Wardens Aren’t That Bad

Ch4mpTW · October 2017

After finally getting my MagDen to Lv.50, I can truly say that Wardens are easily the most enjoyable class by far. Without any doubts or questions, it is by far the class that truly entertains me the most.

I’m currently running: 5pcs. Winterborn, 4x Moondancer (sharpened lightning staff), 2x Iceheart, and 1x Maelstrom Ice (switching between sharpened and infused currently). And bruh... I melt things. Even in VMA. I utterly obliterate in there. I’m not quite too comfortable yet with my my bar positioning to aim for score runs, and Flawless Conqueror on her just yet. But damn, I’m definitely feeling the chilly good vibes.

Now of course... There’s 1 thing that I absolutely must say... ZOS... Bruh... You gotta increase MagDen DPS, though. Because while the magicka variant is incredibly fun to play and all... My DPS is nowhere near where I’d like it to be to bring into 12-man veteran trials. Barely hitting 29k (though supposedly I can hit at max 32k to 34k tops with Necropotence) when I test using my target skeletons. And that’s not good. Sure, I can melt things in VMA, and hold my own against WB’s. But bruh... She’s not ready for those VMoL runs. Wouldn’t even consider her a valuable option, and that makes me sad. Can we please do something about the Warden baby deeps? Please ZOS?

rustic_potato · October 2017

Magika Wardens are really strong in vMA but outside of it it is weaker than a magplar even as a healer.

vovus69 · October 2017

If you are hitting 25k-30k selfbuffed - you are good for trials. Those crazy numbers you see are in the trial groups when with all buffs you will have twice more damage.

-vovus

Tan9oSuccka · October 2017

Man, I tried to give my poor Dunmer mag Warden a go. I just don’t like any of the skills other than fissure and throwing pigeons.

Bear ultimate is ungodly terrible in PVP. Slightly less crappy in PVE.

Two other skill trees of “meh”.

vovus69 · October 2017

warden bear is not for pvp. This is for the cases when you like sustained solo char and want to solo WB or group dungeons in Craglorn. warden in pvp uses mainly healing ult or destro ult if needed.

-vovus

Ch4mpTW · October 2017

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Man, I tried to give my poor Dunmer mag Warden a go. I just don’t like any of the skills other than fissure and throwing pigeons.

Bear ultimate is ungodly terrible in PVP. Slightly less crappy in PVE.

Two other skill trees of “meh”.

Hmm... I don’t know your build enough to try and help ya out, but for starters is the race that you’ve selected. Dunmer for a Warden to me seems rather inconsistent. I went with Altmer (because I love everything about Altmer from a lore and passive perspective), and find it to be the bread n’ butter to the Warden class.

Next up, is the spammable you’re using. I go with Force Pulse, as it let’s me constantly hit numerous things from all the chilled enemies there are. I’m always hitting multiple things at once. Lol. It’s some cheese. And as for Fissure, it takes a long time to get used to and position correctly. A veeeery long time. And the Bear ultimate can be nice (I suppose), but I find it to be some dookie. Unless you’re running a dueling build. Because I’ve seen some amazing MagDen duels running that bear, and even experienced my share of MagDen opponents with that Bear. And they can really be tough to manage (if your opponent is skillful).

Honestly, I have 0 experience with MagDens in PvP so I can’t really speak too much about the PvP aspect of MagDens more than I’ve already said. And have only gotten up to my knees wet regarding PvE with them. I suppose the class perhaps is a love it or hate it kind of thing. There is no middle grounds. Lol.

Tan9oSuccka · October 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Man, I tried to give my poor Dunmer mag Warden a go. I just don’t like any of the skills other than fissure and throwing pigeons.

Bear ultimate is ungodly terrible in PVP. Slightly less crappy in PVE.

Two other skill trees of “meh”.

Hmm... I don’t know your build enough to try and help ya out, but for starters is the race that you’ve selected. Dunmer for a Warden to me seems rather inconsistent. I went with Altmer (because I love everything about Altmer from a lore and passive perspective), and find it to be the bread n’ butter to the Warden class.

Next up, is the spammable you’re using. I go with Force Pulse, as it let’s me constantly hit numerous things from all the chilled enemies there are. I’m always hitting multiple things at once. Lol. It’s some cheese. And as for Fissure, it takes a long time to get used to and position correctly. A veeeery long time. And the Bear ultimate can be nice (I suppose), but I find it to be some dookie. Unless you’re running a dueling build. Because I’ve seen some amazing MagDen duels running that bear, and even experienced my share of MagDen opponents with that Bear. And they can really be tough to manage (if your opponent is skillful).

Honestly, I have 0 experience with MagDens in PvP so I can’t really speak too much about the PvP aspect of MagDens more than I’ve already said. And have only gotten up to my knees wet regarding PvE with them. I suppose the class perhaps is a love it or hate it kind of thing. There is no middle grounds. Lol.

Thanks. I will never roll an Altmer. I can’t stand to listen to them speak or even look at their mangled mugs.

I already have a Breton Sorc and Dunmers have a Mag bonus as well. He’s not yet at 50, but running: 5 Julianos, 3 war maiden, 3 Torugs.

The Bear actually is pretty funny with Duels. I had some scrub steal a chest while I was fighting the mob by it.

That poor sap got slaughtered.

vovus69 · October 2017

regarding pvp - warden's best combo so far looks like this:
activate beetles, pop the immov potion and when beetles are about to activate, do stampede->dawnbreaker->reverse slice. Somewhere in between combo above beetles will be activated. This is usually one shot.
You don't need bear for that.

-vovus

Megabear · October 2017

My Altmer Frost Warden infuriates her enemies. I CC the hell out of the crowd and lol-lol. I only tried a few times as I'm currently focused on hitting max CP, but I really look forward to continuing my lol-lol.

Defilted · October 2017

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Ch4mpTW · October 2017

Defilted wrote: »

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Agreed. It’s a huge issue. It’s always been an actual, and forever will be an issue. Why? Because ZOS is adamant about balancing PvE and PvP together. Regardless of the fact that we have told them for years now that it doesn’t work. Regardless of the fact that lots of players have quit the game over it. Regardless of the fact that their newest class is underperforming on the magicka spectrum of things. ZOS insists upon doing things their way. It doesn’t matter how many times they fail at attempting to do so, and that the data PROVES it’s idiotic to continue doing so — they persist.

I genuinely hope the MagDen gets some love, and soon. Because the magicka side of things can be so beautiful for the Warden class, and shows so much potential. But, ZOS is just constantly ignoring it patch after patch. Why? To appeal to the PvP crowd.

Balamoor · October 2017

I love my warden

That is all

vovus69 · October 2017

zos has no other choice - they positioned themselves first and for all as massive pvp in cyro. The goal they could not reach. They system is not scalable when you have concentration of players in one place. So in pvp it always will be bad until they will redesign the game engine. Redesign is due also because they have pretty old physics and even unreal4 has better physics now. They are leaders in graphics. This is for sure and when they will lose this advantage, they will be done. But now even graphics need some liftup - compare CWC with Glenumbra or other first zones. Difference in resolution is pretty big. But this is all inefficiency in game engine - when you have to handle low res and high res at the same time. And of course, 32 bit client is a shame. I am waiting for Jan 2018 when 64 bit will come up. I would bet, it will be simple port, but it is the move in the right direction.
I think zos is afraid of doing major dev - old devs are fired, new ones don't know the engine. This is why they could not fix anything - just playing with parameters. It is interesting to see how they will redesign the engine. They have so much graphics with high res that unreal4 will be very laggy. This will be the real challenge IMO. Will see.

-vovus

SanTii.92 · October 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Agreed. It’s a huge issue. It’s always been an actual, and forever will be an issue. Why? Because ZOS is adamant about balancing PvE and PvP together. Regardless of the fact that we have told them for years now that it doesn’t work. Regardless of the fact that lots of players have quit the game over it. Regardless of the fact that their newest class is underperforming on the magicka spectrum of things. ZOS insists upon doing things their way. It doesn’t matter how many times they fail at attempting to do so, and that the data PROVES it’s idiotic to continue doing so — they persist.

I genuinely hope the MagDen gets some love, and soon. Because the magicka side of things can be so beautiful for the Warden class, and shows so much potential. But, ZOS is just constantly ignoring it patch after patch. Why? To appeal to the PvP crowd.

it's not really that hard to do so, they've already adress the huge problem that was the healing ulti, now they got to nerf shimmering shield and wardens will be in a good place pvp wise. Then just got to buff winter's revange damage, rework arctic wind into a new dps skill, and allow us to single bar the bear and the class will be fixed.

Anyways, they have already stated that they aware of it

ZOS_Wrobel wrote: »

Some of you have noted that you’d like to see more DPS from Magicka Wardens, and we’ll be looking at the DPS across all classes and specs for a future update. We’re also looking into ways to improve the bear in PvP scenarios to prevent him from running everywhere, and also improve how Warden abilities work with animation cancelling.

So chill with the 'it's the pvp crowd fault' narrative, it's simple not true at all.

Link Edited,

Kalante · October 2017

warden is low key aids

Ch4mpTW · October 2017

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Agreed. It’s a huge issue. It’s always been an actual, and forever will be an issue. Why? Because ZOS is adamant about balancing PvE and PvP together. Regardless of the fact that we have told them for years now that it doesn’t work. Regardless of the fact that lots of players have quit the game over it. Regardless of the fact that their newest class is underperforming on the magicka spectrum of things. ZOS insists upon doing things their way. It doesn’t matter how many times they fail at attempting to do so, and that the data PROVES it’s idiotic to continue doing so — they persist.

I genuinely hope the MagDen gets some love, and soon. Because the magicka side of things can be so beautiful for the Warden class, and shows so much potential. But, ZOS is just constantly ignoring it patch after patch. Why? To appeal to the PvP crowd.

it's not really that hard to do so, they've already adress the huge problem that was the healing ulti, now they got to nerf shimmering shield and wardens will be in a good place pvp wise. Then just got to buff winter's revange damage, rework arctic wind into a new dps skill, and allow us to single bar the bear and the class will be fixed.

Anyways, they have already stated that they aware of it:

ZOS_Wrobel wrote: »

Some of you have noted that you’d like to see more DPS from Magicka Wardens, and we’ll be looking at the DPS across all classes and specs for a future update. We’re also looking into ways to improve the bear in PvP scenarios to prevent him from running everywhere, and also improve how Warden abilities work with animation cancelling.

So chill with the 'it's the pvp crowd fault' narrative, it's simple not true at all.

Can you please link that bit from Wrobel, because I’d love to read it for myself. So sauce please.

Kalante wrote: »

warden is low key aids

Elaborate. Especially when a class such as Nightblades exist. Please explain for me. Because I truly don’t think there is anything more obnoxious from a PvP perspective, than a class that can stack on as many buffs that NB’s can, and can engage and disengage at will. Plus can abuse the most overpowered and buggy CC in all of ESO. Fear. To make matters worse, there are more NB’s than any other class by far in PvP environments. N’ah. Wardens are far from being a nuisance.

Kalante · October 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Agreed. It’s a huge issue. It’s always been an actual, and forever will be an issue. Why? Because ZOS is adamant about balancing PvE and PvP together. Regardless of the fact that we have told them for years now that it doesn’t work. Regardless of the fact that lots of players have quit the game over it. Regardless of the fact that their newest class is underperforming on the magicka spectrum of things. ZOS insists upon doing things their way. It doesn’t matter how many times they fail at attempting to do so, and that the data PROVES it’s idiotic to continue doing so — they persist.

I genuinely hope the MagDen gets some love, and soon. Because the magicka side of things can be so beautiful for the Warden class, and shows so much potential. But, ZOS is just constantly ignoring it patch after patch. Why? To appeal to the PvP crowd.

it's not really that hard to do so, they've already adress the huge problem that was the healing ulti, now they got to nerf shimmering shield and wardens will be in a good place pvp wise. Then just got to buff winter's revange damage, rework arctic wind into a new dps skill, and allow us to single bar the bear and the class will be fixed.

Anyways, they have already stated that they aware of it:

ZOS_Wrobel wrote: »

Some of you have noted that you’d like to see more DPS from Magicka Wardens, and we’ll be looking at the DPS across all classes and specs for a future update. We’re also looking into ways to improve the bear in PvP scenarios to prevent him from running everywhere, and also improve how Warden abilities work with animation cancelling.

So chill with the 'it's the pvp crowd fault' narrative, it's simple not true at all.

Can you please link that bit from Wrobel, because I’d love to read it for myself. So sauce please.

Kalante wrote: »

warden is low key aids

Elaborate. Especially when a class such as Nightblades exist. Please explain for me. Because I truly don’t think there is anything more obnoxious from a PvP perspective, than a class that can stack on as many buffs that NB’s can, and can engage and disengage at will. Plus can abuse the most overpowered and buggy CC in all of ESO. Fear. To make matters worse, there are more NB’s than any other class by far in PvP environments. N’ah. Wardens are far from being a nuisance.

Not yet and obviously you don't pvp.

s7732425ub17_ESO · October 2017

Winterborn and Iceheart are absolute trash. If you were to replace with the good meta sets, you would be even stronger!

Ch4mpTW · October 2017

s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »

Winterborn and Iceheart are absolute trash. If you were to replace with the good meta sets, you would be even stronger!

I don’t think you comprehend what you read too well. But sure, I’ll indulge in your point for a bit. Okay. I’ll swap Winterborn with Necropotence, and perhaps Iceheart with Skoria or Llambris. Ooooo. Suddenly I’m so meta with my Warden. Suddenly I’m pulling in the 30’s with her. Niiiice. Let me go on ahead and swap my Maelstrom’s Ice Staff with a Maelstrom’s Inferno Staff, and be just like the rest of the Wardens copying yet another @Alcast build, and saying how pro I am. Lol.

... N’ah bruh. I refuse. I’m not going to farm Necropotence for every single 1 of my magicka characters damn near, and be a typical meta bandwagoner. Absolutely not. As is, I’m running 4pcs. Moondancer in her. And 1 of said staves is lightning.

I’m not going to be like everyone else using the same sets over and over again to hit high numbers, and to fit in. I never did it before and hit relatively high numbers. And I’m aiming to do it again. All my characters are unique in a sense, and have their own identity. My MagSorc is a PetSorc. My MagDK focuses on flame damage. My MagPlar focuses on magic damage. And so on. I plan on keeping it that way. Just like how my main character was a PetSorc (and forever will be a PetSorc) long before the Necropotence hype train, and bandwagoners swarmed? I’ll be the same with my SnowDen, who will use focus on cold/frost damage.

grannas211 · October 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Agreed. It’s a huge issue. It’s always been an actual, and forever will be an issue. Why? Because ZOS is adamant about balancing PvE and PvP together. Regardless of the fact that we have told them for years now that it doesn’t work. Regardless of the fact that lots of players have quit the game over it. Regardless of the fact that their newest class is underperforming on the magicka spectrum of things. ZOS insists upon doing things their way. It doesn’t matter how many times they fail at attempting to do so, and that the data PROVES it’s idiotic to continue doing so — they persist.

I genuinely hope the MagDen gets some love, and soon. Because the magicka side of things can be so beautiful for the Warden class, and shows so much potential. But, ZOS is just constantly ignoring it patch after patch. Why? To appeal to the PvP crowd.

it's not really that hard to do so, they've already adress the huge problem that was the healing ulti, now they got to nerf shimmering shield and wardens will be in a good place pvp wise. Then just got to buff winter's revange damage, rework arctic wind into a new dps skill, and allow us to single bar the bear and the class will be fixed.

Anyways, they have already stated that they aware of it:

ZOS_Wrobel wrote: »

Some of you have noted that you’d like to see more DPS from Magicka Wardens, and we’ll be looking at the DPS across all classes and specs for a future update. We’re also looking into ways to improve the bear in PvP scenarios to prevent him from running everywhere, and also improve how Warden abilities work with animation cancelling.

So chill with the 'it's the pvp crowd fault' narrative, it's simple not true at all.

Can you please link that bit from Wrobel, because I’d love to read it for myself. So sauce please.

Kalante wrote: »

warden is low key aids

Elaborate. Especially when a class such as Nightblades exist. Please explain for me. Because I truly don’t think there is anything more obnoxious from a PvP perspective, than a class that can stack on as many buffs that NB’s can, and can engage and disengage at will. Plus can abuse the most overpowered and buggy CC in all of ESO. Fear. To make matters worse, there are more NB’s than any other class by far in PvP environments. N’ah. Wardens are far from being a nuisance.

Stamina warden is miles above everything in pvp currently.

Ch4mpTW · October 2017

grannas211 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Agreed. It’s a huge issue. It’s always been an actual, and forever will be an issue. Why? Because ZOS is adamant about balancing PvE and PvP together. Regardless of the fact that we have told them for years now that it doesn’t work. Regardless of the fact that lots of players have quit the game over it. Regardless of the fact that their newest class is underperforming on the magicka spectrum of things. ZOS insists upon doing things their way. It doesn’t matter how many times they fail at attempting to do so, and that the data PROVES it’s idiotic to continue doing so — they persist.

I genuinely hope the MagDen gets some love, and soon. Because the magicka side of things can be so beautiful for the Warden class, and shows so much potential. But, ZOS is just constantly ignoring it patch after patch. Why? To appeal to the PvP crowd.

it's not really that hard to do so, they've already adress the huge problem that was the healing ulti, now they got to nerf shimmering shield and wardens will be in a good place pvp wise. Then just got to buff winter's revange damage, rework arctic wind into a new dps skill, and allow us to single bar the bear and the class will be fixed.

Anyways, they have already stated that they aware of it:

ZOS_Wrobel wrote: »

Some of you have noted that you’d like to see more DPS from Magicka Wardens, and we’ll be looking at the DPS across all classes and specs for a future update. We’re also looking into ways to improve the bear in PvP scenarios to prevent him from running everywhere, and also improve how Warden abilities work with animation cancelling.

So chill with the 'it's the pvp crowd fault' narrative, it's simple not true at all.

Can you please link that bit from Wrobel, because I’d love to read it for myself. So sauce please.

Kalante wrote: »

warden is low key aids

Elaborate. Especially when a class such as Nightblades exist. Please explain for me. Because I truly don’t think there is anything more obnoxious from a PvP perspective, than a class that can stack on as many buffs that NB’s can, and can engage and disengage at will. Plus can abuse the most overpowered and buggy CC in all of ESO. Fear. To make matters worse, there are more NB’s than any other class by far in PvP environments. N’ah. Wardens are far from being a nuisance.

Stamina warden is miles above everything in pvp currently.

Is that right? Well then... I’ll be enjoying my StamDen in PvP until I get Caltrops and Vigor on her it seems. Then she too will be getting laced in PvE gear, and setup for VMA and trials (with my own little twist of course). Thanks for the info. +1 insightful to you, comrade.

Defilted · October 2017

I have both mag and Stam Wardens.

Tried the Winterborn Iceheart as the first set and it was terrible in PVP. Did not run it in PVE but I do not see it performing well there either. Stats are bad with those sets.

Stam Warden seems to me to be the better choice currently for bursty PVP damage and has decent survive-ability with heavy armor and tree ult. I am on console so I have not experienced the changes, but I do not see the changes making any real changes to the stam side of things for Wardens in PVP.

Mag Warden in PVP in a well organized group is a really nice chracter to play. Bird damage is good with around 50K magika. Both the offensive(Northern) and healing ults (Enchanted forest) work nice in this group concept. Running in a small group and not playing the chracter as a utility backup player and you get exposed pretty quickly if you are facing more than just 2 enemies. I have died far more times in a 1vX then survived with my mag warden. Also if you are caught without a shield up you are dead as your HP in Cyro with 64 in mag is almost 20K when maxing out for offense and high utility for your group.

You could re-design the build a little bit and get some more HP and go with lower magika pool, but then you would struggle to down anyone in Cyro.

So far overall I have really enjoyed playing both types of Wardens in PVP and will continue to do so.

Doctordarkspawn · October 2017

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Increase PVE DPS and PVP melts down. Decrease damage becasue of PVP and PVE melts down.

this is the issue.

Agreed. It’s a huge issue. It’s always been an actual, and forever will be an issue. Why? Because ZOS is adamant about balancing PvE and PvP together. Regardless of the fact that we have told them for years now that it doesn’t work. Regardless of the fact that lots of players have quit the game over it. Regardless of the fact that their newest class is underperforming on the magicka spectrum of things. ZOS insists upon doing things their way. It doesn’t matter how many times they fail at attempting to do so, and that the data PROVES it’s idiotic to continue doing so — they persist.

I genuinely hope the MagDen gets some love, and soon. Because the magicka side of things can be so beautiful for the Warden class, and shows so much potential. But, ZOS is just constantly ignoring it patch after patch. Why? To appeal to the PvP crowd.

it's not really that hard to do so, they've already adress the huge problem that was the healing ulti, now they got to nerf shimmering shield and wardens will be in a good place pvp wise. Then just got to buff winter's revange damage, rework arctic wind into a new dps skill, and allow us to single bar the bear and the class will be fixed.

Anyways, they have already stated that they aware of it

ZOS_Wrobel wrote: »

Some of you have noted that you’d like to see more DPS from Magicka Wardens, and we’ll be looking at the DPS across all classes and specs for a future update. We’re also looking into ways to improve the bear in PvP scenarios to prevent him from running everywhere, and also improve how Warden abilities work with animation cancelling.

So chill with the 'it's the pvp crowd fault' narrative, it's simple not true at all.

Link Edited,

It is bloody true.

They can deny it, they can tie it to something else, but it is bloody true, and will forever be bloody true.

Tan9oSuccka · October 2017

I highly recommend observing your bear in Cyrodiil. Especially when trying to attack rock and cliff dancing scrubs.

The bear takes the worst route possible. I was amused at how bad it is.

Tryxus · October 2017

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

I highly recommend observing your bear in Cyrodiil. Especially when trying to attack rock and cliff dancing scrubs.

The bear takes the worst route possible. I was amused at how bad it is.

I

my Bear. Even made a build for it

It's much more useful than what most ppl think

Megabear · October 2017

Kalante wrote: »

warden is low key aids

*aid

Megabear · October 2017

Tryxus wrote: »

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

I highly recommend observing your bear in Cyrodiil. Especially when trying to attack rock and cliff dancing scrubs.

The bear takes the worst route possible. I was amused at how bad it is.

I my Bear. Even made a build for it It's much more useful than what most ppl think

Thank you.

dodgehopper_ESO · October 2017

I enjoy Warden as well. I'm finding the Magden build can do passingly decent DPS but my favorite build with it so far involves rolling multiple DoT's. This can output better damage vs. meaner enemies and vs. squishy opponents the dps is not as good. I find its very fun to play though and I enjoy the animations. At present it is my favorite Class overall. I wouldn't say it has my strongest characters but I just find it a joy. Templar on the other hand has been changed so much I barely recognize it and find it extremely frustrating to play.