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Stamina in not as good as magic in PvP
Vireys
✭
I was shocked when i understood that when i play stamina based character i will drain my most important resource all the time when im running and trying to catch someone in PvP. Magic users dont use up magica when running so that puts us to uneven starting postition if i have to chase down a magic user.
I have depleted a lot of my most valuable resource (stam) while he has not drained his most valuable resource (magica) at all, so if i have to chase the fight starts me at say 60% and he at 100% resources. Another scenario is that if i begin to fail killing this magic user and try to start run away i dont have any stamina to run away now. He in the otherhand has a full stamina bar to make an escape again if he feels too pressured.
So my question is this:
Is there somekind of mechanism that evens the playfield. Excample: stamina regenerates 4 x faster than magica or stamina based skills makes alot more DMG ?
If there is no mechanism then could someone please explain why would anyone make other than magic based characters for PvP?
2
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CyrusArya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It’s a double edged sword. Break free, roll dodge, and blocking cost stamina and are essential to PvP. Another way to look at it is, as a stamina build you can execute these core functions with your main resource pool. A stamina build out of magicka is still ok, a magicka build out of stamina however is dead on the next stun.
An argument can be made that medium armor is weaker than light armor. But stamina is not explicitly weaker than magicka, in my experience.14 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Don't Sprint. Use a gap closer. Speed pots. Laugh at those running from your terrible visage while they reevaluate their life choicesTl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.4 -
NyassaV✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Your title is correct... But flawed reasoning. Magicka can outheal a lot of damage done. And there are so many skills that can't be bodge it put stam in a bad place. With the death of viper (Stam's crutch) it's hard to effectively be a stamina user outside of hit and run tacticsFlawless Conqueror ~ Grand OverlordShe/Her ~ PC/NA | I record things for fun and for info3 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You're doing exactly what they want. They make you chase to drain your Stam.
Speed pots, gap closer, or don't chase. Fight on your terms not theirs.6 -
CavalryPK✭✭✭✭✭As a magblade. I find this post hilarious!THE CAVELRY HAS ARRIVED! Cav is a professional magblade, (in his not so professional opinion). He is immortal and is fighting for the Pact since 2E 572, amidst the turmoil of the Second Akaviri Invasion. He protects the provinces of Skyrim, Morrowind and Black Marsh.
Check out his PVP YouTube channel !
https://youtube.com/TheCavalryPK4 -
Vireys✭
Oh so i need to spend one of my 5 skilslots for cap closer? Does magica users have this handicap too? I dont think they do.
Oh so i need to buy and pop speedpotions for 30sec CD instead of other potions such as +power potions. I guess magic users have to pop these speed potions too or are they free to use +critt +powere etc potions? I think that is the case.
Also someone said that "Dont chase down players in PvP " Excuse me? Is it so that magic users cant chase down players or is this something that stam users only have to wach out for? I think it is.
I thought that some stam users would of want to take this issue under conversation but the concensus seems "Its ok that we loose 1 skill slot, or HAVE to use speedpots instead of something more usefull and we must not chase down players in PvP, its cool for us bro".
Luckily i have the extra 15€ to spend for race change, this thread just made it clear for me that magic users are clearly in much better spot.
Was hoping to see something like:" No man we stam users have much greater regen/pool, or we do more damage once we chase them down it skills scale better for stamina etc".
But seems you guys are happy and after race change im happy so everyones happy !
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Hutch679✭✭✭✭✭
✭I play a magic class, I hardly use sprint. Out if stamina means dead in pvp. If your a stamina character, honestly you should not really be sprinting either. So there are some flaws in your thinking here. Additionally, most stamina skills cost less than magicka skills. Stamina characters get to use shuffle through medium armor in next patch, no one else can. There no mag weapon execute skills, both dw and 2h have executes. There is very much a give and take. I wouldn't necessarily say one is absolutely better than the other, only in certain situations and matchups.0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Oh so i need to spend one of my 5 skilslots for cap closer? Does magica users have this handicap too? I dont think they do.
Oh so i need to buy and pop speedpotions for 30sec CD instead of other potions such as +power potions. I guess magic users have to pop these speed potions too or are they free to use +critt +powere etc potions? I think that is the case.
Also someone said that "Dont chase down players in PvP " Excuse me? Is it so that magic users cant chase down players or is this something that stam users only have to wach out for? I think it is.
I thought that some stam users would of want to take this issue under conversation but the concensus seems "Its ok that we loose 1 skill slot, or HAVE to use speedpots instead of something more usefull and we must not chase down players in PvP, its cool for us bro".
Luckily i have the extra 15€ to spend for race change, this thread just made it clear for me that magic users are clearly in much better spot.
Was hoping to see something like:" No man we stam users have much greater regen/pool, or we do more damage once we chase them down it skills scale better for stamina etc".
But seems you guys are happy and after race change im happy so everyones happy !
First a gap closer is an advantage, not a loss. Snare, independent of debuff movements, DMG... if you can have a gap closer you should.
Speed potion + lingering health is extremely strong, if you need potions consistently for resource management your build is suboptimal
I don't chase because I know I'm purposely setting myself up for a disadvantage, I will control as many aspects of combat as I can.
Magicka is powerful, there are pros and cons to each0 -
SanTii.92✭✭✭✭✭
✭Why are you asking questions on your thread yet you title as if you know what you state is a fact?When the snows fall and the white winds blow,
the lone wolf dies, but the pack survives.
Arg | Pc Na | Factionless Mag Warden.3 -
Zvorgin✭✭✭✭✭Oh so i need to spend one of my 5 skilslots for cap closer? Does magica users have this handicap too? I dont think they do.
Oh so i need to buy and pop speedpotions for 30sec CD instead of other potions such as +power potions. I guess magic users have to pop these speed potions too or are they free to use +critt +powere etc potions? I think that is the case.
Also someone said that "Dont chase down players in PvP " Excuse me? Is it so that magic users cant chase down players or is this something that stam users only have to wach out for? I think it is.
I thought that some stam users would of want to take this issue under conversation but the concensus seems "Its ok that we loose 1 skill slot, or HAVE to use speedpots instead of something more usefull and we must not chase down players in PvP, its cool for us bro".
MagDK don't have speed or gap closer so stop complaining. This thread is nonsense.0 -
Lexxypwns✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Stam is always your most important resource, wether you're magika or stamina based. Once you correct the logical flaws in your thinking then you'll see that you're actually making an arguement for stamina being stronger than magika in PVP since you have the freedom to roll dodge, sprint for 3 seconds, and still have 30k stam left whereas a magika build will be 1 hard CC from death in that situationEdited by Lexxypwns on October 11, 2017 7:48PM4 -
Hutch679✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lol funny complaining magicka is so much better, yet you choooose to play as stamina. Why not just switch to magicka instead of complaining about it?0 -
Vireys✭I play a magic class, I hardly use sprint. Out if stamina means dead in pvp. If your a stamina character, honestly you should not really be sprinting either. So there are some flaws in your thinking here.
I think youre thinking is flawed, youre basically saying that as a stam based char i should not use SPRINT
. And you dont find that outrageous/unfair is beyond me .
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Lexxypwns✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I play a magic class, I hardly use sprint. Out if stamina means dead in pvp. If your a stamina character, honestly you should not really be sprinting either. So there are some flaws in your thinking here.
I think youre thinking is flawed, youre basically saying that as a stam based char i should not use SPRINT. And you dont find that outrageous/unfair is beyond me .
Actually, as a stam build you can use sprint, as a magika build using sprint is basically suicide5 -
Chakei✭✭✭These things are in the game for a reason. Resource management is an issue for both stam and magicka. As a magicka user, my stam pool is very small, so my break free/roll dodge/sprint ability is very limited. I have to either run a set like Shacklebreaker or use pots to compensate for this. I'm not sure why you're so dismissive of the suggestions given here, OP.1 -
Vireys✭Waffennacht wrote: »
First a gap closer is an advantage, not a loss. Snare, independent of debuff movements, DMG... if you can have a gap closer you should.
No its not. Forced capcloser is a disadvantage if it hinders my freedom to choose my skillset since 1 is taking for allready. Maybe i use frost based attacks and have snare allready etc. Maybe i need some good old CC .Speed potion + lingering health is extremely strong, if you need potions consistently for resource management your build is suboptimal
If its so powerfull why wont mag users use it? Its because theyre heals are allready powerfull because of +mag so the dont need the lingering. Allso +spellDMG +critt is better if i dont need movespeed because i can spam my stamina pool for running.I don't chase because I know I'm purposely setting myself up for a disadvantage, I will control as many aspects of combat as I can.
Magicka is powerful, there are pros and cons to each
I will chase i wont let that little snot nose get away from me when im so close killing it... I chase and now as magic user it wont hinder my abilities at all. Ill pop a +spell dmg +Critt potion when you pop some run speed (wich still drains stam ofc) .
Magica is powerfull and....well its more powerfull than stamina cause running/blocking wont use up my most important resource pool, allso magica makes my heals sick! Dont need no lingering health pots lol.
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CavalryPK✭✭✭✭✭I play a magic class, I hardly use sprint. Out if stamina means dead in pvp. If your a stamina character, honestly you should not really be sprinting either. So there are some flaws in your thinking here.
I think youre thinking is flawed, youre basically saying that as a stam based char i should not use SPRINT. And you dont find that outrageous/unfair is beyond me .
Actually, as a stam build you can use sprint, as a magika build using sprint is basically suicide
^THE CAVELRY HAS ARRIVED! Cav is a professional magblade, (in his not so professional opinion). He is immortal and is fighting for the Pact since 2E 572, amidst the turmoil of the Second Akaviri Invasion. He protects the provinces of Skyrim, Morrowind and Black Marsh.
Check out his PVP YouTube channel !
https://youtube.com/TheCavalryPK0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
First a gap closer is an advantage, not a loss. Snare, independent of debuff movements, DMG... if you can have a gap closer you should.
No its not. Forced capcloser is a disadvantage if it hinders my freedom to choose my skillset since 1 is taking for allready. Maybe i use frost based attacks and have snare allready etc. Maybe i need some good old CC .Speed potion + lingering health is extremely strong, if you need potions consistently for resource management your build is suboptimal
If its so powerfull why wont mag users use it? Its because theyre heals are allready powerfull because of +mag so the dont need the lingering. Allso +spellDMG +critt is better if i dont need movespeed because i can spam my stamina pool for running.I don't chase because I know I'm purposely setting myself up for a disadvantage, I will control as many aspects of combat as I can.
Magicka is powerful, there are pros and cons to each
I will chase i wont let that little snot nose get away from me when im so close killing it... I chase and now as magic user it wont hinder my abilities at all. Ill pop a +spell dmg +Critt potion when you pop some run speed (wich still drains stam ofc) .
Magica is powerfull and....well its more powerfull than stamina cause running/blocking wont use up my most important resource pool, allso magica makes my heals sick! Dont need no lingering health pots lol.
I used those lingering health speed pots. They proc transmutation and give my magplar major expedition without having to use vampire for mist form.
Power pots are only a means to complete a build if you want to remove major DMG buffs off your bars. But stamina have access to a burst heal and major brutality in one spell from 2h. Dual weld also gives that DMG buff in a ranged snare.
Gap closers are strong. Just because they put you in a loading screen sometimes doesn't mean they are useless. And think of it this way, 2h and s +b both give you reliable gap closers which are generally not used by mag builds.
If you don't want to use speed pots, use bow on backbar. Dodge rolling on your bow bar gives you major expedition without having to slot extra potions. Plus medium armor can get more speed through those passives. And dual weld has access to a PBAOE that passively hits players around you plus gives you 25% mitigation on all AOE DMG to you.
I'm convinced that stamina mobilty is stronger than mag mobilty. Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
Lexxypwns✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
First a gap closer is an advantage, not a loss. Snare, independent of debuff movements, DMG... if you can have a gap closer you should.
No its not. Forced capcloser is a disadvantage if it hinders my freedom to choose my skillset since 1 is taking for allready. Maybe i use frost based attacks and have snare allready etc. Maybe i need some good old CC .Speed potion + lingering health is extremely strong, if you need potions consistently for resource management your build is suboptimal
If its so powerfull why wont mag users use it? Its because theyre heals are allready powerfull because of +mag so the dont need the lingering. Allso +spellDMG +critt is better if i dont need movespeed because i can spam my stamina pool for running.I don't chase because I know I'm purposely setting myself up for a disadvantage, I will control as many aspects of combat as I can.
Magicka is powerful, there are pros and cons to each
I will chase i wont let that little snot nose get away from me when im so close killing it... I chase and now as magic user it wont hinder my abilities at all. Ill pop a +spell dmg +Critt potion when you pop some run speed (wich still drains stam ofc) .
Magica is powerfull and....well its more powerfull than stamina cause running/blocking wont use up my most important resource pool, allso magica makes my heals sick! Dont need no lingering health pots lol.
I used those lingering health speed pots. They proc transmutation and give my magplar major expedition without having to use vampire for mist form.
Power pots are only a means to complete a build if you want to remove major DMG buffs off your bars. But stamina have access to a burst heal and major brutality in one spell from 2h. Dual weld also gives that DMG buff in a ranged snare.
Gap closers are strong. Just because they put you in a loading screen sometimes doesn't mean they are useless. And think of it this way, 2h and s +b both give you reliable gap closers which are generally not used by mag builds.
If you don't want to use speed pots, use bow on backbar. Dodge rolling on your bow bar gives you major expedition without having to slot extra potions. Plus medium armor can get more speed through those passives. And dual weld has access to a PBAOE that passively hits players around you plus gives you 25% mitigation on all AOE DMG to you.
I'm convinced that stamina mobilty is stronger than mag mobilty.
He couldn't be more wrong. Literally speed+lingering health pots are so good that its worth running on every spec. Sure magika has superior burst heals, but the less you need to use them the longer your offensive window is. This is PVP 101 and I can't believe such a long time player like him would even begin to carry on with these falsehoods.
Magika is currently superior to stam, yes. However, its not for any of the reasons anyone here has listed.2 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Not sure if the OP is trolling.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.2 -
GrigorijMalahevich✭✭✭✭✭I was shocked when i understood that when i play stamina based character i will drain my most important resource all the time when im running and trying to catch someone in PvP. Magic users dont use up magica when running so that puts us to uneven starting postition if i have to chase down a magic user.
I have depleted a lot of my most valuable resource (stam) while he has not drained his most valuable resource (magica) at all, so if i have to chase the fight starts me at say 60% and he at 100% resources. Another scenario is that if i begin to fail killing this magic user and try to start run away i dont have any stamina to run away now. He in the otherhand has a full stamina bar to make an escape again if he feels too pressured.
So my question is this:
Is there somekind of mechanism that evens the playfield. Excample: stamina regenerates 4 x faster than magica or stamina based skills makes alot more DMG ?
If there is no mechanism then could someone please explain why would anyone make other than magic based characters for PvP?
Honestly, get gud...
What do you think magic users use to run? Magic? Really? Only sorc has streak, but they can't keep spamming it. Sprint on stamina character is cheaper...
Any stam class has a gap closer which will never allow any magica class to get away from you.
Not all classes have decent escapes, but you probably are a stamdk and you shouldn't complain from a positionof strongest 1x1 class in openworld...PC/EU 800 CP.
PvP MagSorc.Pedro Gonzales - Mag Sorc EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/CB6j6
Valera Progib - Stam Sorc DC vMA Flawless Conqueror clear https://i.imgur.com/eYgpXG2.png
Valera Pozhar - Mag DK EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/jrsuK
Valera Podlechi - Mag Templar AD vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/N0BYq0 -
Vireys✭Lol funny complaining magicka is so much better, yet you choooose to play as stamina. Why not just switch to magicka instead of complaining about it?
If you would of bothered to read the chain instead of hurrying to post garbage you would know that i have rerolled to mag now and im super happy with it. Next time read things or dont post.0 -
Vireys✭
MagDK don't have speed or gap closer so stop complaining. This thread is nonsense.[/quote]These things are in the game for a reason. Resource management is an issue for both stam and magicka. As a magicka user, my stam pool is very small, so my break free/roll dodge/sprint ability is very limited. I have to either run a set like Shacklebreaker or use pots to compensate for this. I'm not sure why you're so dismissive of the suggestions given here, OP.
I feel they are restricting me too much, but as i have stated im rolling mag now and im super duper happy camper, if youre happy then were happy...
It seems stam peoples are happy doing all these sacrifices (1 skillslot less, *** potions, dont chase down pray) for each of their own. If it makes stam peoples happy its cool, but it sure did not make me happy when i was stam based.
I popped 15€ problim solved /thread.0 -
KRBMMO✭✭✭✭I was shocked when i understood that when i play stamina based character i will drain my most important resource all the time when im running and trying to catch someone in PvP. Magic users dont use up magica when running so that puts us to uneven starting postition if i have to chase down a magic user.
I have depleted a lot of my most valuable resource (stam) while he has not drained his most valuable resource (magica) at all, so if i have to chase the fight starts me at say 60% and he at 100% resources. Another scenario is that if i begin to fail killing this magic user and try to start run away i dont have any stamina to run away now. He in the otherhand has a full stamina bar to make an escape again if he feels too pressured.
So my question is this:
Is there somekind of mechanism that evens the playfield. Excample: stamina regenerates 4 x faster than magica or stamina based skills makes alot more DMG ?
If there is no mechanism then could someone please explain why would anyone make other than magic based characters for PvP?
If you are Stam NB you have steath that uses Magika
If you are Stam sorc you have streak that uses Magica
If you are Stam DK you have that rock shield thing and others
If you are a Stam Templar you have BOL and tons others
YES - USE GAP CLOSERS! I NEVER RUN on my Stam TOONS. Running is for sheep. You are playing like a sheep.
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Vireys✭Sure magika has superior burst heals, but the less you need to use them the longer your offensive window is. This is PVP 101 and I can't believe such a long time player ...
Magica has better sustain heals too, not just burst.
All heals since they scale off from magica+spell dmg. It takes me 3 x clobal CD´s to drop a field of love + HoT for me wich will feed me lots of health wich widens my windows to do DMG. Also i can let my HP dip lower since i know i can burst it back up with powerfull heals.
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Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sure magika has superior burst heals, but the less you need to use them the longer your offensive window is. This is PVP 101 and I can't believe such a long time player ...
Magica has better sustain heals too, not just burst.
All heals since they scale off from magica+spell dmg. It takes me 3 x clobal CD´s to drop a field of love + HoT for me wich will feed me lots of health wich widens my windows to do DMG. Also i can let my HP dip lower since i know i can burst it back up with powerfull heals.
Do you have Vigor unlocked?
Do you use Rally/Forward Momentum?
I am happy you prefer magicka and have something you enjoy. I suspect it's more of a style difference than blaming stamina.
I'm guessing you were in Medium armor? Medium has its own set of issues ATM0 -
Zer0oo✭✭✭✭✭
✭Since you are new on the forum i tell you the most important thing here:L2P
- Update 23Ice Furnace: This item set now grants Spell Damage, rather than Weapon Damage for the 4 piece bonus1
