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vMA and Master weapons are not used just because of the abilty modifiers.
hmsdragonfly
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ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Developer Comments: Due to the fact these items can now be enchanted or poisoned normally, their extraneous stat bonuses have been removed. For example, the Maelstrom’s Greatsword no longer adds 189 Weapon Damage on top of the modifier to Critical Charge.
The bonus stat is a deciding factor for people to use vMA and Master weapons and it helps creating so many unique builds based on those weapons. This change will eliminate 50% of vMA weapon builds.
1) vMA staves will no longer be viable in PvP for all 5 magicka classes. This is a big deal.Very few people use elemental blockade in PvP, so we are not going to see any vMA staff in PvP in the future.
2) vMA 2H weapons are no longer good for stamblades. Most stamblades use Ambush instead of Crit Charge.
3) vMA DW weapons are no longer good for stamplars. Because stamplars use jabs, not Flurry.
4) No more vMA weapons for stamina heavy attack builds.
etc
This really hurts build crafting. If you feel that vMA/Master weapons will be too OP, how about nerfing the bonus stat to 129 weapon/spell damage and 1096 stamina/magicka instead of removing it entirely? Or even nerf the modifiers a little bit. Please leave some kind of the bonus stat so it can be somewhat useful without having to use the specific ability.
Aldmeri Dominion Loyalist. For the Queen!
25
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Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yep, this is definitely the change to cry about this time around. Maybe they'll revert it.7 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Yeh, people seem to think people are better off using random weapon enchant.
Completely ignoring I can proc that on the back bar and then get the VMA bonus on front bar.
I don't use poisons, but it kills that too. Which I kinda like to be honest.
Also, it kills willpower and agility. People use a 5 piece, monster set, the 3 jewellery and VMA front bar. With no VMA front, why use the jewellery sets?3 -
Trashs1✭✭✭after getting all from vma i need.... this hurts me alot..Dolche des Königs (DDK); EuPC, DC, Sotha Sil,7 -
Oakmontowls_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭a possible fix would be to make the bonus stats still an enchantment but keep the change with the ability altering part being a set bonus. this way people that would rather use a normal enchant can but for pvp and other situations where you would rather the flat stat bonuses you can.3 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There were 4 things that made vma (mostly) and master weapons interesting in PVP- Stat on 1 piece
- Being allowed to use poison while keeping that stat
- Combining this with agi/willpower to get 4piece better than regular 4 pieces
- Having nirn trait, that was impossible to get on any but craftable weapons
How that changed?
There is no stat to get anymore.
There is no reason to use poisons anymore (except cost).
Agi/willpower got relatively worse last patch
Trait change (I assume) makes any set weapon available in nirn traitEdited by SodanTok on September 18, 2017 7:57PM8 -
Asardes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭1+2) Weren't good for a long time. It was actually better to run 2 x 5p sets and 1p monster set, or 5/4p back front with 2p monster set. But Master staff will now actually become viable since it can be receive an enchant on top of the set bonus damage to reach. Also Master Greatsword becomes a good option, especially in defense since brawler will hit like a truck. Also if the weapons can be enchanted you can now simply put a weapon/spell enchant bonus on an infused one and still get more damage, and especially more burst damage than before.
3) You can now use Master 2W since every stamina build uses rending anyway. Flurry had become less viable for a long time due to the high cost. That's the reason most classes had moved to 5+5+2 setups. In any case Stamplar with war machine, crescent sweep and the new Perfect Asylum 2H will probably be FotM.
4) No stam DK had been running those for a long time since there's no place for Flurry in the rotation. Not sure about stam sorcs, but even for those other sets were more viable. Also see the buff to Master daggers.
Don't get stuck on the faults, see the opportunities.Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
vMA (The Flawless Conqueror) | vVH (Spirit Slayer & of the Undying Song) | vDSA | vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL | vAS+1 | Emperor
PC-EU CP 3000+
41,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Pact Veteran Trade: Exemplary
Traders of the Covenant: God of Sales
Tamriels Emporium: God of Sales
Valinor Overflow: Trader
The Traveling Merchant: Silver
Characters:
Asardes | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 50 | Master Crafter: all traits & recipes, all styles released before High Isle
Alxaril Nelcarion | 50 High Elf Sorcerer | AD AR 20 |
Dro'Bear Three-paws | 50 Khajiit Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Veronique Nicole | 50 Breton Templar | DC AR 20 |
Sabina Flavia Cosades | 50 Imperial Warden | EP AR 20 |
Ervesa Neloren | 50 Dark Elf Dragonknight | EP AR 20 |
Fendar Khodwin | 50 Redguard Sorcerer | DC AR 20 |
Surilanwe of Lillandril | 50 High Elf Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Joleen the Swift | 50 Redguard Templar | DC AR 20 |
Draynor Telvanni | 50 Dark Elf Warden | EP AR 20 |
Claudius Tharn | 50 Necromancer | DC AR 20 |
Nazura-la the Bonedancer | 50 Necromancer | AD AR 20 |
Tharkul gro-Shug | 50 Orc Dragonknight | DC AR 4 |
Ushruka gra-Lhurgash | 50 Orc Sorcerer | AD AR 4 |
Cienwen ferch Llywelyn | 50 Breton Nightblade | DC AR 4 |
Plays-with-Sunray | 50 Argonian Templar | EP AR 4 |
Milariel | 50 Wood Elf Warden | AD AR 4 |
Scheei-Jul | 50 Necromancer | EP AR 4 |
PC-NA CP 1800+
30,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Savage Blade: Majestic Machette
Characters:
Asardes the Exile | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 30 |7 -
simeion✭✭✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
6 -
GodHawk✭✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Listen to this guy please. Stop saying nonsense.5 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.9 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭I already run 4p alchemist 2h on my frontbar which gives me a weapon damage bonus. The only reason I would ever swap to vMA is if I wanted to use poisons. This change will literally make my 2h alchemist mace better than the 2h vMA mace. Not to mention that I can start theorycrafting new builds for my mag classes that used 2p monster set, 5p set, 3p willpower and vMA/masters staves.
At least I won't have to run vMA for the nirn inferno anymore, so I got that going for me.0 -
hmsdragonfly✭✭✭✭✭
✭1+2) Weren't good for a long time. It was actually better to run 2 x 5p sets and 1p monster set, or 5/4p back front with 2p monster set. But Master staff will now actually become viable since it can be receive an enchant on top of the set bonus damage to reach. Also Master Greatsword becomes a good option, especially in defense since brawler will hit like a truck. Also if the weapons can be enchanted you can now simply put a weapon/spell enchant bonus on an infused one and still get more damage, and especially more burst damage than before.
3) You can now use Master 2W since every stamina build uses rending anyway. Flurry had become less viable for a long time due to the high cost. That's the reason most classes had moved to 5+5+2 setups. In any case Stamplar with war machine, crescent sweep and the new Perfect Asylum 2H will probably be FotM.
4) No stam DK had been running those for a long time since there's no place for Flurry in the rotation. Not sure about stam sorcs, but even for those other sets were more viable. Also see the buff to Master daggers.
Don't get stuck on the faults, see the opportunities.
Good point about stamplar
About vMA staves, you can always back bar lich and front bar vMA so you can run 2x 5pcs, 1 pc monster and a vMA. Master staves won't be that great either because only a few magblade and magwd use reach in PvP and that's it. Also Agility/Willpower builds will be gone.
If you are a stamblade, there's no place for brawler though, you need like 50 abilities on your bar xD
Be able to enchant is a great change, I just feel like there's no point removing the extra stat bonus, if you feel that it makes those weapons too OP, you can simply nerf that bonus to 124 weapon/spell damage instead of 189 to be on par with 1 piece monster set.
Aldmeri Dominion Loyalist. For the Queen!0 -
hmsdragonfly✭✭✭✭✭
✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Except for the fact that it has a cool down and you can always back bar a weapon glyph and front bar vMA. When the glyph procs, your vMA front bar gets the damage bonus. It's not a buff if you don's use the modifiers. If you don't use the modifiers, they offer no benefit at all and you'd better go to the nearest crafting station to craft a random non-set weapon. So, they will be useless for your magicka PvP builds.Edited by hmsdragonfly on September 18, 2017 8:31PMAldmeri Dominion Loyalist. For the Queen!2 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Non-infused maelstrom weapon now: constant 189 weapon damage, poison of any choice
Non-infused mael weapon after the patch: 348 damage for half the time and only after light attack (= 174 damage on average), no poison, some skill buff you may not even want or need
Not to mention you could have backbar weapon with WD enchant and get even moreEdited by SodanTok on September 18, 2017 8:27PM1 -
simeion✭✭✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.4 -
MaselClass RepresentativeOkay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Agreed. This enables a lot of new cool combos and is not a nerf at all.
For example, put vMA destro with Weapon Damage Enchantment on back bar and it will stay active on the front bar. You'll get more return than while having an "old" vMA weapon.Edited by Masel on September 18, 2017 8:35PMPC EU
All Trial Trifecta Titles Done!
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChVEG6ckuAgGs5OyA6VeisA0 -
hmsdragonfly✭✭✭✭✭
✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
You are a Magicka PvPer. You don't use Blockade.
Non-set random inferno staff:
- Take 30 seconds to craft.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a new vMA inferno staff.
- Can choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
New vMA inferno staff
- Took you hundreds of hours to farm it.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a non-set random inferno staff.
- Can't choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
Why use it?Edited by hmsdragonfly on September 18, 2017 8:42PMAldmeri Dominion Loyalist. For the Queen!7 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?0 -
MaselClass RepresentativeOkay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?
1314 Damage is modified by all CPs and Damaged Modifiers. It is a significant buff to light and heavy attacks and especially on a lightning staff. No doubt it is stronger.
This is a buff to these weapons in PvE, no doubt about that. Especially since you can use the vMA and Asylum Destro in Combo for example:
Blockade deals 20% more damage against Burning enemies or sets concussed enemies off-balance.
Front barring asylum Destro leads to those effects being up a lot.
Having an infused or charged vMA lightning/fire staff with an own shock/fire enchant on is insane.
Edited by Masel on September 18, 2017 8:49PMPC EU
All Trial Trifecta Titles Done!
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChVEG6ckuAgGs5OyA6VeisA0 -
hmsdragonfly✭✭✭✭✭
✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?
1314 Damage is modified by all CPs. It is a significant buff to light and heavy attacks and especially on a lightning staff. No doubt it is stronger.
But who use blockade in PvP?Aldmeri Dominion Loyalist. For the Queen!1 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?
1314 Damage is modified by all CPs. It is a significant buff to light and heavy attacks and especially on a lightning staff. No doubt it is stronger.
But who use blockade in PvP?
I do as of yesterday, @Derra does, a few other magblades on PC EU do. It is a very strong skill.
2 -
simeion✭✭✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Except for the fact that it has a cool down and you can always back bar a weapon glyph and front bar vMA. When the glyph procs, your vMA front bar gets the damage bonus. It's not a buff if you don's use the modifiers. If you don't use the modifiers, they offer no benefit at all and you'd better go to the nearest crafting station to craft a random non-set weapon. So, they will be useless for your magicka PvP builds.
Something you have not talked about is using a poison, shock, or flame enchant what is now more damage from from the enchant. Seen enchants hit for 3k in pvp and your 189 wd/sd from the weapon. 189 sd/wd barely moves tool tips. Flame, shock, and poison enchants have a good chance to proc their secondary effects. I will say testing is will be needed, but still believe this is a buff in most circumstances.0 -
hmsdragonfly✭✭✭✭✭
✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Except for the fact that it has a cool down and you can always back bar a weapon glyph and front bar vMA. When the glyph procs, your vMA front bar gets the damage bonus. It's not a buff if you don's use the modifiers. If you don't use the modifiers, they offer no benefit at all and you'd better go to the nearest crafting station to craft a random non-set weapon. So, they will be useless for your magicka PvP builds.
Something you have not talked about is using a poison, shock, or flame enchant what is now more damage from from the enchant. Seen enchants hit for 3k in pvp and your 189 wd/sd from the weapon. 189 sd/wd barely moves tool tips. Flame, shock, and poison enchants have a good chance to proc their secondary effects. I will say testing is will be needed, but still believe this is a buff in most circumstances.
There's no testing needed. Very simple. You are a Magicka PvPer. You don't use Blockade.
Non-set random inferno staff:
- Take 30 seconds to craft.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a new vMA inferno staff.
- Can choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
New vMA inferno staff
- Took you hundreds of hours to farm it.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a non-set random inferno staff.
- Can't choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
New vMA inferno staff offers ZERO benefit compared to a non-set random crafted inferno staff in PvP because you don't use blockade.Aldmeri Dominion Loyalist. For the Queen!2 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Except for the fact that it has a cool down and you can always back bar a weapon glyph and front bar vMA. When the glyph procs, your vMA front bar gets the damage bonus. It's not a buff if you don's use the modifiers. If you don't use the modifiers, they offer no benefit at all and you'd better go to the nearest crafting station to craft a random non-set weapon. So, they will be useless for your magicka PvP builds.
Something you have not talked about is using a poison, shock, or flame enchant what is now more damage from from the enchant. Seen enchants hit for 3k in pvp and your 189 wd/sd from the weapon. 189 sd/wd barely moves tool tips. Flame, shock, and poison enchants have a good chance to proc their secondary effects. I will say testing is will be needed, but still believe this is a buff in most circumstances.
There's no testing needed. Very simple. You are a Magicka PvPer. You don't use Blockade.
Non-set random inferno staff:
- Take 30 seconds to craft.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a new vMA inferno staff.
- Can choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
New vMA inferno staff
- Took you hundreds of hours to farm it.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a non-set random inferno staff.
- Can't choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
New vMA inferno staff offers ZERO benefit compared to a non-set random crafted inferno staff in PvP because you don't use blockade.
This exactly. Even if you use blockade, why would you give up a 5/5/2 setup for like 500 extra light attack damage? It's stupid to think anyone would even consider it a buff. Only reason it was good in the first place was because you could fill that empty gear piece in your build with not only some damage but also poisons.1 -
MaselClass Representativehmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?
1314 Damage is modified by all CPs. It is a significant buff to light and heavy attacks and especially on a lightning staff. No doubt it is stronger.
But who use blockade in PvP?
I do as of yesterday, @Derra does, a few other magblades on PC EU do. It is a very strong skill.
You'd be surprised how many people stay in there to get grilled by lightning staff heavy attacks. Especially Melee enemies tend to melt.PC EU
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Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?
1314 Damage is modified by all CPs. It is a significant buff to light and heavy attacks and especially on a lightning staff. No doubt it is stronger.
But who use blockade in PvP?
I do as of yesterday, @Derra does, a few other magblades on PC EU do. It is a very strong skill.
You'd be surprised how many people stay in there to get grilled by lightning staff heavy attacks. Especially Melee enemies tend to melt.
Yep! Very niche and very strong in the right situations!0 -
f047ys3v3n✭✭✭✭✭
✭Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Up-time on an enchant is less than 50%. Truth bomb. Not a buff, big nerf in general. A few Master weapons may be slightly better as they got their basically nonexistent in magnitude ability altering effects buffed but the vMA weapons, which were better, got a big nerf.I am currently worried for the future of ESO. Population seems like it is in free fall and the cancellation of the North America in-person gathering feels very much like pulling the plug. Kudos on fixing the in-game economy though. Clearly whatever gold shenanigans were happening the last couple years are fixed.0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?
1314 Damage is modified by all CPs. It is a significant buff to light and heavy attacks and especially on a lightning staff. No doubt it is stronger.
But who use blockade in PvP?
I do as of yesterday, @Derra does, a few other magblades on PC EU do. It is a very strong skill.
I have to admit i would not use it for the maelstrom enchantment though
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Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
No it isn't.
I could use the 348 on back bar, proc and switch to front bar with the 189. It's a nerf. Especially to the destro as nobody uses wall of elements in PvP. It's now a random staff basically.
You do know that a flame, poison, or shock damage glyph will out damage 189 wd/sd. You can still proc the berserker glyph of the back bar and swap to the front. This is a big buff in both pvp and pve. 189 sd/wd hardly moves tool tips where a damage type glyph is a new damage source you did not have. You can get an additional 1.5-3k damage off it in pvp, higher in pve. Both types of glyphs don't share a cooldown.
Do they definitely not share cooldown?
Also, nirn pls butality/sorcery make it more than 189. That also effects healing too.
And why not use 5/5 and monster piece? Get a bit less damage but can use the enchant. Especially on the staff. Why give myself a wall of elements buff over 129 spell damage?
1314 Damage is modified by all CPs. It is a significant buff to light and heavy attacks and especially on a lightning staff. No doubt it is stronger.
But who use blockade in PvP?
I do as of yesterday, @Derra does, a few other magblades on PC EU do. It is a very strong skill.
I have to admit i would not use it for the maelstrom enchantment though
Yeah, real set bonuses are just far too valuable.
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simeion✭✭✭Problem is you all are chasing 189 wd/sd. When a shock, poison, or flame enchant will give you more bang on the front bar and back bar a berserker enchant. You do have cooldowns to worry about. The whole idea on most pvp builds is built around setting up combos and burst. I would trade 189 wd/sd over a possibility of a 3k crit glyph hit. If you have been using a maelstrom weapons for the 189 sd/wd, i would have crafted a dead staff long ago.0
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f047ys3v3n✭✭✭✭✭
✭hmsdragonfly wrote: »hmsdragonfly wrote: »Okay, you all know you can enchant the special weapons now and not loose it abilities. So now you can add a weapons/spell damage enchant of 348, which is more than the 189 you get from the weapons bonus. Or you can use a poison and still get the 1 peace weapons ability. This is a buff to these weapons specially if it is infused.
Except for the fact that it has a cool down and you can always back bar a weapon glyph and front bar vMA. When the glyph procs, your vMA front bar gets the damage bonus. It's not a buff if you don's use the modifiers. If you don't use the modifiers, they offer no benefit at all and you'd better go to the nearest crafting station to craft a random non-set weapon. So, they will be useless for your magicka PvP builds.
Something you have not talked about is using a poison, shock, or flame enchant what is now more damage from from the enchant. Seen enchants hit for 3k in pvp and your 189 wd/sd from the weapon. 189 sd/wd barely moves tool tips. Flame, shock, and poison enchants have a good chance to proc their secondary effects. I will say testing is will be needed, but still believe this is a buff in most circumstances.
There's no testing needed. Very simple. You are a Magicka PvPer. You don't use Blockade.
Non-set random inferno staff:
- Take 30 seconds to craft.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a new vMA inferno staff.
- Can choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
New vMA inferno staff
- Took you hundreds of hours to farm it.
- Offer the same amount of damage as a non-set random inferno staff.
- Can't choose the style you want.
- Can choose the glyph you want.
- Can choose the poison you want.
New vMA inferno staff offers ZERO benefit compared to a non-set random crafted inferno staff in PvP because you don't use blockade.
Agreed, and further, the Masters weapon staff, while actually having a skill on it that is at least conceivable to use in PVP, is still a weak buff to an already under-powered skill and I doubt will be used much. I really don't think that even if you used the skill in PVP it would be worth forgoing a general set bonus for it.
Further, the benefit of a vMA staff in PVE was only about 1.5k dps max before (not sure quite how much it already lost since heavy / light attacks were screwed up in morrowind). It is worth even less now. Given that you need a weapon for the second bar and a second vMA staff would now be a poor choice. There will be many who decide to forego it even in PVE where the skill will certainly be used.
Basically, I think vMA weapons being almost universally good is definitely gone. They will be BIS in only a situational way now, will never be any good in PVP, and not BIS by much in those situations in PVE. Big nerf.Edited by f047ys3v3n on September 18, 2017 9:03PMI am currently worried for the future of ESO. Population seems like it is in free fall and the cancellation of the North America in-person gathering feels very much like pulling the plug. Kudos on fixing the in-game economy though. Clearly whatever gold shenanigans were happening the last couple years are fixed.3