Sorry we need our guild monopoly, more collusion also. Keeps the rich, rich and the powerful, powerful.

To Quote the last GM of a popular trading guild...If you don't pay your dues now I'll make your life a misery in this game, you don't know how powerful I am in this game!

Still I am yet to see this power, But srsly Trading system needs reworking, on PC it's not too bad thanks to MM, just buy a spot in a ropey location and sell stuff that people want with good prices and you won't have issues raking it in.

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Problem is for the past few weeks its been very slow everywhere, we need to get more people in on the community trading and being limited with a small minority of guild vendors which can only hold so many people at a time leaves the rest of the game out in the dirt basically.

It's slow because there is nothing good to sell and people are tired of farming, this is the root cause of it all. Any decent is BOP, unless you strike gold and land a sharp necro lit staff you won't sell much at the moment, I just list all my items for way below average prices to get shot of anything.

I would rather just have a global search feature but have it so people still need to do the leg work.

Trading which required effort rather than sitting in one location flipping is better in my mind.

Invincible wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I would rather just have a global search feature but have it so people still need to do the leg work.

Trading which required effort rather than sitting in one location flipping is better in my mind.

That doesn't make any sense.

Okay so right now if you want to market trade even if you're using global search features for deals (like TCC) you need to travel around and do some legwork for the money.

If you have one central hub then you just stand there buying low selling high and never actually move. With add-on's like TCC it wouldn't take long until something more advanced like EVE Online's 3rd party programs came out where it will literally tell you what to buy and sell at what price and all you need to is copy paste text in and out of the client.

Zvorgin wrote: »

The economy is fine. The current trading system is one of the things I enjoy most about ESO and I'd bet a global auction house would ruin it.

Yet every single other MMO on the current market uses some sort of server side auction house, and they aren't ruined at all?

Zvorgin wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Zvorgin wrote: »

The economy is fine. The current trading system is one of the things I enjoy most about ESO and I'd bet a global auction house would ruin it.

Yet every single other MMO on the current market uses some sort of server side auction house, and they aren't ruined at all?

It wouldn't be the same experience, if you want to play a global AH so bad seems like you have options...

But it is the same experience?

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Zvorgin wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Zvorgin wrote: »

The economy is fine. The current trading system is one of the things I enjoy most about ESO and I'd bet a global auction house would ruin it.

Yet every single other MMO on the current market uses some sort of server side auction house, and they aren't ruined at all?

It wouldn't be the same experience, if you want to play a global AH so bad seems like you have options...

But it is the same experience?

Not really. Right now the game has an almost region like trading system with areas where prices vary depending on footfall and guild knowledge.

You have the hubs where you pay a mark up for the benefit of having less travelling, or you can go out and look for a better deal (this can be made more efficient with TTC but that's still not infallible).

With a single point of access to the entire market the trader side of the game simply becomes standing in on location spamming refresh without any real investment into it.

Sure that's not for everyone and I understand why a lot of people want a global AH, but at the same time there are a large number of players who want the current system to remain because they enjoy it.

There is really no correct answer in this debate because it's entirely down to each players perception and enjoyment, at this time however ZOS has decided they want the trade system and last official word was they would be sticking with it.

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Yet every single other MMO on the current market uses some sort of server side auction house, and they aren't ruined at all?

What was that?

A little quote from one of those posts:

Now jump to after the update. The demand has skyrocketed because everyone now needs 101 stacks of plutons for a relic upgrade. HOWEVER, the supply has also skyrocketed, because everyone knows that a bunch of greedy *** jacked up the price from 50k per stack to 1 mil per stack. Let's look at the supply/demand ratio now. On Carbuncle, there are 47 stacks posted today, with an average of 30.7 sold per day (source: FFXIAH). Simple math says 47 / 30.7 = ~1.5. So the supply/demand ratio is now HIGHER than the ratio relative to pre-update Pluton prices. What does this mean? It means this whole "supply and demand" argument is full of ***, because a popular item has skyrocketed in price, even though it is more readily available (there is even an event that makes them easier to obtain ffs). What it really proves is the people who have more time to play have much more money than the casuals, and therefore price-gouge exactly the way RMT did in the CoP era.

A centralized AH is very easy for a select group of individuals to manipulate, far easier than the current system (which has several dozen guilds vying for control of auction spots, encouraging competition). Making this easier will only enable those few very rich individuals to utterly corner parts of the market.

Jamini wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Yet every single other MMO on the current market uses some sort of server side auction house, and they aren't ruined at all?

What was that?

A little quote from one of those posts:

Now jump to after the update. The demand has skyrocketed because everyone now needs 101 stacks of plutons for a relic upgrade. HOWEVER, the supply has also skyrocketed, because everyone knows that a bunch of greedy *** jacked up the price from 50k per stack to 1 mil per stack. Let's look at the supply/demand ratio now. On Carbuncle, there are 47 stacks posted today, with an average of 30.7 sold per day (source: FFXIAH). Simple math says 47 / 30.7 = ~1.5. So the supply/demand ratio is now HIGHER than the ratio relative to pre-update Pluton prices. What does this mean? It means this whole "supply and demand" argument is full of ***, because a popular item has skyrocketed in price, even though it is more readily available (there is even an event that makes them easier to obtain ffs). What it really proves is the people who have more time to play have much more money than the casuals, and therefore price-gouge exactly the way RMT did in the CoP era.

A centralized AH is very easy for a select group of individuals to manipulate, far easier than the current system (which has several dozen guilds vying for control of auction spots, encouraging competition). Making this easier will only enable those few very rich individuals to utterly corner parts of the market.

You do realize its easier to manipulate this system a whole lot easier than one with a legiitmate auction house

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

You do realize its easier to manipulate this system a whole lot easier than one with a legitimate auction house

Not at all.

1. Manipulators must go from merchant to merchant. Even with TTC and MM, you still need to actually do legwork to get your goods and move them. This directly cuts out most botters from the greater market, and as "bad" as you think the current system is, a system with automated bots reselling items would be much, much worse.
2. Bidding on guild traders every week can often open up potentially "vulnerable" spots that may not appear to be so by guilds who think their trader is secure. To date I've seen three different guilds fight to hold their spot (sometimes in direct competition), and while some spots are pretty much locked down (Spicy Economics, Iron Bank, Akaviri traders) others (Razghul, The apple trader in Elden Root, the back row of wayrest traders) fluctuate between several trade guilds.
3. The bid process is a huge, HUGE gold sink. Gold to the tune of several hundred million between every trader is being removed from the economy, helping prevent inflation (Which RMT and bots care the primary cause. Mind, anyone farming humanoids or questing is also a faucet)
4. Even with the cartels that exist (and yes, there are trade guild cartels in ESO) you still have plenty of potential for smaller and more nimble trade guilds to sneak in and make a massive profit if they have good timing and a dedicated crew.

The ESO market is significantly harder to manipulate, basically requiring that you have people or fairly complex bots (which are more prone to breaking or getting exposed). Anyone who openly advocates for a centralized AH is either ignorant of what it would do to the upgrade material and rare item markets, or a very rich player lobbying for more ability to manipulate prices.

Jamini wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Yet every single other MMO on the current market uses some sort of server side auction house, and they aren't ruined at all?

What was that?

A little quote from one of those posts:

Now jump to after the update. The demand has skyrocketed because everyone now needs 101 stacks of plutons for a relic upgrade. HOWEVER, the supply has also skyrocketed, because everyone knows that a bunch of greedy *** jacked up the price from 50k per stack to 1 mil per stack. Let's look at the supply/demand ratio now. On Carbuncle, there are 47 stacks posted today, with an average of 30.7 sold per day (source: FFXIAH). Simple math says 47 / 30.7 = ~1.5. So the supply/demand ratio is now HIGHER than the ratio relative to pre-update Pluton prices. What does this mean? It means this whole "supply and demand" argument is full of ***, because a popular item has skyrocketed in price, even though it is more readily available (there is even an event that makes them easier to obtain ffs). What it really proves is the people who have more time to play have much more money than the casuals, and therefore price-gouge exactly the way RMT did in the CoP era.

A centralized AH is very easy for a select group of individuals to manipulate, far easier than the current system (which has several dozen guilds vying for control of auction spots, encouraging competition). Making this easier will only enable those few very rich individuals to utterly corner parts of the market.

Sorry, but that's just not sustainable, especially if the game has a healthy population.

Drachenfier wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

The guild traders have proven successful in providing a healthy and robust economy. Most have spaces available and I tend to ignore comments based on assumptions like stating there are probably 80% of the game locked out when there are no indications that there are 80% of the population interested in trading and cannot get into a trading guild.

You and I have very, very different definitions for "healthy and robust".

Which is why no one will ever win this never ending debate on guild traders vs auction house.

I mean, I've not seen a new argument made for either in months.

Can somebody check this horses pulse?

BigBragg wrote: »

Can somebody check this horses pulse?

He's dead, Jim