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Infused is Broken and Additive Damage Done Modifiers Are Still Causing Balance Issues
LZH
✭✭✭✭
1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
2) Damage done modifiers - % damage done modifiers are additive with certain active and passive skills like Impale, Puncturing Sweep, Radiant Destruction, dual-wield passive execute, executioner, etc. So for example if you were using Minor Slayer (5%) and had 56 points into Master-at-Arms (20%) instead of buffing your Impale damage by 25% it will only be buffed by (100+300+25)/(100+300) or 6.3%. This is a huge reason why Magicka Templars are absolutely terrible this patch no matter what your setup is. These skills need to have their damage calculations and wording similar to the Mages' Wrath skill in the Sorcerer skill tree if they are going to be fixed.
2) Damage done modifiers - % damage done modifiers are additive with certain active and passive skills like Impale, Puncturing Sweep, Radiant Destruction, dual-wield passive execute, executioner, etc. So for example if you were using Minor Slayer (5%) and had 56 points into Master-at-Arms (20%) instead of buffing your Impale damage by 25% it will only be buffed by (100+300+25)/(100+300) or 6.3%. This is a huge reason why Magicka Templars are absolutely terrible this patch no matter what your setup is. These skills need to have their damage calculations and wording similar to the Mages' Wrath skill in the Sorcerer skill tree if they are going to be fixed.
14
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Dymence✭✭✭✭✭
✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
In case you are referring to the weapon/spell damage enchant, this has always been the case regardless of the weapon, proccing it offbar and maintaining it mainbar. I don't see why this is unintended as it falls within the same ruleset other proc based things follow aswell.1 -
LZH✭✭✭✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
In case you are referring to the weapon/spell damage enchant, this has always been the case regardless of the weapon, proccing it offbar and maintaining it mainbar. I don't see why this is unintended as it falls within the same ruleset other proc based things follow aswell.
That's not what I'm referring to.
The meta setup for Stamina builds right now is to have an Infused weapon with poison enchantment, a sharpened weapon with weapon damage enchantment, and a sharpened vMA bow.
The singular infused trait is buffing all 3 of the weapon enchantments.6 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
In case you are referring to the weapon/spell damage enchant, this has always been the case regardless of the weapon, proccing it offbar and maintaining it mainbar. I don't see why this is unintended as it falls within the same ruleset other proc based things follow aswell.
That's not what I'm referring to.
The meta setup for Stamina builds right now is to have an Infused weapon with poison enchantment, a sharpened weapon with weapon damage enchantment, and a sharpened vMA bow.
The singular infused trait is buffing all 3 of the weapon enchantments.
I´m happy to hear that this it how it works since I have the weapons with correct trait to make this work. But at the same time I feel like this isn´t how it´s supposed to work, feels broken and way to overpowered. I know that the sharpened trait on backbar was carried over to the frontbar but didn´t know infused worked this way. Insightfull to say the least.2 -
Dymence✭✭✭✭✭
✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
In case you are referring to the weapon/spell damage enchant, this has always been the case regardless of the weapon, proccing it offbar and maintaining it mainbar. I don't see why this is unintended as it falls within the same ruleset other proc based things follow aswell.
That's not what I'm referring to.
The meta setup for Stamina builds right now is to have an Infused weapon with poison enchantment, a sharpened weapon with weapon damage enchantment, and a sharpened vMA bow.
The singular infused trait is buffing all 3 of the weapon enchantments.
Ahh, that's what you mean. Haven't heard of this one yet. That is indeed very broken and should be looked at.0 -
ennuid✭✭2) Damage done modifiers - % damage done modifiers are additive with certain active and passive skills like Impale, Puncturing Sweep, Radiant Destruction, dual-wield passive execute, executioner, etc. So for example if you were using Minor Slayer (5%) and had 56 points into Master-at-Arms (20%) instead of buffing your Impale damage by 25% it will only be buffed by (100+300+25)/(100+300) or 6.3%. This is a huge reason why Magicka Templars are absolutely terrible this patch no matter what your setup is. These skills need to have their damage calculations and wording similar to the Mages' Wrath skill in the Sorcerer skill tree if they are going to be fixed.
Agree with this 100%. What's most frustrating is that this change (which dropped magicka templars 20% across the board and magicka nightblades by 20% in execute) was done without warning or discussion. Absolutely nothing in the patch notes, it's like they don't even know.1 -
casparian✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭2) Damage done modifiers - % damage done modifiers are additive with certain active and passive skills like Impale, Puncturing Sweep, Radiant Destruction, dual-wield passive execute, executioner, etc. So for example if you were using Minor Slayer (5%) and had 56 points into Master-at-Arms (20%) instead of buffing your Impale damage by 25% it will only be buffed by (100+300+25)/(100+300) or 6.3%. This is a huge reason why Magicka Templars are absolutely terrible this patch no matter what your setup is. These skills need to have their damage calculations and wording similar to the Mages' Wrath skill in the Sorcerer skill tree if they are going to be fixed.
Agree with this 100%. What's most frustrating is that this change (which dropped magicka templars 20% across the board and magicka nightblades by 20% in execute) was done without warning or discussion. Absolutely nothing in the patch notes, it's like they don't even know.
I'm not sure they do. LZH and others have been talking about this since the Morrowind PTS, and the devs have yet even to acknowledge that this is a thing, let alone to tell us whether it was intended or not.7-day PVP campaign regular 2016-2019, Flawless Conqueror. MagDK/stamplar/stamwarden/mageblade. Requiem, Legend, Knights of Daggerfall. Currently retired from the wars; waiting on performance improvements.1 -
Izaki✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yeah my Endless Hail does almost 10k DPS. Its ridiculous. Should totally be fixed. Infused buffs the vMA bow enchant.1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
In case you are referring to the weapon/spell damage enchant, this has always been the case regardless of the weapon, proccing it offbar and maintaining it mainbar. I don't see why this is unintended as it falls within the same ruleset other proc based things follow aswell.
That's not what I'm referring to.
The meta setup for Stamina builds right now is to have an Infused weapon with poison enchantment, a sharpened weapon with weapon damage enchantment, and a sharpened vMA bow.
The singular infused trait is buffing all 3 of the weapon enchantments.
Precise for raids, not Sharp though
@ Izaki #PCEU
#FrenchKiss #GoneFor2YearsAndMyGuildDoesn'tRaidAnymore
#MoreDPSthanYou
#Stamblade0 -
Own✭✭✭✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
2) Damage done modifiers - % damage done modifiers are additive with certain active and passive skills like Impale, Puncturing Sweep, Radiant Destruction, dual-wield passive execute, executioner, etc. So for example if you were using Minor Slayer (5%) and had 56 points into Master-at-Arms (20%) instead of buffing your Impale damage by 25% it will only be buffed by (100+300+25)/(100+300) or 6.3%. This is a huge reason why Magicka Templars are absolutely terrible this patch no matter what your setup is. These skills need to have their damage calculations and wording similar to the Mages' Wrath skill in the Sorcerer skill tree if they are going to be fixed.
I
things found like this 0 -
Lightspeedflashb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Mettaricana wrote: »Is infused broken or is it just better than sharpen now?
It is broken, read the op.0 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭also in line to receive a large buff next patch.
Source?
I highly doubt they are going to be buffing it again as it's already the best trait on the current PTS build (unless they're buffing all the other traits too, but then that wouldn't be a "buff" to infused).Edited by MLGProPlayer on July 24, 2017 11:28PM0 -
Bladerunner1✭✭✭✭Few people seem to bother with bringing it up, but the bow skill line is gimped by 9% thanks to the additive damage done by long shots and hawk eye. And sword buffs from Twin blade and blunt and heavy weapons are additive to CP as well. Now swords are even further behind daggers, axes and maces.
I bring this up because I still hold on to the hope that one day I'll actually want to bring my Bosmer archer's ranged awesomeness out of the realm of RP and into vet PVE dungeons.1 -
LZH✭✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »
I don't mean the next incremental. By next patch I'm referring to Horns of the Reach.Edited by LZH on July 25, 2017 4:30AM0 -
SirDopey✭✭✭✭✭
✭But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.NA PC | AD
xx Doc Holliday xx0 -
C4Bliss✭✭✭But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?0 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
This works differently tho, because you actually get 2 instead of one trait bonuses. Lets say you have infused on front bar with +damage enchant. This will give you weapon damage that then boosts your backbar DoT damage because that is how it works with everything (like penetration, crit, ...), BUT you also infuse the backbar enchantment that is increasing the damage. So with one trait you are getting 2 'bonuses' instead of one.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
In short: In normal situation you would get full value from 2 traits on DW and almost nothing from backbar trait (let's ignore single target dots), but in this situation with backbar VMA, you get value of 3 traits and almost nothing from backbar.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?
He mean if you cast from backbar some DOT and switch to front bar the crits are calculated with current weapon.
Edited by SodanTok on July 27, 2017 7:49AM0 -
glavius✭✭✭✭✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
I just tested this on PTS, and regarding infused on one weapon applying for both enchants in a dw setup, it's not true.
I tested with the following:
Mainhand infused weapon with health steal enchant, offhand defending weapon with weapon dmg enchant.
Mainhand defending weapon with health steal enchant, offhand defending weapon with weapon dmg enchant.
In both cases the weapon dmg enchant gave exact the same value.
0 -
Liofa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
I just tested this on PTS, and regarding infused on one weapon applying for both enchants in a dw setup, it's not true.
I tested with the following:
Mainhand infused weapon with health steal enchant, offhand defending weapon with weapon dmg enchant.
Mainhand defending weapon with health steal enchant, offhand defending weapon with weapon dmg enchant.
In both cases the weapon dmg enchant gave exact the same value.
It reduces it's cooldown . Weapon damage enchant has 10 seconds of cooldown . If you put it on off bar defending weapon and use infused on main hand , it's cooldown will get reduced . Which doesn't seem intended . In order to increase it's power , you need to use Infused on off hand too .3 -
FakeFox✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭But if you would fix infused it then would be too weak on DDs I guess and would maybe need a buff again, which would be a huge buff for healers and tanks running it since they only use it for one enchant any ways. I guess fixing it and having it not being viable for DDs would be the best solution.EU/PC (GER) - Healermain since 2014 - 50305 Achievement Points - Youtube (PvE Healing Guides, Builds & Gameplay)0 -
glavius✭✭✭✭✭1) Infused trait is broken - in a dual-wield setup simply having Infused on one of the weapons appears to buff both front-bar weapons as well as buffing the vMA bow enchant on your back-bar causing it to be by far the best trait with it also in line to receive a large buff next patch. The trait should only buff the enchantment of the Infused weapon and not any of the other ones.
I just tested this on PTS, and regarding infused on one weapon applying for both enchants in a dw setup, it's not true.
I tested with the following:
Mainhand infused weapon with health steal enchant, offhand defending weapon with weapon dmg enchant.
Mainhand defending weapon with health steal enchant, offhand defending weapon with weapon dmg enchant.
In both cases the weapon dmg enchant gave exact the same value.
It reduces it's cooldown . Weapon damage enchant has 10 seconds of cooldown . If you put it on off bar defending weapon and use infused on main hand , it's cooldown will get reduced . Which doesn't seem intended . In order to increase it's power , you need to use Infused on off hand too .
Ahh weird. Thx for that info.0 -
SirDopey✭✭✭✭✭
✭
This works differently tho, because you actually get 2 instead of one trait bonuses. Lets say you have infused on front bar with +damage enchant. This will give you weapon damage that then boosts your backbar DoT damage because that is how it works with everything (like penetration, crit, ...), BUT you also infuse the backbar enchantment that is increasing the damage. So with one trait you are getting 2 'bonuses' instead of one.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
In short: In normal situation you would get full value from 2 traits on DW and almost nothing from backbar trait (let's ignore single target dots), but in this situation with backbar VMA, you get value of 3 traits and almost nothing from backbar.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?
He mean if you cast from backbar some DOT and switch to front bar the crits are calculated with current weapon.
Yeah, So I guess the weapon traits are working as intended but the issue is with master and vma enchants that remain active after switching bars. If they fix this, won't it require those enchantments to also not benefit from the additional crit, penetration or damage (nirn) if the player switches bars? I'm not sure if them fixing it would be such a nice thing??
I guess the reason they went with an enchantment over a 1 piece item set in the first place was to allow the effect to carry over and this is just an unavoidable side effect? If they are not meant to received a buff from infused when switching they shouldn't receive a buff from the other weapon traits also??NA PC | AD
xx Doc Holliday xx0 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
This works differently tho, because you actually get 2 instead of one trait bonuses. Lets say you have infused on front bar with +damage enchant. This will give you weapon damage that then boosts your backbar DoT damage because that is how it works with everything (like penetration, crit, ...), BUT you also infuse the backbar enchantment that is increasing the damage. So with one trait you are getting 2 'bonuses' instead of one.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
In short: In normal situation you would get full value from 2 traits on DW and almost nothing from backbar trait (let's ignore single target dots), but in this situation with backbar VMA, you get value of 3 traits and almost nothing from backbar.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?
He mean if you cast from backbar some DOT and switch to front bar the crits are calculated with current weapon.
Yeah, So I guess the weapon traits are working as intended but the issue is with master and vma enchants that remain active after switching bars. If they fix this, won't it require those enchantments to also not benefit from the additional crit, penetration or damage (nirn) if the player switches bars? I'm not sure if them fixing it would be such a nice thing??
I guess the reason they went with an enchantment over a 1 piece item set in the first place was to allow the effect to carry over and this is just an unavoidable side effect? If they are not meant to received a buff from infused when switching they shouldn't receive a buff from the other weapon traits also??
No. Exact opposite. (well we could discuss all day long if this change was secretly intended or not). There is no issue with master/vma enchants remaining active after switching bar, that is their feature. Infused is simply broken and affects everything.
There is difference between lets say volley being increased by frontbar trait, because those trait increase overall damage you produce, but infused is supposed to boost glyph of the weapon that is infused.Edited by SodanTok on July 30, 2017 1:44AM1 -
SirDopey✭✭✭✭✭
✭
This works differently tho, because you actually get 2 instead of one trait bonuses. Lets say you have infused on front bar with +damage enchant. This will give you weapon damage that then boosts your backbar DoT damage because that is how it works with everything (like penetration, crit, ...), BUT you also infuse the backbar enchantment that is increasing the damage. So with one trait you are getting 2 'bonuses' instead of one.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
In short: In normal situation you would get full value from 2 traits on DW and almost nothing from backbar trait (let's ignore single target dots), but in this situation with backbar VMA, you get value of 3 traits and almost nothing from backbar.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?
He mean if you cast from backbar some DOT and switch to front bar the crits are calculated with current weapon.
Yeah, So I guess the weapon traits are working as intended but the issue is with master and vma enchants that remain active after switching bars. If they fix this, won't it require those enchantments to also not benefit from the additional crit, penetration or damage (nirn) if the player switches bars? I'm not sure if them fixing it would be such a nice thing??
I guess the reason they went with an enchantment over a 1 piece item set in the first place was to allow the effect to carry over and this is just an unavoidable side effect? If they are not meant to received a buff from infused when switching they shouldn't receive a buff from the other weapon traits also??
No. Exact opposite. (well we could discuss all day long if this change was secretly intended or not). There is no issue with master/vma enchants remaining active after switching bar, that is their feature. Infused is simply broken and affects everything.
There is difference between lets say volley being increased by frontbar trait, because those trait increase overall damage you produce, but infused is supposed to boost glyph of the weapon that is infused.
Is it supposed to only buff the weapon its on? Shouldn't precise only buff the attacks made after we've switched back then? I dunno, I honestly think its been like this since day one - I don't think this was a subtle change because it's been like this for as long as I can remember. You've never heard of anyone running two infused DW but there have been plenty of builds for so many patch iterations that run 1 infused, figured this was always the reason why and it was widely accepted as how its meant to be.NA PC | AD
xx Doc Holliday xx0 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
This works differently tho, because you actually get 2 instead of one trait bonuses. Lets say you have infused on front bar with +damage enchant. This will give you weapon damage that then boosts your backbar DoT damage because that is how it works with everything (like penetration, crit, ...), BUT you also infuse the backbar enchantment that is increasing the damage. So with one trait you are getting 2 'bonuses' instead of one.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
In short: In normal situation you would get full value from 2 traits on DW and almost nothing from backbar trait (let's ignore single target dots), but in this situation with backbar VMA, you get value of 3 traits and almost nothing from backbar.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?
He mean if you cast from backbar some DOT and switch to front bar the crits are calculated with current weapon.
Yeah, So I guess the weapon traits are working as intended but the issue is with master and vma enchants that remain active after switching bars. If they fix this, won't it require those enchantments to also not benefit from the additional crit, penetration or damage (nirn) if the player switches bars? I'm not sure if them fixing it would be such a nice thing??
I guess the reason they went with an enchantment over a 1 piece item set in the first place was to allow the effect to carry over and this is just an unavoidable side effect? If they are not meant to received a buff from infused when switching they shouldn't receive a buff from the other weapon traits also??
No. Exact opposite. (well we could discuss all day long if this change was secretly intended or not). There is no issue with master/vma enchants remaining active after switching bar, that is their feature. Infused is simply broken and affects everything.
There is difference between lets say volley being increased by frontbar trait, because those trait increase overall damage you produce, but infused is supposed to boost glyph of the weapon that is infused.
Is it supposed to only buff the weapon its on? Shouldn't precise only buff the attacks made after we've switched back then? I dunno, I honestly think its been like this since day one - I don't think this was a subtle change because it's been like this for as long as I can remember. You've never heard of anyone running two infused DW but there have been plenty of builds for so many patch iterations that run 1 infused, figured this was always the reason why and it was widely accepted as how its meant to be.
Dunno, never heard of it (before Morrowind). Would be far more used before if it worked this way. Still that does not change it should not work that way. You should not get 2 infused enchantments for price of one, it is simple as that. Even if it worked before and was widely accepted, now Infused got buff so people with this setup are basically rewarded twice.
I dont mind it much, it just sounds stupid and is kinda unfair if you have two handed weapon on main bar (which is unfair already...) you either run balanced traits like sharpened or precise (that are twice better than 1H) and lose this 'feature' or run infused which is worth the same thing as on 1H...Edited by SodanTok on July 30, 2017 11:41PM0 -
SirDopey✭✭✭✭✭
✭
This works differently tho, because you actually get 2 instead of one trait bonuses. Lets say you have infused on front bar with +damage enchant. This will give you weapon damage that then boosts your backbar DoT damage because that is how it works with everything (like penetration, crit, ...), BUT you also infuse the backbar enchantment that is increasing the damage. So with one trait you are getting 2 'bonuses' instead of one.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
In short: In normal situation you would get full value from 2 traits on DW and almost nothing from backbar trait (let's ignore single target dots), but in this situation with backbar VMA, you get value of 3 traits and almost nothing from backbar.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?
He mean if you cast from backbar some DOT and switch to front bar the crits are calculated with current weapon.
Yeah, So I guess the weapon traits are working as intended but the issue is with master and vma enchants that remain active after switching bars. If they fix this, won't it require those enchantments to also not benefit from the additional crit, penetration or damage (nirn) if the player switches bars? I'm not sure if them fixing it would be such a nice thing??
I guess the reason they went with an enchantment over a 1 piece item set in the first place was to allow the effect to carry over and this is just an unavoidable side effect? If they are not meant to received a buff from infused when switching they shouldn't receive a buff from the other weapon traits also??
No. Exact opposite. (well we could discuss all day long if this change was secretly intended or not). There is no issue with master/vma enchants remaining active after switching bar, that is their feature. Infused is simply broken and affects everything.
There is difference between lets say volley being increased by frontbar trait, because those trait increase overall damage you produce, but infused is supposed to boost glyph of the weapon that is infused.
Is it supposed to only buff the weapon its on? Shouldn't precise only buff the attacks made after we've switched back then? I dunno, I honestly think its been like this since day one - I don't think this was a subtle change because it's been like this for as long as I can remember. You've never heard of anyone running two infused DW but there have been plenty of builds for so many patch iterations that run 1 infused, figured this was always the reason why and it was widely accepted as how its meant to be.
Dunno, never heard of it (before Morrowind). Would be far more used before if it worked this way. Still that does not change it should not work that way. You should not get 2 infused enchantments for price of one, it is simple as that. Even if it worked before and was widely accepted, now Infused got buff so people with this setup are basically rewarded twice.
I dont mind it much, it just sounds stupid and is kinda unfair if you have two handed weapon on main bar (which is unfair already...) you either run balanced traits like sharpened or precise (that are twice better than 1H) and lose this 'feature' or run infused which is worth the same thing as on 1H...
Yeah I agree on that. I would have thought that the infused on a one hander was half the value of a two hander? So 10% increase instead of 20%? If its not, I'm at work at the moment so can't look, but if a 1 hander and a 2 hander weapon buff by the same amount then that's what is really broken.NA PC | AD
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Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
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This works differently tho, because you actually get 2 instead of one trait bonuses. Lets say you have infused on front bar with +damage enchant. This will give you weapon damage that then boosts your backbar DoT damage because that is how it works with everything (like penetration, crit, ...), BUT you also infuse the backbar enchantment that is increasing the damage. So with one trait you are getting 2 'bonuses' instead of one.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
In short: In normal situation you would get full value from 2 traits on DW and almost nothing from backbar trait (let's ignore single target dots), but in this situation with backbar VMA, you get value of 3 traits and almost nothing from backbar.But isn't this the same with all weapon traits? I mean if you have precise on the front bar your ability's cast on the back bar get the additional critical damage when you switch back to your front?
I knew this was case with infused but never thought of it as a bug cause all weapon traits work the same way.
I always thought that the crit from precise did not carry over to the other bar?
He mean if you cast from backbar some DOT and switch to front bar the crits are calculated with current weapon.
Yeah, So I guess the weapon traits are working as intended but the issue is with master and vma enchants that remain active after switching bars. If they fix this, won't it require those enchantments to also not benefit from the additional crit, penetration or damage (nirn) if the player switches bars? I'm not sure if them fixing it would be such a nice thing??
I guess the reason they went with an enchantment over a 1 piece item set in the first place was to allow the effect to carry over and this is just an unavoidable side effect? If they are not meant to received a buff from infused when switching they shouldn't receive a buff from the other weapon traits also??
No. Exact opposite. (well we could discuss all day long if this change was secretly intended or not). There is no issue with master/vma enchants remaining active after switching bar, that is their feature. Infused is simply broken and affects everything.
There is difference between lets say volley being increased by frontbar trait, because those trait increase overall damage you produce, but infused is supposed to boost glyph of the weapon that is infused.
Is it supposed to only buff the weapon its on? Shouldn't precise only buff the attacks made after we've switched back then? I dunno, I honestly think its been like this since day one - I don't think this was a subtle change because it's been like this for as long as I can remember. You've never heard of anyone running two infused DW but there have been plenty of builds for so many patch iterations that run 1 infused, figured this was always the reason why and it was widely accepted as how its meant to be.
Dunno, never heard of it (before Morrowind). Would be far more used before if it worked this way. Still that does not change it should not work that way. You should not get 2 infused enchantments for price of one, it is simple as that. Even if it worked before and was widely accepted, now Infused got buff so people with this setup are basically rewarded twice.
I dont mind it much, it just sounds stupid and is kinda unfair if you have two handed weapon on main bar (which is unfair already...) you either run balanced traits like sharpened or precise (that are twice better than 1H) and lose this 'feature' or run infused which is worth the same thing as on 1H...
Yeah I agree on that. I would have thought that the infused on a one hander was half the value of a two hander? So 10% increase instead of 20%? If its not, I'm at work at the moment so can't look, but if a 1 hander and a 2 hander weapon buff by the same amount then that's what is really broken.
No, it's not, because when you hit someone with a dual wield light attack, only on of the 2 weapon hit. If you reduce infused by half, then infused on 2 handed or 1h&S will become useless, and it will be a big nerf to magicka user that use dual wield and hwo can only proc enchant with weavinng.0