How can you say CP is better than no CP, or vice versa?

fred4 · September 2017

My magblade usually plays in CP. Today I ventured into no CP, as I do occasionally. No issues with sustain, since my build is pretty well sorted with only slight adjustments.

My build is a burst build that does not rely on DOTs nor procs. What I noticed, again, was that procs overperform. I first had a protracted, enjoyable duel with a CP910 sorc, which I won (I am CP876 fwiw). I then faced two nightblades, one mag, one stam. The magblade used Skoria. In CP, while strong, I am not too fussed by that set, but here it was devastating. It hit for 4.5K, the same as the (non-crit) Assassin's Scourge from the other nightblade. When Skoria hits for a comparable amount, there is something seriously wrong, in my opinion. The stamblade used all manner of procs and poisons, including bleeds, lingering poisons, Viper, and the Infused Oblivion damage enchant, which all procd simultaneously on me. I lost both of those fights rather quickly.

My build originates in CP. I use shields, which are known to be less effective in no CP, although they were fine against the sorcs I faced (there were two, actually). It's clear that my build is simply not adjusted for no CP, that I should probably get Skoria in a hurry, and change the philosophy of how my build was put together. That sucks. As far as I can tell no CP is just different.

ZOS, please make up your mind whether you want us to PvP with CP, or without CP. I meet people from both camps, and from all I can gather they simply like playing what they're used to and what they have built towards. It took me months to fine tune my build. I am not going to do the same for no CP.

This would be fine, I guess, if you could choose what mode you want to play in, but there is Battlegrounds. First only no CP, for God knows what reason, ZOS are about to make them only CP enabled. With things standing as they are, both choices are equally stupid. As long as you have no CP campaigns, you should also provide no CP Battlegrounds and no CP duels in addition to the CP options. Just my opinion.

Morgul667 · September 2017

I love non CP

geonsocal · September 2017

CP is better than no CP...no CP is better than CP...

not so hard...

i enjoyed that no cp week we had earlier this year (I think that's when it was)...

people died (including myself) really fast...

I enjoyed battlegrounds much less...sure, some of that included having to switch up character set ups between cp pvp and no cp pvp...and, some of it included sustain issues...

needless to say - it's easier to build for cp...easy = better for more casual players...

VaranisArano · September 2017

For me, it comes down to personal preference. Everyone has something they like better. I prefer CP, but that's because my PVP toon is my main toon for everything. She's built for CP in PVE and PVP, and I simply don't care to adjust her gear or stats for the rare times I take her into no-CP content.

That being said, I recognize that people like both types of PVP and I think that ESO would do best to offer both options.

fred4 · September 2017

In addition, on the off-chance that ZOS is listening to this thread, I would be more inclined to explore no CP, from time to time, if I could guest in any campaign. I have recoiled in horror today. The fact that I am now locked into Sotha Sil for 4 days is making me not enter it again, so I can switch back to one of the CP campaigns as soon as possible.

It was possible to enter any campaign with a script command. ZOS, you saw fit to disable that option recently. What was the harm? If you're just intent on p*ssing off certain sections of your player-base, e.g. me

, well, you've done that.

Tigeracer · September 2017

This thread is too neutral! Where is all the name calling and stupid responses?

fred4 · September 2017

VaranisArano wrote: »

For me, it comes down to personal preference. Everyone has something they like better. I prefer CP, but that's because my PVP toon is my main toon for everything. She's built for CP in PVE and PVP, and I simply don't care to adjust her gear or stats for the rare times I take her into no-CP content.

This hits the nail on the head. If you want to play at the highest level, you will have different setups for PvP and PvE, including CP distributions. Players who are seriously into that tyically have multiple toons.

I am more like you. I came from Skyrim, and while I am not a serious role-player, I still think of my characters as people who are on an adventure and want to do a bit of everything. It is partially this attachment to my characters, partially the work involved in re-speccing, and of course my greater interest in PvP that has biased my builds. I have given up on high-end PvE, but I do run the lesser vet dungeons with my characters, and this is indeed one reason that has kept them CP-centric builds.

Minno · September 2017

fred4 wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

For me, it comes down to personal preference. Everyone has something they like better. I prefer CP, but that's because my PVP toon is my main toon for everything. She's built for CP in PVE and PVP, and I simply don't care to adjust her gear or stats for the rare times I take her into no-CP content.

This hits the nail on the head. If you want to play at the highest level, you will have different setups for PvP and PvE, including CP distributions. Players who are seriously into that tyically have multiple toons.

I am more like you. I came from Skyrim, and while I am not a serious role-player, I still think of my characters as people who are on an adventure and want to do a bit of everything. It is partially this attachment to my characters, partially the work involved in re-speccing, and of course my greater interest in PvP that has biased my builds. I have given up on high-end PvE, but I do run the lesser vet dungeons with my characters, and this is indeed one reason that has kept them CP-centric builds.

In CP, you have a little extra help in getting your dmg, mitigation, and cost reduction. This helps in closing the gap between mag/Stam build weaknesses (like break free/block reductions to help mag builds save stamina. Defile star helping health debuffing for builds that have that ability, etc.)

It becomes a chess game, where it depends on mistake due to the longer time in fights. But I do think you need 300-400 CP before you even think about the CP camp; you just won't have the help to tackle some builds out there.

Bam_Bam · September 2017

Just recently changed to Vivec (CP) from Sotha Sil (nonCP) after 3 years on Sotha.

Sotha was a really tough learning curve. The lack of CP forces you to really appreciate the importance of your core build - this has to be really well thought out because you don't have the luxury of topping up your damage, resistances and, more recently especially - your resource recovery.
When I moved over to Vivec, it took me several attempts (check out the numerous threads I've made in tis forum lol) to get my CP set up correctly because they are absolutely just as important as not having them in Sotha.

Personally, I prefer Vivec. 3 years without CP was enough and I needed a change of campaign. I don't regret the move at all and I'm loving finally be able to use my CPs

but, on a side note,

I'm absolutely gutted at the way so many people are leaving PvP (CP or non CP) and Zos need to sit up and do something about it and QUICKLY.

Beardimus · September 2017

Most of the hate either way is just change resistance, as both have merits. People don't like the concept of being less OP however.

And certain build types suffer more in non-CP

HOWEVER the case for keeping BattleGrounds Non-CP is bigger than that, as BG are intended to be fast and furious. Now if a team of 4 can't kill some stupid never die templar tank heal build it will be a dull 15 minutes, and basically like Cyrodiil

Splitting rewards between non-CP and CP could.be one motivation in campaigns perhaps, give people a reason to play both.

geonsocal · September 2017

Tigeracer wrote: »

This thread is too neutral! Where is all the name calling and stupid responses?

what - that has to be the dumbest thing ever written...

you are depriving some village somewhere of an idiot, seriously - you're about as sharp as a marble

Waffennacht · September 2017

Well seeing as BGs will become CP, I'm just going to focus on CP from here on out

There's only one thing that's for no CP, and it's just not worth it to me, especially with how empty that campaign usually is

Drakkdjinn · September 2017

Waffennacht wrote: »

Well seeing as BGs will become CP, I'm just going to focus on CP from here on out

There's only one thing that's for no CP, and it's just not worth it to me, especially with how empty that campaign usually is

Misinformation - NoCP is and has been poppin during primetime consistently. The 7-day camps are all deserts save Shor...sometimes.

fred4 · September 2017

Drakkdjinn wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Well seeing as BGs will become CP, I'm just going to focus on CP from here on out

There's only one thing that's for no CP, and it's just not worth it to me, especially with how empty that campaign usually is

Misinformation - NoCP is and has been poppin during primetime consistently. The 7-day camps are all deserts save Shor...sometimes.

Guys, you have to specify what server you are referring to. I play on PC EU, and Sotha Sil is only slightly behind the population of Vivec. At primtime both tend to be full (only just about, these days). I believe this is different on PC NA.

Waffennacht · September 2017

Xbox, it's on my signature fyi

Drakkdjinn · September 2017

fred4 wrote: »

Drakkdjinn wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Well seeing as BGs will become CP, I'm just going to focus on CP from here on out

There's only one thing that's for no CP, and it's just not worth it to me, especially with how empty that campaign usually is

Misinformation - NoCP is and has been poppin during primetime consistently. The 7-day camps are all deserts save Shor...sometimes.

Guys, you have to specify what server you are referring to. I play on PC EU, and Sotha Sil is only slightly behind the population of Vivec. At primtime both tend to be full (only just about, these days). I believe this is different on PC NA.

I'm talking about PC NA

VaranisArano · September 2017

Drakkdjinn wrote: »

Misinformation - NoCP is and has been poppin during primetime consistently. The 7-day camps are all deserts save Shor...sometimes.

I can't speak for the no-CP campaign on PC NA, but the deserted CP campaigns exist because ZOS still hasn't shut down Kastav and Xarxes despite the PVP event being long over and done with. They were absolutely necessary for the Midyear Mayhem event, but really aren't necessary anymore. Shor is sufficient for any overflow from Vivec.

Shor, like Haderus before it, is primarily the server for guilds who want CP PVP but don't want to deal with the lag or numbers in Vivec. This generally means that Shor is active in primetime, and is otherwise dominated by whichever faction has the most population on the server.

HEBREWHAMMERRR · September 2017

CP had a higher skill floor, NonCP has a way way way higher skill ceiling. In non CP you have to be much more conscious on resource management and timing your bursts as you don't have the CP training wheels on.

To be honest it doesn't matter though, the good players are the same good players whether there is CP, NonCP, battlegrounds, etc. it's just personal preference.

I prefer NonCP for my battlegrounds especially as it offers a much more level playing field and offers the most competitive fights. Cyrodill after 2 years is pretty much a dead, mindless Zergfest full of cancerous builds to me. You can find small scale but who wants to roam around looking for these fights when I can hop in BGs and get right in to the fight.

fred4 · September 2017

I don't see Viper builds much in CP anymore, if ever. In no CP I ran across two within my short foray. It seems to me that pressure builds are more viable there, and proc sets. I was not impressed.

I don't buy into the whole "resource management creates another (interesting) layer of player skill" argument. I never liked those changes, but since cost reduction was removed from CP, it's not that different in no CP anyway. At any rate, that wasn't my problem. I simply got overwhelmed by what seemed to be a different meta, and I have no desire to deal with that. It's bad enough keeping up with quarterly balance changes and new armor sets. I have 3 active characters that I haven't fully explored. I have fine-tuned my builds to deal with the combination of PvP and PvE, in IC, including boss farming. This is actually a reason for me to stay in CP, as I farm Tel Var when there's no PvP, and it's pretty brutal soloing the bosses in no CP. I don't doubt they're doable, but really tedious.

ak_pvp · September 2017

My [insert class here] works better in [Insert mode here] Therefore [insert mode here] is better.