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Werewolf - Out Of Form - 20% DB Damage? Yea / Nay?

raasdal
raasdal
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Can someone confirm for me;

When NOT in WereWolf form, do i take 20% more damage (FG Passive) from Dawnbreaker? Yes / No ?
PC - EU
Gromag Gro-Molag - Sorcerer - EP
Dexion Velus - Dragonknight - AD
Chalaux Erissa - Nightblade - AD
Firiel Erissa - Templar - AD
  • Qbiken
    Qbiken
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    No, only in WW-form
    WTB a non-bugged werewolf for at least one patch
    (PC/EU)
    Probably the worst Werewolf on PC/EU


    Characters:
    EU
    DC - Octius Ciel - Magicka Sorcerer - Breton
    DC - Evelina Septim - Magicka Templar - Breton
    EP - Josephine Tharn - Magicka Templar - Breton
    DC - Zireael the White Flame - Stamina Sorcerer - Bosmer
    EP - Qbi-One-Kenobi - (Previously Tankus Maximus II) - Argonian
    AD - Anconeus - Magicka Nightblade - High Elf
    EP - Cirilla Élen Riannon - Magica Dragonknight - Dark Elf
    AD - The Cub of Cintra - Stamina Nightblade - Redguard
    AD - Alinare Larentius - Magicka Templar - High Elf
    DC - The Alt-Knight - Stamina Dragonknight - Nord
    DC - Féreldir - Magicka Warden - Argonian
    AD - Kuvirá - Stamina Sorcerer - Redguard
    EP - 1vX Material - Stamina Warden - Orc
    EP - Fenrir the Windwalker - Stamina Sorcerer - Orc
    EP - Q_Q Mancer Stamina Necromancer - Orc

    NA
    EP - Sister Q - Stamina Sorcerer - Nord

    Trials
    vAA + HM: Completed
    vHRC + HM: Completed
    vSO + HM: Completed
    vMoL+ HM: Completed
    vMA: Completed, and with 10 characters as Flawless Conquerors.
    vDSA: Completed
    vAS HM: Completed
    vHoF + HM: Completed
    vCR +1
    vBRP
  • raasdal
    raasdal
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    INBF "Google It": I did and all posts about this are very old, and with inconsistent information.
    PC - EU
    Gromag Gro-Molag - Sorcerer - EP
    Dexion Velus - Dragonknight - AD
    Chalaux Erissa - Nightblade - AD
    Firiel Erissa - Templar - AD
  • Tormy
    Tormy
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    No
  • Takes-No-Prisoner
    Takes-No-Prisoner
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    Qbiken wrote: »
    No, only in WW-form
    ^^^^

    A long time ago you could take the extra damage while having the disease in human form. Not anymore.
  • raasdal
    raasdal
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    Thanks for the answers!
    PC - EU
    Gromag Gro-Molag - Sorcerer - EP
    Dexion Velus - Dragonknight - AD
    Chalaux Erissa - Nightblade - AD
    Firiel Erissa - Templar - AD
  • Takes-No-Prisoner
    Takes-No-Prisoner
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    Don’t forget about poison too, that and DB together really hurts when you’re in WW form.
  • Qbiken
    Qbiken
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    Don’t forget about poison too, that and DB together really hurts when you’re in WW form.
    Don’t forget about poison too, that and DB together really hurts when you’re in WW form.

    You don´t need to counter your weakness if you one-shoot them in WW-form
    C4R7-x8VMAE9pQW.jpg
    WTB a non-bugged werewolf for at least one patch
    (PC/EU)
    Probably the worst Werewolf on PC/EU


    Characters:
    EU
    DC - Octius Ciel - Magicka Sorcerer - Breton
    DC - Evelina Septim - Magicka Templar - Breton
    EP - Josephine Tharn - Magicka Templar - Breton
    DC - Zireael the White Flame - Stamina Sorcerer - Bosmer
    EP - Qbi-One-Kenobi - (Previously Tankus Maximus II) - Argonian
    AD - Anconeus - Magicka Nightblade - High Elf
    EP - Cirilla Élen Riannon - Magica Dragonknight - Dark Elf
    AD - The Cub of Cintra - Stamina Nightblade - Redguard
    AD - Alinare Larentius - Magicka Templar - High Elf
    DC - The Alt-Knight - Stamina Dragonknight - Nord
    DC - Féreldir - Magicka Warden - Argonian
    AD - Kuvirá - Stamina Sorcerer - Redguard
    EP - 1vX Material - Stamina Warden - Orc
    EP - Fenrir the Windwalker - Stamina Sorcerer - Orc
    EP - Q_Q Mancer Stamina Necromancer - Orc

    NA
    EP - Sister Q - Stamina Sorcerer - Nord

    Trials
    vAA + HM: Completed
    vHRC + HM: Completed
    vSO + HM: Completed
    vMoL+ HM: Completed
    vMA: Completed, and with 10 characters as Flawless Conquerors.
    vDSA: Completed
    vAS HM: Completed
    vHoF + HM: Completed
    vCR +1
    vBRP
  • Takes-No-Prisoner
    Takes-No-Prisoner
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    Qbiken wrote: »
    You don´t need to counter your weakness if you one-shoot them in WW-form
    C4R7-x8VMAE9pQW.jpg

    wat
  • Thogard
    Thogard
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    PC NA - Thogard / Sir Thogalot / Thoggy Boi jr / Thogaine / El Thogardo

    twitch.tv/ThogardPvP
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
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    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.
    Old member of The Order of Mundus, Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. How far we've come!

    Have questions? Send me a message on the forums or my other social media. Seeing people learn is my dream and passion.

    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • Takes-No-Prisoner
    Takes-No-Prisoner
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    Thogard wrote: »

    Peter is my favorite
  • Thogard
    Thogard
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭
    Thogard wrote: »

    Peter is my favorite

    "And we've been friends ever since"
    PC NA - Thogard / Sir Thogalot / Thoggy Boi jr / Thogaine / El Thogardo

    twitch.tv/ThogardPvP
  • Qbiken
    Qbiken
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    ✭✭✭
    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    To be fair, all WW-passives (aside from the ultimate) are only active while in WW-form. So it´s a balanced trade-off. :)
    WTB a non-bugged werewolf for at least one patch
    (PC/EU)
    Probably the worst Werewolf on PC/EU


    Characters:
    EU
    DC - Octius Ciel - Magicka Sorcerer - Breton
    DC - Evelina Septim - Magicka Templar - Breton
    EP - Josephine Tharn - Magicka Templar - Breton
    DC - Zireael the White Flame - Stamina Sorcerer - Bosmer
    EP - Qbi-One-Kenobi - (Previously Tankus Maximus II) - Argonian
    AD - Anconeus - Magicka Nightblade - High Elf
    EP - Cirilla Élen Riannon - Magica Dragonknight - Dark Elf
    AD - The Cub of Cintra - Stamina Nightblade - Redguard
    AD - Alinare Larentius - Magicka Templar - High Elf
    DC - The Alt-Knight - Stamina Dragonknight - Nord
    DC - Féreldir - Magicka Warden - Argonian
    AD - Kuvirá - Stamina Sorcerer - Redguard
    EP - 1vX Material - Stamina Warden - Orc
    EP - Fenrir the Windwalker - Stamina Sorcerer - Orc
    EP - Q_Q Mancer Stamina Necromancer - Orc

    NA
    EP - Sister Q - Stamina Sorcerer - Nord

    Trials
    vAA + HM: Completed
    vHRC + HM: Completed
    vSO + HM: Completed
    vMoL+ HM: Completed
    vMA: Completed, and with 10 characters as Flawless Conquerors.
    vDSA: Completed
    vAS HM: Completed
    vHoF + HM: Completed
    vCR +1
    vBRP
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
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    Qbiken wrote: »
    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    To be fair, all WW-passives (aside from the ultimate) are only active while in WW-form. So it´s a balanced trade-off. :)

    No Vampire passives are active during Stage 1 of Vampire, so...
    Old member of The Order of Mundus, Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. How far we've come!

    Have questions? Send me a message on the forums or my other social media. Seeing people learn is my dream and passion.

    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • ToRelax
    ToRelax
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    ✭✭
    Qbiken wrote: »
    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    To be fair, all WW-passives (aside from the ultimate) are only active while in WW-form. So it´s a balanced trade-off. :)

    No Vampire passives are active during Stage 1 of Vampire, so...

    But active skills are.
    DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
    The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...

    Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
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    ToRelax wrote: »
    Qbiken wrote: »
    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    To be fair, all WW-passives (aside from the ultimate) are only active while in WW-form. So it´s a balanced trade-off. :)

    No Vampire passives are active during Stage 1 of Vampire, so...

    But active skills are.

    And using them removes a large chunk of your timer in lower stages. Actively using skills means actively progressing through Vampiric stages. Good luck feeding after every mist form.
    Old member of The Order of Mundus, Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. How far we've come!

    Have questions? Send me a message on the forums or my other social media. Seeing people learn is my dream and passion.

    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • Sixty5
    Sixty5
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    ToRelax wrote: »
    Qbiken wrote: »
    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    To be fair, all WW-passives (aside from the ultimate) are only active while in WW-form. So it´s a balanced trade-off. :)

    No Vampire passives are active during Stage 1 of Vampire, so...

    But active skills are.

    And using them removes a large chunk of your timer in lower stages. Actively using skills means actively progressing through Vampiric stages. Good luck feeding after every mist form.

    That's what the Double Bloody Mara is for, though that would be expensive.
    Lord and Savior of the Association of Serious S***posters.

    I play a character called "Gives Me Wood Elf" because I am a mature and sensible person.
    Stam Sorc main in Battlegrounds
  • Bakkagami
    Bakkagami
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    Give me ww passive in human form and I'll take 20% db damage any day. Vampire offers far more flexibility at the cost of a few skills hitting a bit harder and a (mostly) irrelevant health regen debuff. Fire is the only significant downside and, if I recall correctly, that's really only significant at higher stages.
  • Zaldan
    Zaldan
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    Bakkagami wrote: »
    Give me ww passive in human form and I'll take 20% db damage any day. Vampire offers far more flexibility at the cost of a few skills hitting a bit harder and a (mostly) irrelevant health regen debuff. Fire is the only significant downside and, if I recall correctly, that's really only significant at higher stages.

    Let's add using non ww skills in ww form, there is no direct comparison lol
    Dovie'andi se tovya sagain.
    Niidro tiid wah fusvok dirkah.

    aka.@Cuthceol
  • danno8
    danno8
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    ToRelax wrote: »
    Qbiken wrote: »
    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    To be fair, all WW-passives (aside from the ultimate) are only active while in WW-form. So it´s a balanced trade-off. :)

    No Vampire passives are active during Stage 1 of Vampire, so...

    But active skills are.

    And using them removes a large chunk of your timer in lower stages. Actively using skills means actively progressing through Vampiric stages. Good luck feeding after every mist form.

    While you are certainly correct in how Vampire and Werewolf work differently, I think the fact that there are tonnes of active Vampires, using Vampire skills and passives, and nearly non-existent WW's doing the same thing proves that even if Werewolves have the advantage to a certain degree when it comes to passive drawbacks, the way the skill line functions makes it nonetheless far less desirable.
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
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    danno8 wrote: »
    ToRelax wrote: »
    Qbiken wrote: »
    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    To be fair, all WW-passives (aside from the ultimate) are only active while in WW-form. So it´s a balanced trade-off. :)

    No Vampire passives are active during Stage 1 of Vampire, so...

    But active skills are.

    And using them removes a large chunk of your timer in lower stages. Actively using skills means actively progressing through Vampiric stages. Good luck feeding after every mist form.

    While you are certainly correct in how Vampire and Werewolf work differently, I think the fact that there are tonnes of active Vampires, using Vampire skills and passives, and nearly non-existent WW's doing the same thing proves that even if Werewolves have the advantage to a certain degree when it comes to passive drawbacks, the way the skill line functions makes it nonetheless far less desirable.

    That's due to the fact that Vampiric passives are extremely powerful in PvP content. A passive damage mitigation that applies to damage shields, bonus regeneration, and improved sneaking capabilities cover a wide array of what builds want. Werewolves are in need of love, I won't disagree.

    Regardless, my comparison is that Stage 1; which is designed to act as if you were not a Vampire at all (similarly to out of form Werewolves) provides 0 bonus to the player, but still incurs heavy detriments to them. There should be risk associated with reward, but if there is only risk, what is the justification?
    Old member of The Order of Mundus, Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. How far we've come!

    Have questions? Send me a message on the forums or my other social media. Seeing people learn is my dream and passion.

    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • Raudgrani
    Raudgrani
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    Don’t forget about poison too, that and DB together really hurts when you’re in WW form.

    The "oh poison is so dangerous, you can't be a werewolf - it's silly!", is really over exaggerated - to the point that some people you speak of are like "Yaaa, I'd like to go werewolf in PVP, but it's just silly, you're instantly dead if someone shoots you with poison!". You are not.

    Despite people even specifically targeting me with poison (because they obviously believe in said rumor), I have never had a problem with poison. I can actually count on one hand the times I've died from poison as a major cause. Sometimes, I actually run around outside a keep door, to make people shoot what they got at me, just to take damage to remain in werewolf form until we get into the keep. I can have like 10 poison injection fired at me over 30 seconds, and I have no problem whatsoever to go on. And no, I've hardly done anything to counter it with champion points.

    So it's a myth. Not trying to "put you in place" here specifically, but just want to have it said. Some people need to read it. The problem in werewolf form is all these roots and snares. People literally spam all those they got on you, from the very moment you transform.
  • Takes-No-Prisoner
    Takes-No-Prisoner
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    Putting the weaknesses out on the table for the OP to see was really all that post was intended to be.

    There was no reason to take offense.

    The post was never a determent to not go WW, but a weakness to consider, on top of other weaknesses(like you mentioned). Of the more glaring issues, IMO, is having all other abilities locked and only having the WW ones available to use.
  • br0steen
    br0steen
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    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    Apples and oranges. You can still use vampire abilities while stage 1. Bring back the passive stam regen buff without having ww slotted and then you would have a reason to allow the increased damage from fighters guild out of ww form.
  • Barbaran
    Barbaran
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    yup. in or out of form you are a warewolf.
    you want the passives, take the negative side effect of having it.
    thats like saying vampire should only take 20% more damage from it and only take more fire damage if a vamp ability is slotted.
    cant just have positives with no negatives
  • Daus
    Daus
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    Funny how Stage 1 Vampire gets the bonus damage from Fighter's Guild and Prismatic enchants proc on them, but apparently out of form WW's don't? Very interesting.

    You can use vampire abilities regardless of stage. You actually have to transform in order to use werewolf abilities.
  • Drakkdjinn
    Drakkdjinn
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    Gilliam you're making a false analogy - having active skills and an ultimate available despite lack of buffs at stage 1 is not a comparable toolkit to an Un-transformed WW which offers exactly zero utility, zero. They're different considerations.
    <Tertiary Meat> | <The Sleeping Dragon Inn> | <Fus-Ro-Die>

    Drakk the Berserker
    Drakk the Barbarian
    Saltasaurus Rex
    Father of the Year

    The Savior of Cyrodil
  • Wreuntzylla
    Wreuntzylla
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    I would be more than happy to have the additional damage in and out of werewolf form if the ulti cost for ww was dropped to 50-100.

    I don't get the stage 1 vampire argument, my NB vamps never go down in stages, I don't see a need for it.
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