Stamblade Vet PuG Survival Tips

Left4Daud · December 2017

I've had some tough PuG runs over the last few days so this is a lot of text but I'm seriously looking for genuine advice on stamblade survivability in certain vet dungeon fights or similar situations. Yes I prefer running dungeons with friends and guildmates but sometimes they are not available so please offer me some advice based on the complete randomness of a PuG in mind and potentially getting a frail healer or tank that doesn't taunt.

I've started grinding up my Undaunted skill on my stamblade and I've run into a few PuG situations that left me scratching my head. For example I ran some random vet dungeons and got White Gold Tower, Falkreath Hold, and Darkshade Caverns II (among others such as Vaults of Madness, Volenfell, and Imperial City Prison but I had no problems in those ones). But for the other ones I mentioned I ran into situations where a healer would constantly die or tank would lose aggro and then my life as a stamblade got so much harder and so much shorter.

For example in White-Gold Tower on the Planar boss my group mates weren't passing the pinion so I was taking tons of heat stroke damage and burning all my resources trying to survive AND do damage and inevitably either die from damage over time, or usually to the blue flames obviously unable to escape the boss. Ok so maybe this was more mechanics and not so much I can do here if no one else in my group respects the mechanics? For some reason when pugging this fight people forget about the pinion if they have portals and even when I'm spamming blue flame in chat while holding the aggro they just run around the room and let me die ignoring the pinion. I know nightblade can possibly use shade here to maybe help but what else can a stamblade do to survive a fight like this without reliable group members?

Then Falkreath Hold. My pug group gets to the Colossus spirit boss just fine but then the healer literally got one-shot from the boss meteor attack multiple times a fight over 10+ wipes. Even telling this player to block and use a damage shield they just kept getting one shot with 18k health ( they said they were blocking but I was watching and they weren't and they also didn't want to slot annulment). Ok so the only reliable thing about the healer is that they will be dead and be dead soon so then what happens? The tank loses aggro to go for a pointless res and I can't tank the boss hits so I die? Or I'm gasping for resources because I have to heal myself, do damage, and roll dodge the boss heavy attack when the tank loses aggro again and ultimately I get overwhelmed and die. Then the other DPS who is a magicka sorc makes some comments about my survivability ok what am I supposed to do as a stamblade DPS in a fight like that when the healer literally dies as soon as the colossus does his first meteor attack? Plenty of attempts I wasted time rezzing the healer only for them to continually get one shot again so I'm not doing DPS when focusing on rezzing a constantly dying teammate. Then again I suffer because I have to heal myself, do damage, and possibly lose a crucial survival tool in dodge roll due to the increased demand on my resources. So how could a stamblade survive better in a fight like that without a healer and occasionally getting boss aggro? I thought I used a good amount of the defensive tools at my disposal but maybe not? Mirage, blade cloak, vigor, and the dual wield morphs that also heal, as well as trying to manage my resources with heavy attacks to ensure I can block and roll dodge when I inevitably get boss aggro... but it just wasn't enough, and I was constantly being criticized by the other mag sorc DPS even though the healer was the first player to die literally every single attempt on the fight.

Then I got Darkshade Carverns II and everything went fine until the last boss. Couple first timers on the fight so we go over mechanics but then it all goes bad. The healer dying to the flame barrages, the other DPS ignoring the dwemer spheres, the tank running in circles... Ok they all end up dead and it's just me the lonely stamblade so what do I do? I focus on the dwemer spheres because they are all aggroed on me and I need some breathing room. Fortunately the boss is on a fire phase so I can focus damage and get them down. Then I find time to get some rezzes and guess what happens? My teammates die immediately again. Ok I'm solo again, this time it is the poison phase and I'm using my remaining resources to keep myself alive but eventually I get 3-4 dwemer spheres harassing me and I get overwhelmed and die. So how much of my failure in a fight like that is due to skill and how much of it is due to bad group composition?

If anyone can post some stamblade videos soloing veteran Planar Inhibitor, the Colossus from Falkreath Hold, or the Engine Guardian from DCII that would help me see it in action so I can improve. Or tell me what tools do I have as a stamblade to survive when the healer in dungeons like these goes down ASAP? Because I'm having trouble tanking adds/bosses, healing myself, AND doing enough damage to survive in fights like these and then getting yelled at by mag sorcs is pretty frustrating. Should I carry some backup defensive sets? If so what can you recommend? What other abilities do I have at my disposal? How do I build for mitigating incoming damage, sustaining self heals, mitigating aggro, and dealing decent damage in the same spec?

Master stamblades out there, how do you solo fights like the above ones I mentioned when you have to tank, heal yourself, and dish out damage because unreliable teammates mean you will be on your own for a good part of the fighting? What's the secret?

redspecter23 · December 2017

If you're interested in more being more survivable during tough fights and you're really only there to level undaunted, you could respec to a magblade to level up undaunted, then spec back to stamblade later when you're done. Probably not the answer you're looking for but if you're dropping dead every time a pug healer dies in harder content, you may want to explore drastic short term changes to get things done smoother.

Left4Daud · December 2017

redspecter23 wrote: »

..if you're dropping dead every time a pug healer dies in harder content, you may want to explore drastic short term changes to get things done smoother.

@redspecter23

Thanks for responding. Yes as I mentioned in those 3 particular fights my life as a stamblade got harder and shorter once the pug healer bit the dust or tank lost aggro (colossus fight) so I guess ultimately I'm wondering - how much of this is due to so much being stacked against me, or is it just a matter of improving my skills/build?

Your respec suggestion is not a bad one, but if I can survive better in the referenced fights (or similar ones) when because of unreliable pugmates my stamblade has to heal, occasionally hold aggro and continue doing damage I'd very much like to improve and achieve that if possible.

redspecter23 · December 2017

Left4Daud wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

..if you're dropping dead every time a pug healer dies in harder content, you may want to explore drastic short term changes to get things done smoother.

@redspecter23

Thanks for responding. Yes as I mentioned in those 3 particular fights my life as a stamblade got harder and shorter once the pug healer bit the dust or tank lost aggro (colossus fight) so I guess ultimately I'm wondering - how much of this is due to so much being stacked against me, or is it just a matter of improving my skills/build?

Your respec suggestion is not a bad one, but if I can survive better in the referenced fights (or similar ones) when because of unreliable pugmates my stamblade has to heal, occasionally hold aggro and continue doing damage I'd very much like to improve and achieve that if possible.

I think under the circumstances you're describing, any class is going to have a harder time. Though many vet dungeons can be soloed by top elite players, I'm not aware of any choosing to do that on a stamblade. They're just not built for the task compared to other specs. With a well oiled group, you can perform your role exceptionally well. If you constantly have to heal and tank as well as perform dps, then you're just not going to be able to do it. If your end goal is undaunted xp then there are also other ways to do that and maintain your stamblade set up. Don't put yourself in a situation where you'll be playing these harder fights unless you have a premade team. Don't have a premade team and one of these dungeons is the pledge? Just rip through it on normal instead. Half the undaunted xp but potentially much less hassle.

I think you may be trying to ask "Can I build my stamblade to do all the roles necessary in a vet dungeon and carry 2 - 3 other players who may be exceptionally weak?" The answer is that you've already found out the answer. Trying to carry other players in vet dungeons where your character has some weak areas already is just going to end in frustration. It will be an uphill battle to try and build a stamblade to do the things you want it to do. Sure it might be possible, but my suggestion is to change other variables in the situation that are easier to control such as changing your spec, changing your teammates or changing the dungeon difficulty (drop to norm if necessary) rather than get stuck using all the same variable that have proven themselves a poor choice in the past.

kylewwefan · December 2017

To level undaunted, I’d recommend running Vet Fungal Grotto 1 until your eyes bleed. Heck , put it on normal and solo it. It’s faster.

DLC with pugs rarely goes well. Very rarely.

The group finder bonus is sweet but for a real group finder pug I don’t do Vet anymore. Too many bad experiences. And if your eso plus or bought dlc you often get thrown into these groups that have no chance of completing the content.

This has been witnessed countless times.

Danksta · December 2017

Blade Cloak, Vigor and Leaching Strikes is about all you can do.

When I pug I only do the DLC dungeons if I've already breezed through the two easier pledges with the same group and feel it won't be too difficult task for us.

Drummerx04 · December 2017

Danksta wrote: »

Blade Cloak, Vigor and Leaching Strikes is about all you can do.

When I pug I only do the DLC dungeons if I've already breezed through the two easier pledges with the same group and feel it won't be too difficult task for us.

Pretty much that, you can use morphs of dual wield skills that heal you, but really there's nothing you can do alone when built for proper PvE damage. Even on magsorc when built to play with a group you pretty much can't handle some of these situations reliably. If everyone else is dead, you are pretty much dead too the second your resources run dry.

VaranisArano · December 2017

In White Gold Tower, my recommendation for the pinion is to let the group wipe if they aren't respecting the mechanics. Seriously.

I main a tank, so its a little different than doing a stamblade DPS. With the Planar Inhibitor, she's all about respecting the mechanics as a group. If you see your tank struggling with the beginning orange phase, you can pull aggro for a bit, but come blue phase someone has to pull the aggro off of you after you pull it off the tank. No two ways about it. So if they can't/don't/won't, I die and shrug. They can deal with the consequences. Either they get me up or kill the boss, or we wipe. And when we wipe and I explain how to do the pinion mechanic, they are much better about respecting the pinion during blue phase. So taking a wipe usually means they listen the next time. Usually.

I don't have Falkreath, so I can't give specific advice, but it sounds like your healer did a really bad job of adapting to the dungeon.

Darkshade II sounds like you did fantastically well, in all honesty. The Engine Guardian is another one where the group has to move in a coordinated fashion and work together. I prefer for the healer to take charge at that point, because for the ideal strategy the healer needs to stay on the boss and heal through the poison phase. Or the healer needs to clarify that the group needs to run the levers. Also, the tank can help with add control, since the boss can't be tanked in the traditional manner. Again, like the WGT example above, sometimes with weak teammates its better to take a wipe so they learn to respect the mechanics and listen to advice. The first time I ran Darkshade II on my healer, I warned my group to stay close to my on the boss. The ones who didn't listen and ran around in the poison phase died. We wiped to reset the fight, and the second time, everyone listened and we completed pretty easily. Not every group will take a hint, unfortunately.

So the best advice I can give, and its not great advice I know, is that it's not you and its not your build. If you get in a situation where you are better off not rezzing a fallen comrade, don't be afraid to leave them dead. If the group is dying or letting you die because they don't respect the mechanics of the dungeons, so be it. Hopefully, they'll be a little more respectful of the mechanics once they get tired of dying to them. I know that kind of sucks for you to experience, but that experience is going to be the only thing that reliably teaches them to do the fights properly.

Left4Daud · December 2017

Thanks to everyone for the additional responses. I guess I have to get it out of my head that any PuG can get through the content and sometimes you have to cut your losses and try your luck again if changing up the strategy isn't working. It's a bit of a bummer that certain builds and specs are more pug-proof than others but that also presents an opportunity for learning nuances and improving overall as a player. I'm really enjoying stamblade and trying out different set-ups, when I get a half decent PuG it's a blast. The standard PVE rotation is a bit intense but I've been trying out 2hander/Bow in PuGs with decent success.

Magdalina · December 2017

A decent cure from bad pugs(for most dungeons, anyway) is to queue with a friend. Capable dps+support role duo is enough to make most dungeons even if the other 2 do everything in their power to wipe it, and finding one person is always easier than finding full three.

Sarjako · December 2017

Following. Stamblade in the same freaking boat... just want my undaunted leveled.

I had no issues leveling it with my StamDK ( tank ) or my Healplar. As a support role you can step up your game a bit to deal with other people's shortcomings but... as a DPS... you're really at the mercy of the pug rng gods. ;( Someone mentioned respec'ing to a magblade temporarily.. might need to try that but it's hard for a khajiit

Gilliamtherogue · December 2017

Staying alive as a Stamina class in ESO content is extremely difficult compared to other classes. They require constant momentum throughout a fight, and a sizable resource pool to ensure they can keep casting their heals, damage, and dodge rolling. I'll go through some general ideas to optimize the more defensive keys you should be meeting;

- Have Resolving Vigor on your main bar. This is a skill obtained in Cyrodiil, and shouldn't take more than a few hours of solid PvP (taking resources, towns, keeps). This morph will help the skill heal you for an additional amount.

- Have Leeching Strikes slotted, and always active. You'll need to remind yourself to always Light or Heavy Attack in between each ability to ensure you receive the healing of this skill. This is what I referred to with the momentum comment, as if you stop the offensive, you won't be able to trigger this heal.

- Run 5 Medium, 1 Light, 1 Heavy OR 5 Medium, 2 Heavy. Make sure you have Undaunted 9 with this, you'll get some extra Health. 5/1/1 and 5/2 are identical in terms of Maximum Health, but you'll have slightly more resource management and mitigation with 2 Heavy, at the expense of some Max Stamina from 5/1/1.

- Run the Serpent Mundus until you're confident in your abilities to DPS and stay alive. Running out of Stamina is the #1 cause of death in most of these instances. You need a hearty resource pool to dodge roll, cc break, damage, AND heal; so try and stay above 30% when soloing content.

- Grab any and every passive that deals with survivability. I mean ANYTHING. Even though we'll only be using 1 or 2 pieces of Heavy/Light armor, you should be taking passives like Juggernaut and Constitution in the Heavy armor skill line. The same goes for the Spell Resistance passive in Light armor, if you take that route.

- Don't worry about losing DPS if it means staying alive. "A dead DPS does no DPS." Live by this motto until you're comfortable with staying alive. Slowly move towards more risk-reward changes AFTER you've begun seeing success with this motto. Trade Stamina for Health in your attribute points or enchants. Begin kiting the boss if you know a mechanic is going to happen soon. Run more defensive abilities like Blade Cloak instead of Rending Slashes, if it means staying alive.

Didgerion · December 2017

Gilliamtherogue wrote: »

S

- Run 5 Medium, 1 Light, 1 Heavy OR 5 Medium, 2 Heavy. Make sure you have Undaunted 9 with this, you'll get some extra Health. 5/1/1 and 5/2 are identical in terms of Maximum Health, but you'll have slightly more resource management and mitigation with 2 Heavy, at the expense of some Max Stamina from 5/1/1.

HAHAHAHA

Thats a good one LOL!!

The guy is after undaunted skill line! Didn't you read?

Gilliamtherogue · December 2017

Didgerion wrote: »

Gilliamtherogue wrote: »

S

- Run 5 Medium, 1 Light, 1 Heavy OR 5 Medium, 2 Heavy. Make sure you have Undaunted 9 with this, you'll get some extra Health. 5/1/1 and 5/2 are identical in terms of Maximum Health, but you'll have slightly more resource management and mitigation with 2 Heavy, at the expense of some Max Stamina from 5/1/1.

HAHAHAHA

Thats a good one LOL!!

The guy is after undaunted skill line! Didn't you read?

His question wasn't how to get Undaunted up, it was how to deal with situations where you need to carry your team. If your reading comprehension skills are as poor as you've let on, I pity you.

Left4Daud · December 2017

@Gilliamtherogue

Thanks for stopping by and giving some great general advice. I hadn't considered running the Serpent mundus so I might give that a try. What is your opinion on optimizing dodge rolls, is it worth taking a look at? What are your thoughts on maybe running Well-Fitted instead of Divines and putting more CP into reduced dodge roll cost from a PVE perspective? I feel like dodge rolling wrecks my stamina because they are challenging to sustain as a defensive mechanism if you have to spam them. I try not to but sometimes I end up in a situation where I feel I need to dodgeroll 2-3 times in relative quick succession and then my remaining stamina suffers pretty hard.

As an update I managed to get a PuG clear on Vet Falkreath last night. The colossus fight went much better with that group, we got it in two tries but the final boss was still challenging as a stamblade. In any event progress feels good!

Gilliamtherogue · December 2017

Left4Daud wrote: »

@Gilliamtherogue

Thanks for stopping by and giving some great general advice. I hadn't considered running the Serpent mundus so I might give that a try. What is your opinion on optimizing dodge rolls, is it worth taking a look at? What are your thoughts on maybe running Well-Fitted instead of Divines and putting more CP into reduced dodge roll cost from a PVE perspective? I feel like dodge rolling wrecks my stamina because they are challenging to sustain as a defensive mechanism if you have to spam them. I try not to but sometimes I end up in a situation where I feel I need to dodgeroll 2-3 times in relative quick succession and then my remaining stamina suffers pretty hard.

As an update I managed to get a PuG clear on Vet Falkreath last night. The colossus fight went much better with that group, we got it in two tries but the final boss was still challenging as a stamblade. In any event progress feels good!

I always have at least 19% cost reduction for Dodge Roll since it's the only means of real survival for a Stamina DPS. Especially when soloing, a lot of times simple basic attacks lined up from enemies can kill you, so learning the time windows of when to optimize dodge roll is vital.

Koensol · December 2017

kylewwefan wrote: »

To level undaunted, I’d recommend running Vet Fungal Grotto 1 until your eyes bleed. Heck , put it on normal and solo it. It’s faster.

DLC with pugs rarely goes well. Very rarely.

The group finder bonus is sweet but for a real group finder pug I don’t do Vet anymore. Too many bad experiences. And if your eso plus or bought dlc you often get thrown into these groups that have no chance of completing the content.

This has been witnessed countless times.

At least as a dd you can carry the pug group most of the time. I tried tanking a vet pug again last week. I instantly got reminded of one of the biggest reasons why I quit tanking in the first place...

Left4Daud · December 2017

Update: Managed to beat vet Falkreath hold with a PuG, clearing the colossus boss in two tries which was a far cry better than my first attempt with random group. The last boss was still tricky but we ended up getting the clear 5 minutes before they took the servers down.

Also I just "carried" a group through the final fight of vet Darkshade Caverns II. Again I found myself as the lonely stamblade alive during the Engine Guardian (group mates all died before 90% boss health). Taking some advice here and learning from my past failure I kept my cool, used line of sight to kite the dwemer spheres, timed my burst to kill them opposite of the boss and managed to get 3 rezzes off to bring my pugmates back into the fight.

You might not care but it feels vindicating to get clears on these particular fights with a subpar PuG that left me to my own devices during the thick of battle. As a struggling stamblade it feels very rewarding.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · December 2017

Koensol wrote: »

kylewwefan wrote: »

To level undaunted, I’d recommend running Vet Fungal Grotto 1 until your eyes bleed. Heck , put it on normal and solo it. It’s faster.

DLC with pugs rarely goes well. Very rarely.

The group finder bonus is sweet but for a real group finder pug I don’t do Vet anymore. Too many bad experiences. And if your eso plus or bought dlc you often get thrown into these groups that have no chance of completing the content.

This has been witnessed countless times.

At least as a dd you can carry the pug group most of the time. I tried tanking a vet pug again last week. I instantly got reminded of one of the biggest reasons why I quit tanking in the first place...

as a tank, i would just leave and find a group that is good. tanks are hard to come by and they get groups fast.

to the op, i would just leave. there is zero reason to play with people dont know their role. unless you have a time concern, leaving bad players is the best response most of the time, don't waste your time on them.