Snakeblood (Alchemy) and PvP poisons

PS4_ZeColmeia · August 2017

Dear @ZOS_GinaBruno,

How are you? I'm good and I've been mostly a good ESO player so far this year. I hope that for Update 15 you can grant me a wish?

See, I've been playing on this single character since PS4 launch and I do everything on him: crafting, healing, tanking, DPS, PvE and PvP. I love my character and I have every skill line maxed, even bows, and 2H that I don't have the skill points to even use. I just have this issue.

I feel that enchants should be a comparable choice to poisons in PvP. I want to first applaud the team on buffing enchants a few updates ago and the buff to infused have greatly contributed to this! Thank you! The issues is update 14. In a vacuum, the aforementioned changes to enchants would have mostly balanced the 2 out. However, now with Update 14 regen changes and the addition of assassin's guile, I feel that this swung the balance hard towards poison. Additionally, while people can wear armor, elemental glyphs, sets that block spell types, etc. to counter the things that weapon glyphs do (obviously leaving out oblivion damage).

Poisons however really only have CP stars (3 of them but you only have to counter those 3 CP stars with a single 1 CP star), 1-2 mundus stones, soon to be prosperous, and regen orientated sets. The issue is that while counters to increased damage via glyphs is abundant, numerous, and most importantly, integrated within DPS sets to allow minimal impact to DPS unless you want to really get tanky, the only counter to poisons is to abandon DPS and become a regen monkey. I want something other than a lump of coal for Update 15 and only you can help.

Remember I said I do everything on 1 character? well I have this hole in the alchemy set called Snakeblood. It's so underutilized I'm sure you forgot about it so let me remind you: its to avoid poisoning yourself when drinking essence potions. Did I mention that there is no essence combination for potions that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits? I've been studying really hard so you should totally remember that when I get to asking for my wish.

So I'll get to it, instead of making this passive only benefit those that are too lazy to search on Google or trial and error not poisoning themselves, can you just make Snakeblood have an additional trait to mitigate when others poison you too? I can understand not letting it be 100% like when you are sabotaging yourself, but having a useful secondary trait for this unused passive and it would be a bit more balanced in its approach to have more sources to counter measure poison without gimping yourself everywhere else.

Thanks and here's to hoping that you don't want to give me a lump of coal!

/signed

me

SodanTok · August 2017

Dont forget there are other poisons than cost poisons. Making every one of them useless so cost poisons arent too good is hardly viable strategy is it?

I guess without addons it is not that obvious (or maybe console meta is different), but non cost poisons are super rare already. Three of four damaging poisons aren't even working since Morrowind and nearly no one noticed.

And we are just now approaching meta where infused got buffed and sharpened nerfed. That is very strong and obvious buff to enchants. Enchants that were already better than most poisons last patch.

Maryal · August 2017

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

Dear @ZOS_GinaBruno,

Remember I said I do everything on 1 character? well I have this hole in the alchemy set called Snakeblood. It's so underutilized I'm sure you forgot about it so let me remind you: its to avoid poisoning yourself when drinking essence potions. Did I mention that there is no essence combination for potions that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits? I've been studying really hard so you should totally remember that when I get to asking for my wish.

So I'll get to it, instead of making this passive only benefit those that are too lazy to search on Google or trial and error not poisoning themselves, can you just make Snakeblood have an additional trait to mitigate when others poison you too? I can understand not letting it be 100% like when you are sabotaging yourself, but having a useful secondary trait for this unused passive and it would be a bit more balanced in its approach to have more sources to counter measure poison without gimping yourself everywhere else.

Thanks and here's to hoping that you don't want to give me a lump of coal!

/signed

me

I don't understand what you mean by the top paragraph ... the part that says: " No essence combination ... that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits?"

As far as the second paragraph, you incorrectly assume the ONLY time someone would create a potion that included a negative effect was due to laziness, yada yada.

You know, some ingredients are rather difficult to come by (doesn't matter if you are farming them or buying them in the guild store). If you run out of something you normally use to make your potion, there is often an alternative combination that will work, except that it also produces a negative effect. That is where snakeblood comes in. If you have fully maxed it out, you won't be effected by any negative effect contained in your potion. Basically, the passive expands the options you have when crafting your potions. If you were truly a Master Crafter, or Master Alchemist, you would have known this, rather than putting your foot in your mouth.

Best wishes.

Edit: Sorry, but you DO get a lump of coal.

PS4_ZeColmeia · August 2017

Maryal wrote: »

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

Dear @ZOS_GinaBruno,

Remember I said I do everything on 1 character? well I have this hole in the alchemy set called Snakeblood. It's so underutilized I'm sure you forgot about it so let me remind you: its to avoid poisoning yourself when drinking essence potions. Did I mention that there is no essence combination for potions that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits? I've been studying really hard so you should totally remember that when I get to asking for my wish.

So I'll get to it, instead of making this passive only benefit those that are too lazy to search on Google or trial and error not poisoning themselves, can you just make Snakeblood have an additional trait to mitigate when others poison you too? I can understand not letting it be 100% like when you are sabotaging yourself, but having a useful secondary trait for this unused passive and it would be a bit more balanced in its approach to have more sources to counter measure poison without gimping yourself everywhere else.

Thanks and here's to hoping that you don't want to give me a lump of coal!

/signed

me

I don't understand what you mean by the top paragraph ... the part that says: " No essence combination ... that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits?"

When you take Laboratory use you can use 3 reagents. There is no potion/essence combination to make some tri-pot that requires you to take a negative affect.

Maryal wrote: »

As far as the second paragraph, you incorrectly assume the ONLY time someone would create a potion that included a negative effect was due to laziness, yada yada.

You know, some ingredients are rather difficult to come by (doesn't matter if you are farming them or buying them in the guild store). If you run out of something you normally use to make your potion, there is often an alternative combination that will work, except that it also produces a negative effect. That is where snakeblood comes in. If you have fully maxed it out, you won't be effected by any negative effect contained in your potion. Basically, the passive expands the options you have when crafting your potions. If you were truly a Master Crafter, or Master Alchemist, you would have known this, rather than putting your foot in your mouth. Best wishes.

Maybe it's my length of time playing and solo mentality but I have farming routes and do writs everyday. I have 500+ of every reagent, except nirnroot, so for me I feel between either farming or buying, there is no reason to make an inferior tri-pot. Now if it was possible to make 4 traits but you had to have a negative affect to do it, then Snakeblood has value. As it stands, its too lazy to google or farm, or too cheap/broke to purchase proper reagents to make the pots you want. Maybe in those circumstances of gaming approach the 3 skill points are then worth it, hey all power to you, but I chalk that up to finding value in maxing keen eyes vs putting 1 point in it. Sure you get more visibility but the opportunity cost of the 2 sp seems hardly worth it.

It's in the eye of the beholder, but I'd rather play a main (if you do crafting alts) or just play my character (if you're like me and play 1 character and have 340+ skill points and still are short by 20ish to do everything you want) than invest time getting points that would generally be a waste. YMMV

Maryal wrote: »

Edit: Sorry, but you DO get a lump of coal.

NOOOOoOOoOoOOOOOooOooOOOOOO! lol

Maryal · August 2017

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

Dear @ZOS_GinaBruno,

Remember I said I do everything on 1 character? well I have this hole in the alchemy set called Snakeblood. It's so underutilized I'm sure you forgot about it so let me remind you: its to avoid poisoning yourself when drinking essence potions. Did I mention that there is no essence combination for potions that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits? I've been studying really hard so you should totally remember that when I get to asking for my wish.

So I'll get to it, instead of making this passive only benefit those that are too lazy to search on Google or trial and error not poisoning themselves, can you just make Snakeblood have an additional trait to mitigate when others poison you too? I can understand not letting it be 100% like when you are sabotaging yourself, but having a useful secondary trait for this unused passive and it would be a bit more balanced in its approach to have more sources to counter measure poison without gimping yourself everywhere else.

Thanks and here's to hoping that you don't want to give me a lump of coal!

/signed

me

I don't understand what you mean by the top paragraph ... the part that says: " No essence combination ... that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits?"

When you take Laboratory use you can use 3 reagents. There is no potion/essence combination to make some tri-pot that requires you to take a negative affect.

Maryal wrote: »

As far as the second paragraph, you incorrectly assume the ONLY time someone would create a potion that included a negative effect was due to laziness, yada yada.

You know, some ingredients are rather difficult to come by (doesn't matter if you are farming them or buying them in the guild store). If you run out of something you normally use to make your potion, there is often an alternative combination that will work, except that it also produces a negative effect. That is where snakeblood comes in. If you have fully maxed it out, you won't be effected by any negative effect contained in your potion. Basically, the passive expands the options you have when crafting your potions. If you were truly a Master Crafter, or Master Alchemist, you would have known this, rather than putting your foot in your mouth. Best wishes.

Maybe it's my length of time playing and solo mentality but I have farming routes and do writs everyday. I have 500+ of every reagent, except nirnroot, so for me I feel between either farming or buying, there is no reason to make an inferior tri-pot. Now if it was possible to make 4 traits but you had to have a negative affect to do it, then Snakeblood has value. As it stands, its too lazy to google or farm, or too cheap/broke to purchase proper reagents to make the pots you want. Maybe in those circumstances of gaming approach the 3 skill points are then worth it, hey all power to you, but I chalk that up to finding value in maxing keen eyes vs putting 1 point in it. Sure you get more visibility but the opportunity cost of the 2 sp seems hardly worth it.

It's in the eye of the beholder, but I'd rather play a main (if you do crafting alts) or just play my character (if you're like me and play 1 character and have 340+ skill points and still are short by 20ish to do everything you want) than invest time getting points that would generally be a waste. YMMV

Maryal wrote: »

Edit: Sorry, but you DO get a lump of coal.

NOOOOoOOoOoOOOOOooOooOOOOOO! lol

I have all crafting maxed on my main character, and all have been maxed for well over a year now. Alchemy was the first one maxed (including all passives except snakeblood), roughly 1 1/2 -2 years ago. I only pumped points into snakeblood about 6 months ago because I wanted to see how well it worked. I was tired of running out of 2 particular mushrooms that are not found in abundance (each used for a different potion), and hoped snakeblood would alleviate the negative effect of using a substitute ingredient ... it did. While I do prefer the better quality ingredients, in a pinch sometimes I just have to "make do," especially when in the middle of something that I don't want to put 'on hold' just to go farm or search guild traders because what I need is usually way way over priced, and I'm not interested in queuing into Cyro just to get to the IC sewers telvar merchant to try my RNG luck buying a flower sack (or whatever it's called).

I only craft for myself, and I only farm for myself. I've collected alchemy regents since day 1 of the crafting bag, but I don't spend the majority of my time farming (I try to devote 1-2 hours per week solely for alchemy farming, and 5 hours per week farming all the other crafting stuff). I spend the most time divided between PVP / PVE.

Okay, maybe we can forget about the lump of coal.

It actually would be nice to have the snakeblood passive be expanded to include some resistance to crafted poisons during pvp.

PS4_ZeColmeia · August 2017

Maryal wrote: »

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

Dear @ZOS_GinaBruno,

Remember I said I do everything on 1 character? well I have this hole in the alchemy set called Snakeblood. It's so underutilized I'm sure you forgot about it so let me remind you: its to avoid poisoning yourself when drinking essence potions. Did I mention that there is no essence combination for potions that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits? I've been studying really hard so you should totally remember that when I get to asking for my wish.

So I'll get to it, instead of making this passive only benefit those that are too lazy to search on Google or trial and error not poisoning themselves, can you just make Snakeblood have an additional trait to mitigate when others poison you too? I can understand not letting it be 100% like when you are sabotaging yourself, but having a useful secondary trait for this unused passive and it would be a bit more balanced in its approach to have more sources to counter measure poison without gimping yourself everywhere else.

Thanks and here's to hoping that you don't want to give me a lump of coal!

/signed

me

I don't understand what you mean by the top paragraph ... the part that says: " No essence combination ... that requires you to poison yourself to get 3 benefits?"

When you take Laboratory use you can use 3 reagents. There is no potion/essence combination to make some tri-pot that requires you to take a negative affect.

Maryal wrote: »

As far as the second paragraph, you incorrectly assume the ONLY time someone would create a potion that included a negative effect was due to laziness, yada yada.

You know, some ingredients are rather difficult to come by (doesn't matter if you are farming them or buying them in the guild store). If you run out of something you normally use to make your potion, there is often an alternative combination that will work, except that it also produces a negative effect. That is where snakeblood comes in. If you have fully maxed it out, you won't be effected by any negative effect contained in your potion. Basically, the passive expands the options you have when crafting your potions. If you were truly a Master Crafter, or Master Alchemist, you would have known this, rather than putting your foot in your mouth. Best wishes.

Maybe it's my length of time playing and solo mentality but I have farming routes and do writs everyday. I have 500+ of every reagent, except nirnroot, so for me I feel between either farming or buying, there is no reason to make an inferior tri-pot. Now if it was possible to make 4 traits but you had to have a negative affect to do it, then Snakeblood has value. As it stands, its too lazy to google or farm, or too cheap/broke to purchase proper reagents to make the pots you want. Maybe in those circumstances of gaming approach the 3 skill points are then worth it, hey all power to you, but I chalk that up to finding value in maxing keen eyes vs putting 1 point in it. Sure you get more visibility but the opportunity cost of the 2 sp seems hardly worth it.

It's in the eye of the beholder, but I'd rather play a main (if you do crafting alts) or just play my character (if you're like me and play 1 character and have 340+ skill points and still are short by 20ish to do everything you want) than invest time getting points that would generally be a waste. YMMV

Maryal wrote: »

Edit: Sorry, but you DO get a lump of coal.

NOOOOoOOoOoOOOOOooOooOOOOOO! lol

I have all crafting maxed on my main character, and all have been maxed for well over a year now. Alchemy was the first one maxed (including all passives except snakeblood), roughly 1 1/2 -2 years ago. I only pumped points into snakeblood about 6 months ago because I wanted to see how well it worked. I was tired of running out of 2 particular mushrooms that are not found in abundance (each used for a different potion), and hoped snakeblood would alleviate the negative effect of using a substitute ingredient ... it did. While I do prefer the better quality ingredients, in a pinch sometimes I just have to "make do," especially when in the middle of something that I don't want to put 'on hold' just to go farm or search guild traders because what I need is usually way way over priced, and I'm not interested in queuing into Cyro just to get to the IC sewers telvar merchant to try my RNG luck buying a flower sack (or whatever it's called).

I only craft for myself, and I only farm for myself. I've collected alchemy regents since day 1 of the crafting bag, but I don't spend the majority of my time farming (I try to devote 1-2 hours per week solely for alchemy farming, and 5 hours per week farming all the other crafting stuff). I spend the most time divided between PVP / PVE.

Okay, maybe we can forget about the lump of coal.

It actually would be nice to have the snakeblood passive be expanded to include some resistance to crafted poisons during pvp.

So I think we generally agree. I think the potion side of it is fine, but it'd be nice to have poisons (for the PvP side) to apply as well. I don't want poisons to be ineffective, they have a place, but I do want the counter play. I haven't really used snakeblood because I'm really flush on ingredients, but it's nice to hear that there is value somewhere for it.

Oh and yay! No coal!