too much to ask for.

The CP EXP curve never changes. If you want max CP, play the game, learn the game, and earn the CP the right way. Anything else is detrimental to the health of endgame, and a disservice to the player.

Juju_beans · February 2018

Phage wrote: »

If they play consistently for 9-12 months (about 3-4 months actual playtime), they will go from zero to max. That's not too much to ask for.

The CP EXP curve never changes. If you want max CP, play the game, learn the game, and earn the CP the right way. Anything else is detrimental to the health of endgame, and a disservice to the player.

But OP said they are a casual player so maybe they want to log off for months and when they come back just buy their way to max cp level each and every time they decide to play.

I'm a casual player but not like the OP. I'm playing almost a year now (May 2017 I started) and I'm around CP315.
The only time I watched my CP and tried to grind it up was to go from 50 to CP160 so I could make my gear. I don't watch my CP at all, I just play and right before I log off I see if I have any points to allocate.

madchuska83 · February 2018

If you consider yourself a "casual player" there is no need to farm CP. You can do all normal content, other than trials, at lvl 50. If you call yourself a "casual player" but are actually interested in end-game content, get to farming. The enlightenment feature is plenty for people who only play once or twice a week.

DieAlteHexe · February 2018

.

Juju_beans wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

If they play consistently for 9-12 months (about 3-4 months actual playtime), they will go from zero to max. That's not too much to ask for.

The CP EXP curve never changes. If you want max CP, play the game, learn the game, and earn the CP the right way. Anything else is detrimental to the health of endgame, and a disservice to the player.

But OP said they are a casual player so maybe they want to log off for months and when they come back just buy their way to max cp level each and every time they decide to play.

I'm a casual player but not like the OP. I'm playing almost a year now (May 2017 I started) and I'm around CP315.
The only time I watched my CP and tried to grind it up was to go from 50 to CP160 so I could make my gear. I don't watch my CP at all, I just play and right before I log off I see if I have any points to allocate.

Basically, the same albeit a slightly faster time frame due to having scads of free time. I'm in no rush as I see an MMO as something to take one's time with. Played right, you never run out of content.

madchuska83 · February 2018

I got back into this game last year at CP130. It's taken me nearly 7 months to hit my current 675CP. Am I angry or frustrated with the time It's consumed? Absolutely not. It's improved my skill considerably.

pattyLtd · February 2018

Be carefull what you wish for because you might realize its not what you expect from it after buying your CP.
You mis alot of awesome parts of the game by rushing through it but each their own ofc.

Wanting to buy a ticket to end game makes absolutely zero sense to me.
Why buy a game if you only want to play the last 1%?

End game is fairly limited isnt it? its just a few trials, vma and maybe vdsa.
Either way if this gets in CS they should add the crown icon behind the players name.

Ps. I dont take any game that has these level buying options serious.
They are usually free to play and for very good reason. They suck.

Abysswarrior45 · February 2018

How about... no...

ofSunhold · February 2018

Knowledge wrote: »

Autumnhart wrote: »

That's what all those double XP festival buffs are for.

I think we need something that caters to everyone's play time.

Like a holiday event that goes on for days?

Trinity_Is_My_Name · February 2018

No. Earn your CP.

SilverIce58 · February 2018

pattyLtd wrote: »

Wanting to buy a ticket to end game makes absolutely zero sense to me.
Why buy a game if you only want to play the last 1%?

This 100%. The fun is in playing the game, which as a "casual player" you should know OP. I'm a "casual player" in that I've got 370 cp, and I've been playing since beta. I could hit max cp if I tried, as the only content i literally haven't done are dungeons and trials, which with all the enlightenment I save up from not using that character, I could probably hit it in a few weeks to a month (maybe a month and a half).

Jura23 · February 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

Back in my day, we had to earn VR/CP walking uphill both ways in a snowstorm with bees chasing us!

^ This thread, in a nutshell.

There's an interesting real-life parallel here because it shows just how common it is for people who already got theirs to selfishly resist any sort of progress that might help other people get theirs, too.

"OMG it would ruin the game, OMG you might as well just sell gold and Maelstrom weapons in the Crown Store, OMGeezy this isn't WoW" blah blah blah.

Just strong opinions masquerading as reasons.

Why do you care if it becomes easier for someone else to get to max CP? Does that somehow diminish your meaningless achievement of reaching max CP?

I'm nowhere near the cap, I have 519 CP. I would still prefer if they removed enlightenment completely.

AlienatedGoat · February 2018

Juju_beans wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

If they play consistently for 9-12 months (about 3-4 months actual playtime), they will go from zero to max. That's not too much to ask for.

The CP EXP curve never changes. If you want max CP, play the game, learn the game, and earn the CP the right way. Anything else is detrimental to the health of endgame, and a disservice to the player.

But OP said they are a casual player so maybe they want to log off for months and when they come back just buy their way to max cp level each and every time they decide to play.

I'm a casual player but not like the OP. I'm playing almost a year now (May 2017 I started) and I'm around CP315.
The only time I watched my CP and tried to grind it up was to go from 50 to CP160 so I could make my gear. I don't watch my CP at all, I just play and right before I log off I see if I have any points to allocate.

Logging off and not playing for months is not casual playing. It's literally not playing at all.

Casual playing is playing a small set number of hours per week, usually 1-3 nights per week. Any less than that is nothing but playing occasionally, so if you're not putting the time in, of course you're not going to get the levels out.

LiquidPony · February 2018

Phage wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

Back in my day, we had to earn VR/CP walking uphill both ways in a snowstorm with bees chasing us!

^ This thread, in a nutshell.

There's an interesting real-life parallel here because it shows just how common it is for people who already got theirs to selfishly resist any sort of progress that might help other people get theirs, too.

"OMG it would ruin the game, OMG you might as well just sell gold and Maelstrom weapons in the Crown Store, OMGeezy this isn't WoW" blah blah blah.

Just strong opinions masquerading as reasons.

Why do you care if it becomes easier for someone else to get to max CP? Does that somehow diminish your meaningless achievement of reaching max CP?

Has nothing to do with achievement at all. If you'd bothered to actually read my posts in this thread you'd know that.

Not going to bother retyping it all. It's there if you want to read it, and the reason is sound.

I did read your posts in this thread I just didn't really think much of them. What I see all over this thread is nothing but people thinking that they should get to dictate how and why other people play the game. Just seems silly to me.

"CP doesn't make you good." Great, who cares? What's that got to do with anything? Not having CP doesn't make you good, either.

"You don't need a bunch of CP to do [insert content here]." Again, who cares? None of us need to do anything, because we're playing a video game. It's a question of want, not need, like everything else in every game ever.

"Inexperienced players need to play through hundreds of hours of brain-dead solo content to learn how to play in the end game which has virtually nothing in common with said brain-dead solo content." And again, why is this your concern? What if people don't want to do that?

If you don't really need CP to do anything in the game and getting to CP cap is not an achievement worth caring about, then why does it matter? Who cares if the next guy can pay IRL money for a CP boost? It doesn't hurt anything. And who knows, it might attract new plays to the game who are interested in dungeons/raids/PvP but aren't interested in spending 200 hours running around solo before they get to do what they want to do.

xeNNNNN · February 2018

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

There is a CP catch-up mechanic, it's called enlightenment, and the experience requirements for the lower CP levels are heavily reduced each patch to allow you to catch up.

As much as I love EVE, this is not EVE. EVE's business model does not belong in this game, and if you want that, you should go play EVE.

Earn what you have.

This ^

Also OP; Please dont give ZoS horrible ideas. Buying levels is essentially breaking apart the game into DLCs. I Will quit this game if it ever tries $0.99 per CP. Screw that.

Twenty0zTsunami · February 2018

if it's such a worthless achievement, @LiquidPony why are you so anxious to achieve it?

Seems to me you're just some n00b who is full of himself. CP is easy as hell to get.

AlienatedGoat · February 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

Back in my day, we had to earn VR/CP walking uphill both ways in a snowstorm with bees chasing us!

^ This thread, in a nutshell.

There's an interesting real-life parallel here because it shows just how common it is for people who already got theirs to selfishly resist any sort of progress that might help other people get theirs, too.

"OMG it would ruin the game, OMG you might as well just sell gold and Maelstrom weapons in the Crown Store, OMGeezy this isn't WoW" blah blah blah.

Just strong opinions masquerading as reasons.

Why do you care if it becomes easier for someone else to get to max CP? Does that somehow diminish your meaningless achievement of reaching max CP?

Has nothing to do with achievement at all. If you'd bothered to actually read my posts in this thread you'd know that.

Not going to bother retyping it all. It's there if you want to read it, and the reason is sound.

I did read your posts in this thread I just didn't really think much of them. What I see all over this thread is nothing but people thinking that they should get to dictate how and why other people play the game. Just seems silly to me.

"CP doesn't make you good." Great, who cares? What's that got to do with anything? Not having CP doesn't make you good, either.

"You don't need a bunch of CP to do [insert content here]." Again, who cares? None of us need to do anything, because we're playing a video game. It's a question of want, not need, like everything else in every game ever.

"Inexperienced players need to play through hundreds of hours of brain-dead solo content to learn how to play in the end game which has virtually nothing in common with said brain-dead solo content." And again, why is this your concern? What if people don't want to do that?

If you don't really need CP to do anything in the game and getting to CP cap is not an achievement worth caring about, then why does it matter? Who cares if the next guy can pay IRL money for a CP boost? It doesn't hurt anything. And who knows, it might attract new plays to the game who are interested in dungeons/raids/PvP but aren't interested in spending 200 hours running around solo before they get to do what they want to do.

You've missed the point completely. My point of view of CP has nothing to do with any achievement or entitlement.

Endgame PvE is already riddled with players that have high CP and don't know enough about the game to pull their weight, mostly from people grinding CP without actually taking the time to learn.

Adding the ability to get to instantly get max CP compounds that problem. Endgame PvE shouldn't be full of clueless max CP players.

Anotherone773 · February 2018

Phage wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

Back in my day, we had to earn VR/CP walking uphill both ways in a snowstorm with bees chasing us!

^ This thread, in a nutshell.

There's an interesting real-life parallel here because it shows just how common it is for people who already got theirs to selfishly resist any sort of progress that might help other people get theirs, too.

"OMG it would ruin the game, OMG you might as well just sell gold and Maelstrom weapons in the Crown Store, OMGeezy this isn't WoW" blah blah blah.

Just strong opinions masquerading as reasons.

Why do you care if it becomes easier for someone else to get to max CP? Does that somehow diminish your meaningless achievement of reaching max CP?

Has nothing to do with achievement at all. If you'd bothered to actually read my posts in this thread you'd know that.

Not going to bother retyping it all. It's there if you want to read it, and the reason is sound.

I did read your posts in this thread I just didn't really think much of them. What I see all over this thread is nothing but people thinking that they should get to dictate how and why other people play the game. Just seems silly to me.

"CP doesn't make you good." Great, who cares? What's that got to do with anything? Not having CP doesn't make you good, either.

"You don't need a bunch of CP to do [insert content here]." Again, who cares? None of us need to do anything, because we're playing a video game. It's a question of want, not need, like everything else in every game ever.

"Inexperienced players need to play through hundreds of hours of brain-dead solo content to learn how to play in the end game which has virtually nothing in common with said brain-dead solo content." And again, why is this your concern? What if people don't want to do that?

If you don't really need CP to do anything in the game and getting to CP cap is not an achievement worth caring about, then why does it matter? Who cares if the next guy can pay IRL money for a CP boost? It doesn't hurt anything. And who knows, it might attract new plays to the game who are interested in dungeons/raids/PvP but aren't interested in spending 200 hours running around solo before they get to do what they want to do.

You've missed the point completely. My point of view of CP has nothing to do with any achievement or entitlement.

Endgame PvE is already riddled with players that have high CP and don't know enough about the game to pull their weight, mostly from people grinding CP without actually taking the time to learn.

Adding the ability to get to instantly get max CP compounds that problem. Endgame PvE shouldn't be full of clueless max CP players.

^ This. I remember in Wow people could buy insta level characters. So we would get a leveled death knight tank and the guy playing it literally had no clue how to use any of the abilities or play the character because he was level 1 an hour ago.

In ESO, you will have people running around trying to do harder content on characters that they dont even know how to play, which DOES mess the game up for everyone they group with. On top of this instant CP isnt that useful because you still have to get all your skyshards, do your quests for skill points, run your dungeons for skill points, and level all your needed guilds.

So in reality its not a shortcut because its only part of the leveling that is required. BUT you do fool people, at first, into thinking that you put time in to get the skills you need and learn how to use them and then you cause your group to wipe constantly because you have know clue what any of the few abilities you do have do.

It would make the game miserable for everyone that had to play with one of these insta levelers.

Slick_007 · February 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

I did read your posts in this thread I just didn't really think much of them. What I see all over this thread is nothing but people thinking that they should get to dictate how and why other people play the game. Just seems silly to me.

we didnt think much of your posts either. i love this attitude. give me something for free that everyone else earned. no? stop dictating how i can play.

you know whats silly? you. buying a game and then not wanting to play it and instead demanding that the game developers just hand stuff to you on a silver platter.

If you cant handle it, go find a single player game with an xp hack and you do that to your hearts content. We dont care. But the people who earned our levels by actually playing, dont want people like you to be at our level in the game. Then we might actually think you know how to play and want to group with you. buying levels to many people is cheating. And we dont like cheats.

MattT1988 · February 2018

Knowledge wrote: »

As the champion point cap is gradually raised the casual players are left feeling like they are in a never-ending grind to catch-up. Why not offer an alternative similar to EVE Online? EVE Online allows you to purchase skillpoints for your character. Why not allow players in ESO to buy "Champion Packs" on the Crown Store similar to mount speed and inventory space?

*sigh* you again? Geez your posts are painful to read sometimes.

I don’t think this game needs this and I hope it never happens.

DocDova · February 2018

VaranisArano wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Those of you asking for more enlightenment, do you seriously play enough to be constantly running out? It accrues every day. The only times I've ever run out was during double exp events when I was questing constantly.

Well, the day's allowance does run out in a single random normal dungeon, which can take as little as 10 minutes.

Enlightenment is a great catch-up, but it isn't for grinders. If you grind (or quest) out your enlightenment every single day, then you don't need the catch-up as much as someone who only plays for a couple days a week, and thus benefits from having the enlightenment accrue.

If you want more enlightenment total, take a break.

If you want more daily enlightenment, well, that you can ask ZOS for. I doubt they'll do it, since they've already frontloaded CP value and lowered the exp necessary for early CP.

Someone can be trying to catch up from, say, CP 400 after being away for a while to CP 720 so they can do end-game trials. The 400k/day (4 mil pool max) will not help them catch up very quickly. Otherwise, what are people catching up to?

Out of curiosity, how much do you think the daily enlightenment should be so that this hypothetical player can reach CP 720 "quickly" while also theoretically gaining the player experience to complete end-game trials?

Because, after all, they could merely grind in Skyreach with their increased daily enlightenment, but that's unlikely to prepare a player for end-game trials.

I think enlightenment should be enough to get about 5 CP/Day. Otherwise it gets boring.

I despite very very bad connectivity (thanks to my ISP) these days still run out of enlightenment daily. Either there should be no Enlightenment or Enlightenment should be sufficient. I feel once daily dose of enlightenment runs out, Many won't feel like playing more for that day.

I play one game at a time, It's been ESO for like 2-3 months now, I skipped Monster Hunter, Evil WIthin (firstly due to shadow of war then ESO). 720 is itself a huge number, With ever increasing experience required, I am hardly doing much quests these days, enthusiasm comes down with enlightenment end. Just gathering material or roaming and collecting skyshards.

SO in my opinion Either there should be no enlightenment or enough enlightenment.

Anastian · February 2018

Unfadingsilence wrote: »

Knowledge wrote: »

As the champion point cap is gradually raised the casual players are left feeling like they are in a never-ending grind to catch-up. Why not offer an alternative similar to EVE Online? EVE Online allows you to purchase skillpoints for your character. Why not allow players in ESO to buy "Champion Packs" on the Crown Store similar to mount speed and inventory space?

All gold training gear and 150% experience pots takes 4 days to go from 0 to 690 CP and if you wait for a double experience event with the 150% experience pots..... you can just grind your little heart out and hit max in only 2 days

Teach me master!

At the moment, with purple training gear, great DPS and 150 ambrosia I can get an average of 8 CP levels with 45 minutes of buff in Spellscar (which is way better than Skyreach, measured with same buffs and timing).
How are you achieving such a speed in levelling? Consider that I am currently CP 610, and that I am slowly grinding to 720 (I get 10 CPs a day, this way I can maintain hold on my soul).

PS: I never actually went on grinding CPs until lately

Gprime31 · February 2018

Ackwalan wrote: »

Knowledge wrote: »

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

There is a CP catch-up mechanic, it's called enlightenment, and the experience requirements for the lower CP levels are heavily reduced each patch to allow you to catch up.

As much as I love EVE, this is not EVE. EVE's business model does not belong in this game, and if you want that, you should go play EVE.

Earn what you have.

I don't feel like that is enough of a catch up. I would settle for permanent enlightenment until the previous CP cap is met. For example, if we had "permanent enlightenment" up to 690 CP that would make sense.

Lets be honest, you won't be happy until you can buy max CP on the crown store.

i'd buy that! 25$

morrowjen · February 2018

Knowledge wrote: »

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

There is a CP catch-up mechanic, it's called enlightenment, and the experience requirements for the lower CP levels are heavily reduced each patch to allow you to catch up.

As much as I love EVE, this is not EVE. EVE's business model does not belong in this game, and if you want that, you should go play EVE.

Earn what you have.

I don't feel like that is enough of a catch up. I would settle for permanent enlightenment until the previous CP cap is met. For example, if we had "permanent enlightenment" up to 690 CP that would make sense.

You have scrolls and ambrosia plus enlightenment.

Enslaved · February 2018

OP is making troll threads.

Storm_knight22 · February 2018

there are already enough CP catch p mechanics. Enlightenment, XP provisioning items and scrolls and multiple double xp events, If you add up the holiday events there are literally MONTHS during which you can gain double XP. I

DieAlteHexe · February 2018

Phage wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

If they play consistently for 9-12 months (about 3-4 months actual playtime), they will go from zero to max. That's not too much to ask for.

The CP EXP curve never changes. If you want max CP, play the game, learn the game, and earn the CP the right way. Anything else is detrimental to the health of endgame, and a disservice to the player.

But OP said they are a casual player so maybe they want to log off for months and when they come back just buy their way to max cp level each and every time they decide to play.

I'm a casual player but not like the OP. I'm playing almost a year now (May 2017 I started) and I'm around CP315.
The only time I watched my CP and tried to grind it up was to go from 50 to CP160 so I could make my gear. I don't watch my CP at all, I just play and right before I log off I see if I have any points to allocate.

Logging off and not playing for months is not casual playing. It's literally not playing at all.

Casual playing is playing a small set number of hours per week, usually 1-3 nights per week. Any less than that is nothing but playing occasionally, so if you're not putting the time in, of course you're not going to get the levels out.

I maintain there is another definition for "casual" and I'm the epitome of it.

I play pretty much daily. I do a variety of things as mood dictates. I do not focus on being the best or über. I focus on having fun, my way, within the parameters of the game. Questing, crafting, exploring, working on achievements etc.

The difference is the mindset. I'm not driven to do anything. I don't feel the need to have BiS, merely to have whatever works for whatever I'm fighting. I'm not concerned that other players are better or higher level or have neater looking gear.

That said, I think folk should earn what they want, in general and accept that if they're not crazy about certain aspects of the game (PvP or Undaunted or trials etc.) that they cannot then expect to be on the same level as those willing to put their time and energy into those things.