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What the BG?
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Jarryzzt✭✭✭✭In principle, I sort of like the way WoT has been approaching this.
Essentially, the engine that puts together the teams for the "random deathmatch" mode (which is what most players play most of the time) tries to make it so that if there are any pre-made groups (called "platoons") in the queue, both teams get an equal share of them. In other words, if Team 1 includes a platoon, Team 2 gets one as well. It's not quite perfect, but it prevents situations where one side is all pre-made on Skype and the other just some random PUG players.
Of course, WoT "random" mode has teams of 15 on 15, and max platoon size is 3. And so the parameters of the problem aren't quite the same as for ESO. If ESO could borrow anything from WoT matchmaking, I guess, it would be splitting off a separate mode for pre-made teams (seven on seven, I think...haven't touched that part of the game in a long time), but then I have no idea what the queue looks server-side, i.e. how many people are in it at a specific point in time, how many are PUGs vs. pre-made...the one thing you never want to do as an MMO is to create a game mode with long queue times, more so for deathmatch type games where waiting for even two minutes feels like a bloody long time...0 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭If NO CP is comming back , my Aids warden will wreck again 1vs8 with over than 30 kills in death matches as a TANK ^^ .1 -
UppGRAYxDD✭✭✭✭✭
✭+1 group/solo, +1 for making BGs a base game mode.
Also, end the grab bag mode and let us choose the mode we want to play. As the OP stated, premade groups rule the realm until the face a better premade or get tired of roflstomping the opposition. I was in a premade yesterday and we stomped everyone to the point that many games the opponents had a total kill count less then our lowest scoring teammate. Out of 18 games, we lost one objective game due to getting in a "sword measuring competition" with another premade. Luckily our nuke button was bigger and worked..."Stendarr's mercy be upon you, for the vigil has none to spare."0 -
WillhelmBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DanielWinterborn wrote: »LadyLavina wrote: »DanielWinterborn wrote: »
They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.
@DanielWinterborn , gods forbid , the playing field evens out a bit more.The_Brosteen wrote: »
Can't play without cp?
L2p
^ thisWillhelmBlack wrote: »The_Brosteen wrote: »DanielWinterborn wrote: »Apache_Kid wrote: »Apache_Kid wrote: »I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.
Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.
NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.
The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.
Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.
I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.
Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.
The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.
Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.
Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.
They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.
Can't play without cp?
L2p
I hate throwing L2P around so I'll just quote this guy.The_Brosteen wrote: »DanielWinterborn wrote: »Apache_Kid wrote: »Apache_Kid wrote: »I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.
Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.
NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.
The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.
Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.
I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.
Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.
The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.
Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.
Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.
They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.
Can't play without cp?
L2p
This right here ladies and gentlemen are classic cases of noobs. Believe it or not they have nothing to add to the discussion so they spam the classic "l2p".
If I need to l2p without cp then does that mean that you have no idea to p with it? Here's an idea kids, how about we remove all the skills together and use just click? Better for you this way?
It's not my fault you can't master the CP system or you're too lazy to level it. Even giving the sorts of you my time to write this reply should be considered a kind gesture. I for one don't have all the 690 CP and only have 600 but I can see its benefits, what's the point in having it if you're not able to use it anywhere?
This classic l2p answer is from people that suck at the game, they wish to drag everyone down to their level so then maybe just maybe they can hit a bird out of the sky. If you can't take the complexity then just stick to the non CP campaigns and have fun there, don't run around the forums calling people bad at the game, you need to git gud at it.
The thread is about groups vs pugs, so think for once in your life before you bash the keyboard.
Thank you,
Sincerely,
The guy with the CP kicking your ass in game.
Pahahaha!PC EU0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If NO CP is comming back , my Aids warden will wreck again 1vs8 with over than 30 kills in death matches as a TANK ^^ .
It wasn't working in CP?1 -
MurderMostFoul✭✭✭✭✭
✭If NO CP is comming back , my Aids warden will wreck again 1vs8 with over than 30 kills in death matches as a TANK ^^ .
I remember this.
@ZOS_GinaBruno - y'all should take a look, something needs to change to address the over-performance of this build:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/365937/video-warden-meta-the-destroyer-no-cp-and-cp#latestEdited by MurderMostFoul on January 8, 2018 2:10PM“There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so.”0 -
Thogard✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DanielWinterborn wrote: »Nothing about battlegrounds premade in this coming update, I guess stupid level is rising! Add a new mode : group or without group to join!
How is this good for business? You get 2x premade teams rocking BG for 3 hours and the rest of the players without premade raging and quitting. That's 8 people happy in 3 hours and at least 40 swearing and cursing, smart thinking!
It's one thing to fight on even ground and win/lose because of your gear/skill/build and another get thrown in against people on skype with a dungeon group, wth?
I don't even know why I'm trying anymore, it's like this guys WANT you to quit lol. Is there like a blockage somewhere in Zos development team? Do you guys need any help adding the option?
What’s your char name?
PC NA - @dazkt - Dazk Ardoonkt / Sir Thogalot / Dask Dragoh’t / Dazk Dragoh’t / El Thogardo
Stream: twitch.tv/THOGARDvsThePeasants
YouTube: http://youtube.com/c/thogardpvp0 -
teladoy✭✭✭✭✭Like in any MOBA game premades of 4 should be matched with premades of 4, premades of 2 with premades of 2 and random players with random players.
I've opened a post yesterday with the same problem as you. It kills the fun completely. I hope ZOS change this.0