Stopping Trading Guilds from Cheating?

Galenus_of_Pergamon · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

Belidos wrote: »

Rahotu wrote: »

or another fix could be make a guild unable to be disbanded for 2 weeks after creation,not perfect but at least the planning would become tougher

They don't disband the guild, they drop their membership below the requirement for the store, and they lose the store, meanwhile the guild leader of their real guild is standing waiting for it to drop so he can snatch it up.

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

I fail to see what's so bad about this, to the extent that it is true.

It means that the lesser trade guilds get less of a chance to own a trader because the major trade guilds are holding onto multiple fake guilds and monopolizing the traders.

There's not enough traders available to provide one to every guild in the game as it is, the guilds doing this are making that number of available traders smaller and smaller.

Not so- having 49 members does not result in the guild losing it's trader. The effect is that this guild cannot bid on another trader until their membership exceeds 49.

Diminish · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

I can confirm that this does 100% occur every week with some of the largest trading guilds on PS4 NA.

Galenus_of_Pergamon · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

I'm not such of those guilds that you speak of.. but, good luck, since this has been occurring, probably, for a year now. Blame it on the blind bidding. Legitimately, nobody really knows how much gold the competitors have placed a bid and each is forced to throw in outrageous amount in hopes it will outbid the others. Ultimately, the bid has increased to an ungodly amount, which forced GM and guilds to think outside the box. Call it human ingenuity or whatever..

I don't think this is very wide spread, this having 5 shell guilds business. If they want 5 spots they have to chuck down 1M a spot just to get the trader... Disbanding it they still lose that 1M per trader, meaning the only active trader cost them 5M.. No Guild makes 5M in taxes, not by a long shot, plus farming 50 people every week just for the sake of it so time consuming.

This isn't the issue that actually goes on, it's just they agree on how much they bid for a spot and only bid on set traders only.

If they actually are disbanding I think they just got lucky and no one bid on the trader or they got it for next to nothing. There is no financial viability in paying top dollar for several slots and only using 1.

You don't need to farm 50 people. Each cabal guild master and his/her senior officers quickly form a 50 person guild.

Also, another strong piece of evidence is that guildmasters of several major trading guilds- and all of their senior officers- are all senior officers in each other guilds. There is nothing illegal about this. However, it is one possible means of quickly forming shell guilds and it's suggestive of the potential of shady behavior.

Galenus_of_Pergamon · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

JUGSoMILK wrote: »

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

I play on PS4 NA. I have a four month old trading guild. We are moving up in Tamriel.

We just learned about a huge cabal (a secret political clique or faction) of 10+ major trading guilds. They each have side guilds. We'll call these side guilds "shell" or "shadow" guilds.

Each major trading guild will have 1-4 shell guilds (20-50 total guilds controlled by 10 guilds). The shell guilds will bid on secondary and tertiary traders in case the main trading guild loses their primary trader bid. Then, late Sunday night/Monday morning, the shell guild will disband, making the Trader they held available for 10k, and an officer from the main guild will be on standby waiting to snatch up the trader immediately after the shell guild has disbanded.

What if ZoS restricted Trader bidding to a 24-hour window (Saturday night, 9pm Eastern to Sunday night, 9pm Eastern)? Legitimate trading guilds would still have a 24 hour window to bid and shady guilds holding 4-5 traders at once would be significantly less valuable. It's a great compromise.

This would almost eliminate powerhouse guilds from bidding on 4-5 traders each. No longer would one trading guild effectively control 4-5 traders.

Hate to break the news for ya man.. but there are 2 large groups of trading guilds who do this. About 10 in each group on PS4 NA. With 20 guilds they dominate the capitals every week. I only know of three guilds who independently hold their own spots weekly in capital cities. ForTheNorth, Tribunal Council and Unprecedented. Mostly all other guilds u see in capital cites are either with the Mournhold Mafia or The Chaos Group. Don't get me wrong guilds come and go with huge bids in those cities when they have enough money. But 90% of the time it's those 2 groups. They also use "ghost" guilds in many other parts of Tamriel as well. They cordinate bids so none of them bid on each other and everything. If u need a list of all the guilds in the 2 groups let me know however, I will vote no on changing the bidding system only because I have heard of u camp out on one of these shell guilds u can some times buy it urself and steal it from them... so it's not 100% effective. U can steal a trader from them for 10k when they bought it for millions. Ur guild would love that!

Thank you for substantiating my claim. I have unconfirmed reports of one cabal having 22 guilds within its control, another cabal having 10 guild within its control, and a cabal having 7 guilds within its control.

MalagenR · July 2017

None of this should matter because these major guilds have a large number of active traders that supply the market with more goods than most of the small guilds complaining. If you're a small guild, work your way up, eventually if you have a large amount of active traders you'll be able to compete, they won't be able to stop you.

theflawlessteabagger · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

Danksta wrote: »

Always have to vote for the opposite poll option in biased polls that the OP wanted. Especially in this case since you have no evidence to back your claim.

Its true . Eveyone knows the Mournhold mafia conspiracy if u play ps4 NA

U obv still selling to merchants lol

Galenus_of_Pergamon · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

MalagenR wrote: »

None of this should matter because these major guilds have a large number of active traders that supply the market with more goods than most of the small guilds complaining. If you're a small guild, work your way up, eventually if you have a large amount of active traders you'll be able to compete, they won't be able to stop you.

At many of your suggestions, I am intelligent and resourceful enough to play their game along with them, but I am here to advocate for fair market practices.

JUGSoMILK · July 2017

No, let guilds bid 168 hours (7 days) per week on a trader- and preserve convenience- even if it encourages monopolies and breaches in ZoS terms of service.

MalagenR wrote: »

None of this should matter because these major guilds have a large number of active traders that supply the market with more goods than most of the small guilds complaining. If you're a small guild, work your way up, eventually if you have a large amount of active traders you'll be able to compete, they won't be able to stop you.

That's exactly what we had to do. We bid HEAVY and these Mafia guilds rarely out bid us in capital cities.

JUGSoMILK · July 2017

No, let guilds bid 168 hours (7 days) per week on a trader- and preserve convenience- even if it encourages monopolies and breaches in ZoS terms of service.

Speaking of trading.... can maintence be done yet geeezeeeee!

Galenus_of_Pergamon · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

JUGSoMILK wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

None of this should matter because these major guilds have a large number of active traders that supply the market with more goods than most of the small guilds complaining. If you're a small guild, work your way up, eventually if you have a large amount of active traders you'll be able to compete, they won't be able to stop you.

That's exactly what we had to do. We bid HEAVY and these Mafia guilds rarely out bid us in capital cities.

You haven't been on their radar or pissed them off yet. Twenty two guilds having tens of millions of gold can push out anyone if they don't want you there.

Drachenfier · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

Or, we could just have a central market and be done with this crap system once and for all.

AlnilamE · July 2017

No, let guilds bid 168 hours (7 days) per week on a trader- and preserve convenience- even if it encourages monopolies and breaches in ZoS terms of service.

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

I play on PS4 NA. I have a four month old trading guild. We are moving up in Tamriel.

We just learned about a huge cabal (a secret political clique or faction) of 10+ major trading guilds. They each have side guilds. We'll call these side guilds "shell" or "shadow" guilds.

Each major trading guild will have 1-4 shell guilds (20-50 total guilds controlled by 10 guilds). The shell guilds will bid on secondary and tertiary traders in case the main trading guild loses their primary trader bid. Then, late Sunday night/Monday morning, the shell guild will disband, making the Trader they held available for 10k, and an officer from the main guild will be on standby waiting to snatch up the trader immediately after the shell guild has disbanded.

What if ZoS restricted Trader bidding to a 24-hour window (Saturday night, 9pm Eastern to Sunday night, 9pm Eastern)? Legitimate trading guilds would still have a 24 hour window to bid and shady guilds holding 4-5 traders at once would be significantly less valuable. It's a great compromise.

This would almost eliminate powerhouse guilds from bidding on 4-5 traders each. No longer would one trading guild effectively control 4-5 traders.

Alternatively: Do not allow a guild to disband if they are holding a Guild Trader or a Cyrodiil resource. They have to wait until their trader expires the next week.

Giraffon · July 2017

No, let guilds bid 168 hours (7 days) per week on a trader- and preserve convenience- even if it encourages monopolies and breaches in ZoS terms of service.

JUGSoMILK wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

None of this should matter because these major guilds have a large number of active traders that supply the market with more goods than most of the small guilds complaining. If you're a small guild, work your way up, eventually if you have a large amount of active traders you'll be able to compete, they won't be able to stop you.

That's exactly what we had to do. We bid HEAVY and these Mafia guilds rarely out bid us in capital cities.

I've never understood the obsession of some guilds to get a trader no matter the cost. Let's say you bid 4 million on a trader. Are you gonna' make that up on sales commissions? I think not. Raw sales volume maybe, but profit?

Danksta · July 2017

No, let guilds bid 168 hours (7 days) per week on a trader- and preserve convenience- even if it encourages monopolies and breaches in ZoS terms of service.

theflawlessteabagger wrote: »

Danksta wrote: »

Always have to vote for the opposite poll option in biased polls that the OP wanted. Especially in this case since you have no evidence to back your claim.

Its true . Eveyone knows the Mournhold mafia conspiracy if u play ps4 NA

U obv still selling to merchants lol

Yes, I forgot, conspiracies are always true. How forgetful of me...

AlnilamE · July 2017

No, let guilds bid 168 hours (7 days) per week on a trader- and preserve convenience- even if it encourages monopolies and breaches in ZoS terms of service.

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

This would have no affect and might actually benefit the larger trading guilds as they would have an easier time of making sure someone was on to bid in that 24 hour period. At the end of the 24 hour period they could still disband the other guilds.

Not a great solution but if a guild wins a trader then disbands maybe that trader should just be locked for the week. The guild would lose the gold they bid and there would be fewer incentives to bid on traders you have no intention of using. Large trading guilds could still bid on other traders and leave them empty hoping to cut down on competition but that would be expensive quick to be very effective.

If it weren't a drain on resources and/or a pain to implement might also ban (from bidding) any account that has bid on a trader then had the guild fold. Even the big guilds would quickly run out of players able and willing to bid on sham traders.

Here's how it would at least partially alleviate the problem.

Hypothetical shell guild named "Heroic Trading" bids on a trader Saturday night at 9pm eastern. Let's say Heroic Trading wins their trader on Sunday night at 9pm (standard trader change time).

So, then they disband it Sunday night at 11pm for their parent guild to be right beside the trader stall to pick it up for 10k.

Not anymore! Once they disband the shell guild, the trader stall becomes unavailable until next Sunday and remains empty.

Granted, the shell guild could still disband on Saturday night at 9:01pm and the parent guild could own the trader for 23 hours.

But, how much less valuable is holding a trading guild for 23 hours than for 168 hours (7 full days)?

Except that this would effectively negate legitimate guilds who lost their bid on a trader and are able to find a free trader after the trader switch. Or are you saying this limitation on hires would only apply to traders who had a bid at switch?

Again, I think not allowing a guild to disband while they hold a guild trader would be a far more effective solution to this problem.

Slurg · July 2017

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

This would have no affect and might actually benefit the larger trading guilds as they would have an easier time of making sure someone was on to bid in that 24 hour period. At the end of the 24 hour period they could still disband the other guilds.

Not a great solution but if a guild wins a trader then disbands maybe that trader should just be locked for the week. The guild would lose the gold they bid and there would be fewer incentives to bid on traders you have no intention of using. Large trading guilds could still bid on other traders and leave them empty hoping to cut down on competition but that would be expensive quick to be very effective.

If it weren't a drain on resources and/or a pain to implement might also ban (from bidding) any account that has bid on a trader then had the guild fold. Even the big guilds would quickly run out of players able and willing to bid on sham traders.

"maybe that trader should just be locked for the week."

This is what I said. "Not being able to bid on an empty trader" is synonymous with "trader should be locked for a week".

No. You said limit the bids to 24 hours. It's not the same thing. In fact what you are saying means traders that are not bid on also will not be available for any of the non-cheating guilds to pick up as a backup if they lose their bid.

If a guild (person) can only bid on a trader for 24 hours (Saturday, 9pm to Sun 9pm), then by the power of logic they cannot bid on a trader for the other 144 hours.

Ergo, the trader is locked for a week if the original guild bands it (or at least for 144 hours). This is simple deduction.

Your logic does not hold up. It is unnecessarily restrictive and punitive to guild leaders who have lives. Why on earth would it be necessary to prevent people from putting in a bid on the previous Friday for Sunday? It isn't, it's just mean spirited.

Galenus_of_Pergamon · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

Slurg wrote: »

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

This would have no affect and might actually benefit the larger trading guilds as they would have an easier time of making sure someone was on to bid in that 24 hour period. At the end of the 24 hour period they could still disband the other guilds.

Not a great solution but if a guild wins a trader then disbands maybe that trader should just be locked for the week. The guild would lose the gold they bid and there would be fewer incentives to bid on traders you have no intention of using. Large trading guilds could still bid on other traders and leave them empty hoping to cut down on competition but that would be expensive quick to be very effective.

If it weren't a drain on resources and/or a pain to implement might also ban (from bidding) any account that has bid on a trader then had the guild fold. Even the big guilds would quickly run out of players able and willing to bid on sham traders.

"maybe that trader should just be locked for the week."

This is what I said. "Not being able to bid on an empty trader" is synonymous with "trader should be locked for a week".

No. You said limit the bids to 24 hours. It's not the same thing. In fact what you are saying means traders that are not bid on also will not be available for any of the non-cheating guilds to pick up as a backup if they lose their bid.

If a guild (person) can only bid on a trader for 24 hours (Saturday, 9pm to Sun 9pm), then by the power of logic they cannot bid on a trader for the other 144 hours.

Ergo, the trader is locked for a week if the original guild bands it (or at least for 144 hours). This is simple deduction.

Your logic does not hold up. It is unnecessarily restrictive and punitive to guild leaders who have lives. Why on earth would it be necessary to prevent people from putting in a bid on the previous Friday for Sunday? It isn't, it's just mean spirited.

You're confusing solution and logic. You may disagree with my solution, but you cannot refute my logical statement.

168-24 =144. That's 6 days where traders cannot be bid on.

Is my solution the solution? Perhaps not. Does 168-24= 144? Yes, irrefutably.

Immortal_Dark410 · July 2017

Slurg wrote: »

[ Your logic does not hold up. It is unnecessarily restrictive and punitive to guild leaders who have lives. Why on earth would it be necessary to prevent people from putting in a bid on the previous Friday for Sunday? It isn't, it's just mean spirited.

I do agree, Most if not all GM's have a life outside of the game & Can't commit to one specific day to put bids in, they could be at work or have other commitments on those days, dont think we can limit it to just 1 day, maybe if we limit it to, Can put 1 Bid in only in a 7 day window & Cannot increase the bid after, Maybe that might help, Who know's im just throwing idea's out there lol.

lordxyrax_ESO · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

puffytheslayer wrote: »

just get rid of traders already - im sorry but if i wanted to play with money id play monopoly!

THIS!!

The whole trader system is beyond stupid. Just do what most other games do and have a global AH.

Galenus_of_Pergamon · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

This is my last comment.

I do not intend to gain the favor of all forum folks.

I do not claim my solution is the best solution.

I do not claim to have a neutral poll. I am a whistleblower, not a scientist.

I do claim that some ESO players (on the Playstation 4 North American server) are manipulating an in-game mechanic in a way not intended by Zenimax Studios (disbanding guilds for the purpose of gifting and/or reselling traders). More than one person in this thread has substantiated my claim.

It is so. Think of it what you will.

Hawco10 · July 2017

Yes, restrict the trader bidding window to 24 hours (thus discouraging shadow guilds from gifting traders to their parent guilds and/or reselling the trader for profit).

Another thing that concerns me here. There was a poster who said that some trading guilds hide the transaction history, this means that if someone is puttIng in 10/20k per week due to "high bid prices" then that might not be factual. Therefore, not only are the general population being ripped off, so too are the paying members of the tradiing guild. Which leaves a small band of people raking in the gold. How on earth can this possibly be justified as good for the game ? How can Zos allow this? How does this form of scamming provide a positive gameplay experience for us, the player base?

driosketch · July 2017

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

If you limit bidding to a shorter duration it would mostly hurt the smaller trading guilds. The leaders and officers of top guilds usually have a lot of time and can bid every week, no matter when it's allowed to bid. In smaller guilds people usually play less. So the small guilds might loose their trader just because the leader and officer have something better to do on a sunday than playing a game.

Even small trading guilds that care about being an actual trading guild can find the time on the weekend to place a bid. If not, that's what recruiting active officers are for.

Not as easy as you think. You can't just give a random member officer powers. Take my guild, small but the leadership subsidies our lone trader spot to give our members access to the market. I'm already the back up, our founder is on leave, and my latest recruit for an officer position hasn't been on since last week.

The change you propose could cost us a trader some weeks while the big guilds might just take our spot and mirror membership to the side guild. @kargen27 has it right. You lock a trader for the rest of the week after a guild disbands to kill the practice while not hurting the small guy.

Immortal_Dark410 · July 2017

Hawco10 wrote: »

Another thing that concerns me here. There was a poster who said that some trading guilds hide the transaction history, this means that if someone is puttIng in 10/20k per week due to "high bid prices" then that might not be factual. Therefore, not only are the general population being ripped off, so too are the paying members of the tradiing guild. Which leaves a small band of people raking in the gold. How on earth can this possibly be justified as good for the game ? How can Zos allow this? How does this form of scamming provide a positive gameplay experience for us, the player base?

I dont know how you can do that, its not possible unless their using some kind of cheating add on, because in the games Base User-interface all Guild History & Guild Bank Transactions are made public so members can see them, Even the sales. so I dont know how thats possible. Just go in game click on the Guild home page & The Orb on the top right is Guild History Page.

Tan9oSuccka · July 2017

Danksta wrote: »

Always have to vote for the opposite poll option in biased polls that the OP wanted. Especially in this case since you have no evidence to back your claim.

Your kidding, right?

Watch the guild Traders in Mournhold at about 8PM on Sunday. About half are no name guilds with nothing for sale.

Pay close attention to the names. They'll change to a real guild shortly after.

What additional proof do you need? A notorized stool sample?

DivinityDay · July 2017

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

This would have no affect and might actually benefit the larger trading guilds as they would have an easier time of making sure someone was on to bid in that 24 hour period. At the end of the 24 hour period they could still disband the other guilds.

Not a great solution but if a guild wins a trader then disbands maybe that trader should just be locked for the week. The guild would lose the gold they bid and there would be fewer incentives to bid on traders you have no intention of using. Large trading guilds could still bid on other traders and leave them empty hoping to cut down on competition but that would be expensive quick to be very effective.

If it weren't a drain on resources and/or a pain to implement might also ban (from bidding) any account that has bid on a trader then had the guild fold. Even the big guilds would quickly run out of players able and willing to bid on sham traders.

Here's how it would at least partially alleviate the problem.

Hypothetical shell guild named "Heroic Trading" bids on a trader Saturday night at 9pm eastern. Let's say Heroic Trading wins their trader on Sunday night at 9pm (standard trader change time).

So, then they disband it Sunday night at 11pm for their parent guild to be right beside the trader stall to pick it up for 10k.

Not anymore! Once they disband the shell guild, the trader stall becomes unavailable until next Sunday and remains empty.

Granted, the shell guild could still disband on Saturday night at 9:01pm and the parent guild could own the trader for 23 hours.

But, how much less valuable is holding a trading guild for 23 hours than for 168 hours (7 full days)?

I see your point and it sounds logical but then trolls might see this as an opportunity to make stalls unavailable.

MalagenR · July 2017

But none of what you're saying matters because those trading guilds have the best active traders in them. The best active crafters and some of the best active players. They provide the market place with a ton more goods than any of the complaining guilds can, and, once the complaining folks get their *** together, the big guilds just can't stop them. It's literally that simple, it's pretty basic economics. If you can't compete with a bid it's because you don't have enough sales volume to actually compete with these guilds. If you don't have the sales volume why the hell would any of us want your guild to have a trader over a guild that is going to have more supply of rare items and better prices on raw materials etc.?

It is whack they use shadow guilds but they are probably doing it to bid in stages so that somehow they get a trader and don't get pushed out of the market by some guy who gold hoarded since open beta and wants to lock down all the stores with stupid high bids and ruin the market for people actually playing.

Can't tell you how many "free" trading guilds I've joined that are populated with hundreds of members and nobody buys or sells a damn thing in the guild store. It's pathetic, you're not a trading guild unless people are actually trading in your guild.

Slurg · July 2017

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

This would have no affect and might actually benefit the larger trading guilds as they would have an easier time of making sure someone was on to bid in that 24 hour period. At the end of the 24 hour period they could still disband the other guilds.

Not a great solution but if a guild wins a trader then disbands maybe that trader should just be locked for the week. The guild would lose the gold they bid and there would be fewer incentives to bid on traders you have no intention of using. Large trading guilds could still bid on other traders and leave them empty hoping to cut down on competition but that would be expensive quick to be very effective.

If it weren't a drain on resources and/or a pain to implement might also ban (from bidding) any account that has bid on a trader then had the guild fold. Even the big guilds would quickly run out of players able and willing to bid on sham traders.

"maybe that trader should just be locked for the week."

This is what I said. "Not being able to bid on an empty trader" is synonymous with "trader should be locked for a week".

No. You said limit the bids to 24 hours. It's not the same thing. In fact what you are saying means traders that are not bid on also will not be available for any of the non-cheating guilds to pick up as a backup if they lose their bid.

If a guild (person) can only bid on a trader for 24 hours (Saturday, 9pm to Sun 9pm), then by the power of logic they cannot bid on a trader for the other 144 hours.

Ergo, the trader is locked for a week if the original guild bands it (or at least for 144 hours). This is simple deduction.

Your logic does not hold up. It is unnecessarily restrictive and punitive to guild leaders who have lives. Why on earth would it be necessary to prevent people from putting in a bid on the previous Friday for Sunday? It isn't, it's just mean spirited.

You're confusing solution and logic. You may disagree with my solution, but you cannot refute my logical statement.

168-24 =144. That's 6 days where traders cannot be bid on.

Is my solution the solution? Perhaps not. Does 168-24= 144? Yes, irrefutably.

I'm not confused at all. Your proposed solution is just bad.

Immortal_Dark410 · July 2017

MalagenR wrote: »

But none of what you're saying matters because those trading guilds have the best active traders in them. The best active crafters and some of the best active players. They provide the market place with a ton more goods than any of the complaining guilds can, and, once the complaining folks get their *** together, the big guilds just can't stop them. It's literally that simple, it's pretty basic economics. If you can't compete with a bid it's because you don't have enough sales volume to actually compete with these guilds. If you don't have the sales volume why the hell would any of us want your guild to have a trader over a guild that is going to have more supply of rare items and better prices on raw materials etc.?

It is whack they use shadow guilds but they are probably doing it to bid in stages so that somehow they get a trader and don't get pushed out of the market by some guy who gold hoarded since open beta and wants to lock down all the stores with stupid high bids and ruin the market for people actually playing.

Can't tell you how many "free" trading guilds I've joined that are populated with hundreds of members and nobody buys or sells a damn thing in the guild store. It's pathetic, you're not a trading guild unless people are actually trading in your guild.

I agree with you on the "Traders" have to be active, its true, if their not then its hard to even keep a Trader stall or get one, members need to be active in that guild & they need to be supporting that guild as well, for it to actually be sustainable or flourish.

JUGSoMILK · July 2017

No, let guilds bid 168 hours (7 days) per week on a trader- and preserve convenience- even if it encourages monopolies and breaches in ZoS terms of service.

Galenus_of_Pergamon wrote: »

JUGSoMILK wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

None of this should matter because these major guilds have a large number of active traders that supply the market with more goods than most of the small guilds complaining. If you're a small guild, work your way up, eventually if you have a large amount of active traders you'll be able to compete, they won't be able to stop you.

That's exactly what we had to do. We bid HEAVY and these Mafia guilds rarely out bid us in capital cities.

You haven't been on their radar or pissed them off yet. Twenty two guilds having tens of millions of gold can push out anyone if they don't want you there.

Oh bro! I used to be in the mafia... I have pissed them off ALOT! We ain't scared tho!

FelixTheCatt · July 2017

Stand up to guild traders. They're nothing special anyways. Enough players boycott em , they'd listen to their members and just maybe ZoS would actually do something about them.

Another case of falling on deaf ears as noone will do a thing to stop it. The players like to whine but do nothing to take action beyond !making another crybaby thread and ZoS could care less as long as the money rolls in.