Fix the guards right freakin now

TheAngelofDeath99 · August 2017

40k worth of stolen goods and with A FULL BAR OF STAMINA I cannot break free from petrify. Die, lose it all. I am the Vestige, defeater of Molag Bal, yet I cannot fight a guard, much less break free? Fix your game ZOS.

inb4 "hurr durr shudnta gotta caught"
- Fair argument, but what happened to the other games where you could get your goods back? At least add a chest in that requires a master lock, and is surrounded by guards. At least we have a chance at getting our stuff back.

Also, why are the Thieves Guild footpads only OUTSIDE? If they can instantly disappear surely they should be able to do it inside too.
And that *** reveal. My thief toon is a nb, but why OH WHY must the guard use the flare, then an unbreakable CC after? Guards are OP enough as it is. I'm sure many people (myself included) use a Magblade with cloak as their thief, so it is just *** that the guard uses a flare+we cannot go back to stealth+the guard uses petrify+cannot break free WITH A FULL STAM BAR= Death in one heavy hit.

What are your thoughts on the guards? Do they need to be reworked, even if they are still invincible?

Sorry about the first part had to blow off some steam.

UPDATE: I took the one person's suggestion about using mist form, and it's worked out great so far. But remember, the problem here is not that I lost 40k worth of stolen goods (which sucks but I can always just steal more easily), the problem is that I could not break free with a FULL BAR OF STAMINA. This is a problem that has been seeing many times in PvP and PvE. If it is not going to be fixed, then imo, the guards should not be able to spam CC, even if there are hard counters.

[Edit for profanity]

HorrorShow · August 2017

I don't understand why the guards are so tough. Not like we need the protection from enemy faction attacks.

Because they don't allow enemy faction attacks.

Maybe they should allow enemy faction attacks. Then the tough guards would actually make sense.

Swifigames · August 2017

Anyone else notice the guards' health bars? They list at 10.4 million HP just before highlighting as a solid gold bar.
Not sure it was like that before a month or two ago...I never noticed it at least.

So can we kill a guard with a zerg?

MLGProPlayer · August 2017

rekt

Alpheu5 · August 2017

Hue hue, thou shan't have been seized such like thine mother's chastity.

Heroeric1337 · August 2017

I dont think petrify was designed to be a ability that can be broken free from. Pretty sure its like that in PVP. I dont know why it would be any different with the guards

Hippie4927 · August 2017

My thieves are all vampires. I use vampire mist form and the guards can't touch me!

Necrelios · August 2017

There is a couple of different gear options that will make it so you can outrun their flare while in stealth and if you become a vamp and use elusive mist you are immune to all of their cc's. Just a couple of options, but I still believe immortal AI will be the downfall of humanity one day so I'm not a fan of this trend in particular.

platonicidealgirlfriend · August 2017

Double check your bindings? I've broken out of petrify constantly. Retreating maneuver helps too.

ETA: the standard mapped M1+M2 can be finicky depending on a number of factors, so you might consider switching it to an additional single binding.

smtdbplus · August 2017

TheAngelofDeath99 wrote: »

I am the Vestige, defeater of Molag Bal

Everyone in Tamriel is the Vestige and defeated Molag Bal. May be the guards did that many times before your arrival.

You may not be as special as you think.

Taleof2Cities · August 2017

theroyalestpythonnub18_ESO · August 2017

Swifigames wrote: »

Anyone else notice the guards' health bars? They list at 10.4 million HP just before highlighting as a solid gold bar.
Not sure it was like that before a month or two ago...I never noticed it at least.

So can we kill a guard with a zerg?

iirc guards have an attack called riot control which will instagib anyone in a zerg before they even come close to killing them

Malic · August 2017

Well this clown has a point, he is the vestige, defeated molag bal and is pretty tight with meridia and sheogorath.

You should fill out a ticket, they'll never reply and you'll probably be punished for your insolence but you'll be a forum hero for 2-3 minutes, maybe luck out and and get 5 awesomes on a sat morning.

Go get em little buckaroo.

TheShadowScout · August 2017

TheAngelofDeath99 wrote: »

40k worth of stolen goods and with A FULL BAR OF STAMINA I cannot break free from petrify. Die, lose it all. I am the Vestige, defeater of Molag Bal, yet I cannot fight a guard...?

But of course.
Working as intended.
If you could fight off the guards with impunity, the thieving game would be turned unplayable by jerks, and the criminal system would become worthless.

(though I admit they should have been handled differently... maybe with them being just normal mobs, but firing off some "capture criminal" spell at 50% HP that auto-arrests you, wraps you in mystical chains for them to search and process instead of being godlike guards)

And you -don't- carry that much loot. You take a dash to the outlaw refugee fence before it gets that much. That way your losses never go too high...

And remember to save your TG speechcraft for when you found something -really- nifty.

TheAngelofDeath99 wrote: »

what happened to the other games where you could get your goods back?

Weren't "your" goods. You stole them, you got caught, the guard gave them back to their original owners, end of story.

TheAngelofDeath99 wrote: »

Also, why are the Thieves Guild footpads only OUTSIDE?

Where else would you expect random allies to be? Standing inside a residental building?? Where would be the sense in that?
The footpads are random thieves that spot guards chasing you, and decide to offer a helping hand. They are thus only in places where one might expect to meet "random thieves" - aka, the streets!

TheAngelofDeath99 wrote: »

...but why OH WHY must the guard use the flare, then an unbreakable CC after?

...exactly so magblades -don't- get a free ride! (not anymore at any rate)

Here's what you do next time - break out your selfheals, and run. Just run. Jump down some ledge if the city has one to use their pathing against them, and run. Run out of the city, or better to the pier if present and jump into the water, then swim away. They will use their chains to pull you back, but you can jist heal their blows and keep running. I escaped dozends of angry guards that way - if my nightblade tries to stealth, I get instakilled, but if i just run, I have a good chance of getting away.

If they catch you inside some house, you are most likely fu... uhm... in deep doo-doo. But its still possible to loose them -just- long enough to use the door in some houses (the ones where you can take a jump shortcut to -again- use the guards pathing against them - run up the first floor, jump down, grab for the door, hope they are slow enough you will be able to dash out just as they come to hit you again for the "in combat" timer - sometimes it works, more often not, so don't go burglaring laden with goodies)

ThePrinceOfBargains · August 2017

What kind of moron carries around 40k worth of stolen goods with a bounty on their head? That's grounds for an immediate visit to the Outlaw Refuge. The ones in Rawl'kha and Anvil are right next to the wayshrine with no guards.

That said, I do think the law system in this game is one of the worst, most nonsensical I've ever seen. Needs to be reworked.

max_only · August 2017

Running works. Also the potions you get from thieves caches.

Mostly running though....

I've never been petrified, I wonder if they bust out the big spells depending on how much you are worth? Like only chains for under 200g?

Animal_Mother · August 2017

Here, I thought ZOS made the guards easier.

I've outran at least 5 since Morrowind including a level 3 alt in Seyda Neen who was falsely accused of walking off with the Governor's personal effects.

Betsararie · August 2017

I can't remember the last time I've been killed by a guard.

If you have a bounty, just avoid them.

Rapid maneuver is a skill that is available to all classes, it will grant you major gallop, increasing your mounted speed by 40%.

You can use this to speed past guards and to safety.

TheAngelofDeath99 · August 2017

Hippie4927 wrote: »

My thieves are all vampires. I use vampire mist form and the guards can't touch me!

Am I vamp myself, guess I'll try that so I can avoid this BS again.

Slick_007 · August 2017

i got busted in daggerfall castle stealing the treasure for karis hit list. popped stealth pot - guards stood around for a bit then said 'musta been my imagination' and left.

piece. of. cake.

CastaLyron · August 2017

If they weren't like this, ppl would kill all the guards and npc just for the lulz. Wish it wasn't like that, but it's necessary.

Onigar · August 2017

I look at it this way the guards are as tough as they are to make you into a better thief

When I sometimes get killed and lose all my loot I dont blame the guards but blame myself for not being careful enough.

Rohamad_Ali · August 2017

Immortall guards are lore breaking . There is no lore to support them . Should be removed immediately followed by an apology from the lore team . There needs to be continuity checks that support the brand . The Role Play community hath spoken !

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom We humbly request a full RP explanation for these invincible NPCs from Lawrence .

Slick_007 · August 2017

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Immortall guards are lore breaking . There is no lore to support them . Should be removed immediately followed by an apology from the lore team . There needs to be continuity checks that support the brand . The Role Play community hath spoken !

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom We humbly request a full RP explanation for these invincible NPCs from Lawrence .

why do you think molag bal hasnt just appeared in a town? those guards are fully sick bro!

STEVIL · August 2017

TheAngelofDeath99 wrote: »

40k worth of stolen goods and with A FULL BAR OF STAMINA I cannot break free from petrify. Die, lose it all. I am the Vestige, defeater of Molag Bal, yet I cannot fight a guard, much less break free? Fix your game ZOS.

inb4 "hurr durr shudnta gotta caught"
- Fair argument, but what happened to the other games where you could get your goods back? At least add a chest in that requires a master lock, and is surrounded by guards. At least we have a chance at getting our stuff back.

Also, why are the Thieves Guild footpads only OUTSIDE? If they can instantly disappear surely they should be able to do it inside too.
And that [snip] reveal. My thief toon is a nb, but why OH WHY must the guard use the flare, then an unbreakable CC after? Guards are OP enough as it is. I'm sure many people (myself included) use a Magblade with cloak as their thief, so it is just r*tarded that the guard uses a flare+we cannot go back to stealth+the guard uses petrify+cannot break free WITH A FULL STAM BAR= Death in one heavy hit.

What are your thoughts on the guards? Do they need to be reworked, even if they are still invincible?

Sorry about the first part had to blow off some steam.

to me if you cannot manage your crime better than described in your opening, maybe try other content.

there are multiple ways in the game to deal with "i got bounty and tons of good on me" that do not involve any risk of guards - for one who plans ahead.

having guards be major pains that cannot be killed means that they become a DIFFERENT type of challenge.

Ok so i get it. For some its not good enough that 99.9999999999999999999% of the casual repeatable content is "win with DPS" (more or less) and having any casual repeatable content at all where "evasion" or "stealth" or "planning" are prioritized over "do mo' damage bro'" and so unkillable guards you have to evade/escape are an abomination unto creation... but me, and maybe a few others, we kinda like having that "other flavor" of ice cream in the ESO Robbins Parlor.

So, no, from my POV we do not need to change the guards and remove their unkillable and put "mo' damage bro'" in as a key to victory for that last bit'o'content.

if anything, i want more of the casual repeatable but not solved by "mo' damage bro'" one club fits all gameplay..

I think a major omission from Morrowind was not having "freeing slaves" be an added "injustice" activity that prompted bounty if caught, guards out to get you, etc and provided its own achieves and unlocks.

idk · August 2017

1. passive to force the lock. Have not found a safe box that did not have a few moments to crack it open meaning there is enough time to pick it if one is fast.
2. invis potions. As long as you have not been attacked for a few seconds you can get through a door. Then of course sneak and avoid getting caught a second time but it is easy to outrun the guards anyhow.
3. I have only experienced not being able to break free in PvP, sometimes, not from a guard CC which is usually petrify.

Really have not found the guards to be much of a challenge. Cannot kill them but easy to outrun.

Drummerx04 · August 2017

Swifigames wrote: »

Anyone else notice the guards' health bars? They list at 10.4 million HP just before highlighting as a solid gold bar.
Not sure it was like that before a month or two ago...I never noticed it at least.

So can we kill a guard with a zerg?

I soloed a town guard to 0 health once, it took 15 minutes. I had heard that the guards were immortal. Surprise! they are indeed immortal. Their attacks also deal stacking oblivion damage, so if you take too many hits in a row, they will one shot you through any defenses.

So to answer the obvious question: Something I did - I don't know what - glitched out the town guard and he only came after me with uppercuts and talons, so he was pretty easy to dodge.

But about OP getting flared... HAHAHA now you know how the stealth aspect of this game feels for everyone else.

Rohamad_Ali · August 2017

Slick_007 wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Immortall guards are lore breaking . There is no lore to support them . Should be removed immediately followed by an apology from the lore team . There needs to be continuity checks that support the brand . The Role Play community hath spoken !

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom We humbly request a full RP explanation for these invincible NPCs from Lawrence .

why do you think molag bal hasnt just appeared in a town? those guards are fully sick bro!

Still requires a back story for their immortality .

In past ES titles guards are killable but more and more keep spawning until the player has to flee or be over run . Much more lore friendly and challenging as the area gets more saturated with law enforcement , repeat crimes in the area becomes more difficult .

ArchMikem · August 2017

How in the world did you get 40k worth of stolen items on you at one time?

idk · August 2017

ArchMikem wrote: »

How in the world did you get 40k worth of stolen items on you at one time?

True. If it was actually the case the next question is why the heck did he risk all that loot. Does not seem to be the prudent way to thieve.

Pele · August 2017

You can break out of petrify. I say this as a thieving little *** who gets petrified by guards all the time. The most trouble I have with guards is breaking out of their talons, but that's because I personally have issues with dodge rolling.

Also, I think the immortal guards are fine, and their damage is fine. The only time I've been oneshot by a guard was when I was testing their limits. I attacked then ran out of range to heal to full. I did this a few times then it suddenly oneshot me instead of the usual talons, chains, and petrify.

There have been some awesome tips given on how to successfully get away from guards. Try it. Good luck!