The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
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• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 29
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Momentum moved to FG (DISCUSSION)
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GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DocFrost72 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Oh ye Zos.
Where is the variety? Every stamClass has to slot 2h for Momentum.
Where is the play as you want? I want to play without 2h. Am I limited only to overland contect with this handicapped build? @ZOS_GinaBruno
You do know that outside of PVP no one uses 2h right? If you took a two-hander build into a vet trial you'd be laughed out.
Like, trials, maelstrom, vet dungeons, it's all DW & bow.
https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-sorcerer-2h-build-pve/
I'm biting my tongue to keep it civil
Short response: 2h has fantastic cleave damage on a class already renowned for it, and it's survivability with brawler and surge is absolutely amazing.
Now show me 1vX videos and 1v1 videos of all stamclasses using DW/BOW. And I will admit that there is play as you want.
@Tannus15 maybe you can provide such evidence for play as you want as any stamClassEdited by GeorgeBlack on October 23, 2017 1:22AM0 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »Absolutely no. There are compromises in place that make sense.
The recent changes in limiting armor skills to their respective armor type is a very good direction for this game.
Moving utility skills from weapon trees to make up for changes like the one above is an excuse for the lack of will to compromise.
Remove Entropy from Mages Guild then to be in line with the direction of the armor changes. Answer that.
Entropy has nothing to do with the armor changes. It provides Major Sorcery. I'm guessing you are salty because FG still does not offer Major Brutality?
I would not be opposed to FG getting Major Brutality - but not in the form of Forward Momentum.
By the way, moving Entropy to either the destruction staff or restoration staff skill lines would not be as punishing as you want it to be for magicka players. Nice try though.
Ofcourse it wouldn't be as punishing. Thank you for showing us your agenda. A magika player that wants to prohibit fun options for stamina. Thank you for proving me right.
Entropy has nothing to do with the armor changes? And how does Momentum relate to that? Wasn't this your standing point of your arguement? You are losing the plot here furthering my point that you have bullcrap prete d arguements to cover up your ulterior motive, which you just showed to us with the "nice try" remark.
Entropy provides maj sorc +heal over time. Fixed it for you.
My agenda? I don't have one. I simply disagree that a snare removal tool (Forward Momentum) should be so easily available without compromise. It's good where it is right now.
Me discussing the armor changes holds relevance to Forward Momentum because it provides snare removal to heavy armor users now that they cannot use Shuffle anymore (and has a compromise).
Thank you for clarifying that Entropy provides a heal. I almost forgot about that OP heal - clearly that is the reason it is slotted. I won't derail this thread discussing Entropy though. Nice try though.
Edit: Consider one more thing: Moving Forward Momentum to FG also opens it up to magicka players. That's scary enough.Edited by brandonv516 on October 23, 2017 1:25AM1 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »Absolutely no. There are compromises in place that make sense.
The recent changes in limiting armor skills to their respective armor type is a very good direction for this game.
Moving utility skills from weapon trees to make up for changes like the one above is an excuse for the lack of will to compromise.
Remove Entropy from Mages Guild then to be in line with the direction of the armor changes. Answer that.
Entropy has nothing to do with the armor changes. It provides Major Sorcery. I'm guessing you are salty because FG still does not offer Major Brutality?
I would not be opposed to FG getting Major Brutality - but not in the form of Forward Momentum.
By the way, moving Entropy to either the destruction staff or restoration staff skill lines would not be as punishing as you want it to be for magicka players. Nice try though.
Ofcourse it wouldn't be as punishing. Thank you for showing us your agenda. A magika player that wants to prohibit fun options for stamina. Thank you for proving me right.
Entropy has nothing to do with the armor changes? And how does Momentum relate to that? Wasn't this your standing point of your arguement? You are losing the plot here furthering my point that you have bullcrap prete d arguements to cover up your ulterior motive, which you just showed to us with the "nice try" remark.
Entropy provides maj sorc +heal over time. Fixed it for you.
My agenda? I don't have one. I simply disagree that a snare removal tool (Forward Momentum) should be so easily available without compromise. It's good where it is right now.
Me discussing the armor changes holds relevance to Forward Momentum because it provides snare removal to heavy armor users now that they cannot use Shuffle anymore (and has a compromise).
Thank you for clarifying that Entropy provides a heal. I almost forgot about that OP heal - clearly that is the reason it is slotted. I won't derail this thread discussing Entropy though. Nice try though.
Nothing new. Bs arguements. Typical "stam is fine as it is. No improvements required."Edited by GeorgeBlack on October 23, 2017 1:24AM1 -
DocFrost72✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »DocFrost72 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Oh ye Zos.
Where is the variety? Every stamClass has to slot 2h for Momentum.
Where is the play as you want? I want to play without 2h. Am I limited only to overland contect with this handicapped build? @ZOS_GinaBruno
You do know that outside of PVP no one uses 2h right? If you took a two-hander build into a vet trial you'd be laughed out.
Like, trials, maelstrom, vet dungeons, it's all DW & bow.
https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-sorcerer-2h-build-pve/
I'm biting my tongue to keep it civil
Short response: 2h has fantastic cleave damage on a class already renowned for it, and it's survivability with brawler and surge is absolutely amazing.
Now show me 1vX videos and 1v1 videos of all stamclasses using DW/BOW. And I will admit that there is play as you want.
@Tannus15 maybe you can provide such evidence for play as you want as any stamClass
I'll show you any video you like of you can show me where in my post I claimed
A ) Stam classes with dw and bow could 1vX
B ) I believe you can play as you want.
Cause if you got either of those two points out of my post, I'm going to need a really good explanation how. Did you quote the wrong person? Lol.Edited by DocFrost72 on October 23, 2017 1:25AM1 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭kyle.wilson wrote: »This has been mentioned before.
And no it shouldn't be done.
Stop looking for a way to avoid pvp to get vigor.
Why would one think it? Vigor is much easy to get... I have it on every character... I didn't even thought about it... Lol
Because it's the only stamina heal available other than Momentum?I would be very pleased with this change that would allow me to play with Stam dk using sword and board in medium armor in PvP without depending on heavy.
And other option would be dual wield a d bow on nightblade, I really prefer to use dual over two handed, and the need of rally is what make us use two handed to have the heal and wd buff.
Wait what? Stam DK has easy access to major brutality, and you've got vigor, pots and green dragon blood, why do you need rally?
So you want major brutality on your bow/bow sniper.
Just use pots.
how about we don't take away the main feature of two-handed skill line just so your bow/bow niche build doesn't have to use pots.
I mean, wouldn't it just make more sense to ask for silver bolts to get a morph which adds major brutality, like daggers on the DW line?
You talk like green dragon blood is a strong spell. kek.1 -
Vesper_BR✭✭✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »kyle.wilson wrote: »This has been mentioned before.
And no it shouldn't be done.
Stop looking for a way to avoid pvp to get vigor.
Why would one think it? Vigor is much easy to get... I have it on every character... I didn't even thought about it... Lol
Because it's the only stamina heal available other than Momentum?I would be very pleased with this change that would allow me to play with Stam dk using sword and board in medium armor in PvP without depending on heavy.
And other option would be dual wield a d bow on nightblade, I really prefer to use dual over two handed, and the need of rally is what make us use two handed to have the heal and wd buff.
Wait what? Stam DK has easy access to major brutality, and you've got vigor, pots and green dragon blood, why do you need rally?
So you want major brutality on your bow/bow sniper.
Just use pots.
how about we don't take away the main feature of two-handed skill line just so your bow/bow niche build doesn't have to use pots.
I mean, wouldn't it just make more sense to ask for silver bolts to get a morph which adds major brutality, like daggers on the DW line?
You talk like green dragon blood is a strong spell. kek.
Every person that claims gdb in theirs argument know nothing of dks...
Let's play with other classes instead of just assuming things.... When I say some of my opinions I'm talking because even having a dk as my main with more than 4k hours of gameplay, I've played and still play well enough with other classes... Yesterday I was trying my stam sorc in medium armor... Even before the changes he is a beast in cirodill and vma.
VESPER BR - MAGICKA DRAGONKNIGHT - GRAND OVERLORD + FLAWLESS CONQUEROR (1070 CP / 01-01-2018)
XBOX ONE - NA - EBONHEART PACT BRASIL1 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »Absolutely no. There are compromises in place that make sense.
The recent changes in limiting armor skills to their respective armor type is a very good direction for this game.
Moving utility skills from weapon trees to make up for changes like the one above is an excuse for the lack of will to compromise.
Remove Entropy from Mages Guild then to be in line with the direction of the armor changes. Answer that.
Entropy has nothing to do with the armor changes. It provides Major Sorcery. I'm guessing you are salty because FG still does not offer Major Brutality?
I would not be opposed to FG getting Major Brutality - but not in the form of Forward Momentum.
By the way, moving Entropy to either the destruction staff or restoration staff skill lines would not be as punishing as you want it to be for magicka players. Nice try though.
Ofcourse it wouldn't be as punishing. Thank you for showing us your agenda. A magika player that wants to prohibit fun options for stamina. Thank you for proving me right.
Entropy has nothing to do with the armor changes? And how does Momentum relate to that? Wasn't this your standing point of your arguement? You are losing the plot here furthering my point that you have bullcrap prete d arguements to cover up your ulterior motive, which you just showed to us with the "nice try" remark.
Entropy provides maj sorc +heal over time. Fixed it for you.
My agenda? I don't have one. I simply disagree that a snare removal tool (Forward Momentum) should be so easily available without compromise. It's good where it is right now.
Me discussing the armor changes holds relevance to Forward Momentum because it provides snare removal to heavy armor users now that they cannot use Shuffle anymore (and has a compromise).
Thank you for clarifying that Entropy provides a heal. I almost forgot about that OP heal - clearly that is the reason it is slotted. I won't derail this thread discussing Entropy though. Nice try though.
Nothing new. Bs arguements. Typical "stam is fine as it is. No improvements required."
You should probably read the section I edited at the bottom about Forward Momentum going to a skill line that benefits magicka players too.
Give my destro/resto magicka NB access to cheap snare removal/immunity and I don't need to crutch on vampire. Add what I have already in major evasion/expedition, shields, cloak, heals, etc.
Yes I definitely have an agenda.Edited by brandonv516 on October 23, 2017 1:38AM0 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DocFrost72 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »DocFrost72 wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Oh ye Zos.
Where is the variety? Every stamClass has to slot 2h for Momentum.
Where is the play as you want? I want to play without 2h. Am I limited only to overland contect with this handicapped build? @ZOS_GinaBruno
You do know that outside of PVP no one uses 2h right? If you took a two-hander build into a vet trial you'd be laughed out.
Like, trials, maelstrom, vet dungeons, it's all DW & bow.
https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-sorcerer-2h-build-pve/
I'm biting my tongue to keep it civil
Short response: 2h has fantastic cleave damage on a class already renowned for it, and it's survivability with brawler and surge is absolutely amazing.
Now show me 1vX videos and 1v1 videos of all stamclasses using DW/BOW. And I will admit that there is play as you want.
@Tannus15 maybe you can provide such evidence for play as you want as any stamClass
I'll show you any video you like of you can show me where in my post I claimed
A ) Stam classes with dw and bow could 1vX
B ) I believe you can play as you want.
Cause if you got either of those two points out of my post, I'm going to need a really good explanation how. Did you quote the wrong person? Lol.
Meh.. I'm not arguing with you. I'm furthering you point and mine....0 -
Tannus15✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »kyle.wilson wrote: »This has been mentioned before.
And no it shouldn't be done.
Stop looking for a way to avoid pvp to get vigor.
Why would one think it? Vigor is much easy to get... I have it on every character... I didn't even thought about it... Lol
Because it's the only stamina heal available other than Momentum?I would be very pleased with this change that would allow me to play with Stam dk using sword and board in medium armor in PvP without depending on heavy.
And other option would be dual wield a d bow on nightblade, I really prefer to use dual over two handed, and the need of rally is what make us use two handed to have the heal and wd buff.
Wait what? Stam DK has easy access to major brutality, and you've got vigor, pots and green dragon blood, why do you need rally?
So you want major brutality on your bow/bow sniper.
Just use pots.
how about we don't take away the main feature of two-handed skill line just so your bow/bow niche build doesn't have to use pots.
I mean, wouldn't it just make more sense to ask for silver bolts to get a morph which adds major brutality, like daggers on the DW line?
You talk like green dragon blood is a strong spell. kek.
Every person that claims gdb in theirs argument know nothing of dks...
Let's play with other classes instead of just assuming things.... When I say some of my opinions I'm talking because even having a dk as my main with more than 4k hours of gameplay, I've played and still play well enough with other classes... Yesterday I was trying my stam sorc in medium armor... Even before the changes he is a beast in cirodill and vma.
So you should change you OP to be for PVP only, since you're only interested in discussing this in a PVP context.
you want a discussion, and you got a discussion and then you have basically turned around and said "yeah, whatever PVE people, we're only talking PVP here."0 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Oh ye Zos.
Where is the variety? Every stamClass has to slot 2h for Momentum.
Where is the play as you want? I want to play without 2h. Am I limited only to overland contect with this handicapped build? @ZOS_GinaBruno
You do know that outside of PVP no one uses 2h right? If you took a two-hander build into a vet trial you'd be laughed out.
Like, trials, maelstrom, vet dungeons, it's all DW & bow.
The idea that DW is for PvE and 2h is for PvP is stupid. And those that proclaim it either have a vested interest or are not intelligent enough to understand how silly what they say is and how bad for the game these limitations are. I bet that they have an ulterior motive
"Everyone who doesn´t agree with me a plotting against me".......0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I´ve brought this up before - imo the only skill that could be traded would be trap.
That however would be a situation most would not be happy with (imo).<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Yesterday I was trying my stam sorc in medium armor... Even before the changes he is a beast in cirodill and vma.Ragnarock41 wrote: »kyle.wilson wrote: »This has been mentioned before.
And no it shouldn't be done.
Stop looking for a way to avoid pvp to get vigor.
Why would one think it? Vigor is much easy to get... I have it on every character... I didn't even thought about it... Lol
Because it's the only stamina heal available other than Momentum?I would be very pleased with this change that would allow me to play with Stam dk using sword and board in medium armor in PvP without depending on heavy.
And other option would be dual wield a d bow on nightblade, I really prefer to use dual over two handed, and the need of rally is what make us use two handed to have the heal and wd buff.
Wait what? Stam DK has easy access to major brutality, and you've got vigor, pots and green dragon blood, why do you need rally?
So you want major brutality on your bow/bow sniper.
Just use pots.
how about we don't take away the main feature of two-handed skill line just so your bow/bow niche build doesn't have to use pots.
I mean, wouldn't it just make more sense to ask for silver bolts to get a morph which adds major brutality, like daggers on the DW line?
You talk like green dragon blood is a strong spell. kek.
What changes were made to benefit stam sorcs?
Edited by Chilly-McFreeze on October 23, 2017 6:28AM0 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No thanks. While I agree that it isn’t right for stam builds in pvp to be pidgeonholed into running 2h for the heal, this is not the solution. The solution is to implement class based stamina healing, and better major brutality sources via skill lines.
On an unrelated note, you never mentioned what would replace Momentum in the 2h line. Typically when one is proposing an idea, they think everything through and find a quantifying replacement.Edited by templesus on October 23, 2017 7:37AM1 -
Vesper_BR✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
Yesterday I was trying my stam sorc in medium armor... Even before the changes he is a beast in cirodill and vma.Ragnarock41 wrote: »kyle.wilson wrote: »This has been mentioned before.
And no it shouldn't be done.
Stop looking for a way to avoid pvp to get vigor.
Why would one think it? Vigor is much easy to get... I have it on every character... I didn't even thought about it... Lol
Because it's the only stamina heal available other than Momentum?I would be very pleased with this change that would allow me to play with Stam dk using sword and board in medium armor in PvP without depending on heavy.
And other option would be dual wield a d bow on nightblade, I really prefer to use dual over two handed, and the need of rally is what make us use two handed to have the heal and wd buff.
Wait what? Stam DK has easy access to major brutality, and you've got vigor, pots and green dragon blood, why do you need rally?
So you want major brutality on your bow/bow sniper.
Just use pots.
how about we don't take away the main feature of two-handed skill line just so your bow/bow niche build doesn't have to use pots.
I mean, wouldn't it just make more sense to ask for silver bolts to get a morph which adds major brutality, like daggers on the DW line?
You talk like green dragon blood is a strong spell. kek.
What changes were made to benefit stam sorcs?
No changes will be made to benefit Stam sorcs i think, but since heavy armor will be nerfed, medium armor will be more competitive than it's now (notice that I haven't said it will be better)...
VESPER BR - MAGICKA DRAGONKNIGHT - GRAND OVERLORD + FLAWLESS CONQUEROR (1070 CP / 01-01-2018)
XBOX ONE - NA - EBONHEART PACT BRASIL1 -
Ocelot9x✭✭✭✭kyle.wilson wrote: »This has been mentioned before.
And no it shouldn't be done.
Stop looking for a way to avoid pvp to get vigor.
Why would one think it? Vigor is much easy to get... I have it on every character... I didn't even thought about it... Lol
Because it's the only stamina heal available other than Momentum?I would be very pleased with this change that would allow me to play with Stam dk using sword and board in medium armor in PvP without depending on heavy.
And other option would be dual wield a d bow on nightblade, I really prefer to use dual over two handed, and the need of rally is what make us use two handed to have the heal and wd buff.
Wait what? Stam DK has easy access to major brutality, and you've got vigor, pots and green dragon blood, why do you need rally?
So you want major brutality on your bow/bow sniper.
Just use pots.
how about we don't take away the main feature of two-handed skill line just so your bow/bow niche build doesn't have to use pots.
I mean, wouldn't it just make more sense to ask for silver bolts to get a morph which adds major brutality, like daggers on the DW line?
Gdb heals for 2k and cost 4k mag good luck using that on a stam dk1