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Time to update Group finder, Dungeon and Dungeon role information in game.

Narvuntien
Narvuntien
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I think this event has really shown a lot of the weaknesses of the group finder system. Not just the code of it just working about about dungeons and the responsibilities of the roles in general.

I propose a difficulty rating system for the dungeons, so people know what they are getting into. Could just be a quick green, orange, red difficulty rating. Tag the dungeons with how hard they are complete, how much knowleadge of mechanics and how important it is to stick to the roles. The more information a player has the better. I mean I know the DLC dungeons are way harder but a new player (perhaps a new subscriber) doesn't know. Plus a new player could easy get through CoA1 then go into CoA2 just to continue the story without knowing what they are stepping into. Normal and Vet is obvious but one and two is not. Particularly with a dungeon as different in difficult of CoA1 and CoA2. People want the monster helmets and jewerlly so they could step into things they are not ready for. "Oh I am level 50 thats max level, clearly I am ready for vet". With the level restictions it is clear you know some are more difficult than others but that information is not provided to players.

I think you move this into the random dungeon system, I know it being random is why there is a reward. But perhaps a random "easy vet queue" could be a thing.

Okay so the main boards are all lit up with "fake tanks" and "fake dps" too much of how to play roles is left up to the community. herp derp everyone knows what a tank does?.. do they? I really don't think so. It is time to change the undaunted quest. Just going into a dungeon for the first time.. teaches you nothing. I had a level 14 "healer" rage quit from my daily random banished cells when our dps ran off and soloed the whole thing. Did that player learn anything about doing dungeon i really don't think so. I have seen people in guild chat asking "How do I taunt?" Players aren't reading "how to play" and help articles.. they are trying to learn by doing. People also never learn to get reasonable dps, players bow light attacking through dungeons is pretty common. Does over land content need more difficulty so people learn to use more skills? or importance of AoE and damage over time skills in boss fighting needs to be emphrasised.

Thoughts?
  • Urza1234
    Urza1234
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    Honestly my initial thought isnt very helpful, but its that ZOS should have consolidated their game design a little bit better originally so that proactive individuals like the OP would not have to take to the forums to try to help them design functioning PVE elements.
    Edited by Urza1234 on December 3, 2017 1:53PM
  • Gan Xing
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    Urza1234 wrote: »
    Honestly my initial thought isnt very helpful, but its that ZOS should have consolidated their game design a little bit better originally so that proactive individuals like the OP would not have to take to the forums to try to help them design functioning PVE elements.

    They left a lot for addon creators to do.... How do you think we got the buff system that we have now? I'm not at home, so I can't check to see if there are any addons that does this for you.

    Baack before all the dungeons were updated to be "no specific level" we used to make dungeons easier by joining with the lowest level member be lead. I don't think you can do it this way anymore.

    Another thing is that "difficulty" is subjective. I personally think Direfrost keep is easy, other players feel otherwise. I personally think the new DLC dungeons are extremely difficult. And I still struggle with Maelstrom Arena (both Nonvet and Vet)

    I mainly PvP (and despite doing that for 3+ years) I still think I suck at it.
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  • xiZeroPointix
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    I would like to see Dragonstar Arena and maybe some trial content accessible via the group finder tool. I would say over half of the current trial groups are pug groups that we gather using zone chat and are typically always done on normal and finding a vet group is abysmal. The rest are guild members and 1% elite groups for vet related content. I know its a long shot. Considering in Cyrodil we can use the group finder tool to zerg keeps or group for imperial city. It can take up to 3 hours to complete a trial, factoring in and hour or longer to gather people explain mechanics, getting gear optimized etc. and often leads to a large number of people leaving the group before the content is completed. The 3 hours is about all the time most people have to play due to life, work , family etc. Therefore the group is disbanded and a game session is wasted. Due to this, most people have never done a trial or are sick and tired of the time it takes to put a group together. This makes trials for the most part unobtainable to a large percentage of the player base. People pay for the dlc content that contains a new exciting trial, but are largely unable to experience the content. When finding people in zone chat, they for the most part are not prepared to complete a trial. They are either doing overland content or waiting on a que to a dungeon or cyro. So people often have to change characters, cp, attributes and gear taking even more time. If we were to incorporate dungeon que for trials and dsa, people would already be optimized and prepared with gear and cp, because they were able to plan ahead instead of waiting for an hour or so to see a random invite in zone chat to a group and even then they might be kicked from the group due to cp or lvl. Leaving the player unable to complete the content he/she paid for. Finding tanks and healers take up the most time as dps is is a dime a dozen. I understand the stam and magicka preferences, but stam is in a really good place right now to be viable in trial instances. If say I already have a group of 8 dps for example we could simply que for healers and tanks and be ready to go. This would allow a larger player base to participate in the content. In regards to the OP, I agree that there is a very large difference in mechanics and npc resistances/ health/ damage received to the player between 1 and 2 dungeons / normal and vet. The majority of players are unaware of these differences, especially 1 and 2 dungeons. Even on normal the difference between 1 and 2 is vastly different and often results in lower lvl / lower experienced players unable to complete the content or are kicked from the instance therefore aquiring the 10 min cooldown period (i think this should only happen if you voluntarily quit the instance rather than punishing people for being forced to leave by being kicked or disconnnected due to server issues and such) before being able to que for another instance. CP is a large factor regarding trials so maybe normal and vet trials should have grouping system to match say a lower cp player to high cp to provide enough balance for a completion. We could also have a minimum CP requirement as this will give players a goal to obtain i.e a player reaches lvl 15 he can now complete normal dungeons, player reaches 160cp he can now do vet dungeons, player reaches 300cp he can due normal dsa and trials, player reaches 690 he can now due vet dsa and trials. This would eliminate alot of the issues involved with grouping in general and give players a rewarding goal or incentive to reach those cp limits and have a more enjoyable experience, because they have the appropriate amount of cp and experience to be succesful. Even now players wont allow certain cp levels in groups and causes a lot of unnecessary tension and hostility resulting in unfavorable conditions for a vast majority of players. This way we are almost guaranteed a good clean completion of the content resulting in an overall more constructive atomosphere for the player base. I know this was long winded, but something has to be done about the availability of paid content to a larger player base
  • Slurg
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    You mean an additional selection for dungeon group finder for difficulty level, where a player could select more than one? I could see this being useful, not just for new players but also for existing players who maybe are trying out a new build and don’t want to test it on the hardest dungeons. As long as people who don’t care what difficulty level they get could still get a truly random selection, I think such a feature could make group finder less painful for a lot of people.
    Happy All the Holidays To You and Yours!
    Remembering better days of less RNG in all the things.
  • NordSwordnBoard
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    "Undaunted Academy"

    - Instanced delve for training
    - Trainee and trainer join for the same role
    - NPCs form rest of group
    - Bosses have multiple effects, but low damage
    - A few mob spawns that have different effects/skills
    - Rewards for both, double or better quality for the trainee.
    - Similar to daily lfg, first of the day reward is far better to encourage a habit for trainers
    Fear is the Mindkiller
  • xiZeroPointix
    xiZeroPointix
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    Slurg wrote: »
    You mean an additional selection for dungeon group finder for difficulty level, where a player could select more than one? I could see this being useful, not just for new players but also for existing players who maybe are trying out a new build and don’t want to test it on the hardest dungeons. As long as people who don’t care what difficulty level they get could still get a truly random selection, I think such a feature could make group finder less painful for a lot of people.

    Yes and personally I enjoy helping newer players learn the mechanics and still feel that they are viable in a group, you still get a random que but say a lvl 690 can choose all difficulty ranges and not only have a higher chance of being grouped, but you are more aware of the experince level of your group. If i am say cp 160 i know that i will be grouped with 160 or higher. We will have more people in a grouped instance not biting off more than they can chew and not have to accrue expensive armor repair costs (especially no cp low lvl players) and possibly not being able to complete the content.
    "Undaunted Academy"

    - Instanced delve for training
    - Trainee and trainer join for the same role
    - NPCs form rest of group
    - Bosses have multiple effects, but low damage
    - A few mob spawns that have different effects/skills
    - Rewards for both, double or better quality for the trainee.
    - Similar to daily lfg, first of the day reward is far better to encourage a habit for trainers

    This is great for players with no cp and are low lvl. You are introduced to basic mechanics while learning your roles in a group which is vital to end game success. Players need to understand what each member brings to the group. Tanks for instance for the most part people think they just hold block...no...they offer damage mitigation, mob/boss debuffs, crowd control and group utility. A training portion would be great especially since some quests require that you complete a dungeon without even knowing what a dungeon is, let alone survive and be successful. This sets a player up for failure in my opinion. This also gives incentive for high lvl players to earn extra rewards and xp for aiding newer players. A solo instance could be viable as well because i imagine a high lvl player going in and destroying everything while the newbie watches in disappointment
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