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Should Stamina Nightblades get a class based on demand self heal ?
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Krayzie✭✭✭✭✭Also worth noting that sorcs do not have a class based self heal outside of pets. Most sorcs choose to not run pets because they are completely broken, but also not enjoyable for either party to play with.
Dark Conversion is nota heal, Its cast time is 1.2 sec which is too long for use in combat. It is used for sustain only, the heal is a bonus.
Mag sorc has the worst healing in the game and this is not debatable in any way. It is possible to achieve decent healing but you have to get "creative". Stam blades have comparatively very good healing, as well as cloak.
Surge.
It's hilarious that any time there's a class discussion thread about any other class, inevitably a magsorc will show up to moan about something. Magsorcs are in the clover, and I say that as a magsorc main.
Ok Surge is not an on demand self heal, it's based off of RNG more than anything and is totally overrated. I achieve the same spell damage bonus through other means and heal myself with other means. Works fine for me.
Sorcs do not have an access to an on demand heal such as vigor, green dragon blood, etc.
Surge is absolutely not overated, as a sorcerer you should have high crit anyways and with hurricane, crit is pretty good on stamsorc too.
I don't know why you're trying to turn this into a defending sorc thread lolI'm a PVE roleplayer concerned about my vampires stage 4 skin tone and keep getting load screens so I came here to distract people from major issues with a rant thread about my characters cosmetic appearance.8 -
Killset✭✭✭✭Also worth noting that sorcs do not have a class based self heal outside of pets. Most sorcs choose to not run pets because they are completely broken, but also not enjoyable for either party to play with.
Dark Conversion is nota heal, Its cast time is 1.2 sec which is too long for use in combat. It is used for sustain only, the heal is a bonus.
Mag sorc has the worst healing in the game and this is not debatable in any way. It is possible to achieve decent healing but you have to get "creative". Stam blades have comparatively very good healing, as well as cloak.
Surge.
It's hilarious that any time there's a class discussion thread about any other class, inevitably a magsorc will show up to moan about something. Magsorcs are in the clover, and I say that as a magsorc main.
Ok Surge is not an on demand self heal, it's based off of RNG more than anything and is totally overrated. I achieve the same spell damage bonus through other means and heal myself with other means. Works fine for me.
Sorcs do not have an access to an on demand heal such as vigor, green dragon blood, etc.
You have freaking SHEILDS! Good god. Playing a medium armor Stamblade is brutal anymore in PvP. If cloak was even remotely dependable it might be a different story. But with the amount of AOE's being thrown around, on top of fire and forget PoTL's, Cliff Racer, Curses, detect pots, lag, etc, it's laughable at times.
I have every class aside from Warden, my NB is AvA rank Overlord, I dueled almost exclusively up through Palatine. I assure you my NB is the weakest of all my characters. Aside from ganking(which I hate), the class has been decimated through direct and indirect nerfs. My mag DK would roast my Stamblade in seconds. I've been hit with 10k curses in 6 impen. Medium is that much of a joke. Magic has so many advantages in this game it is obscene. Trying to kill a good Sorc is about impossible with CP changes and resto ult. You will never run them out of magic and you won't run them out of stamina. Your only hope is they F up a CC break and you do 24k damage in 1 second. Of course you can kill bad Sorcs but you will most likely kill that player on any class they play. Most high end magica builds/players don't even run tri-stat because they can run witchmothers or bi-stat and have enough stamina for break free through CP changes. The class is still strong against scrubs, but who isn't? With equally skilled players and min/maxed builds, NB is outshined by nearly every other class in PvP right now. Anybody who tells you different is selling something.
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Everstorm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Uhm, sap essence, swallow soul and refreshing path heal pretty darn well.
None of those are Stam NB abilities. The heals on those are pretty much non existent on a stamina build.Ok Surge is not an on demand self heal, it's based off of RNG more than anything and is totally overrated. I achieve the same spell damage bonus through other means and heal myself with other means. Works fine for me.
Sorcs do not have an access to an on demand heal such as vigor, green dragon blood, etc.
Surge pretty much procs every single second. So it's a permanent Heal Over Time. And Dark Exchange is an on demand heal + gives magicka back.
OP edited his post to specify stamina builds after my response.1 -
doslekis✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areAs a stam nb main I'm ok without a class based stamina heal.
When I was just learning and questing soul swallow, and the duel wield morphs kept me alive.
When I became a big boy I slot vigor like every other stamina character.I don't normally use daggers, but when I do, I choose dos Lekis.3 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No...Eventhough I agree Stamina NB need heal but I am afraid it will break the class in PVP or PVENightblade's just need a new revamped version of Dark Cloak to purge only DoT's instead of Debuff's + DoT's like in 1.6. I don't think Nightblade's need more healing but a way to shred off pressure instead of spamming heals like maniacs.PS4 NA DC2 -
Betsararie✭✭✭✭✭
✭No...I am happy the way things areAlso worth noting that sorcs do not have a class based self heal outside of pets. Most sorcs choose to not run pets because they are completely broken, but also not enjoyable for either party to play with.
Dark Conversion is nota heal, Its cast time is 1.2 sec which is too long for use in combat. It is used for sustain only, the heal is a bonus.
Mag sorc has the worst healing in the game and this is not debatable in any way. It is possible to achieve decent healing but you have to get "creative". Stam blades have comparatively very good healing, as well as cloak.
Surge.
It's hilarious that any time there's a class discussion thread about any other class, inevitably a magsorc will show up to moan about something. Magsorcs are in the clover, and I say that as a magsorc main.
Ok Surge is not an on demand self heal, it's based off of RNG more than anything and is totally overrated. I achieve the same spell damage bonus through other means and heal myself with other means. Works fine for me.
Sorcs do not have an access to an on demand heal such as vigor, green dragon blood, etc.
Surge is absolutely not overated, as a sorcerer you should have high crit anyways and with hurricane, crit is pretty good on stamsorc too.
I don't know why you're trying to turn this into a defending sorc thread lol
That's fine, just know I don't agree with you.
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Autumnhart✭✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areGreenSoup2HoT wrote: »I don't think Nightblades need more healing but a way to shred off pressure instead of spamming heals like maniacs.
Agree.Shadow hide you.0 -
Kalante✭✭✭✭✭
✭What stam nb's need is pressure, their burst damage gets negated by almost everything other than bad players or another stam nb. If people think their heals are decent they obviously do not play a medium stam nb in an open field against two or three more opponents who somewhat know what they are doing.
Those 2.6k rally heals ain't gonna save you against them or have an opening to let you go offensively without tanking your resources to the ground, you give up so many resources to gain good healing because the only way to get good healing as a medium stam nb is trough stacking weapon damage. I have 4k weapon damage buffed at all times with a nirnhoned maelstrom bow on my backbar, around 50cp in the blue constellation and 30 on the red one both for healing.
My heals are around 2.7k without any castle or resource buffs. Pretty sure an argonian could reach 3k. Guess what? those heals are still not enough because you run out of resources, also medium armor squishiness and low health. With heavy armor sure you could survive way better but a stam nb should not be ran on heavy armor. It's really sad were pvp is at the moment, it's a tanking meta. My stam nb is not a ganking set up either. I am extremely anti ganking. I have 1.9k stam regen, that is the maximum regen i can gain for any decent vigor healing of about 2.7k ticks. If i up my stam regen to 2.1k or 2.3k my vigor will be reduced to about 2.5k to 2.4k ticks and that is horrible.
The set up is hundings rage, agility, molag keena, velidreth, nirn maelstrom bow, sharpened maelstrom maul. This gives you constant heals unlike other builds were you proc high bursts of damage for a short amount of time, i do not like those because they are not reliable at all times. I mean what is the point of having all the regen in the world and weapon damage if you lose half your health by a crystal frags or wrecking blow.
Stam nb is fkedd.Edited by Kalante on September 20, 2017 6:47AM5 -
Krayzie✭✭✭✭✭Also worth noting that sorcs do not have a class based self heal outside of pets. Most sorcs choose to not run pets because they are completely broken, but also not enjoyable for either party to play with.
Dark Conversion is nota heal, Its cast time is 1.2 sec which is too long for use in combat. It is used for sustain only, the heal is a bonus.
Mag sorc has the worst healing in the game and this is not debatable in any way. It is possible to achieve decent healing but you have to get "creative". Stam blades have comparatively very good healing, as well as cloak.
Surge.
It's hilarious that any time there's a class discussion thread about any other class, inevitably a magsorc will show up to moan about something. Magsorcs are in the clover, and I say that as a magsorc main.
Ok Surge is not an on demand self heal, it's based off of RNG more than anything and is totally overrated. I achieve the same spell damage bonus through other means and heal myself with other means. Works fine for me.
Sorcs do not have an access to an on demand heal such as vigor, green dragon blood, etc.
Surge is absolutely not overated, as a sorcerer you should have high crit anyways and with hurricane, crit is pretty good on stamsorc too.
I don't know why you're trying to turn this into a defending sorc thread lol
That's fine, just know I don't agree with you.
Okay, just know that surge is just as good as everyone thinks it is.I'm a PVE roleplayer concerned about my vampires stage 4 skin tone and keep getting load screens so I came here to distract people from major issues with a rant thread about my characters cosmetic appearance.4 -
Kalante✭✭✭✭✭
✭Also lol at the fear nerf that i saw in another thread.
Edited by Kalante on September 20, 2017 6:56AM0 -
FloppyTouch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areStam dk has no stam class heal too. Dont know what ur talking about only class with out a stam version of a heal. I think all stam classes but the stam sorc don't have a stam version class heal. I might be wrong but I think all of them are magic.0 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areWarden has HoTs and a burst.
Sorc has a HoT, but no burst heal (dark deal is a resource tool on Stam, not a heal).
Dk has one that doesn't scale with Stam
Templar has one that doesn't scale with Stam.
So only warden has a good, Stam base burst heal.
The last thing we need in PvP is a stamblade to heal better than they do. Yeh, they're healing is kinda weak in PvP. They have other survival tools and have insane resource management and damage though.
Don't forget about leeching strikes too. It's decent healing over time and gives resources back.Edited by Brrrofski on September 20, 2017 7:13AM2 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areWhat stam nb's need is pressure, their burst damage gets negated by almost everything other than bad players or another stam nb. If people think their heals are decent they obviously do not play a medium stam nb in an open field against two or three more opponents who somewhat know what they are doing.
Those 2.6k rally heals ain't gonna save you against them or have an opening to let you go offensively without tanking your resources to the ground, you give up so many resources to gain good healing because the only way to get good healing as a medium stam nb is trough stacking weapon damage. I have 4k weapon damage buffed at all times with a nirnhoned maelstrom bow on my backbar, around 50cp in the blue constellation and 30 on the red one both for healing.
My heals are around 2.7k without any castle or resource buffs. Pretty sure an argonian could reach 3k. Guess what? those heals are still not enough because you run out of resources, also medium armor squishiness and low health. With heavy armor sure you could survive way better but a stam nb should not be ran on heavy armor. It's really sad were pvp is at the moment, it's a tanking meta. My stam nb is not a ganking set up either. I am extremely anti ganking. I have 1.9k stam regen, that is the maximum regen i can gain for any decent vigor healing of about 2.7k ticks. If i up my stam regen to 2.1k or 2.3k my vigor will be reduced to about 2.5k to 2.4k ticks and that is horrible.
The set up is hundings rage, agility, molag keena, velidreth, nirn maelstrom bow, sharpened maelstrom maul. This gives you constant heals unlike other builds were you proc high bursts of damage for a short amount of time, i do not like those because they are not reliable at all times. I mean what is the point of having all the regen in the world and weapon damage if you lose half your health by a crystal frags or wrecking blow.
Stam nb is fkedd.
Honestly, upping your Stam regen will help you survive a lot more than an extra 300 health on vigor ticks. Being able to chain dodge rolls is a big survival boost. I run 2.5k regen and even have shadow walker on my back bar. I really like big regen on a stamblade. Give it a try.1 -
Zbigb4life✭✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areGo to pvp and unlock vigor. Stamplars don't have a heal abilty as well (unless you take the magicka abilities, but so can a Stam NB use sap essence, swallow soul,...)0
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Illurian✭✭✭✭✭
✭Uhm, sap essence, swallow soul and refreshing path heal pretty darn well.
None of those are Stam NB abilities. The heals on those are pretty much non existent on a stamina build.Ok Surge is not an on demand self heal, it's based off of RNG more than anything and is totally overrated. I achieve the same spell damage bonus through other means and heal myself with other means. Works fine for me.
Sorcs do not have an access to an on demand heal such as vigor, green dragon blood, etc.
Surge pretty much procs every single second. So it's a permanent Heal Over Time. And Dark Exchange is an on demand heal + gives magicka back.
Surge and Dark Exchange aren't stamina based abilities. They both cost magicka, so saying stam sorc has stamina based heals is just wrong. No one has stamina heals besides the warden. NB has a lot of stamina skills, you dont need a heal too
I was responding to a mag sorc post.
Stam sorc has dark deal and crit surge...
Dark Deal costs Magicka, gives you health. Crit Surge costs Magicka, gives you health.
Dark Deal costs magicka because it refunds stamina and health. It would be frankly stupid if it cost stamina just to return you that stamina.
Crit Surge is based off of your weapon crit and gives you major brutality.
If you want to take part in these discussions, you need to stop being so narrow minded. Just because something costs magicka does not inherently mean it's a skill for a magicka build.
Personally, my stamsorc sustains so much easier than even my magblade (far easier to solo vet dungeons on hm with a stamsorc), which has many more sustain options than stamblades, so if you are complaining about sorcs needing love then maybe you should try nightblades.Kiss the chaos.5 -
Pele✭✭✭✭✭I can't tell if this thread is serious because NBs have many class-based ways to heal themselves. Stamina NBs are actually at a greater advantage than Magicka NBs when it comes to heals because we don't primarily use magicka, so all our magicka can be used on NB heals and utility.
Reaper's Mark + Sap Essence + the weapons of your choice and you will never die as a StamNB unless you eat ***, lag, don't pay attention, or you're learning the class. Add heals to weaving with Leeching Strikes, which also helps with resource management issues. Killer Blade is a high-damage stamina execute that heals. There are more NB class skills that heal. Read and learn your NB skill tree.
Disclaimer: the above info applies to PvE (overland and solo dungeons).0 -
Unfadingsilence✭✭✭✭✭
✭Do NBs need more heals when they already have vigor, rally, and cloak..... Obviously not. That is a ridiculous idea.
I even play Stamblade occasionally and I'm not in favor of this.
When was vigor a NB ability and rally? Umm last I checked cloak does not heal at all and looking at it right now it just says it puts me in cloak is all "sure you can get a critical heal from vigor which I last checked was a Alliance skill and rally which im not sure but maybe 100% sure it's a 2huge skill as well... I'm pretty sure the ONLY NB skills that heal are siphoning attacks, for Stam NB and for magic NB you have swallow soul and refreshing path but I'm pretty sure OP asked about a stamina based class ability that heals for NBs1 -
Runschei✭✭✭✭✭
✭OtherI want a stamina based selfheal for nightblade, but I am afraid of which skill ZOS might remove/edit for the sake of that skill.3 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things are1. Vigor - can magicka toons have also acces to powerful aoe heal not bound to any kind of weapon?
2. Rally - this is even more sick because nb can use it while cloaked and get 100% crit heal... without breaking the stealth - what better skill you need? Maybe spamable, stamina selftargeted (why waste stamina to heal others? ) BoL that dont break the cloak and maybe lets make of it reversed executioner so when below 50% hp it heals stronger based on missing health, scales up to 300%? Suuuuuure."We are currently investigating connection issues some players are having on the European megaservers. We will update as new information becomes available."
— They always claim they’re “investigating” the causes, but in reality they’re just waiting until the PC EU players go to bed. Once that happens, you can suddenly log in again and they happily mark the issue as Fixed.0 -
KingJ✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes...NB should have some sort of class based healingYes Nightblade need better healing.Our only way to get a decent heal compared to other classes is to combine it with Cloak which breaks randomly alot.Stamblading healing sucks even with rally and vigor.
Stam sorc have rally vigor crit surge and when they need stam dark conversion.
Stamdk has major mending
Stamplar has minor mending and vitality
Stamblades have a crit heal which every other class can also get rather easily.Stamblade has the worst out of every class.0 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areYes Nightblade need better healing.Our only way to get a decent heal compared to other classes is to combine it with Cloak which breaks randomly alot.Stamblading healing sucks even with rally and vigor.
Stam sorc have rally vigor crit surge and when they need stam dark conversion.
Stamdk has major mending
Stamplar has minor mending and vitality
Stamblades have a crit heal which every other class can also get rather easily.Stamblade has the worst out of every class.
As long as you let all classes disengage combat as easily as Stam nbs, can stack regen as easilly as Stam NBs, have high damage class spammable like a Stam NB as have and insanly powerful, low cost ult....
Yeh, Stam NB healing is weak compared to the rest. They have things other don't though. Not every class needs everything. Anyway, crit surge isn't even great in PvP. Stam sorc doesn't have much better than Stam NB.1 -
Azurya✭✭✭✭✭
✭No...I am happy the way things areplaying 7 NB myself, I have no need for more heal, and that would cost another skill right?, so pls not.0 -
mb10✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yes...NB should have some sort of class based healingEveryone saying No just hates NBs.
How can anyone that actually plays NB oppose a heal?1 -
xRIVALENx✭✭✭Siphoning Strikes does an exceptional job at self healing, literally tanked Cernunon and his 3 friends on my Stamblade in Veteran Falkreath with Inner Fire and light attacks.
*Edit*
We had a new tank whom didn't know when to roll dodge the charged attacks.Edited by xRIVALENx on September 20, 2017 11:26AM0 -
kylewwefan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No...I am happy the way things areI had to go to Cyrodil like everyone else to get me Vigor. Maybe if they could buff the leeching strikes heals. It actually used to work good, but no one ever used that morph because it cost you %20 damage.0 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areEveryone saying No just hates NBs.
How can anyone that actually plays NB oppose a heal?
Because not every class has a class heal.
Magica NB within it's class has path, strife and sap. Also can use resto staff.
Stamina can use 2h, dw and even bow for healing. Can also get vigor from PvP. Also, doesn't killers blade heal?
Both can use either morphs of siphoning which heals. A morph of mark heals if I recall too.
So plenty of heals. You want a one button heal regardless of weapon choice. Vigor is strong and does that. The only ones that have it in class are mag temp, wardens and mag dk. Mag sorc, Stam sorc, Stam dk, Stam templar also don't have class instant/burst heals.Edited by Brrrofski on September 20, 2017 11:34AM0 -
KingJ✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes...NB should have some sort of class based healing
Yes NB can easliy escape and disengage combat when cloak works the issue is cloak doesn't always work.You can par it with shadow image but you can easily walk out of range of if during a fight and if another uses it can break your cloak.You have to fight someone brain dead for if to work.For example someone who doesn't fight you near it or a group that doesn't have a AOe on it.Yes Nightblade need better healing.Our only way to get a decent heal compared to other classes is to combine it with Cloak which breaks randomly alot.Stamblading healing sucks even with rally and vigor.
Stam sorc have rally vigor crit surge and when they need stam dark conversion.
Stamdk has major mending
Stamplar has minor mending and vitality
Stamblades have a crit heal which every other class can also get rather easily.Stamblade has the worst out of every class.
As long as you let all classes disengage combat as easily as Stam nbs, can stack regen as easilly as Stam NBs, have high damage class spammable like a Stam NB as have and insanly powerful, low cost ult....
Yeh, Stam NB healing is weak compared to the rest. They have things other don't though. Not every class needs everything. Anyway, crit surge isn't even great in PvP. Stam sorc doesn't have much better than Stam NB.
The other classes don't need to stack heavy in to regen,Stam sorc have dark deal so they can run low regen,stream through a person DD and gg have some health and some stam.With shuffle up which all stam builds use you can dodge the bash rather easily with just RNG while the person your facing wasting stam and if you play xbox also counts as blocking which stops regen ticks.
StamDk have battle roar and mountain blessing that give them stam back,plus heavy attacks majority of DK run heavy even noobs run heavy nords do.
Stamwarden has Netch.
stamplar sustain sucks in general and heavy armor would assist them more when they DW heavy attack heavy than in meduim but it's easier to stack regen in meduim armor but heavy Is better because it helps with all the undodgable crap meduim armor has to deal with.
stamplar and stamwarden has high damage undodgable class spammables.Im all in favor of getting stamdk a stam whip but there nothing you can really give stam sorc as a ultimate or spammable in class unless they completely change the skill line to fit it.
Cheap ultimate Dk have leap which is AOE and hit harder than my Incap,Stamplar crescent sweeps AOE and hits just as hard as my Incap.Stamwarden has the best which is good in duels I been told plus all stam build has access to Dawnbreaker and Stam sorc it only cost 100 ultimate for something that hit as hard as incap and leaves a Dot not to mention AOe.You know what crazy you can on only dodge incap but all those abilities have the roughly the same damage as incap but are AOE so they hit more people.All those ultimate are just as powerful if not better since they hit more people.
My crit surge is up pretty much the entire fight as long as I'm in combat I have crit surge up.Hurrican and PI is usually good enough if I using my Dot build I have a really good uptime even against a magplar he can't purge to much or he gonna run out of magic.
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Gulkrim-mur✭✭✭No...I am happy the way things areThe only class that does not have a class based self heal is Stamina NB.
This becomes problematic especially for newcomers to ESO who level their first Stamina NB.
You can argue that DW tree has healing but that can never be equal to an on demand class based healing that everyone has.
And not everyone loves to level a Magicka NB for them to have a Resto staff back bar.
All class heals are magicka except one single heal the warden has can morph to stamina. Stam builds use rally and vigor.
Most mags use resto heals over class heals anyway its lest costly and more efficient
In short your just not looking hard enough.0
