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Do you think the EA star wars battlefront loot crate crisis will affect other games including ESO?
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Cpt_Teemo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Even if the US doesn't have a ban on gambling, still a bad sign for all online gambling experiences including online poker doh0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Since Zenimax is headquartered in the U.S. they run off U.S. law, or...well I hardly understand most of that bull, but I highly doubt the Courts here would make the same ruling.
Then again, Paying real Cash into a prize system that runs off a random number generator is practically Gambling, and Gambling by Law has an age restriction. So every Minor that plays ESO and buys some Crown Crates is technically breaking the Law.
There are already states pushing against the whole crate thing. So the fight to ban them is actually gaining momentum there too. And if Zos operates inside of the EU or other countries, they have to follow our laws too. And shutting down servers here would be financially catastrophic for them because the game is actually more populated here from what I have heard than in the US.1 -
WhiteCoatSyndrome✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭For those of you complaining nothing will happen...some of that is within your control. Write to your local government. Leave a message on their Twitter. Get the word out. It'll blow over if they think no one cares. So make sure they know you care!#proud2BAStarObsessedLoony
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
A useful explanation for how RNG works
How to turn off the sustainability features (screen dimming, fps cap) on PC4 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »TelvanniWizard wrote: »I hope Zos gets affected by this. We could finally be free of scam crates, being able to buy plainly what we want!
I'd love it. I'd love if the tide of hate for this practice in the industry forces these games to abandon this idiotic model and start giving people what they want instead of trying to sell them gamble crates.
The price tags for the special mounts etc would be crazy because it has to reflect the actual drop rate as it is right now. So for example let's say there is 0.1 % chance to get the mount you want from a crate that costs 1 Euro, the mount would then have to cost 1000 Euro in order for ZOS to make the same amount of money on it. People understand these horrendous absolute amounts very well and won't buy while it seems like they don't when it's hidden behind crates and rng. Now this is extremely simplified as not everybody is trying to get that one specific amount or won't continue buying until the mount finally drops but still. If the mounts and other stuff cost what they actually cost I think many people would be pretty shocked and ZOS pretty poor.
Or. Y'know. ZOS could price things what they're actually worth, make a slightly less profit, and be happy with that instead of attempting to consume everything and the damned moon.4 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Considering the -political- side of this, that is the officials speaking about it form Hawaii at least isn't going away, signs point to 'maybe'. Too early to tell.2 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »TelvanniWizard wrote: »I hope Zos gets affected by this. We could finally be free of scam crates, being able to buy plainly what we want!
I'd love it. I'd love if the tide of hate for this practice in the industry forces these games to abandon this idiotic model and start giving people what they want instead of trying to sell them gamble crates.
The price tags for the special mounts etc would be crazy because it has to reflect the actual drop rate as it is right now. So for example let's say there is 0.1 % chance to get the mount you want from a crate that costs 1 Euro, the mount would then have to cost 1000 Euro in order for ZOS to make the same amount of money on it. People understand these horrendous absolute amounts very well and won't buy while it seems like they don't when it's hidden behind crates and rng. Now this is extremely simplified as not everybody is trying to get that one specific amount or won't continue buying until the mount finally drops but still. If the mounts and other stuff cost what they actually cost I think many people would be pretty shocked and ZOS pretty poor.
Or. Y'know. ZOS could price things what they're actually worth, make a slightly less profit, and be happy with that instead of attempting to consume everything and the damned moon.
We disagree on a lot, but this we are in clear agreement.1 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It is to early to tell. Especially since all that has happened is a preliminary statement has been made by one country.
I do not think Battlefront is in Crisis just yet and it will be a long process before any possible changes are put into effect.
Besides, even if all this comes to fruition, game developers will find another source of revenue into play. Things may change eventually, years, and it will be ok.0 -
N0TPLAYER2✭✭✭✭✭We already have crown crates. Same shet, with worse odds since its consumables only.0
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JackDaniell✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »I'm sure most of you heard about the loot crate p2w outrage with star wars battlefront II. EA has now remove all real money transaction and is working on adjusting the loot crate system.
The outrage was so big that governments like Belgium and Hawaii now are investigating the gambling part about loot crates and is considering laws against it. It seems like a matter of time before other governments follow.
I'm glad this is happening since all games now were starting to use this system including ESO because it takes advantage of people's gambling addictions. It doesnt have to be p2w to be gambling also so even if it is cosmetic like ESO it will still be affected by gambling laws.
What do you guys think about this issue? do you think this will affect ESO?
The crownstore has always been garbage. People pay real money for ingame garbage and zeni (like so many other companys wih poor ethical guidlines) have NO PROBLEMS WITH EXPLOITING AND TAKING FROM PEOPLE WITH ADDICTIONS.
How moraly defficiant can you be to be ok with making money off another persons suffering? This is a moral issue, this is about showing how you feel towards your fellow man or woman THROUGH YOUR ACTIONS.
Zenimax just lumps itself in with all other moraly devoids companys by adhering to thier ways. I have no repect for people and companys that thrive off these coruppt systems. They are just making themselves a part of a bigger problem.Ebonheart Templar
www.youtube.com/user/kristofersommermusic6 -
Dexxadude✭✭
Unfortunately this thread was closed due to the fact that "adults" just cant seem to bloody behave.
So this is the new "Loot crate" thread it seems lol.
To the Moderators,
STILL no answer on the topic just closing threads. Any answer would be nice to confirm you're acknowledging the subject at hand.
Thank you2 -
SFDB✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Unfortunately this thread was closed due to the fact that "adults" just cant seem to bloody behave.
So this is the new "Loot crate" thread it seems lol.
To the Moderators,
STILL no answer on the topic just closing threads. Any answer would be nice to confirm you're acknowledging the subject at hand.
Thank you
I don't know, personally I pity whoever is stuck moderating a game forum on Thanksgiving.
Whatever mod is reading this, I would set you an extra plate if I could.5 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Unfortunately this thread was closed due to the fact that "adults" just cant seem to bloody behave.
So this is the new "Loot crate" thread it seems lol.
To the Moderators,
STILL no answer on the topic just closing threads. Any answer would be nice to confirm you're acknowledging the subject at hand.
Thank you
Honestly, this is one time they should just remain quiet. This is legal/political territory and so communication on the matter should go through someone like Pete Hines, and not on the forums.
Edit: And the other side of that coin is that nothing has happened that requires that Pete Hines say anything.Edited by Elsonso on November 23, 2017 10:09PMXBox EU/NA:@ElsonsoJannus
PC NA/EU: @Elsonso
PSN NA/EU: @ElsonsoJannus
Total in-game hours: 11321
X/Twitter: ElsonsoJannus2 -
vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Just throwing this out there agrain for those who are of the mind that loot crates are needed to support the big money games...
https://youtu.be/W94t5vE9oRsnotimetocare wrote: »No, and it will barely have an impact on EA or BF2.
It is almost like they don’t need the loot crate money... like it is all completely just extra fat cash money for them to roll around in. Seems odd since the arguement for these crates is that they need to money to support how expensive games are to make now.Edited by vyndral13preub18_ESO on November 23, 2017 10:27PM3 -
Hamburglarjones✭✭✭Hopefully. It's an awful practice used in many games today, hopefully it stops here and doesn't progress to something even worse.Boone
Dunmer Magicka DragonKnight
MagDK raid build guide
Guild: Dragon's Crest - retired
World's 3rd vHoF clear & 3rd vHoF HM clear0 -
badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭I dont drink alcahol very often, I dont really care for it.
But that doesnt make me want the government to prohibit it.
I dont like this entitled attitude that if you dont like the way something works you should push for the government to step in and put a stop to it. Just dont participate. Dont buy games with loot crates, or dont buy the crates. Make a video review calling the horrible game mechanics. Buy and promote games that dont do it.
Getting governments involved is a slippery slope. How long until things like event containers get banned? Ring of mara, crown exp scrolls, eso+, any race any alliance, riding lessons and more are all things we treade real money for to theoretically get more pulls of the virtual slot machine to possibly get that jackpot drop.
We players might see a difference, but would a lawyer care?[DC/NA]1 -
monktoasty✭✭✭✭✭Just be fair and no one will complain. If they keep being shady than its going to get ugly eventually1
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badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭monktoasty wrote: »Just be fair and no one will complain. If they keep being shady than its going to get ugly eventually
Its impossible to have a fair crown crate system after they have been prohibited. Laws dont care how fair you feel the system is.[DC/NA]0 -
monktoasty✭✭✭✭✭monktoasty wrote: »Just be fair and no one will complain. If they keep being shady than its going to get ugly eventually
Its impossible to have a fair crown crate system after they have been prohibited. Laws dont care how fair you feel the system is.
But if it's fair..we will be hush hush and not tell2 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Since Zenimax is headquartered in the U.S. they run off U.S. law, or...well I hardly understand most of that bull, but I highly doubt the Courts here would make the same ruling.
Then again, Paying real Cash into a prize system that runs off a random number generator is practically Gambling, and Gambling by Law has an age restriction. So every Minor that plays ESO and buys some Crown Crates is technically breaking the Law.
It's not a judicial issue (the courts making that decision), it's legislative (congressmen, senators, that crowd). So far as that goes, Hawaii is already looking at loot boxes as an issue, so this will spill over into the US, moving forward.2 -
WhiteCoatSyndrome✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@Dexxadude, Moderators != game devs. Asking them to comment is like expecting the janitorial staff to tell you what the software company's stance is, except the mods have to deal with more sewage. And given that this boiled up over Thanksgiving (a large chunk of Zeni is in the States and this is a major holiday for them) it's unlikely we'll hear anything from them until Monday...IF we hear anything at all; Zeni isn't directly involved in anything at the moment, and no new laws have been passed or are likely to be in the near future.#proud2BAStarObsessedLoony
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
A useful explanation for how RNG works
How to turn off the sustainability features (screen dimming, fps cap) on PC2 -
SirAxen✭✭✭✭✭Or, I do what I want with my money when I want too. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? I do not take part in things every single day that cost money. Some people do. If random fluff items out of a digital crate is something you want to put some money down on, then have at it. Nothing in them gives you an advantage in the game. Loot boxes aren't ideal, but if they must be there, ESO does them fairly classy. Crown gems, nothing p2w in them, weekend mini-events that nets you free ones, etc.0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Or, I do what I want with my money when I want too. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? I do not take part in things every single day that cost money. Some people do. If random fluff items out of a digital crate is something you want to put some money down on, then have at it. Nothing in them gives you an advantage in the game. Loot boxes aren't ideal, but if they must be there, ESO does them fairly classy. Crown gems, nothing p2w in them, weekend mini-events that nets you free ones, etc.
This, kinda, starts to fall apart when you're literally marketing a game towards children. Specifically games like BF2, which, I mean, come on, it's ****ing Star Wars.
It's well enough to say, "we're all consenting adults," but that's not universal in the market.2 -
SirAxen✭✭✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »Or, I do what I want with my money when I want too. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? I do not take part in things every single day that cost money. Some people do. If random fluff items out of a digital crate is something you want to put some money down on, then have at it. Nothing in them gives you an advantage in the game. Loot boxes aren't ideal, but if they must be there, ESO does them fairly classy. Crown gems, nothing p2w in them, weekend mini-events that nets you free ones, etc.
This, kinda, starts to fall apart when you're literally marketing a game towards children. Specifically games like BF2, which, I mean, come on, it's ****ing Star Wars.
It's well enough to say, "we're all consenting adults," but that's not universal in the market.
I'm talking about ESO itself. ESO is a rated M for mature MMORPG. Nothing about what I said 'falls apart'. I'm a grown man, and you absolutely get zero say in what I spend my hard earned money on. These sweeping generalizations aren't protecting anybody.Edited by SirAxen on November 23, 2017 11:30PM1 -
nolangrady✭✭✭Unfortunately this won't end well. As legislators start to discuss banning micro transactions they deem to be gambling, we have analysts suggesting developers raise game prices. Hours of video game play is the cheapest form of entertainment aside from going outside and licking a frozen flagpole. Anyone that thinks game developers and investors are not going to replace the "gambling crates" with some other measure to recoup costs are not thinking clearly in my opinion.
As others mentioned, if ZoS simply places everything in the crown store to buy rather than in crates they will likely boost the price of those items to recoup their costs. MMOs are extremely expensive to develop and maintain. With all that said ZoS is inept and greedy due to that fact that they should have a very steady flow of income that clearly isn't going back into the game in the form of improving gameplay such as infinite load screens in cyrodiil, which have been around for 3 years. I am not pissed that ZoS offers crates to folks with terrible self control I am pissed they don't use that money to make their product better.Edited by nolangrady on November 23, 2017 11:29PM5 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »Or, I do what I want with my money when I want too. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? I do not take part in things every single day that cost money. Some people do. If random fluff items out of a digital crate is something you want to put some money down on, then have at it. Nothing in them gives you an advantage in the game. Loot boxes aren't ideal, but if they must be there, ESO does them fairly classy. Crown gems, nothing p2w in them, weekend mini-events that nets you free ones, etc.
This, kinda, starts to fall apart when you're literally marketing a game towards children. Specifically games like BF2, which, I mean, come on, it's ****ing Star Wars.
It's well enough to say, "we're all consenting adults," but that's not universal in the market.
I'm talking about ESO itself.
To be fair, you were talking about personal responsibility.
I mean, as these things go, yeah, I can kinda agree, ESO's is on the easier end of things. At the same time, this entire business model is kinda scummy.1 -
SirAxen✭✭✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »Or, I do what I want with my money when I want too. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? I do not take part in things every single day that cost money. Some people do. If random fluff items out of a digital crate is something you want to put some money down on, then have at it. Nothing in them gives you an advantage in the game. Loot boxes aren't ideal, but if they must be there, ESO does them fairly classy. Crown gems, nothing p2w in them, weekend mini-events that nets you free ones, etc.
This, kinda, starts to fall apart when you're literally marketing a game towards children. Specifically games like BF2, which, I mean, come on, it's ****ing Star Wars.
It's well enough to say, "we're all consenting adults," but that's not universal in the market.
I'm talking about ESO itself.
To be fair, you were talking about personal responsibility.
I mean, as these things go, yeah, I can kinda agree, ESO's is on the easier end of things. At the same time, this entire business model is kinda scummy.
Pretty sure my post is clear. This is an ESO forum. The Crown Crates are optional purchases. It is up to you, the consumer, whether you partake. Hence, personal responsibility. Word gymnastics don't change anything. I don't hate nor love Crown Crates, but if I choose to buy some then I CHOOSE to buy some. Not you, not jimmy down the street. Me. A balance needs to be found, not sweeping generalizations. Always, always look inward first.1 -
vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭nolangrady wrote: »Unfortunately this won't end well. As legislators start to discuss banning micro transactions they deem to be gambling, we have analysts suggesting developers raise game prices. Hours of video game play is the cheapest form of entertainment aside from going outside and licking a frozen flagpole. Anyone that thinks game developers and investors are not going to replace the "gambling crates" with some other measure to recoup costs are not thinking clearly in my opinion.
As others mentioned, if ZoS simply places everything in the crown store to buy rather than in crates they will likely boost the price of those items to recoup their costs. MMOs are extremely expensive to develop and maintain. With all that said ZoS is inept and greedy due to that fact that they should have a very steady flow of income that clearly isn't going back into the game in the form of improving gameplay such as infinite load screens in cyrodiil, which have been around for 3 years. I am not pissed that ZoS offers crates to folks with terrible self control I am pissed they don't use that money to make their product better.
If they aren’t putting the money back into the game the crown crates aren’t needed to support the game The arguement for them falls apart. Yes they might raise the prices on things. And honestly I’m ok with that. Then I get to make the choice on how much something cost and If I am willing to pay that. Not a how much I am willing to pay for a chance to get something.
But as you point out. The money isn’t going back into the game so we could do without it altogether and see no difference. Heck EA themselves say this won’t really affect them. What!? But these are needed to support the massive cost of AAA games right?? Turns out, not so much.2
