DPS queueing as healers or tanks

SoLooney · July 2017

This isnt a big of a deal in normal dungeons as you can mostly faceroll through them with 3 or 4 dps and a healer or tank maybe, but holy crap, how many times Im doing a hard vet dungeon like the dlc ones and I get some scrub dps who for a second thinks he can get away tanking some really hard bosses.
What ends up happening is the fake tank is immediately killed or teammates are aggrod and end up having to kite the boss so dps is so bad because the boss is moving around so much.

What really takes the cake is after we all wipe, I initiate a vote and some idiot decides to allow this behavior and it says vote kick has failed. Like holy crap, you like having fake tanks and contantly wiping?
Just needed to vent, this happens way too often in pug groups.
Yes, i have guilds to do dailies with but sometimes cant get people, so i pug.
Share your stories

MyKillv2.0 · July 2017

Welcome to ESO, "play as you want".

I once had a Sorc que as a healer and then claimed to have forgotten his resto staff. #smh... happens. A lot of try hards watch YouTube vids where "content creators" solo these dungeons and these try hards think they can do the same because hey copy & paste their build. They fully expect to hear "OMGz u so awesome" rather than the real reaction of salt and annoyance.

South Park had a skit on these types of people a few years ago, featuring them as motorcycle bikers.

Dracindo · July 2017

There once was an Argonian by the name of Dracindo, who stayed away from endgame PvE content as much as he could, and ended up living a stress-free life in Tamriel.

The End.

Crafts_Many_Boxes · July 2017

I random qued Saturday and got normal Crade of Shadows. It went okay, even though the tank was a 30-something warden tank, because both myself and the other dps were decent and we had a good healer.

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Got another tank, also a 20-something with like 20k hp. Got rekt, we boot him, que up again. A third tank comes in, level 21 templar with 18k hp, and I flat out ask him "hey man, do you at least have a tank set you haven't equipped yet, or know the mecahnics in here?" and he just responds with "it's cool I'll leave". We went through three "tanks" over the course of an hour, and not one of them was able to do this content. We ultimately disbanded, on the second to last boss.

Hey, does anyone remember that time I made a whole thread about lowbies being able to get DLC and II dungeons in their normal random ques is a huge problem, and the vast majority said I was crazy? Because I sure remember!

eso_nya · July 2017

Id like a soloinstance with tank-challenge, healer-challenge and dd-challenge u have to beat in order to unlock role-icons for vet-modes groupfinder.

Yes i can solo some of the vet dungeons, but when i q, i want ppl who can do the role they picked. If they fail doing so, they r just deadweight.
In regards of the new dlc, when i heard dungeonpack i thought "Great, good grps will complete hm on day 1 and qq in the forums it was to easy, while i wont try to pug them before 2018."

Jamini · July 2017

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Was he dying on the spin attack, or after the teleport?

* The spin attack on normal can be survived with 20k health or so as long as you block it.
* The teleport move is always a oneshot. The players who don't get tethered down need to bash the shadows so the person tied down can move out of the way (just sprint away/rolldodge twice away)

I'm not dismissing you, but that fight requires a lot more than others from DPS players due to the mechanics. If you don't do them, the tank is always going to die/get one-shot.

Giraffon · July 2017

Those guys running around queuing up as tanks that aren't actually tanks. They really hack me off. And what never stops amazing me is how rude they are when you confront them. They always just want to bully through. It's always like "It's fine, let's go" type responses when you call them out on it.

When I'm on with a DPS and I've been in the queue for 40 minutes to get to this dungeon and now another DPS jumps in after about 30 seconds because he/she queued as a tank. Yeah, it's not fair. It's rude. I don't like it. Whether we need a tank or not is not the issue for me. Usually what I'll do is before we get to the first boss I'll say something like, "You are clearly not a tank. If we wipe on any boss because you were not pulling agro I'm going to vote to kick you." Sometimes that gets ignored. Sometimes the vote doesn't pass even when I do it, but it helps to educate the other players in the group what is expected. I will usually drop out if a kick vote doesn't pass. Even if I think they can get through it, I'll do it on principle.

SoLooney · July 2017

Giraffon wrote: »

Those guys running around queuing up as tanks that aren't actually tanks. They really hack me off. And what never stops amazing me is how rude they are when you confront them. They always just want to bully through. It's always like "It's fine, let's go" type responses when you call them out on it.

When I'm on with a DPS and I've been in the queue for 40 minutes to get to this dungeon and now another DPS jumps in after about 30 seconds because he/she queued as a tank. Yeah, it's not fair. It's rude. I don't like it. Whether we need a tank or not is not the issue for me. Usually what I'll do is before we get to the first boss I'll say something like, "You are clearly not a tank. If we wipe on any boss because you were not pulling agro I'm going to vote to kick you." Sometimes that gets ignored. Sometimes the vote doesn't pass even when I do it, but it helps to educate the other players in the group what is expected. I will usually drop out if a kick vote doesn't pass. Even if I think they can get through it, I'll do it on principle.

Love your post. I also call them out and they either ignore or say the dps will be good so we can ignore mechanics. Certain bosses it just doesnt cut it and after we wipe, i always vote to kick. if it doesnt pass after multiple times, the group is beyond help and i just block the fake tank and leave. i dont mind fake healers as much, i usually can self sustain fine. fake tanks are a lot worse

Crafts_Many_Boxes · July 2017

Jamini wrote: »

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Was he dying on the spin attack, or after the teleport?

* The spin attack on normal can be survived with 20k health or so as long as you block it.
* The teleport move is always a oneshot. The players who don't get tethered down need to bash the shadows so the person tied down can move out of the way (just sprint away/rolldodge twice away)

I'm not dismissing you, but that fight requires a lot more than others from DPS players due to the mechanics. If you don't do them, the tank is always going to die/get one-shot.

I understand there are things for the dps to do, but it was mostly on the tank. He wasn't blocking a lot of the big hits, not interrupting a lot of the wind-up attacks, and just dying all the time. Again, this guy had like 25k health, and he probably wasn't in tank gear. Who knows if he had the right passives or armor on.

As for the tether move, we freed the target every time. Does he teleport to the target and oneshot them if you fail that? In previous groups before that day I'd noticed the person always died, but I'd never observed a teleport.

Reverb · July 2017

I've got a guildmate who runs a s+b Healer build for plugging, because she says there are so many fake tanks in the queue that she draws aggro with her heals in almost every boss fight. I used to make fun of her, but in my last few vet pug attempts I've though about eating crow and asking about her build.

lordspyder · July 2017

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

I random qued Saturday and got normal Crade of Shadows. It went okay, even though the tank was a 30-something warden tank, because both myself and the other dps were decent and we had a good healer.

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Got another tank, also a 20-something with like 20k hp. Got rekt, we boot him, que up again. A third tank comes in, level 21 templar with 18k hp, and I flat out ask him "hey man, do you at least have a tank set you haven't equipped yet, or know the mecahnics in here?" and he just responds with "it's cool I'll leave". We went through three "tanks" over the course of an hour, and not one of them was able to do this content. We ultimately disbanded, on the second to last boss.

Hey, does anyone remember that time I made a whole thread about lowbies being able to get DLC and II dungeons in their normal random ques is a huge problem, and the vast majority said I was crazy? Because I sure remember!

I started a new tank last week, and at Lil 10 queued up. Cos was my first dungeon. I survived as tank at Lvl 10. Me thinks you just don't k ow the dungeons

Crafts_Many_Boxes · July 2017

lordspyder wrote: »

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

I random qued Saturday and got normal Crade of Shadows. It went okay, even though the tank was a 30-something warden tank, because both myself and the other dps were decent and we had a good healer.

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Got another tank, also a 20-something with like 20k hp. Got rekt, we boot him, que up again. A third tank comes in, level 21 templar with 18k hp, and I flat out ask him "hey man, do you at least have a tank set you haven't equipped yet, or know the mecahnics in here?" and he just responds with "it's cool I'll leave". We went through three "tanks" over the course of an hour, and not one of them was able to do this content. We ultimately disbanded, on the second to last boss.

Hey, does anyone remember that time I made a whole thread about lowbies being able to get DLC and II dungeons in their normal random ques is a huge problem, and the vast majority said I was crazy? Because I sure remember!

I started a new tank last week, and at Lil 10 queued up. Cos was my first dungeon. I survived as tank at Lvl 10. Me thinks you just don't k ow the dungeons

Except I took my friend in there yesterday who's a CP 193 tank with okay gear and some know-how. I was in TS talking him through it, and we got it done in 2-3 attempts, with worse heals and a worse dps helping me.

A level 10 with a couple hundred CP points > a level 30 with the wrong armor, completely wrong passives, and no CP points.

Jamini · July 2017

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

I understand there are things for the dps to do, but it was mostly on the tank. He wasn't blocking a lot of the big hits, not interrupting a lot of the wind-up attacks, and just dying all the time. Again, this guy had like 25k health, and he probably wasn't in tank gear. Who knows if he had the right passives or armor on.

As for the tether move, we freed the target every time. Does he teleport to the target and oneshot them if you fail that? In previous groups before that day I'd noticed the person always died, but I'd never observed a teleport.

There is nothing a tank can interrupt on that boss. He literally just needed to block until the red phase (where he needs to kite the boss into the shadows). If he doesn't know that, you need to tell him. 25k health in any armor (yes even light. I've gotten hit by my healer and dps with 16k and 18k health before and survived with a simple block) can survive the spin as long as you are blocking. 30k health in heavy armor can survive it on normal without blocking. (do not recommend)

The oneshot is delayed and has a fairly large cone (larger than you think). The boss himself likes to move when using his high-damage attacks. You need to dodgeroll TWICE to 100% avoid it as soon as you are free.

Tasear · July 2017

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

I random qued Saturday and got normal Crade of Shadows. It went okay, even though the tank was a 30-something warden tank, because both myself and the other dps were decent and we had a good healer.

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Got another tank, also a 20-something with like 20k hp. Got rekt, we boot him, que up again. A third tank comes in, level 21 templar with 18k hp, and I flat out ask him "hey man, do you at least have a tank set you haven't equipped yet, or know the mecahnics in here?" and he just responds with "it's cool I'll leave". We went through three "tanks" over the course of an hour, and not one of them was able to do this content. We ultimately disbanded, on the second to last boss.

Hey, does anyone remember that time I made a whole thread about lowbies being able to get DLC and II dungeons in their normal random ques is a huge problem, and the vast majority said I was crazy? Because I sure remember!

Was that me

Because I walked away from that fight. Healer couldn't keep up with damage and I had poor ressintance in my lvl 30 tank. So had 10k health after adds pin me down.

josiahva · July 2017

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

I random qued Saturday and got normal Crade of Shadows. It went okay, even though the tank was a 30-something warden tank, because both myself and the other dps were decent and we had a good healer.

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Got another tank, also a 20-something with like 20k hp. Got rekt, we boot him, que up again. A third tank comes in, level 21 templar with 18k hp, and I flat out ask him "hey man, do you at least have a tank set you haven't equipped yet, or know the mecahnics in here?" and he just responds with "it's cool I'll leave". We went through three "tanks" over the course of an hour, and not one of them was able to do this content. We ultimately disbanded, on the second to last boss.

Hey, does anyone remember that time I made a whole thread about lowbies being able to get DLC and II dungeons in their normal random ques is a huge problem, and the vast majority said I was crazy? Because I sure remember!

20k health is perfectly sufficient for CoS(hell, I have tanked vCoS with 24k health). There are 3 things that can one shot a 20k tank in vCoS(probably not even a one shot in normal)
1. Dranos' Steel Tornado heavy attack...stepping back three steps and forward one step will cause this to miss(while blocking of course in case it connects)
2. Its possible a 20k tank could also be one shotted by one of the statue AoEs...not likely in normal though.
3. Dranos' pinning move...this will one shot ANY tank under 50k health(vet) unless the ads are interrupted by the DPS and/or healer.

You see all these 50k+ health tanks running around(and yes, I have one set of gear that gives me 50k, which I use for shield spamming for the group and to survive Dranos' pinning when people don't interrupt) but 50k is NOT needed for tanking. I consider 24k the bare minimum needed for tanking a difficult vet dungeon, depending on the build, but in the end, its not the health that makes the tank....its the tanking and the knowledge. Its quite possible you had a run of bad tanks...this happens, I know I had a miserable time the first time I tanked Dranos, until I learned that fight is 90% tanking and how to do it, but dont go blaming their health...blame their skill and/or lack of knowledge, both of which are solved with experience.

Tan9oSuccka · July 2017

I want them to get rid of the multi queuing ability.

Too many Mr. clever DPS guys who can't wait in line like the others.

svartorn · July 2017

News flash: most players in this game are dead weight.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

Sounds like you should join a guild and run pre-made groups of 4 to clear dungeons. Seriously, the amount of stupid you'll encounter via the Group Finder isn't worth it. You'll just end up wasting your time, soul germs, and gold most of the time.

DivinityDay · July 2017

Sorc DPS here, I q up as TANK, HEALS and DPS. Then, once in the dungeon I run though ALL the rooms, pull all the bosses and adds and burn them down in the last room. Then I just cool walk away.

Crafts_Many_Boxes · July 2017

Tasear wrote: »

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

I random qued Saturday and got normal Crade of Shadows. It went okay, even though the tank was a 30-something warden tank, because both myself and the other dps were decent and we had a good healer.

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Got another tank, also a 20-something with like 20k hp. Got rekt, we boot him, que up again. A third tank comes in, level 21 templar with 18k hp, and I flat out ask him "hey man, do you at least have a tank set you haven't equipped yet, or know the mecahnics in here?" and he just responds with "it's cool I'll leave". We went through three "tanks" over the course of an hour, and not one of them was able to do this content. We ultimately disbanded, on the second to last boss.

Hey, does anyone remember that time I made a whole thread about lowbies being able to get DLC and II dungeons in their normal random ques is a huge problem, and the vast majority said I was crazy? Because I sure remember!

Was that me

Because I walked away from that fight. Healer couldn't keep up with damage and I had poor ressintance in my lvl 30 tank. So had 10k health after adds pin me down.

I don't think so? We kicked our tank after we tried explaining (what we understood of) the mechanics to him about the ads the orbs and making sure to block and such, and continued to wipe for several more pulls.

I'm not surprised though, that boss seems to derail every CoS run that survives the teleport-caster in the spider caves.

josiahva wrote: »

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

I random qued Saturday and got normal Crade of Shadows. It went okay, even though the tank was a 30-something warden tank, because both myself and the other dps were decent and we had a good healer.

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Got another tank, also a 20-something with like 20k hp. Got rekt, we boot him, que up again. A third tank comes in, level 21 templar with 18k hp, and I flat out ask him "hey man, do you at least have a tank set you haven't equipped yet, or know the mecahnics in here?" and he just responds with "it's cool I'll leave". We went through three "tanks" over the course of an hour, and not one of them was able to do this content. We ultimately disbanded, on the second to last boss.

Hey, does anyone remember that time I made a whole thread about lowbies being able to get DLC and II dungeons in their normal random ques is a huge problem, and the vast majority said I was crazy? Because I sure remember!

20k health is perfectly sufficient for CoS(hell, I have tanked vCoS with 24k health). There are 3 things that can one shot a 20k tank in vCoS(probably not even a one shot in normal)
1. Dranos' Steel Tornado heavy attack...stepping back three steps and forward one step will cause this to miss(while blocking of course in case it connects)
2. Its possible a 20k tank could also be one shotted by one of the statue AoEs...not likely in normal though.
3. Dranos' pinning move...this will one shot ANY tank under 50k health(vet) unless the ads are interrupted by the DPS and/or healer.

You see all these 50k+ health tanks running around(and yes, I have one set of gear that gives me 50k, which I use for shield spamming for the group and to survive Dranos' pinning when people don't interrupt) but 50k is NOT needed for tanking. I consider 24k the bare minimum needed for tanking a difficult vet dungeon, depending on the build, but in the end, its not the health that makes the tank....its the tanking and the knowledge. Its quite possible you had a run of bad tanks...this happens, I know I had a miserable time the first time I tanked Dranos, until I learned that fight is 90% tanking and how to do it, but dont go blaming their health...blame their skill and/or lack of knowledge, both of which are solved with experience.

Yeah, I understand that health isn't the be-all end-all. Still, these tanks must have not been blocking enough then. I'm guessing they didn't have the stamina for sustained blocking, considering I don't think any of them had block cost reduction from CP and probably didn't have many sturdy traits / weren't heavy attacking between the big hits. It all goes back to how they probably weren't properly equipped to tank, which is why OP started this thread.

Sordidfairytale · July 2017

A few things are being discussed here, Tanking techniques, fight mechanics, and catfish queuing. Only one of them can't be improved by forum posts.

HalloweenWeed · July 2017

eso_nya wrote: »

Id like a soloinstance with tank-challenge, healer-challenge and dd-challenge u have to beat in order to unlock role-icons for vet-modes groupfinder.

Interesting idea, and I would agree except for the actual implementation (ZOS) part. Heck, they've been working on the group finder for how long - and still haven't gotten it right. Then there's the newer Battlegrounds - still patching. And would you trust them to implement a test for role? I wouldn't. Even if they implemented a system to check stats for possible roles - would be buggy as heck. This is why I think they must leave that unchanged, the way it is.
What's worse than players that aren't tanks queuing as tanks? Player that ARE tanks NOT being allowed to queue as tanks.

Not only that, as was said the player execution of plays is the biggest thing that makes a difference. And tanks MUST taunt, or they're worthless in some situations. I'd bet many of the players that think they are tanking don't even have a taunt ability - or know to use it.

Oh, my upcoming tank on the PC NA server is Casontril BTW. Lv 40 presently.

vovus69 · July 2017

I do random normals and regular normal dungeons a lot. My rule of thumb looks like this:
1) all I and II dungeons with exception of Darkshade II - doesn't matter. Even one vet (me) and 3 non vets will dps through
2) Darkshade II - absolute minimum - 2 vets, one dps (me) and one heal. If heal is non vet - you should tell him what to do when last boss went to green phase.
3) DLC dungeons - ICP and WGT - three vets min. If I see two non vets on normal, I am leaving.
4) DLC dungeons - RoM and CoS - four vets, no exclusions. Those have weird mechanics and it should be done properly. If there are no four vets, I am leaving.

Follow this up and you will be fine all the time

-vovus

KingMagaw · July 2017

PCEU asking in capital zones and craglorn can take ages to fill a group, usually tank then healer hardest to get.

Games population or no update to monster helms in a while you choose.

People can either waste time in group finder as a DD or highlight all 4 icons, haha, and get in straight away. Or decline invites until they get one as a DD but that defeats selecting all roles haha.

Players want to play the game not queue to squander time. Many have been carried through dungeon runs so are clueless what to do.

ZoS fault for nerfing down PvE where players can solo Veteran Dungeons content that is designed for a 4 person team.

MrBetadine · July 2017

DivinityDay wrote: »

Sorc DPS here, I q up as TANK, HEALS and DPS. Then, once in the dungeon I run though ALL the rooms, pull all the bosses and adds and burn them down in the last room. Then I just cool walk away.

If you are so capable, why not just solo the dungeon? Why use grouping tool and ruin other people's fun? Nobody want to watch your personal show.

rotaugen454 · July 2017

Fake tank queuing should earn a 30 day suspension by ZoS.

lordspyder · July 2017

vovus69 wrote: »

I do random normals and regular normal dungeons a lot. My rule of thumb looks like this:
1) all I and II dungeons with exception of Darkshade II - doesn't matter. Even one vet (me) and 3 non vets will dps through
2) Darkshade II - absolute minimum - 2 vets, one dps (me) and one heal. If heal is non vet - you should tell him what to do when last boss went to green phase.
3) DLC dungeons - ICP and WGT - three vets min. If I see two non vets on normal, I am leaving.
4) DLC dungeons - RoM and CoS - four vets, no exclusions. Those have weird mechanics and it should be done properly. If there are no four vets, I am leaving.

Follow this up and you will be fine all the time

-vovus

Wow, that's rough, My first clear ever of RoM was with 4 sub 50's. I was lvl 24 at the time. None of us had ever been there and we still cleared it. Maybe if you need groups to be that high level the problem is you...

Magdalina · July 2017

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

Jamini wrote: »

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Was he dying on the spin attack, or after the teleport?

* The spin attack on normal can be survived with 20k health or so as long as you block it.
* The teleport move is always a oneshot. The players who don't get tethered down need to bash the shadows so the person tied down can move out of the way (just sprint away/rolldodge twice away)

I'm not dismissing you, but that fight requires a lot more than others from DPS players due to the mechanics. If you don't do them, the tank is always going to die/get one-shot.

I understand there are things for the dps to do, but it was mostly on the tank. He wasn't blocking a lot of the big hits, not interrupting a lot of the wind-up attacks, and just dying all the time. Again, this guy had like 25k health, and he probably wasn't in tank gear. Who knows if he had the right passives or armor on.

As for the tether move, we freed the target every time. Does he teleport to the target and oneshot them if you fail that? In previous groups before that day I'd noticed the person always died, but I'd never observed a teleport.

That guy is very kite-able. Just saying. I've kited him before up until I'd get chained on my 16k health sorc, no streak, no speed buff. Granted I was doing 0 dps pretty much but he is possible to do without a proper tank. That was on vet too, the thing is all his attacks are conveniently very melee range.

It doesn't excuse bad tanks, it simply means if you and just one other person(needed to bash) know what they're doing you can pass him with or without a tank.

Also, one thing a lot of people don't understand is that bash doesn't interrupt his heavy when someone is chained, it only breaks the person free so they're able to avoid it. Do basically once you're un-chained you MUST dodge or block/shield, no exceptions. A lot of people simply don't realize this on their first runs so it really helps if you tell them(assuming of course they're capable of listening at all).

Crafts_Many_Boxes · July 2017

Magdalina wrote: »

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

Jamini wrote: »

Crafts_Many_Boxes wrote: »

The blood fountain boss comes along (the human who spawns the red clones of himself), and the tank just got repeatedly 1 or 2 shot. There's no healing through that, and we couldn't rez the tank fast enough for the pull not to fall apart. Tried it a few more times, then had to boot the tank.

Was he dying on the spin attack, or after the teleport?

* The spin attack on normal can be survived with 20k health or so as long as you block it.
* The teleport move is always a oneshot. The players who don't get tethered down need to bash the shadows so the person tied down can move out of the way (just sprint away/rolldodge twice away)

I'm not dismissing you, but that fight requires a lot more than others from DPS players due to the mechanics. If you don't do them, the tank is always going to die/get one-shot.

I understand there are things for the dps to do, but it was mostly on the tank. He wasn't blocking a lot of the big hits, not interrupting a lot of the wind-up attacks, and just dying all the time. Again, this guy had like 25k health, and he probably wasn't in tank gear. Who knows if he had the right passives or armor on.

As for the tether move, we freed the target every time. Does he teleport to the target and oneshot them if you fail that? In previous groups before that day I'd noticed the person always died, but I'd never observed a teleport.

That guy is very kite-able. Just saying. I've kited him before up until I'd get chained on my 16k health sorc, no streak, no speed buff. Granted I was doing 0 dps pretty much but he is possible to do without a proper tank. That was on vet too, the thing is all his attacks are conveniently very melee range.

It doesn't excuse bad tanks, it simply means if you and just one other person(needed to bash) know what they're doing you can pass him with or without a tank.

Also, one thing a lot of people don't understand is that bash doesn't interrupt his heavy when someone is chained, it only breaks the person free so they're able to avoid it. Do basically once you're un-chained you MUST dodge or block/shield, no exceptions. A lot of people simply don't realize this on their first runs so it really helps if you tell them(assuming of course they're capable of listening at all).

Are you sure you're not talking about a vet mechanic that doesn't exist on normal? We were consistently breaking out the trapped person by bashing the two clones, but I don't remember any extra aoe cone from the boss during that timeframe, or even a heavy attack during it for that matter. That being said, i try to keep my distance from that particular boss to give the healer one less melee to worry about.

It was pretty rare that one of us would die, 90% of the time it was the tank at certain times, and the pull would fall apart because he'd run around killing all of us before rezzes could be done.

Megabear · July 2017

I give them the boot and vote almost always votes in favor of the boot. One guy yesterday said "I hate you guys" as he was being removed from the dungeon. That was kind of endearing though.

Asardes · July 2017

Guilty as charged. I queue as tank on my sorcerer to farm some normal instances and end up doing 60-80% group DPS