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Level rewards system is intrusive and immersion-breaking
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Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭That it pops up during combat as well is the real problem - if it would pop up out of combat, it would be much less annoying.
I mean what we really need is more molehills made into mountains. But then again everybody likes to complain about something in the game.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.5 -
Twenty0zTsunami✭✭✭✭VexingArcanist wrote: »Apache_Kid wrote: »
If it doesn't bother you, just stay out of this conversation - you are adding nothing to it.
"Look here buddy you have a contrary point, we don't have discussion and dialogue around here. Get out of my safespace!"
- Snowflake
Found the neckbeard.2 -
Hurtfan✭✭✭✭✭That it pops up during combat as well is the real problem - if it would pop up out of combat, it would be much less annoying.
Yes, and this should be possible. When PvPing, if you get a group invite pop-up, it disappears during a battle, and pops back up when you stop fighting.For the Pact!Keyboard not found, press any key to continue0 -
VexingArcanist✭✭✭✭Yes, and my opinion to that is it is annoying and intrusive to me - I do not need someone to tell me, that it is not - it is for me.
Dare someone have a different opinion and like you, voice it.
There are no safespaces here, it is the internet. Deal with being confronted by differing opinions. No brain-washing college professor gonna cloak you and drive the voices away.7 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭VexingArcanist wrote: »Yes, and my opinion to that is it is annoying and intrusive to me - I do not need someone to tell me, that it is not - it is for me.
Dare someone have a different opinion and like you, voice it.
There are no safespaces here, it is the internet. Deal with being confronted by differing opinions. No brain-washing college professor gonna cloak you and drive the voices away.
Oh it is quite easy to get rid of it - there is a "block" option and then the voices are gone.1 -
emilyhyoyeon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Just because someone finds the messages immersion breaking, doesn't mean that they are so for everyone. Likewise, just because someone doesn't find the messages immersion breaking, doesn't mean that they aren't so for everyone.
So in this case, the opinion that it isn't immersion breaking isn't really necessary, because the system is already fine for people who don't have an issue. We're looking for a solution for people who do have an issue.
There should be an option to turn leveling rewards or the messages off so both groups of people are satisfied.IGN @ emilypumpkin
Tullanisse Starborne altmer spellsword battlemage & scholar of the ayleids
Qa'Rirra khajiit assassin & dancer
Seliwequen Narilata altmer necromancer & debaucher2 -
Twenty0zTsunami✭✭✭✭emilyhyoyeon wrote: »Just because someone finds the messages immersion breaking, doesn't mean that they are so for everyone. Likewise, just because someone doesn't find the messages immersion breaking, doesn't mean that they aren't so for everyone.
So in this case, the opinion that it isn't immersion breaking isn't really necessary, because the system is already fine for people who don't have an issue. We're looking for a solution for people who do have an issue.
There should be an option to turn leveling rewards or the messages off so both groups of people are satisfied.
It's not just about immersion though, it quite literally interferes with one of the primary interaction option, and the menu takes up a significant portion of the screen evven while engaged in combat. It will actually prevent you from resurrecting your allies in combat, if you happen to level before the end of a fight.
Honestly I don't see why people are defending it, all they're doing is trying to further reinforce the carrot-on-a-stick/treadmill aspect of it. Go do some research on skinner boxes (Operant conditioning chamber) .. and tell me they aren't clearly trying to get more people "hooked" on the "progress" of the game.
Here, I'll help you get started on your journey.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operant_conditioning_chamberEdited by Twenty0zTsunami on February 15, 2018 5:27PM2 -
PrayingSeraph✭✭✭✭✭I absolutely love the lore and getting immersed into the setting but I swear the "muh immersion" crowd consistently make me cringe. This is a MMO for crying out loud, you need to be able to ignore this stuff. This is a game where we constantly have people running around in weird costumes riding weird mounts. You can ignore that but somehow this of all things ruins your immersion!??
The immersion point is nonsense. The interference with gameplay point may be worthy of a fix...but it should be far down the list of things that need fixes. At worst its a mild inconvenience, nothing elseEdited by PrayingSeraph on February 15, 2018 5:39PM2 -
Sevalaricgirl✭✭✭✭✭I don't mind it at all. Don't know why you're complaining except maybe...free stuff.1
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Twenty0zTsunami✭✭✭✭Sevalaricgirl wrote: »I don't mind it at all. Don't know why you're complaining except maybe...free stuff.
You're literally ignoring the entirely valid point that it 1000% in fact interferes with regular gameplay.
Good luck resurrecting your allies next time you level up in the middle of a boss fight.2 -
PrayingSeraph✭✭✭✭✭Twenty0zTsunami wrote: »
Are you saying you're against game rewarding progress? Yes, generally speaking devs want to create incentives to get players to keep playing. I don't see how this is shocking or bad.3 -
Twenty0zTsunami✭✭✭✭PrayingSeraph wrote: »Twenty0zTsunami wrote: »
Are you saying you're against game rewarding progress? Yes, generally speaking devs want to create incentives to get players to keep playing. I don't see how this is shocking or bad.
of course you don't
You've been conditioned. Edited by Twenty0zTsunami on February 15, 2018 5:45PM1 -
Kendaric✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There is an option to disable it in its settings menu. Don't know if it also disables the handclapping little dance.
Aren't you confusing it with the skill advisor? I know the skill advisor thing can be disabled, but the level up advisor?
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Dojohoda✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Speaking of immersion.... When my character claps when receiving the reward, I want to smack it. My characters are hard core warriors, They Do Not Clap!!!
Fan of playing magblade since 2015. (PC NA)
Might be joking in comments.
-->(((Cyrodiil)))<--2 -
AndyTGD✭✭✭Apache_Kid wrote: »Sounds like you're complaining about free stuff.
Its pretty clear that he's complaining about its implementation. I agree, its a pretty gaudy and in-your-face way of doing this.2 -
JamuThatsWho✭✭✭✭✭
✭>Immersion
>MMO
Pick one.@JamuThatsWho - PC EU - CP2100
Main:
Vasiir-jo - Khajiit Magicka Necromancer, AD
Alts:Sul-Mael Hlarothran - Dunmer Magicka Sorcerer, EP
Ushaar-Ixaht - Argonian Magicka Nightblade, DC
Rorbakh gro-Khraag - Orc Stamina Templar, AD
Anduuroon - Altmer Magicka Warden, EP
Travanius Braelia - Imperial Stamina Dragonknight, DC
Daeralon - Bosmer Stamina Arcanist, AD1 -
jaye63✭✭✭✭Twenty0zTsunami wrote: »PrayingSeraph wrote: »Twenty0zTsunami wrote: »
Are you saying you're against game rewarding progress? Yes, generally speaking devs want to create incentives to get players to keep playing. I don't see how this is shocking or bad.
of course you don't You've been conditioned.
You're taking a psych class arent you.7 -
Annalyse✭✭✭✭✭I don't care about the immersion aspect, but I really do get distracted by things popping up in the middle of the screen and think it was a really bad design. There is no reason they can't have the message appear off to the side somewhere, and they definitely should allow a keybind change. Honestly it would be way better to just have it appear in the mail so you can check it when you are not busy, or have a little flashing icon on the character screen that you'd see when you go to assign your points.0 -
AndyTGD✭✭✭Twenty0zTsunami wrote: »PrayingSeraph wrote: »Twenty0zTsunami wrote: »
Are you saying you're against game rewarding progress? Yes, generally speaking devs want to create incentives to get players to keep playing. I don't see how this is shocking or bad.
of course you don't You've been conditioned.
There's always a great enlightened person around to tell everyone (bar themselves, of course) they've been conditioned and all are mindless automata. lol
Yes, the way the system has been implemented is manipulative, on the one side. But on the other, for folks who are leveling anyway for whatever reason, it takes the edge off the grinding process by making each level more valuable, than merely just another generic step in your ascent up The Throat of the World.3 -
Jhalin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I'll retract my earlier statement about the notification being unobtrusive since I didn't realize it just... doesn't go away.
I still hold that most of OP's complaints about combat functionality being impaired are baseless because they chose to rebind the key that functions as confirmation and interaction with just about every notification system in the game. But still, level up rewards should have the same kind of visibility timer as a ready check, and should have an option to dismiss the notification until the character screen gets openned to allocate stats and such.
But for real, don't keybind minor things to major keys.Edited by Jhalin on February 15, 2018 6:33PM0 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The problem I have is that... you are basically FORCED to answer this stupid 'accept reward' thing before you can interact with anything, which is especially annoying at Dolemens. You cannot free the final lock or access the chest until you... so in that way, YES, it's extremely intrusive... ZOS should have at least picked a key that isn't bound to be your main 'interactive' key.
Isn't the interact key by standard "E", while the claim reward key is "F"? So unless you have changed that it doesn't stop you from interacting with your environment. Group invites maybe, but that's not what you talked about.0 -
Mauin✭✭✭✭I have yet to level up in a dungeon with any of my lowbies after the update, but if it's true that the permanent message interferes with something like resurrecting a fallen ally, then that really needs to be looked at. Along with everything else that was broken by this update.
However, I have been working on my 15th character and... Yeah. This thing is getting on my nerves. I dislike having to claim my skill/attribute points every time I level up. On top of that, I feel like having the level up message being permanent was a really bad design choice. Partly with it interfering with anything else that happens to use the F key, and partly because the only way to get rid of it is to actually go and claim the rewards. I feel like it needs to function like a group invite, where you can hit F to claim rewards or hit X to dismiss it and go through that crap later.
I also keep getting the urge to reach into the game and slap my character every time I claim rewards. This is just personal preference, but I feel that cheering is entirely unnecessary. I would love it if there was a way to stop that from happening.PC NA CP 1900+
Raid Lead for Eyes of the Queen.Main account:
Sharzee'Rai --- Ruzasha-La
Landalinwe --- Astara Veturius
Taheer Stone-Arm --- Gathilien
Nyralor Fenris --- Siphons-Shadows
Sebastian Stormwind --- Vetherin Tree-Shade
Morvina Vadryon --- Jorvund the Greenshaper
Celina Veturius --- Faulrenor
Celoranion --- Varondel
Dance-of-the-Macabre --- Vashra-jo
Second account:
Bowl-Harvest --- Steele de Monet
Nord Warden Aid Me --- Fifty-Scent
Holy Procamole --- Asneeze at-Sudafed
Ahchoo at-Sudafed --- Asniff at-Sudafed
Piery-Rage --- Hambush Porksbane1 -
Hurbster✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Could be worse, could have been called cupcake...So they raised the floor and lowered the ceiling. Except the ceiling has spikes in it now and the floor is also lava.1 -
Slick_007✭✭✭✭✭
✭VexingArcanist wrote: »Yes, and my opinion to that is it is annoying and intrusive to me - I do not need someone to tell me, that it is not - it is for me.
Dare someone have a different opinion and like you, voice it.
There are no safespaces here, it is the internet. Deal with being confronted by differing opinions. No brain-washing college professor gonna cloak you and drive the voices away.
Oh it is quite easy to get rid of it - there is a "block" option and then the voices are gone.
but can you ignore the whole forum? and who would you complain to then? he didnt say your opinion was wrong or invalid, they simply stated theirs. like you, thats their right and pretty much what forums are for. If you cant handle that, you shouldnt be here. or many other places.4 -
Hippie4927✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The problem I have is that... you are basically FORCED to answer this stupid 'accept reward' thing before you can interact with anything, which is especially annoying at Dolemens. You cannot free the final lock or access the chest until you... so in that way, YES, it's extremely intrusive... ZOS should have at least picked a key that isn't bound to be your main 'interactive' key.
this is exactly the point with this.
Are you telling me that we PC controller users finally have something that works better than you keyboard users? I can be at a dolmen when the leveling rewards pop up and I can finish the dolmen, pull the pinion, collect the chest, and loot the bodies and then when I am finished, I can accept my rewards.PC/NA/EP ✌️1 -
Carbonised✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Apache_Kid wrote: »Apache_Kid wrote: »
If it doesn't bother you, just stay out of this conversation - you are adding nothing to it.
Conversations where we all agree are boring no?
It was just another fanboy, who isn't bothered, so we shouldn't be too comment - it adds nothing to the conversation.
I just think it's funny when people complain about immersion in an MMO.
You do realise that the RP in MMORPG stands for role playing, right? Immersion has always been a part of the role playing genre, no matter which platform is used.
While MMOs historically haven't exactly been the best place for immersion and roleplaying, that doesn't mean it should simply be minimalized or neglected as much as possible. Some of us actually still play a game such as this one for the immersion, into a character, into a setting, or simply into the great visuals and audio, which is arguably some of the best elements of this game.
Every popup message, every disco light, every element that crashes with this immersion, slowly but surely chips away at my enjoyment of such a game. I become frustrated that the game continually reminds me that "hey, you're just playing some kind of progressive hamster wheel, move faster and your next reward is just around the corner!" Well, no, actually I was enjoying the sunrise over the mountainside in Vvardenfell, watching those Nix Hounds in the distance while Red Mountain rumbled ominously under my feet. But thanks for reminding me that it's all just fake and make believe, because hey, now it's time to grind grind and ding ding chase that next carrot!
And while there may be other people around, and while there may be many elements that challenge your immersion into the setting, you do your best to block them out. Ignore all the other busybodies running about. And oftentimes when you're out in the zones, you don't really come across that many other people. People are sheep, they tend to gather in numbers at the same places and do the same things. There are many places where you can be left alone or do your own thing.
I also recall doing the 3 Alliance questlines (in fact, I have done every one-time quest in the game by now), and there are plenty of times you can immerse yourself in the storyline, enjoy the going ons and participate, as much as is possible in a multiplayer game anyway. But it does get progressively harder the more elements you have to try and ignore, block out and disregard. And it does reach a limit. OP was trying to provide a good example of doing a questline, one that lends to a certain kind of dramatic feel, only to have the bubble popped by some unnecessary message from ZOS reminding him that he got a free gambling crate to get him hooked on the idea of buying more.
I can't really blame him for being annoyed or discontent at that, I would have been too.
Edited by Carbonised on February 16, 2018 8:38AM1 -
efster✭✭✭✭✭I ran a lowbie templar through normal Maelstrom the other day; she leveled just as I forgot not to stand in the water on the Runa stage, and it was definitely mega weird to take my level rewards and see my character to the celebration emote in ghost form.
AD is the best looking faction. I don't make the rules, I just enforce them.1 -
Aesthier✭✭✭✭✭There is an easy way to counteract that. Its called toggle the UI off.
^ that would give you better immersion than seeing life bars like you do now.1
