ESO Community Explain Please

Countcalorie · November 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Why is it that we as a community find it perfectly okay to charge people for trial clears, and essentially sell “carry runs” to those who don’t deserve said: Titles, skins, loot, etc. Yet, we look down so harshly on those who exploit trial runs via using skills like Snipe, or by leaving the map?

Why do condemn people who cheat so heavily in PvE, yet on the PvP side? Miiat add-on on PC ran rampant for months regarding PvP? And that add-on was some straight up cheating from what I understand about it. Through and through. Yet hundreds if not thousands of people abused it. Why have the audacity to criticize PvE’ers so heavily, yet CE users barrage through Cyrodill and Battlegrounds. Even to this very moment in time. And you have folks who work across alliances to keep the same people who normally get emperor to resume doing so. Trading and even selling emperorship to folks. What type of **** is that?

You have folks who sit about complaining about bots and gold sellers, but then turn around and buy those super cheap materials from said bots and gold sellers. And how do I know this? Because, I’ve seen it personally. Right in Craglorn. A few people who’ve complained on these forums about bots, I’ve seen huddled around an obvious bitter/gold seller to pick-up the goods. Yet come on these very forums and try to act so clean and pristine, knowing very well that their hands are just as covered and dirt.

Why is this ESO community? Someone please tell me why.

Oh, and for the record? I am NOT defending cheating or exploiting in any kind. I’m all for the most EXTREME of extremes when it comes to dealing with those who violate the TOS that people agreed to in-game. And anyone who knows me or knows of me knows this fact about me. I will fight tooth and nail to see cheaters and overall dishonest players get punished to the highest extent possible. And will wrestle as hard as I can with those I know of to have said players blacklisted from guilds and all that jazz. Even when it comes to myself encountering bugs and or exploits. You all will see me post a video of here right here on these forums, and beg and plead to ZOS to have it looked into. Why? Because I don’t want people taking advantage of said bug, and dragging the game even further into the dirt. Although at this point, I just send PM’s to ZOS staff directly, rather than cause a scene. The only exceptions being when said exploit requires as much attention as possible to have it neutralized and on the devs’ radar (e.g. Leaping into keeps, god mode, etc.).

So n’ah. Champ doesn’t defend anything about cheating or exploiting. Let alone anything dishonest. However, Champ also doesn’t throw shade at 1 thing but not the other. I look at all exploits as an exploit. Regardless of its severity. Not 1 being allowed to slide, while condemning the others. N’ah b. That’s deadass wrong. And I would like for us as a community to cut that bs out.

I'll explain.Zenimax aren't good moderaters.to be honest they aren't good at anything even their microtransactions fail.
I still don't know what im doing here there is like only 20 people on Xbox Eu when I hop on so that says something of how much a trashfire both Zenimax and the Eso community are.

Turelus · November 2017

For me it's pretty simple.

Selling a run for gold and without account sharing is just players monetising their abilities. Playing sandbox MMO games in the past this is pretty normal to me, you're good at something and can help others with that ability so you sell it.

However cheating and exploiting to do something is different on the grounds you're not doing off the skill of others, you're doing it from bugs or broken mechanics.

I have no problem if people who "don't deserve" a title or skin earn it off the backs of others, however I have a problem when people start using bugs or cheats to do it.

LukosCreyden · November 2017

The way I see it, if a guild is good enough to clear a vet trial with 11 + 1 buyer, then good for them. They deserve to be able to make some gold off of their skills. these people have worked hard to learn the trial, get good as a team, earn and upgrade gear to clear the trials.

If a buyer wishes to spend millions of their hard-earned gold on getting a skin, then go for it. They earned their gold, let them spend it how they please. these people have worked hard to earn their gold, market research, selling rare items which they have farmed for or through saving over a very long peruod of time. Maybe from providing services to others, such as crafting. Or maybe a carry run or two?

If a guild wishes to exploit a bug to complete difficult endgame content, a glitch anyone with a bow can do, then that is NOT ok.these people clearly don't have the skill, knowledge or gear to complete the trial. They also have not taken the time and effort to earn the gold to pay an experienced guild to give them a space on their next run or carry them.

Slick_007 · November 2017

Turelus wrote: »

For me it's pretty simple.

Selling a run for gold and without account sharing is just players monetising their abilities. Playing sandbox MMO games in the past this is pretty normal to me, you're good at something and can help others with that ability so you sell it.

no, actually. this is the first mmo iv played that sold carries. it is the only one im currently playing, so it is possible others introduced it after i stopped playing them. i wouldnt say its common. i think its an indication that people have no clue whatsoever about how to make friends anymore. because in the past, you'd make friends and you wouldnt have to pay. people would run it because they wanted to run it, not to make gold.

Mureel · November 2017

Turelus wrote: »

For me it's pretty simple.

Selling a run for gold and without account sharing is just players monetising their abilities. Playing sandbox MMO games in the past this is pretty normal to me, you're good at something and can help others with that ability so you sell it.

However cheating and exploiting to do something is different on the grounds you're not doing off the skill of others, you're doing it from bugs or broken mechanics.

I have no problem if people who "don't deserve" a title or skin earn it off the backs of others, however I have a problem when people start using bugs or cheats to do it.

Yeah and, even so- they earned the 250k-1mil somehow to pay for it, so they at least had to earn the gold. I wouldn’t pay for a clear but I’m no more against it than I am people charging for skyreach runs.

starkerealm · November 2017

Mureel wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

First, there is, in fact a line. Not everyone agrees on exactly where that line is, but for most of us, exploits like the vAS HM clears, are over it. Carries are (usually) not.

For some people, there's a legitimate statement to be had that even in a carry, they were legitimately there participating in the content. Even if they weren't individually good enough to complete, their team was capable of doing so. So, the titles are representative of your entire team's skill, not just yours. At that point, it doesn't matter nearly as much that everyone was up to snuff so long as the group effort cleared the bar.

For some people, the idea is that everyone needs to be able to pull their share, and as a result carries are deeply offensive.

For almost everyone, deliberately exploiting the game's mechanics to trivialize content is a bridge too far.

Okay, that's PvE. Give me a minute.

The bolded bit, and many times people who are legit part of the group and are not even paying are getting carried themselves.
My clear of VMOL on my DPS on Rakhat was with a really good group and my dps was 2nd to lowest at 27k and we weren’t even running or catching meteors. We 2 were carried in a sense because we were the weakest links.

Yeah, I'd make a joke about my last Rakhat parse being ~4k, but truth is, I was running. So no sweet DPS numbers for me.

But, I've been there. Even in ESO early on, when I was first learning the dungeon mechanics. Now, I mean, I really hate being the weakest link, but it's certainly happened.

Like I said, dungeons (and trials for that matter) are group content. You're being graded as a team. Even if three of the four aren't up to snuff, you can still clear content legitimately, because the team, as a whole, was able to pass the challenge (even if 3 of them were taking a dirt nap at the time.)

I understand the hostility to paid carries, but it's not that different from the unpaid carries everyone gets when they're first learning the ropes. Anyone who insists they've never been the weakest link, is lying.

Hilariously, paid bites... I did used to charge people, but, at the same time, if it was someone who was paying, I'd talk them through it, even gear them out, and get them consumables in some cases if they needed it. Everybody learns, and if you're paying for my time, I do want to make sure you actually learn.

Paying for carries isn't something I'd even consider doing, but I get it. I'm kinda neutral on the subject overall, but I get being in a place where you go, "I'll never be able to do this, but if I pay these guys, I can see some of the content I haven't had the opportunity to yet, and never really will be in a place to do so."

Though, even then, glitched carries? You're not getting that at all.