A counter criticism of 1vxers

Rainraven · August 2017

generalmyrick wrote: »

zergs are bad, zergs this, zergs that....blah blah blah ;-)

well, whatcha think?

I think you probably got killed chasing somebody you shouldn't have been chasing, and next time might not do that.

But it's just a theory.

Mettaricana · August 2017

There was one on AD i fought against hundreds of times i can't say his name but he had skills sick friggan skills he could take advantage of any kinda terrain and when we zerged him he ate us like a wood chipper on twigs.. he killed our entire 24 man zerg alone.. he was countering bashing casts javelining ranged casters repentence drawing back stam using trees rocks water everything to advantage he was just great i couldn't even be mad at him cuz how epic he was dodged the right times blocked right times never spam casted always used right skill roght time wihout fail. No proc sets no tremorscale he just friggan ate us like with a fork... group cried hax i saw no havks qe on ps4 hard to mod and hack persay we've killed him once or twice woth organization and precise attacks but in a nut shell he takes more effort to fight than seiging an occupied castle the dude literally solo seiged us out of a castle he set up several seige gear and fired each off wittled the wall down and ate anyone who dared stop him. Busted in and proceeded to evict us alone. I partied with him on another char got some tips how to play like him im just not that skilled i managed to do some of his 1 v x but just cannot compare to his level he has my respect for mad skills

generalmyrick · August 2017

Rainraven wrote: »

generalmyrick wrote: »

zergs are bad, zergs this, zergs that....blah blah blah ;-)

well, whatcha think?

I think you probably got killed chasing somebody you shouldn't have been chasing, and next time might not do that.

But it's just a theory.

you guys just can't help yourself ;-)

Rainraven · August 2017

generalmyrick wrote: »

Rainraven wrote: »

generalmyrick wrote: »

zergs are bad, zergs this, zergs that....blah blah blah ;-)

well, whatcha think?

I think you probably got killed chasing somebody you shouldn't have been chasing, and next time might not do that.

But it's just a theory.

you guys just can't help yourself ;-)

You asked!

Drakkdjinn · August 2017

Everyone knows that 1vX is a formula where X = the number of hours the "1" needs to spend editing gameplay footage to cut out the countless fail encounters and kiting required to make a pointless and contrived video for YouTube that makes them look good.

Olen_Mikko · August 2017

What is common to all 1vXers, is that they need noobs in order to succeed.

You don't see group of experienced players getting their assess handed to them by 1vXer.

Then there's 2 type of 1vXers. The wannabe 1vXer rides in its zerg's shadow, fighting near zerg fights, so the zerg can finish noobs off.

Or he just lures them somewhere where suddenly 2-3 NBs gank them off.

Then there is the "real" 1vXers that picks the noobs without the backup of his own zerg.

Anyway, i'm rarely impressed by them, as they just can't 1vX against skilled and experienced players.

Malic · August 2017

Its like some of you have never played mmo's before which I suppose is possible.

Ive never seen an MMO and ive played as many as anyone that hasnt had people QQing about dying in a PVP zone. Something is OP, someone is cheating.

Its never that they suck, or dont understand how to counter, nope never. You'll rarely find someone who pvp's tell you that they get rolled because they suck, its always the other guy is meta, cheating, macro user etc.

I zerg, I small group, I roam ive been out there for years now and everyone has to die.

Rohamad_Ali · August 2017

Actually I do not see any real 1vX players come to the forums and whine about anything . The good ones are pretty reserved on the forums .

ShadowMole25 · August 2017

I personally like XvXing. Mid-sized, open field, mostly even fights are what I try to find in Cyrodiil.

maxjapank · August 2017

Actually had a similar discussion just yesterday. A small scale group of 4 gets zerged down by a group of 16 and begins to send angry whispers to the zergers. Then two minutes later, the same 4 can be seen demolishing a single player.

FearAndPatching · August 2017

People complaining about players knowing how to use environment to gain an advantage versus 20 opponents. Sounds like the English Military complaining how Colonial Soldiers learned to use cover to fight in war rather than matching in line into battle outnumbered to get slaughtered by an army 100 times larger during American Revolution.

phairdon · August 2017

A few of the 1vX players are "angry sociopathic 1vx'rs". The problem being, those types of players expect everyone else to play their style, expect the alliance war to be 1v1 and go around specifically targeting players in groups, proceeded by whispering abuse to players they kill. Can think of a couple of formally well known streamers guilty of this behavior. One was banned multiple times (no names mentioned).

LegacyDM · August 2017

The only problem I have with 1vxers is that when I See them I can't help myself but kill them. Then I get a rage tell from them telling me to stop ruining their 1vx. I ask them why and it's because within the elite pvp community it's not socially acceptable for other elite pvpers to jump in a 1vx. Apparently, 1vx is only reserved for killing noobs. I've ignored the rage tells and now I am blacklisted within the elite pvper community as a Zerg surfer.

Drummerx04 · August 2017

badmojo wrote: »

Hypocrisy much? Being upset about being generalized while generalizing about other players.

There are plenty of 1vXer elitist players, they are the ones who run into a tower instead of fighting on a resource flag, they run around, and around, and around, and they only stop to fight when someone shows weakness. Which would be fine, if the game was team deathmatch and kills actually helped your alliance win the war, but that's not the game we play. It's like they're racing cars down a street, and notice another car pulling ahead so they abruptly pull a hard right and then say the turn was always part of the race. No, it wasn't, you saw failure looming and decided to take the cowards way out rather than simply losing. At least that's the way I view those players when I see them on the battlefield wasting everyone's time.

Also, fighting in a zerg is not simply a face roll like so many comments would have you believe. Sure, if all you want to do is survive and get free AP, then you could certainly just follow the pack and do nothing.... but enough people doing that will wipe a zerg quickly. At the end of the day a zerg is a big ball of AP for the enemy zerg, the weaker team always gets exposed. For a zerg to be successful against other zergs, at least some of them have to be playing with skill.

So hang on, you are telling me that 1-4 players tying up 12+ enemy players at some random resource for 10+ minutes is not beneficial to the war effort? Those 12 players are not on the front lines taking keeps and spending quality time with the faction stack, so in the end it's actually quite useful.

What do you expect them to do? "Oh no, I appear to be outnumbered. Might as well put my weapon away and go for a coffee break."

badmojo · August 2017

WhiteMage wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

Getting killed is often the best way to get to where your fighting will make a difference. While you are running laps around a rock with 10 amature players the skilled ones are taking your stuff.

On the other hand, that's 10 other players that aren't doing anything productive either.

That's certainly the justification people love to use. I'm just not sure it's actually as effective as its being portrayed as. Any player would have a very difficult time 1v10'ing if those 10 players were highly skilled. You might waste the time of 10 unskilled players, but then your assuming those 10 unskilled players would change the outcome of the battle they're being held back from, that's the part I don't agree with. If players can't deal with a guy running around a rock, they could be just as useless on the front lines. On the other side, a player 1vXing is probably skilled enough to be valuable on the front lines.

Point is, it's easy to claim you're effecting the war through distraction, because it's virtually impossible to prove it either way. In the best case scenario, sure they're going to be effective, but in many other cases I think people are just making excuses for their favorite mini-game. Which is fine, play how you want, but I'm not going to pretend that wasting enemy players time is the best use of their time, I would rather see them fighting next to me capping and defending the objectives that matter most to the overall war.

Caza99 · August 2017

This thread has all the lols

badmojo · August 2017

Drummerx04 wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

Hypocrisy much? Being upset about being generalized while generalizing about other players.

There are plenty of 1vXer elitist players, they are the ones who run into a tower instead of fighting on a resource flag, they run around, and around, and around, and they only stop to fight when someone shows weakness. Which would be fine, if the game was team deathmatch and kills actually helped your alliance win the war, but that's not the game we play. It's like they're racing cars down a street, and notice another car pulling ahead so they abruptly pull a hard right and then say the turn was always part of the race. No, it wasn't, you saw failure looming and decided to take the cowards way out rather than simply losing. At least that's the way I view those players when I see them on the battlefield wasting everyone's time.

Also, fighting in a zerg is not simply a face roll like so many comments would have you believe. Sure, if all you want to do is survive and get free AP, then you could certainly just follow the pack and do nothing.... but enough people doing that will wipe a zerg quickly. At the end of the day a zerg is a big ball of AP for the enemy zerg, the weaker team always gets exposed. For a zerg to be successful against other zergs, at least some of them have to be playing with skill.

So hang on, you are telling me that 1-4 players tying up 12+ enemy players at some random resource for 10+ minutes is not beneficial to the war effort? Those 12 players are not on the front lines taking keeps and spending quality time with the faction stack, so in the end it's actually quite useful.

What do you expect them to do? "Oh no, I appear to be outnumbered. Might as well put my weapon away and go for a coffee break."

It's extremely debatable, that's the problem with discussions like this. There are so many more factors than simply 1-4 players tying up 12+ for a duration. If those 1-4 players were badly needed in a keep defense for example, I don't care if they're tying up 25+ enemy players, losing a keep matters more.

I've seen it play out many times as a DC player. Ash LM will get taken or tagged, instead of following the rest of the DC players to our siege on Nikel, I'll run down to check out Ash LM and 7 out of 10 times I will find some 1vXer types running circles around the tower. Are they distracting to players trying to take the LM back? You bet, do they stop us from taking Nikel? Hell no. Them being at nikel might not have made any difference either, but who knows, maybe they would have made all the difference?

Animal_Mother · August 2017

Osteos wrote: »

Ignore them

Easier said than done.

If I'm in a group of 4+ people trying to take out 1 player and the fight lasts more than a minute; I'm looking for a way out. Someone isn't playing smart - it may be others or probably me and it's time to move on, get a fresh perspective. Get in the open...

"Stupid Animal, what you doing fighting around terrain. You're a Magplar. Get in the open and let RD shine."

Waffennacht · August 2017

I roam Cyrodiil alone.

Sometimes I find a lone PvE person and we just pass
Sometimes a lower level decides he wants to try his luck against this lone AD, they die and I ride
Sometimes I run into another lone PvPer and I may die or I may live and it's fun
Sometimes I run into a group of 3/4 usually 1 630 with 2-3 100s and they attack me and they all die
Sometimes I run into 2-4 PvPers and I get insta gibbed
Sometimes I run into 50 players and I flee

Banana · August 2017

Everything about PVP is terrible

Vapirko · August 2017

ku5h wrote: »

I actually think small scalers are biggest crybabies. Groups of 4-8 TSed players run around and basicly Xv1ing ppl 1 by 1, but when group double their size comes and wipes them, they cry zergers. IMO small scalers have biggest delusions of grandeur, but in reality they are mostly fighting with advantage over oponents.

Absolutely the worst offenders, good at outnumbering randos that stream out at them. Solo players or 2 man groups I have respect for and am working on getting better at it myself. It's not just exploitation not by a long shot. But man those salty small scale groups that will happily Xv1 people all day and then rage tell when they end up getting out numbered after setting up shop near a keep lol. Like the just expect people to let them sit there.

WhiteMage · August 2017

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Saint314Louis1985 wrote: »

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

generalmyrick wrote: »

1 shield stacking, talon spamming, spear chucking, mass hysteria casting can beat 10 casual players.

If somebody can do all that, yes I imagine they might beat 10 players

you havent heard of the sorcplardragonblade class?

I thought he was talking about the nightplar sorcknight..

Sorcblade dragonplar?
Nightknight Temperer?

badmojo wrote: »

WhiteMage wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

Getting killed is often the best way to get to where your fighting will make a difference. While you are running laps around a rock with 10 amature players the skilled ones are taking your stuff.

On the other hand, that's 10 other players that aren't doing anything productive either.

That's certainly the justification people love to use. I'm just not sure it's actually as effective as its being portrayed as. Any player would have a very difficult time 1v10'ing if those 10 players were highly skilled. You might waste the time of 10 unskilled players, but then your assuming those 10 unskilled players would change the outcome of the battle they're being held back from, that's the part I don't agree with. If players can't deal with a guy running around a rock, they could be just as useless on the front lines. On the other side, a player 1vXing is probably skilled enough to be valuable on the front lines.

Point is, it's easy to claim you're effecting the war through distraction, because it's virtually impossible to prove it either way. In the best case scenario, sure they're going to be effective, but in many other cases I think people are just making excuses for their favorite mini-game. Which is fine, play how you want, but I'm not going to pretend that wasting enemy players time is the best use of their time, I would rather see them fighting next to me capping and defending the objectives that matter most to the overall war.

As a dabbler in the art of 1vX, I care very little about the "war." Idgaf about what the zergs are doing, so long as it's away from me. In the year and a half I've been PvPing, I've sieged my fill of each keep. I don't care about them outside of their uses as spawn points and AP gain, and occasionally as a battlefield. Most of the time, I don't care who owns Fort Ash, etc. I PvP because I literally like to PvP. The fights are fun and little else. But only certain kinds of fights: fights where I can feel my contribution to the outcome. If there are 20 other players on my side, I'm not contributing meaningfully relative to the accomplishments of the collective group. That's boring. I go out of my way to find stragglers and kill them because if I win and when I die, it was probably my decisions that were ultimately responsible.

I don't think it should be about "winning" because you can't actually win, after all. I am not satisfied by the carrot and stick that ESO presents me. The first time I played I probably was, but the useless rewards certainly don't encourage anyone to care about the arbitrary rules they set. Campaign health is a far more rewarding thing to persue, and that's not about subjugating your enemies, it's about participating in enjoyable fights for both sides so that everyone can win and keep winning and keep playing.

Because the "war" is perpetual, it should be in everyone's best interests to keep it that way.

out51d3r · August 2017

generalmyrick wrote: »

Small group porponents (1vxer elitists!) who like to 1vx are just folks who can cheese (take advantage of mechanics)

Mechanics are what define a game. There is nothing wrong with "taking advantage" of them. It's a game, the person that uses the mechanics most successfully should win.

sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub

idk · August 2017

Zerging has been in Cyrodiil since day one. Early on it was zerging just for the sake of zerging. Long chains of players just going around cleaning up anything they found, going so far and putting down a camp to keep the group going. They did not care about keeps or resources.

To a large degree zergs like what I am trying to explain are not as prevalent, More often tactics are used today to farm AP by taking something.

Finding ways to defeat a zergs was what followed. For the which came first, the zerg or the zerg buster, it was the Zerg. How can someone say 1vXers use cheese to bust the zerg when a zerg is the ultimate cheese.

Edit: Further, the example OP provides is not even cheese. It is a player merely about to get the attention of someone who is willing to fall for the trap. Really not something to complain about. The lambs to the slaughter hopefully learned a valuable lesson, otherwise, well, they will keep falling for the same old trick, lol

Feanor · August 2017

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

generalmyrick wrote: »

zergs are bad, zergs this, zergs that....blah blah blah ;-)

Small group porponents (1vxer elitists!) who like to 1vx are just folks who can cheese (take advantage of mechanics) the best and dislike that NUMBERS > Abuse of Mechanics. In its own way, zerging has risen to counter the fact that 1 shield stacking, talon spamming, spear chucking, mass hysteria casting can beat 10 casual players.

Consider the progression;
1 guy running circles around a tree has got the attention of random casual player going to attack a castle.

casual player peels from group to get murdered by the 1vxer.

casaul player calls for help (it starts!)

1vxer wins again and continues to win until...

the call for help reaches such proportion that the 1vxer is finally killed...

And so mad that they come to the forums complaining about (insert skill here) and that it needs to be nerfed and zerglings are skill-less potatoes. (not realizing they were superior in skill and experience and mechanic knowledge in the first place...but its not enough, they need MORE power to dominate.)

well, whatcha think?

Has it ever occured to you that most solo players would never label themselves as 1vXers but are just seasoned PvPers who like to roam solo? Why putting people in categories? This whole "us" (poor casual butterflies) versus "them" (angry sociopathic 1vXers) thingy is something you create in your mind to feel better... about what? Wouldn't it be far more interesting and revealing to do some research on your own behavior and why you feel the need to react that way? Pretty sure you would be pretty chill about that issue afterwards.

I am pretty casual, too. But no matter how bad I was I would always choose to go solo over grouping up, because the process of becoming a better player is the most fun for me in gaming and grouping up is not helping in that regard. It is a fact though, that 90% of the people rolling in bigger groups (at least on my server PC EU) don't even try to go out there solo, take the losses, learn from it and finally become a better player.

Thats what makes a potato a potato - the unwillingness to learn how to pvp, instead compensating with numbers and still pointing fingers, labeling people - desperately trying to blame someone for never being brave enough to discover their own pvp capabilities.

You're certainly not casual @Mojomonkeyman

But I agree with your statement. I always run solo myself for the reason that I can do what I want then, have no obligations to follow any crown or heed any command, and can even get afk killed if I need a break. That's all not possible in a group because for me being in group brings responsibility towards the other players. You should be bringing your best always when you're grouping up.

I'm not a 1vXer though. And I don't publish videos either. So there is a distinct line between solo and 1vX.

As for explaining zerging with a counter to 1vX, that's simply a fabricated excuse. Most people Zerg just because it's easier. Plain and simple.

scrobey · August 2017

I don't whine when I'm zerged down, I find it funny how far a group of 10 will chase one person to be honest.

Biro123 · August 2017

Vapirko wrote: »

ku5h wrote: »

I actually think small scalers are biggest crybabies. Groups of 4-8 TSed players run around and basicly Xv1ing ppl 1 by 1, but when group double their size comes and wipes them, they cry zergers. IMO small scalers have biggest delusions of grandeur, but in reality they are mostly fighting with advantage over oponents.

Absolutely the worst offenders, good at outnumbering randos that stream out at them. Solo players or 2 man groups I have respect for and am working on getting better at it myself. It's not just exploitation not by a long shot. But man those salty small scale groups that will happily Xv1 people all day and then rage tell when they end up getting out numbered after setting up shop near a keep lol. Like the just expect people to let them sit there.

Gotta say, that's what I find too. I mean, not all small-scalers, but there IS a number of them who will happily gang up on soloers but cry foul when they are outnumbered.
The only thing I don't like is hypocrisy.

Runschei · August 2017

That's the only situation I'll slot agony and use it, then run with my group towards the targeted keep.

Thogard · August 2017

LegacyDM wrote: »

The only problem I have with 1vxers is that when I See them I can't help myself but kill them. Then I get a rage tell from them telling me to stop ruining their 1vx. I ask them why and it's because within the elite pvp community it's not socially acceptable for other elite pvpers to jump in a 1vx. Apparently, 1vx is only reserved for killing noobs. I've ignored the rage tells and now I am blacklisted within the elite pvper community as a Zerg surfer.

dude... seriously... you're too good to add onto fights.

Kr3do · August 2017

Shoutout to the OP for those constructive, helpful and mature answers!

generalmyrick wrote: »

Aelakhaii_De_Mythos wrote: »

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

Has it ever occured to you that most solo players would never label themselves as 1vXers but are just seasoned PvPers who like to roam solo? Why putting people in categories? This whole "us" (poor casual butterflies) versus "them" (angry sociopathic 1vXers) thingy is something you create in your mind to feel better... about what? Wouldn't it be far more interesting and revealing to do some research on your own behavior and why you feel the need to react that way? Pretty sure you would be pretty chill about that issue afterwards.

I am pretty casual, too. But no matter how bad I was I would always choose to go solo over grouping up, because the process of becoming a better player is the most fun for me in gaming and grouping up is not helping in that regard. It is a fact though, that 90% of the people rolling in bigger groups (at least on my server PC EU) don't even try to go out there solo, take the losses, learn from it and finally become a better player.

Thats what makes a potato a potato - the unwillingness to learn how to pvp, instead compensating with numbers and still pointing fingers, labeling people - desperately trying to blame someone for never being brave enough to discover their own pvp capabilities.

Nice post, i'm pretty sure most of the good pvp players agree with this aswell.

Small group porponents (1vxer elitists!) who like to 1vx are just folks who can cheese (take advantage of mechanics) the best and dislike that NUMBERS > Abuse of Mechanics. In its own way, zerging has risen to counter the fact that 1 shield stacking, talon spamming, spear chucking, mass hysteria casting can beat 10 casual players.

I shouldnt even comment on this tbh... but i'll do it anyways. If you hold those opinions then you're in all likelyhood not a very able player...

It is people like you and those who agree with you who have destroyed pvp and made ESO a less skilled game.

You were my sun, you were my earth
But you didn't know all the ways I loved you, no
So you took a chance, made other plans
But I bet you didn't think that they would come crashing down, no
You don't have to say, what you did
I already know, I found out from him
Now there's just no chance
With you and me
There'll never be
Don't it make you sad about it?
You told me you love me
Why did you leave me all alone
Now you tell me you need me
When you call me on the phone
Girl I refuse
You must have me confused with some other guy
The bridges were burned
Now it's your turn, to cry
Cry me a river
Cry me a river
Cry me a river
Cry me a river