I don't know man. We've played the same period on the same server. What I remember from back then is,... PC transfers, tons and tons of OP players spanking noobs left and right. There wasn't even a cap on those players CP back then. Wrecking blow empowering itself, and Incap, and take flight.
Endless ball groups of MagSorc's. Templar jabs stunning players, over and over. Stats and gear won fights back then.

Proc sets are painful to deal with. The fact that they are the hardest hitting skills of most builds that run them still amazes me. But I've never seen a new player simply slot some gear and win with it. Ambush>Proc>Incap>Proc>killers blade is sure effective, but it's not exactly going win in group scenarios regardless. That squishy build is only good against solo, unsuspecting, players with defenses down.

But I do feel that from last patch to this, PvP is in a much better place. Last patch was the worst it's ever been. And the CP system was clearly to blame. But I can't say it's all doom and gloom. The game was never a tryhard haven of competitive balance, not even close. And improvements are happening.

Blobsky wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Don't agree with the sensational title, but many of your points are bang on.

Does feel like ur a stam player with a slight bias so nervous it was a nerf Sorc thread in disguise.

But I agree with most. Personally I think the streamers wreck the game. They male this 'meta' BS amd everyone flocks to it for easy mode.

If everyone theory crafted and built they own way game would be way more interesting.....its bending a knee to.the casuals that's wrecked it..

Yo i dont even use procs and make my own meta as a streamer

mmmmmmmm.....

did i miss something or you use valkin skoria on your dk ( yesterday i was fighting you and i crealy saw the proc)
the stamina + health proc in your "torpedo" build is also a .... PROC
you even have a "proctard" build.
poisons are... a 20% chance proc

Don't do the white knight is useless, lots of sets in the game contains a "proc" but is ok
Stacking them is the issue , not having 1 proc set ( offensive or defensive) in your build and honestly you are one of the last streamers who keep the thing soft , i can't say the same about others.

QuebraRegra wrote: »

if you don't like the current state of the game's combat, take your complaints to WROBEL!

Ah nostalgia for previous iterations of the game... I'd like to roll back to 1.5 or there abouts, I think softcaps made for far better build diversity, where it was no advantage to simply stack a single stat. Every character invested into both skill pools to be effective. More variety.

<<<<<< SNIP>>>>

.

Had to quote this as people still do that with the game better not named and want the Developers to open a Vanilla server

There's always going to be those players. Although I personally would return to the Game not to be named if they opened a Vanilla server.

Games change. Not necessarily for the better.

Want an interesting example.

A WoW hunter. Currently, you find the pet you want, tame him, and it's yours. Easy. Weapon: Gun or Bow, switch if and when you feel like it. And that's basically the whole thing. Don't need bullets or arrows, your weapon never runs out of ammo.

In the old days: There were some skills you had to learn to properly tame a pet. Sometimes the lion tamed the hunter, so usually you had a friend go with you to help you. I remember dying at least 4 times during the process.

There were two trainers, one trained you in different hunter skills, the other trained your pet in his skills. You had to go to town and learn your skills and the pet learned his, and not necessary at the same time, different levels = different time(s). And those training sessions were not free, so you needed money to pay the trainers. Oh, these trainers were not available in every city, so you had to research where they were for your or your pet's training level, travel there and back - more money. Sometimes a trainer was on a different continent.

Now, your pet gets hungry during the day, whether you're just riding around or are in a 20-man raid. So, you had to go out and find the appropriate animal to kill so you could feed your pet. But different animals required different food items (lions, birds, or spiders don't all eat the same thing), so you had to find out what your pet eats and then go out in the wilderness and kill whatever provided that food. I made good money getting different animal parts and sold them on the auction house so other pet owners could get their food that way.

If you had a gun, you needed bullets - you had to buy those and needed money for that. If you had a bow, you needed arrows - you had to buy those, too.

Some of us had 3-4 different pets depending on what type mission you were doing because pets had different abilities/spells they could use. Now you needed to carry different food with you, because when the raid leader told you to be ready in 10 minutes to jump in the raid for someone who couldn't make it, that was not the time to worry about food, bullets, arrows, etc.

Oh, and great times were had often when players who didn't pay attention to their stuff asked the raid leader in the middle of a raid if they could leave to go and buy more bullets, food, arrows, etc. They didn't come back to the raid. I know of several guilds that had high-level raid teams where players got kicked from the guild when they ran out of bullets during a raid.

I probably missed some stuff here, but just to give you an idea how far these changes go. I think the simplification has gone too far, but it's too late because you can't go back.

And, I keep mentioning money. You still had to go out and quest because you needed to level up, you needed to learn professions (trainers there, too). You needed to figure out how to make money to pay for stuff. It was a great game back then because of all the stuff you had to do. You also had a responsibility to your guild, your guild mates, etc. That is all gone now.

/end rant

6

Things started going wrong when they scrapped this early design (which was much more traditional MMO)

Best. Post. Ever.

Tandor wrote: »

I guess it all depends on how you play the game and what you look for in it. Personally, I have been playing since PC launch and continue to subscribe (on two accounts), don't use the crown shop, don't buy crown crates, adapt to the changes in as much as they ever affect me, and continue to play and enjoy the game just the same as when I started. The game was great for me when it started, and it's improved consistently ever since. However, I neither PvP nor do competitive PvE, and that doubtless accounts for a lot of my enjoyment with the way the game has developed as well as going some way to explaining why I've never had any performance issues with it. I'd like a proper trading system but apart from that I think they're doing a pretty decent job with the game. So for me at least, and I know I'm not alone, this thread is based on a false premise.

This is clearly a pvp topic lol. If you dont pvp then you cant possibly understand the issue.

For me it sometimes feels like the coding is done by interns that don't understand what consequences the last code writer would run into if having to rewrite a particular section . Take the CC immunity bug we have right now . Instead of a hotfix , everyone in PVP is stuck with broken cc for months . So players just start spamming old CC's because what else can you do except sploit the system right back at the players doing it to them . Now every DK is slotting talons and every Mage has mines out . NBs spam cripple and on and on . So the entire mess multiplies every day in Cyrodiil until some people just bail out or add to the mess . All over something in another big MMO that would be prioritized and fixed in a few days or a week maybe . Here we wait for everything to hopefully be fixed in the next patch . Basically players are always dealing with one thing or another . Playing other games I just see fixes come out way faster .

I basically fell in love with the original creation of ESO and still to this day hold expectations of quality , foolishly or not , to the original dev team when I first started up in 2014 . I want the current team to get better and start making changes for the better . I want the game to last a long time and grow not shrink . Someone at the top has to see that over time we have lost a lot of people on PC since launch day . Console launch seemed much stronger then today too . If it were my business I would be trying to get those people back in and sinking resources into quality control and people that can produce content without breaking a lot of other things . I know it's easy to say then to do but I hope that is their focus soon . Players only hold out for so long if a game keeps breaking . The longer the wait for fixes the more people walk away in frustration . We need improvements .

Removing of the scaling
Botter which are ignored too long
No GMs anymore
Proc Sets
Miss-designed champion point system
Bugs which are existing for too long

It could be a rly awesome game but it isnt.

ZOS missing the red line where the game should go

i assumed this was a full game thing not a Pvp only thing....

My comments on Pvp: will never be balanced will always be meta builds.

Yubarius wrote: »

Well I for one can't wait for next patch because proc sets are FINALLY getting a real nerf instead of the weak attempt given a couple patches ago.

1. Tremorscale will have a 1 second delay
2. Viper is a dot, FUCKIKG FINALLY
3. Red Mountain spawns some *** mini volcano ore something, I just know it's not good

I too miss the good old days when armor only dictated which stats you wanted to up the most. Do you want more crit, wpn/spell damage, do you wanna bump your health stam or mag a lot? I hate that so many sets in this game give free and RELIABLE damage.

Yet skoria is still OP and selene is still gonna hit harder than ults.

Zbigb4life wrote: »

The game is dying

Nah the game itself is healty...
This is the problem, they will not realize what is wrong with the game till is full of people who play only the single player aspect of it,
all the people who play in a more mmo oriented way is complayning but since we are a minority no one listen.
This game is becoming more and more skyrim with people around...

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@leepalmer95

I think the philosophy that new players should feel "powerful" as well is to blame. This led to introducing high damage proc sets (so that you can get a kill off a better player regardless of your own skill) and to that "raise the floor" mantra. I don't think this will change, as ZOS seems to target players who stay for some weeks at best as their main audience now.

Yeah same, the whole making new players feel like they can compete was a stupid idea.

New players should get thrown into the 1-50 pvp campaign. They're new and should play with new players until they aren't.

This is an MMO, the simple fact is new players are not mean't to compete with long term players when they first start. They aren't mean't to get to that level for a while, its a MMO not a moba. The longer term players have experience, gear and level on them. It's not like they won't even be able to get to that level, thats a catchup mechanic on cp, theres a cap on cp. Gear can all be farmed but the experienced needs to be learned.

Zos went about it the wrong way. They should of locked new players without cp into a under 50 campaign which is locked for people with no cp only. Let them learn and compete with new players similar to them. It's way more than what i got when i first started xD You got battle leveled to 50 and thats it, you hit vet 1 and life got hard.

not everyone is new to mmo, and not everyone wants to always start at ground zero with new to mmo people. I've been playing mmo for over 10 years, and though i'm new to eso, I'm not helpless.

threads like this never end well. I've seen it time and again, and your attitude is very much against mmo. Older mmo never had petty locks outside of levels. Even in WoW on pvp servers they never locked new and old players. Locking new players with new players only does a disservice to mmo life. Content gets old eventually, and not a ton of new people flood the gates. It looks bad from a mmo-pvp stand point if only 2-5 ppl are in the pvp zone.

which is what happens when you lock it. ff11 was a lot like this early on, friends couldn't play together or level together if 1 was 10 levels higher then the other, it took a levelsync system to help late joiners out. System like these are put into mmo to keep content full of people, new and old. Having a lock will make people quict because of lack of people doing the content at their level.

agegarton wrote: »

I'm left wondering what game you're playing. In my opinion - someone who has been playing since the Beta, and who has completed almost all content - this game is great and going (generally) in the right direction.

There are some bugs, but millions fewer than there were at launch. There's also tons of new content, and a truly massive area to explore. It's a highly complex game spread across multiple platforms, so it's never going to be bug free. What piece of software is, these days?

As for changes, I have lost track of the number of times a small number of people have cried out about something new. The game has always moved forward, and rarely have the complainers been right (remember when the destro staff ulti was weak and rubbish, only to find that it's actually not; remember when the Warden was going to OP against every other class, only to find that it's not; remember when the regen changes were going to break the game, only to find they didn't; remember when One Tamriel was going to break all of the servers, only to find that it didn't - I could go on and on).

Ultimately, if you don't like the game, don't play it. You're going to find that creating a post that ambiguously whinges about it won't actually change anything.

Again its reminiscing. Also this post is about Pvp. Pvp has not gotten better at all.

Maybe you think its getting better, personally i don't see how.

Theres bugs that have been in the game for years without being fixed.

Warden is OP is certain situations, bird spam is broken.

Destro ult was going to be weak, originally is was half the dmg it is now. Which would of been 20%~ lower dmg than bats.

Regen changes would of been great but then zos decided to buff heavy attack return for some reason which pretty much countered the changes.

Honestly i barely play the game much nowdays, getting tired of being dissapointed every DLC.

Usually some half ass cheap dlc which is usually pretty bad and usually broken on release and is broken for months after.

Then the balance changes usually fail to completely address issues of previous patches, zos brings some half assed band aids fixes which only hurt the game long term.

Then they fail to actually listen to most problems and suggestions people say and things that are broke remain broke for another 3 months.

Oh they usually throw on something to kill 1vX or duo pvp even more at the end of the 4th pts. Doubling cost poisons when they was brought out, the random 100% gap closer snare, making something uncounterable etc..