Penalty for botting

nnargun · November 2017

The thing is not that no actions at all are being taken, post number #2 was obviously sarcasm. The thing is that bots could be removed from this game with very little effort as farming spots are always the same. One GM could probably do it on both servers working half time. Because, as stated by others, they are ridiculously easy to spot and anyone asking for more proof than the obvious moves they make is a denying halfwit.
And if someone actually checked on and banned them regularly it would quickly not be feasible for them anymore.

I feel like there were less threads about bots lately, though. So maybe it's getting better?

Elsonso · November 2017

nnargun wrote: »

The thing is not that no actions at all are being taken, post number #2 was obviously sarcasm. The thing is that bots could be removed from this game with very little effort as farming spots are always the same. One GM could probably do it on both servers working half time. Because, as stated by others, they are ridiculously easy to spot and anyone asking for more proof than the obvious moves they make is a denying halfwit.
And if someone actually checked on and banned them regularly it would quickly not be feasible for them anymore.

I feel like there were less threads about bots lately, though. So maybe it's getting better?

Topiic fatigue. People get excited about a topic, and then get less excited. They take a break.

I feel that quickly banning bots would not only discourage these people from starting up new bots, but could also serve as a decent short-term revenue source. Only for those who purchase legitimate new copies, though. I am seeing more bots with achievements, and even saw one with ESO Plus the other day. I think these are accounts that have been sold by the original owner, but obviously I cannot be sure.

As for whether it is getting better, I would say that the number of bots tends to be the same, but the turnover seems to be increasing. There are places where the same accounts have been running bots so long they should send a world designer out to make a rut in the ground along their path. There are places where I find myself reporting new bots every few days.

On a related note, one of the nice things about the Orsinium event is that there are a lot fewer bots in Wrothgar. I was there for a couple hours farming stuff and watching for bots and didn't see any. As a DLC zone, it adds a layer of protection from bots, at least for now.

Turelus · November 2017

lordrichter wrote: »

UnversedNumber3 wrote: »

What is the penalty for botting. A group of friends and I ran into a bot (over 690cp) running in loop attacking blood fiends one by one for over 8 hours. Same loop same rotation. We all reported him for botting and we found him in the same place doing the same thing a few days later. I thought the penalty for botting would be a permanent ban but I guess not. Is there even a penalty for botting?

As has been stated, permanent ban for the first offense. ("bots get nuked on the first offense")

That said, it does take them a while to get around to the reports, and the more reports there are the faster they will get around to them. So, tell us where this happened? Location and server?

Keep in mind that it takes less time for the botters to put a new bot into the game than it takes ZOS to remove that bot.

lordrichter posted everything I was going to say so I will just quote him and give him an insightful.

Lord-Otto · November 2017

I definitely saw bots I reported being put out of order. So feedback helps, Jessica even confirmed that personally in regards to me at some point.

However, there doesn't seem to be an IP ban, or the botters just generate a new one by certain means. In any case, I did see simiöar bots in the same spot again.

Can ZOS track the messaging system? I bet! Maybe whack the player receiving 10k raw mats every hour!

I'm on console master race, so there's less bots to begin with. Our wax is indeed at 7k. I think you PC people do benefit from bots, absurd as that sounds...
xD

Elsonso · November 2017

Lord-Otto wrote: »

I definitely saw bots I reported being put out of order. So feedback helps, Jessica even confirmed that personally in regards to me at some point.

However, there doesn't seem to be an IP ban, or the botters just generate a new one by certain means. In any case, I did see simiöar bots in the same spot again.

Can ZOS track the messaging system? I bet! Maybe whack the player receiving 10k raw mats every hour!

It is hard to tell what they do with the mats. I can say that certain bots that operate in a zone periodically take a detour to a nearby wayshrine. They leave the zone and go to a city wayshrine where they talk to a specific merchant before running back to the wayshrine and returning to the zone and the path that they run.

They might be converting the mats to gold. They might be mailing the mats to someone and selling the trash.

In any case, yes, ZOS should be able to track where that stuff is going an nuke those accounts, too. This is why legitimate guilds want to be careful about who they let deposit and withdraw from the bank.

Dont_do_drugs · November 2017

Nighn_9 wrote: »

if that banned bots they would ban every big time trading guildmaster more than likely. Their the only players i know that would buy like 6+ accounts anyways

tell me more. which guild leaders are botting?

Elsonso · November 2017

Dont_do_drugs wrote: »

Nighn_9 wrote: »

if that banned bots they would ban every big time trading guildmaster more than likely. Their the only players i know that would buy like 6+ accounts anyways

tell me more. which guild leaders are botting?

I think they are just axe grinding.

Lord-Otto · November 2017

@lordrichter
I have seen some people sell mats very, very cheap. I bet their message history could show some bots. Worth checking.

If bots deposit into guild banks... Ugh, I dunno. Maybe delete what has been deposited? Won't help if it has been retrieved already, hm...

Can you slap an ID on gathered mats? Blizzard to that with items, AFAIK. You could track and delete them, maybe even refined and the golden mats from them?

nnargun · November 2017

Lord-Otto wrote: »

@lordrichter
I have seen some people sell mats very, very cheap. I bet their message history could show some bots. Worth checking.

If bots deposit into guild banks... Ugh, I dunno. Maybe delete what has been deposited? Won't help if it has been retrieved already, hm...

Can you slap an ID on gathered mats? Blizzard to that with items, AFAIK. You could track and delete them, maybe even refined and the golden mats from them?

Why so much effort on tracking items etc? Ban the obvious bots on a daily basis. Done.

Blizzard's problem with Diablo is that the game is completely instanced so bots can hide in their own world (no idea about bots in WoW). That is not the case here.

Turelus · November 2017

Lord-Otto wrote: »

lordrichter
I have seen some people sell mats very, very cheap. I bet their message history could show some bots. Worth checking.

If bots deposit into guild banks... Ugh, I dunno. Maybe delete what has been deposited? Won't help if it has been retrieved already, hm...

Can you slap an ID on gathered mats? Blizzard to that with items, AFAIK. You could track and delete them, maybe even refined and the golden mats from them?

If it's worth checking, send a ticket to ZOS to check. If they have been linked to botting ZOS will act.

This again though is a case of "I think these people cheat, ZOS didn't ban them, thus ZOS doesn't act" rather than "I suspect they could cheat, ZOS doesn't ban them, I guess maybe I was wrong"

Gonna get flamed for this one I know.

Lord-Otto · November 2017

Oh, no. Nonononono, that's not what I'm saying.

ZOS have to think about innocent buyers and so on. They have to be cautious about whom to ban. I'm not mourning over the suspected "bot traders" because of that.

Banning every bot right away would be nice, but it is highly impracticable. That is why I'm thinking about ways to rather pin down the person behind it.

Elsonso · November 2017

Turelus wrote: »

This again though is a case of "I think these people cheat, ZOS didn't ban them, thus ZOS doesn't act" rather than "I suspect they could cheat, ZOS doesn't ban them, I guess maybe I was wrong"

Based on how long it takes from the time I report a bot to the time the bot disappears, it is not unreasonable to think the former rather than the latter. One of the problems I have with how ZOS does bots and cheating is that there is nothing to indicate a false report vs inactivity. They don't have to tell us the outcome, but if the player disappears from the game in a few hours, we sort of get a clue. In that environment, if the player hangs around for days or weeks, it is an indication that nothing is wrong.

Runs · November 2017

They do get banned but it can take upwards of 6 months if it's just a few people reporting each day with video evidence. The quicker way to do it is to make a video, post it here and tag Gina or Jessica or both and have a bunch of people in the thread.

Cpt_Teemo · November 2017

Delimber wrote: »

Colecovision wrote: »

Honest question, not trying to be difficult. Is there enough Dreaux Wax to go around without the bots? I farm and craft and I still have to buy some here and there. Would each wax be 7k? Who does that help?

There is plenty of Wax out there (sitting on almost 200 myself). Just a matter of finding a zone with a low population and farm, farm, farm.

Or do writs on 14 chars a day, / surveys.

Cpt_Teemo · November 2017

Runs wrote: »

They do get banned but it can take upwards of 6 months if it's just a few people reporting each day with video evidence. The quicker way to do it is to make a video, post it here and tag Gina or Jessica or both and have a bunch of people in the thread.

You'd have to block there name out as well though while filming

Apache_Kid · November 2017

For all the people that are saying that it takes longer for ZoS to ban a bot than it does for the bot-master to put a new bot in, why isn't that bot-master having their IP banned. Is something like that impossible to implement on this game? Am i being ignorant here?

JKorr · November 2017

Apache_Kid wrote: »

For all the people that are saying that it takes longer for ZoS to ban a bot than it does for the bot-master to put a new bot in, why isn't that bot-master having their IP banned. Is something like that impossible to implement on this game? Am i being ignorant here?

They probably do. Unfortunately, there are ways around that. Blocking all methods of making new accounts might be impossible.

Apache_Kid · November 2017

JKorr wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

For all the people that are saying that it takes longer for ZoS to ban a bot than it does for the bot-master to put a new bot in, why isn't that bot-master having their IP banned. Is something like that impossible to implement on this game? Am i being ignorant here?

They probably do. Unfortunately, there are ways around that. Blocking all methods of making new accounts might be impossible.

I know there are ways around that for PC but is it the same for console? I've seen the same bot master (can tell its most likely the same by the behavior of his bots) in Rivinspire and have reported his whole chain on 3 occasions but they keep coming back. Although as I'm typing this I remember that things can be done to ban the entire console. I guess without knowing exactly what kind of punishment these bot-masters are getting it's moot to have this discussion but whatever they are doing currently doesn't seem to be effective that is for sure.