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End Game Content NEEDS a Change in it's Dificulty
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HatchetHaro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Actually, your description of your vMA run sounds pretty normal. In fact, for the Morrowpocalypse patch, you sound pretty impressive for a first-time run.
I sort-of agree about vMA needing a nerf, though I would personally go for a straight nerf to damage. The reasoning behind this is that the Morrowpocalypse patch has nerfed all our sustain, which is a really important part to completing vMA, without counter-nerfs to vMA itself to balance the difficulty back out.
I'm glad I got my stam DK flawless just before the patch.Edited by HatchetHaro on May 26, 2017 6:56PMBest Argonian NA and I will fight anyone for it
20 Argonians
6x IR, 7x GH, 7x TTT, 5x GS, 6x DB, 1x PB, 4x SBS, 1x MM, 1x US, 2x CB, 1x Unchained2 -
DjMuscleboy02✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »Lemme guess, in vMA you're still of the idea that DPS=Win.
Sustain = Win. Having Sustain means you can continue to DPS without fear of that bar being empty and suddenly your buttons don't work, but at the same time if I went on and slapped some regen glyphs on my jewelry, my Spell Power would drop to like, 1,600. And I can't change my Mundus stone from the Thief. My only source of "reliable" healing is Power Surge. That needs Crits to Heal and I'm already barely hanging on to 60% chance.
My work around was putting CP into Tenacity so my Heavy Attack weaving would help with regen, but I can't spend time doing Heavy Attacks when I'm constantly throwing Hardened Ward up so I'm not one shot by half a dozen mechanics at once.
False, that is a self defeating philosophy. The more sustain you have, the more you will need. VMA has never favored sustain builds because they lack DPS and the fights take 3 times as long. With the exception of magic DK within the first 3 months of launch, I have never used a single recovery glyph or drink (regen) buff in this place.
Surge and a shield are PLENTY to clear the arena. There is almost never a scenario where you are facing a "half a dozen mechanics" at a time and you can count the number of one shot mechanics in the arena on one hand. Most stages have 1 obvious and unique mechanic, and most bosses have 2-3 moves at best. The last boss is certainly the toughest fight, but until he has killed you at least a 100 times, you wont have a grasp on his mechanics and timing. If you are getting overwhelmed, there is a good chance that your kill priority is wrong, you DPS is low, or you are standing in stupid (red).
If you have specific questions or problems with the fights, this forum will bend over backwards to give you help. If you are asking for a nerf to the one challenging piece of solo content in the game (that has been out for 18 months and nerfed quarterly as we get more CP), you are going to be met with resistance.
Best laugh I've had all day.
People dont want to hear what you have to say unless your praising the game unconditionally, dont give me this crap. You wanna criticize the content? They're of a mind to beat you. Wanna ask for help? "Git gud scrub, L2P".
What? No, people get annoyed and criticize you when you a) beg for nerfs because you can't complete something or b) ask for help then blatantly disregard given help because you think you know better than someone. Ask for help and accept the help. This is the misconception that end game players have because people will come to them with their 65k hp (pre-Morrowind) tank and ask why they don't get into trial groups, then be like lmao but I like my build don't tell me to change it and cry when they are told to get good.
OP is annoyed at what? People telling him he just needs to "git gud" cause literally that is his only problem right now. Just run it until you beat it, if he's gotten to R9 then he's doing something right, no one beats vma in 45 minutes flawlessly their first try.Brodor - PC NA - ESO's only pure bodybuilding guild
Hodor, but stronger3 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭vMA can be successfully and reliably completed with an average DPS of 15k in an one hour run. That's far from elite DPS required. I was in the "woah that sh*t is too hard" boat myself. But it's really true. Once you beat it you just get better and better and look back on your previous struggles, wondering how it wasn't obvious from the first.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.1 -
SSlarg✭✭✭I think the ultimate fix would
be to simply stop making items BOUND!
then everyone could buy that Maelstrom staff for 500k lolPS4 NA PSN - SSlarg
Currently Looking To Buy:
NoThInG1 -
Elusiin✭✭✭✭✭It needs to be the way it is, otherwise everyone would get bored of the game. There should be challenging content, casuals can stick to stories and questing... >_>3 -
Unfadingsilence✭✭✭✭✭
✭LiquidPony wrote: »IMO ... if you got through round 5 of Maelstrom, you are more than capable of completing the whole thing.
Stage 9 is far easier than stage 5. You'll get it, it just takes practice ... a lot of practice.
It's a all about the mechanics of VMA once you know them and understanding of what to take out first and when do burn the right mobs everything about VMA is easy when I first started I was pulling 300k scores taking an hour to 2 hours to bear it now I'm at 550k scores 40 min runs and trying to go faster stage 5 was the hardest for me at first now from the first boss to the last boss in stage 5 takes 5 mins if not less0 -
Unfadingsilence✭✭✭✭✭
✭If anything maybe make endgame content harder since last I heard it's all scaled to 300CP1 -
Unfadingsilence✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think the ultimate fix would
be to simply stop making items BOUND!
then everyone could buy that Maelstrom staff for 500k lol
Lol 500k on what PC? I know that on Xbox when spinners was a hot thing it was going for well over a million so a maelstrom staff at least a few million would be OK with me I would go and farm the hell out of VMA1 -
BigES✭✭✭✭✭OP, I guarantee you can beat it. In fact, if you're persistent enough, you will come back in a couple months, read this post, and laugh at yourself. Because nearly everyone who's posted in this thread has been in your exact position.
Once you beat it for the first time and get that 257 score that everyone gets, its hilarious how much better you'll become at it. Just the knowledge that you can beat it is a confidence booster. And you'll feel much more rewarded for having invested your time. No, not everyone will post leaderboard scores, but you'll start to crank out 200-300k runs no sweat, and get those items you're after.
Edited by BigES on June 14, 2017 3:50AM1 -
UnversedNumber3✭✭✭I died 200-300 times trying to complete vMA my first time. My second time I survived with my vitality intact. You just have to learn how to do it. After that its easy.Played for about 2 years on Xbox and did everything you can do (-emp).
Still pretty new to PC-NA.1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »Lemme guess, in vMA you're still of the idea that DPS=Win.
Sustain = Win. Having Sustain means you can continue to DPS without fear of that bar being empty and suddenly your buttons don't work, but at the same time if I went on and slapped some regen glyphs on my jewelry, my Spell Power would drop to like, 1,600. And I can't change my Mundus stone from the Thief. My only source of "reliable" healing is Power Surge. That needs Crits to Heal and I'm already barely hanging on to 60% chance.
My work around was putting CP into Tenacity so my Heavy Attack weaving would help with regen, but I can't spend time doing Heavy Attacks when I'm constantly throwing Hardened Ward up so I'm not one shot by half a dozen mechanics at once.
False, that is a self defeating philosophy. The more sustain you have, the more you will need. VMA has never favored sustain builds because they lack DPS and the fights take 3 times as long. With the exception of magic DK within the first 3 months of launch, I have never used a single recovery glyph or drink (regen) buff in this place.
Surge and a shield are PLENTY to clear the arena. There is almost never a scenario where you are facing a "half a dozen mechanics" at a time and you can count the number of one shot mechanics in the arena on one hand. Most stages have 1 obvious and unique mechanic, and most bosses have 2-3 moves at best. The last boss is certainly the toughest fight, but until he has killed you at least a 100 times, you wont have a grasp on his mechanics and timing. If you are getting overwhelmed, there is a good chance that your kill priority is wrong, you DPS is low, or you are standing in stupid (red).
If you have specific questions or problems with the fights, this forum will bend over backwards to give you help. If you are asking for a nerf to the one challenging piece of solo content in the game (that has been out for 18 months and nerfed quarterly as we get more CP), you are going to be met with resistance.
Best laugh I've had all day.
People dont want to hear what you have to say unless your praising the game unconditionally, dont give me this crap. You wanna criticize the content? They're of a mind to beat you. Wanna ask for help? "Git gud scrub, L2P".
Show me one thread on these forums where a person legitimately asked for help, not cried for nerfs, and got trolled to death rather than being helped.
Heck even in this thread OP got some very good advices already despite his tone and got offered more had he felt like asking specific questions regarding what's giving him issues beyond generic "it's too hard for me so it needs nerfed".
(Plot twist, I hate vMA. I've completed it on my magsorc and I must've died several thousand times. Doesn't mean it needs a nerf.)
I could probably if I sat down and looked but lets be real honest, the people helping are in the minority. Community sucks, buddy, lets not pretend it dont. I saw some recently but I cant remember what thread it was. Go to the help section and watch for the trolling, it's there. Otherwise, your agressive pushing of the narrative that the OP is yelling for it to be nerfed because he cant beat it is all the evidence in the world.
Show me an actual arguement as to why the content shouldn't be brought in line with what ZOS is attempting to make the adverage/adverage peak for DPS this patch. Show me why it shouldn't be edited.
On the subject of the thread itself, lets be honest, your not interested in an arguement on the subject. You decided the truth allready, not gonna waste the time it'd take to argue it.
Love how people are jumping down my throat like I'm making some sort of grand point about the difficulty, though. (People trying to throw me under the bus by going 'he supports the OP!' like this is some sort of friggin crime against nature.) Fact is, we're working with one half of a stat crunch. The content needs to be edited, end of story. Maybe not nerfed, but brought in line with what the devs expect the adverage low/high of player DPS to be. Like most of the content. It needs edited, people, change is scary, we get it, but your knee jerk reaction isn't going to help the game grow.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on May 26, 2017 8:48PM1 -
Xylphan✭✭✭✭My only complaint against end game content is that unless you're high DPS all you can really do is group content. You try to run through vMA without being high high DPS you either die (if you're not a tank) or end up in never ending battles (they can't kill you, but you can't kill them either).vMA can be successfully and reliably completed with an average DPS of 15k in an one hour run. That's far from elite DPS required. I was in the "woah that sh*t is too hard" boat myself. But it's really true. Once you beat it you just get better and better and look back on your previous struggles, wondering how it wasn't obvious from the first.
My only complaint is that I can't beat vMA as a tank. I have to respec into damage or else there's simply no possible way to beat it (infinite battle due to boss regen). VMA is basically a DPS e-peen contest.
That's fine for people who play DPS characters. But there's no equivalent of vMA for non-DPS characters. It'd be nice if there were, but I don't expect that to ever happen. Non-DPS characters are a very small percentage of the player base, and you'd have to design the content in a way to be very challenging for non-DPS, but not able to be face-rolled by DPS characters. It's possible to do, but is it worth their time and effort to do so? Probably not.2 -
Cocorocho✭✭✭Im not going to try nd sugar coat this or buff my presumed capabilities. I need some god mode cp600s to carry me through Cradle of Shadows for the Monster Helm. Its apparently the most difficult dungeon in the game and i dont want to be the reason a PUG wipes whenever it comes up as a pledge. I just need an infused or divines helm for my Stamblade, and maybe my Stamknight if im lucky for more than one run, and thats it. I can stick to doing the regular pledges for the keys for the shoulders.
Is there anyone willing to take me in?
8 may 20170 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »Lemme guess, in vMA you're still of the idea that DPS=Win.
Sustain = Win. Having Sustain means you can continue to DPS without fear of that bar being empty and suddenly your buttons don't work, but at the same time if I went on and slapped some regen glyphs on my jewelry, my Spell Power would drop to like, 1,600. And I can't change my Mundus stone from the Thief. My only source of "reliable" healing is Power Surge. That needs Crits to Heal and I'm already barely hanging on to 60% chance.
My work around was putting CP into Tenacity so my Heavy Attack weaving would help with regen, but I can't spend time doing Heavy Attacks when I'm constantly throwing Hardened Ward up so I'm not one shot by half a dozen mechanics at once.
False, that is a self defeating philosophy. The more sustain you have, the more you will need. VMA has never favored sustain builds because they lack DPS and the fights take 3 times as long. With the exception of magic DK within the first 3 months of launch, I have never used a single recovery glyph or drink (regen) buff in this place.
Surge and a shield are PLENTY to clear the arena. There is almost never a scenario where you are facing a "half a dozen mechanics" at a time and you can count the number of one shot mechanics in the arena on one hand. Most stages have 1 obvious and unique mechanic, and most bosses have 2-3 moves at best. The last boss is certainly the toughest fight, but until he has killed you at least a 100 times, you wont have a grasp on his mechanics and timing. If you are getting overwhelmed, there is a good chance that your kill priority is wrong, you DPS is low, or you are standing in stupid (red).
If you have specific questions or problems with the fights, this forum will bend over backwards to give you help. If you are asking for a nerf to the one challenging piece of solo content in the game (that has been out for 18 months and nerfed quarterly as we get more CP), you are going to be met with resistance.
Best laugh I've had all day.
People dont want to hear what you have to say unless your praising the game unconditionally, dont give me this crap. You wanna criticize the content? They're of a mind to beat you. Wanna ask for help? "Git gud scrub, L2P".
Show me one thread on these forums where a person legitimately asked for help, not cried for nerfs, and got trolled to death rather than being helped.
Heck even in this thread OP got some very good advices already despite his tone and got offered more had he felt like asking specific questions regarding what's giving him issues beyond generic "it's too hard for me so it needs nerfed".
(Plot twist, I hate vMA. I've completed it on my magsorc and I must've died several thousand times. Doesn't mean it needs a nerf.)
I could probably if I sat down and looked but lets be real honest, the people helping are in the minority. Community sucks, buddy, lets not pretend it dont. I saw some recently but I cant remember what thread it was. Go to the help section and watch for the trolling, it's there. Otherwise, your agressive pushing of the narrative that the OP is yelling for it to be nerfed because he cant beat it is all the evidence in the world.
Show me an actual arguement as to why the content shouldn't be brought in line with what ZOS is attempting to make the adverage/adverage peak for DPS this patch. Show me why it shouldn't be edited.
On the subject of the thread itself, lets be honest, your not interested in an arguement on the subject. You decided the truth allready, not gonna waste the time it'd take to argue it.
Love how people are jumping down my throat like I'm making some sort of grand point about the difficulty, though. (People trying to throw me under the bus by going 'he supports the OP!' like this is some sort of friggin crime against nature.) Fact is, we're working with one half of a stat crunch. The content needs to be edited, end of story. Maybe not nerfed, but brought in line with what the devs expect the adverage low/high of player DPS to be. Like most of the content. It needs edited, people, change is scary, we get it, but your knee jerk reaction isn't going to help the game grow.
Someone that understands my point in the OP, (even if it was a bit emotionally charged). I'm not asking for a Nerf, I don't want everything to be made easier. The fact that I can get all the way to Solkyn AND manage, even if just once, to get the guy down to just 8k health before wiping means it's doable. The problem however is the amount of crap ZOS put in to harass you and check your survivability. When there are five different attacks each dealing 10k, 20k, or even the stupid 50k+ one shot mechanics coming at you all at once, that is what specifically needs to be changed. Not everyone is a God tier multi-tasker. Not everyone is a twitchy gamer. It's overwhelming to keep up with and borderline unfair. I understand the punishments for not having your guard up during a Boss Fight but these punishments, even for slight slip ups are outrageously extreme. Wipes, just because you stepped to the right instead of the left, wipes because you accidentally mixed up which ability bar you were on in the heat of battle.
I wouldn't mind the slightest if they buffed Solkyn up to a 2mil health bar or something, I can deal with that, I've actually soloed a few Vet group bosses. But when there's a dozen other things trying to kill you in that fight? Like speedracer Clannfear, speedracer fire breathing Daedroth, multiple sources knocking you back, stunning you, throwing you into lava and the game making you go through several seconds before you can actually get out of the lava as it burns you. It's too much, even if it can still be done, it's still too much.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!1 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Im not going to try nd sugar coat this or buff my presumed capabilities. I need some god mode cp600s to carry me through Cradle of Shadows for the Monster Helm. Its apparently the most difficult dungeon in the game and i dont want to be the reason a PUG wipes whenever it comes up as a pledge. I just need an infused or divines helm for my Stamblade, and maybe my Stamknight if im lucky for more than one run, and thats it. I can stick to doing the regular pledges for the keys for the shoulders.
Is there anyone willing to take me in?
8 may 2017
Yeah? So? Vet Cradle is terrible and I suffered through countless unsuccessful PuGs before I finally found a good group. What's your point?CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0 -
strikeback1247✭✭✭✭✭
✭LadyNalcarya wrote: »
If you people want to jump to conclusions I'd LOVE to watch you take the Helm of my Character and get a Flawless. Then you have my permission to talk crap.
People already cleared vMA with broom and bucket:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVFYPJW-aa8
Or even naked:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDv_0BKu9kg
So I'm 100% sure your char can kill the last boss.
This is amazing.P.A.W.S. - Positively Against Wild Sasquatches - NO TO BIGFOOT!1 -
Cocorocho✭✭✭Im not going to try nd sugar coat this or buff my presumed capabilities. I need some god mode cp600s to carry me through Cradle of Shadows for the Monster Helm. Its apparently the most difficult dungeon in the game and i dont want to be the reason a PUG wipes whenever it comes up as a pledge. I just need an infused or divines helm for my Stamblade, and maybe my Stamknight if im lucky for more than one run, and thats it. I can stick to doing the regular pledges for the keys for the shoulders.
Is there anyone willing to take me in?
8 may 2017
Yeah? So? Vet Cradle is terrible and I suffered through countless unsuccessful PuGs before I finally found a good group. What's your point?
Point is you are asking for a nerf when you can't beat something, almost everyone already mentioned it takes *** loads of death, repair, soul gems to beat it for first time. It is just a content that rewards(based on rng ofc) your dedication.
People beat dark souls using guitar hero guitar as controller, if you want to get vma weapons you are obligated to learn the mechanics just like every other has done. If you don't want then do what you like in this game but don't cry for nerf just because can't beat it2 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Im not going to try nd sugar coat this or buff my presumed capabilities. I need some god mode cp600s to carry me through Cradle of Shadows for the Monster Helm. Its apparently the most difficult dungeon in the game and i dont want to be the reason a PUG wipes whenever it comes up as a pledge. I just need an infused or divines helm for my Stamblade, and maybe my Stamknight if im lucky for more than one run, and thats it. I can stick to doing the regular pledges for the keys for the shoulders.
Is there anyone willing to take me in?
8 may 2017
Yeah? So? Vet Cradle is terrible and I suffered through countless unsuccessful PuGs before I finally found a good group. What's your point?
Point is you are asking for a nerf when you can't beat something, almost everyone already mentioned it takes *** loads of death, repair, soul gems to beat it for first time. It is just a content that rewards(based on rng ofc) your dedication.
People beat dark souls using guitar hero guitar as controller, if you want to get vma weapons you are obligated to learn the mechanics just like every other has done. If you don't want then do what you like in this game but don't cry for nerf just because can't beat it
People who have beatened it just posted a thread asking for the same thing he is.
Not everyone is a drone.0 -
Ihatenightblades✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm not wanting a straight Nerf, I know full well everyone would just mock me and tell me to L2P and Git Gud. But the things that make the content difficult blatantly needs a change, ESPECIALLY now that ZOS has for some reason decided they needed to make it even harder to play this game by handicapping our Survivability.
Personally, (and I'm certain I'm not alone in this) I've completely had it with End Game Content. The DLC Dungeons, Trials, God Damned mother....Maelstrom. Even though I've been complaining about Maelstrom since the dawn of time, I'm not a stranger to it. I've been in there, I've done a few runs on Normal, I've experienced the Mechanics, and now I tried Vet. I took my BEST PvE MagSorc character in there and was at first doing pretty well. Until Stages Five and Seven. I burned through all 15 of my Vitality lives in those but through multiple tries I persevered through and got to the Theater. A few more deaths learning the Mechanics and finally Solkyn. That Horker wiped me DOZENS of times, no matter what I tried, what skills I used, going back to the guy so I can repair. I'm not saying I want a Nerf, but there's too many Mechanics! There's too many damage sources all around, all with the capability to one shot. My resources are drained by the time I even get up top for the first crystal, I can't run from the mobs waiting for my regen since the Mobs are like they're in Nascar, and I even got SO CLOSE to actually finishing him only once. 8,000 health. That's all he had left as I was desperately trying to shield against four different sources of high damage attacks but wiped before I could cast that last needed Fury. After that I never even got him under 60% again through another dozen wipes.
I'm just done, this is complete bull, I don't understand why you people actually find joy in this. Games are supposed to have replayability but this kind of content makes me NEVER want to try it again. So I'm just calling it finished now. A 30 or so death run with a score of 350,000. I was so damn close to my first Maelstrom weapon.
You're continuing to make the new Content harder while at the same time making it more difficult for our Characters to survive. I didn't buy ESO so I could be a Min/Maxer wearing Gold Trial Gear.
I was going to take a pic of one of my death screens and superimpose a giant %$#& YOU on it, but I figured that might be a bit much.
Dude there is over over 20 vet dungeons that you can 2 man without even wiping..
Thats enough easy content lol vet trials and dlc dungeons are the only things i do at this point since i already git every maelstrom weapon i need although i can use a infused bow
This is definitely a l2p issue because vet maelstrom mechanics are really easy after you watch videos and get through it a few times.
It took me a month to complete vet maelstrom after it was released with orsinium wrothgar dlc.
Believe me with the right gear and practice vma will be a walk through for you just watch some clips of other people2 -
Cocorocho✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Im not going to try nd sugar coat this or buff my presumed capabilities. I need some god mode cp600s to carry me through Cradle of Shadows for the Monster Helm. Its apparently the most difficult dungeon in the game and i dont want to be the reason a PUG wipes whenever it comes up as a pledge. I just need an infused or divines helm for my Stamblade, and maybe my Stamknight if im lucky for more than one run, and thats it. I can stick to doing the regular pledges for the keys for the shoulders.
Is there anyone willing to take me in?
8 may 2017
Yeah? So? Vet Cradle is terrible and I suffered through countless unsuccessful PuGs before I finally found a good group. What's your point?
Point is you are asking for a nerf when you can't beat something, almost everyone already mentioned it takes *** loads of death, repair, soul gems to beat it for first time. It is just a content that rewards(based on rng ofc) your dedication.
People beat dark souls using guitar hero guitar as controller, if you want to get vma weapons you are obligated to learn the mechanics just like every other has done. If you don't want then do what you like in this game but don't cry for nerf just because can't beat it
People who have beatened it just posted a thread asking for the same thing he is.
Not everyone is a drone.
so 5 people, 10 people, 100 people who posted in forums presents the majority and make them right? i doubt it, though i also read lots of people saying pve content is way too easy and should be harder... I don't know who to believe.
So you are saying game forces you to be a drone so you can finish the content? oh have you heard about free will?0 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »Lemme guess, in vMA you're still of the idea that DPS=Win.
Sustain = Win. Having Sustain means you can continue to DPS without fear of that bar being empty and suddenly your buttons don't work, but at the same time if I went on and slapped some regen glyphs on my jewelry, my Spell Power would drop to like, 1,600. And I can't change my Mundus stone from the Thief. My only source of "reliable" healing is Power Surge. That needs Crits to Heal and I'm already barely hanging on to 60% chance.
My work around was putting CP into Tenacity so my Heavy Attack weaving would help with regen, but I can't spend time doing Heavy Attacks when I'm constantly throwing Hardened Ward up so I'm not one shot by half a dozen mechanics at once.
False, that is a self defeating philosophy. The more sustain you have, the more you will need. VMA has never favored sustain builds because they lack DPS and the fights take 3 times as long. With the exception of magic DK within the first 3 months of launch, I have never used a single recovery glyph or drink (regen) buff in this place.
Surge and a shield are PLENTY to clear the arena. There is almost never a scenario where you are facing a "half a dozen mechanics" at a time and you can count the number of one shot mechanics in the arena on one hand. Most stages have 1 obvious and unique mechanic, and most bosses have 2-3 moves at best. The last boss is certainly the toughest fight, but until he has killed you at least a 100 times, you wont have a grasp on his mechanics and timing. If you are getting overwhelmed, there is a good chance that your kill priority is wrong, you DPS is low, or you are standing in stupid (red).
If you have specific questions or problems with the fights, this forum will bend over backwards to give you help. If you are asking for a nerf to the one challenging piece of solo content in the game (that has been out for 18 months and nerfed quarterly as we get more CP), you are going to be met with resistance.
Best laugh I've had all day.
People dont want to hear what you have to say unless your praising the game unconditionally, dont give me this crap. You wanna criticize the content? They're of a mind to beat you. Wanna ask for help? "Git gud scrub, L2P".
@Doctordarkspawn
I think if you read the vast body of work of people like myself and others on this forum, it is mostly trying to give advice to people needing help. The number of times I have written a small guide about a section of this arena to help a complete stranger is more than I care to count.
Sure, from time to time, we have to put our foot down to people like you that do nothing but complain, but if you ask for specific help, you will get it. Perhaps the forums arent the problem, it's they way in which you post in them.
5 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »Lemme guess, in vMA you're still of the idea that DPS=Win.
Sustain = Win. Having Sustain means you can continue to DPS without fear of that bar being empty and suddenly your buttons don't work, but at the same time if I went on and slapped some regen glyphs on my jewelry, my Spell Power would drop to like, 1,600. And I can't change my Mundus stone from the Thief. My only source of "reliable" healing is Power Surge. That needs Crits to Heal and I'm already barely hanging on to 60% chance.
My work around was putting CP into Tenacity so my Heavy Attack weaving would help with regen, but I can't spend time doing Heavy Attacks when I'm constantly throwing Hardened Ward up so I'm not one shot by half a dozen mechanics at once.
False, that is a self defeating philosophy. The more sustain you have, the more you will need. VMA has never favored sustain builds because they lack DPS and the fights take 3 times as long. With the exception of magic DK within the first 3 months of launch, I have never used a single recovery glyph or drink (regen) buff in this place.
Surge and a shield are PLENTY to clear the arena. There is almost never a scenario where you are facing a "half a dozen mechanics" at a time and you can count the number of one shot mechanics in the arena on one hand. Most stages have 1 obvious and unique mechanic, and most bosses have 2-3 moves at best. The last boss is certainly the toughest fight, but until he has killed you at least a 100 times, you wont have a grasp on his mechanics and timing. If you are getting overwhelmed, there is a good chance that your kill priority is wrong, you DPS is low, or you are standing in stupid (red).
If you have specific questions or problems with the fights, this forum will bend over backwards to give you help. If you are asking for a nerf to the one challenging piece of solo content in the game (that has been out for 18 months and nerfed quarterly as we get more CP), you are going to be met with resistance.
Best laugh I've had all day.
People dont want to hear what you have to say unless your praising the game unconditionally, dont give me this crap. You wanna criticize the content? They're of a mind to beat you. Wanna ask for help? "Git gud scrub, L2P".
@Doctordarkspawn
I think if you read the vast body of work of people like myself and others on this forum, it is mostly trying to give advice to people needing help. The number of times I have written a small guide about a section of this arena to help a complete stranger is more than I care to count.
Sure, from time to time, we have to put our foot down to people like you that do nothing but complain, but if you ask for specific help, you will get it. Perhaps the forums arent the problem, it's they way in which you post in them.
Good for you, for trying to help.
The forums are definately the problem, considering if you offer even the least ammount of criticism people like you, yes, I include you, will take any excuse to dismiss that criticism. You are part of the problem. End of story. And as you have decided what the OP's position is, I shall decide yours for you.
Oh, and much like the other thread I've mentioned on this one, where a dude who beat it, this patch, said it oughta be nerfed because the DPS decrease without content to match sucks...Ones where people cant throw out the l2p excuse? They just sorta like to let fade into the backround never to be seen again. People got selective memories, seems like.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on May 26, 2017 9:40PM1 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Im not going to try nd sugar coat this or buff my presumed capabilities. I need some god mode cp600s to carry me through Cradle of Shadows for the Monster Helm. Its apparently the most difficult dungeon in the game and i dont want to be the reason a PUG wipes whenever it comes up as a pledge. I just need an infused or divines helm for my Stamblade, and maybe my Stamknight if im lucky for more than one run, and thats it. I can stick to doing the regular pledges for the keys for the shoulders.
Is there anyone willing to take me in?
8 may 2017
Yeah? So? Vet Cradle is terrible and I suffered through countless unsuccessful PuGs before I finally found a good group. What's your point?
Point is you are asking for a nerf when you can't beat something, almost everyone already mentioned it takes *** loads of death, repair, soul gems to beat it for first time. It is just a content that rewards(based on rng ofc) your dedication.
People beat dark souls using guitar hero guitar as controller, if you want to get vma weapons you are obligated to learn the mechanics just like every other has done. If you don't want then do what you like in this game but don't cry for nerf just because can't beat it
The Hell does my looking for a group post have anything to do with Maelstrom? And if you bothered to actually have read anything I said you'd have seen that I have actually been learning the Mechanics.
So. Again. What is your point?CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0 -
Cocorocho✭✭✭@ArchMikem
I already mentioned my point.
Even though i don't really like putting it this way i guess i need to mention that its a L2P issue rather than the contents requiring a nerfEdited by Cocorocho on May 26, 2017 9:46PM0 -
WalksonGraves✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think it's ridiculous that the "play what you want" game has an endgame that involves 3 builds. I saw an xbox review where the guy says "4/5 even though my wood elf archer can't do trials"
That guy played for a long time just to find out bad game design choices rendered his character obsolete and he was still upbeat about it despite getting hosed. Maybe if ZOS spent more time designing the game instead of designing ways to empty your wallet there would be actual balance and all classes would offer something worthwhile.4 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »Lemme guess, in vMA you're still of the idea that DPS=Win.
Sustain = Win. Having Sustain means you can continue to DPS without fear of that bar being empty and suddenly your buttons don't work, but at the same time if I went on and slapped some regen glyphs on my jewelry, my Spell Power would drop to like, 1,600. And I can't change my Mundus stone from the Thief. My only source of "reliable" healing is Power Surge. That needs Crits to Heal and I'm already barely hanging on to 60% chance.
My work around was putting CP into Tenacity so my Heavy Attack weaving would help with regen, but I can't spend time doing Heavy Attacks when I'm constantly throwing Hardened Ward up so I'm not one shot by half a dozen mechanics at once.
False, that is a self defeating philosophy. The more sustain you have, the more you will need. VMA has never favored sustain builds because they lack DPS and the fights take 3 times as long. With the exception of magic DK within the first 3 months of launch, I have never used a single recovery glyph or drink (regen) buff in this place.
Surge and a shield are PLENTY to clear the arena. There is almost never a scenario where you are facing a "half a dozen mechanics" at a time and you can count the number of one shot mechanics in the arena on one hand. Most stages have 1 obvious and unique mechanic, and most bosses have 2-3 moves at best. The last boss is certainly the toughest fight, but until he has killed you at least a 100 times, you wont have a grasp on his mechanics and timing. If you are getting overwhelmed, there is a good chance that your kill priority is wrong, you DPS is low, or you are standing in stupid (red).
If you have specific questions or problems with the fights, this forum will bend over backwards to give you help. If you are asking for a nerf to the one challenging piece of solo content in the game (that has been out for 18 months and nerfed quarterly as we get more CP), you are going to be met with resistance.
Best laugh I've had all day.
People dont want to hear what you have to say unless your praising the game unconditionally, dont give me this crap. You wanna criticize the content? They're of a mind to beat you. Wanna ask for help? "Git gud scrub, L2P".
@Doctordarkspawn
I think if you read the vast body of work of people like myself and others on this forum, it is mostly trying to give advice to people needing help. The number of times I have written a small guide about a section of this arena to help a complete stranger is more than I care to count.
Sure, from time to time, we have to put our foot down to people like you that do nothing but complain, but if you ask for specific help, you will get it. Perhaps the forums arent the problem, it's they way in which you post in them.
Good for you, for trying to help.
The forums are definately the problem, considering if you offer even the least ammount of criticism people like you, yes, I include you, will take any excuse to dismiss that criticism. You are part of the problem. End of story. And as you have decided what the OP's position is, I shall decide yours for you.
Oh, and much like the other thread I've mentioned on this one, where a dude who beat it, this patch, said it oughta be nerfed because the DPS decrease without content to match sucks...Ones where people cant throw out the l2p excuse? They just sorta like to let fade into the backround never to be seen again. People got selective memories, seems like.
I didnt decide anything for OP. I pointed out that he is going to be met with criticism by asking for blanket nerfs, and suggested that he would do better to ask for specific advice on how to beat something. The second I get a clear cut question, I will do my best to answer it.
As for the second argument, sorry I dont buy it. There is this thing called power creep. It is a very real issue in MMOs. Even after the morrowind patch, which certainly nerfed most builds, we are significantly more powerful now then we were when VMA was released. Anyone who tried VMA on a stam build within 3 months of launch is falling out of their chair laughing at this thread.
I will be the first to criticize ZOS when I disagree with their decisions. I absolutely disagree with some of the decisions they made this patch. That being said, it is not realistic to expect them to re-balance the game every time they adjust the power of our characters. By that logic, VMA would have been BUFFED in difficulty to match our power output every patch except this one since release, and it would still need to be much tougher than it is now to compensate for our current power levels.0 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »I didnt decide anything for OP. I pointed out that he is going to be met with criticism by asking for blanket nerfs,
There actually is a difference between Criticism, and practically bullying into submission.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »Lemme guess, in vMA you're still of the idea that DPS=Win.
Sustain = Win. Having Sustain means you can continue to DPS without fear of that bar being empty and suddenly your buttons don't work, but at the same time if I went on and slapped some regen glyphs on my jewelry, my Spell Power would drop to like, 1,600. And I can't change my Mundus stone from the Thief. My only source of "reliable" healing is Power Surge. That needs Crits to Heal and I'm already barely hanging on to 60% chance.
My work around was putting CP into Tenacity so my Heavy Attack weaving would help with regen, but I can't spend time doing Heavy Attacks when I'm constantly throwing Hardened Ward up so I'm not one shot by half a dozen mechanics at once.
False, that is a self defeating philosophy. The more sustain you have, the more you will need. VMA has never favored sustain builds because they lack DPS and the fights take 3 times as long. With the exception of magic DK within the first 3 months of launch, I have never used a single recovery glyph or drink (regen) buff in this place.
Surge and a shield are PLENTY to clear the arena. There is almost never a scenario where you are facing a "half a dozen mechanics" at a time and you can count the number of one shot mechanics in the arena on one hand. Most stages have 1 obvious and unique mechanic, and most bosses have 2-3 moves at best. The last boss is certainly the toughest fight, but until he has killed you at least a 100 times, you wont have a grasp on his mechanics and timing. If you are getting overwhelmed, there is a good chance that your kill priority is wrong, you DPS is low, or you are standing in stupid (red).
If you have specific questions or problems with the fights, this forum will bend over backwards to give you help. If you are asking for a nerf to the one challenging piece of solo content in the game (that has been out for 18 months and nerfed quarterly as we get more CP), you are going to be met with resistance.
Best laugh I've had all day.
People dont want to hear what you have to say unless your praising the game unconditionally, dont give me this crap. You wanna criticize the content? They're of a mind to beat you. Wanna ask for help? "Git gud scrub, L2P".
@Doctordarkspawn
I think if you read the vast body of work of people like myself and others on this forum, it is mostly trying to give advice to people needing help. The number of times I have written a small guide about a section of this arena to help a complete stranger is more than I care to count.
Sure, from time to time, we have to put our foot down to people like you that do nothing but complain, but if you ask for specific help, you will get it. Perhaps the forums arent the problem, it's they way in which you post in them.
Good for you, for trying to help.
The forums are definately the problem, considering if you offer even the least ammount of criticism people like you, yes, I include you, will take any excuse to dismiss that criticism. You are part of the problem. End of story. And as you have decided what the OP's position is, I shall decide yours for you.
Oh, and much like the other thread I've mentioned on this one, where a dude who beat it, this patch, said it oughta be nerfed because the DPS decrease without content to match sucks...Ones where people cant throw out the l2p excuse? They just sorta like to let fade into the backround never to be seen again. People got selective memories, seems like.
I didnt decide anything for OP. I pointed out that he is going to be met with criticism by asking for blanket nerfs, and suggested that he would do better to ask for specific advice on how to beat something. The second I get a clear cut question, I will do my best to answer it.
As for the second argument, sorry I dont buy it. There is this thing called power creep. It is a very real issue in MMOs. Even after the morrowind patch, which certainly nerfed most builds, we are significantly more powerful now then we were when VMA was released. Anyone who tried VMA on a stam build within 3 months of launch is falling out of their chair laughing at this thread.
I will be the first to criticize ZOS when I disagree with their decisions. I absolutely disagree with some of the decisions they made this patch. That being said, it is not realistic to expect them to re-balance the game every time they adjust the power of our characters. By that logic, VMA would have been BUFFED in difficulty to match our power output every patch except this one since release, and it would still need to be much tougher than it is now to compensate for our current power levels.
There's a simple solution to their inability to move mountains and all that.
1. Figure out the ceiling and floor you WANT for DPS characters. Actually communicating what this would be would also be nice.
2. Work on geting the characters there.
3. Design the game around that.
This is what the original game did. The original game, before the game changed dev hands. I still believe, that the Tamriel Unlimited patch, was the best patch this game ever had because it accomplished this. People didn't like it because it wasn't balls hard, but there was no question there was enough there to figure they had a plan or at least, were working within a plan.
ZOS may well be trying for this, but they ain' hitting the mark very well.
So I dont buy that they cant do better. And will continue to challenge them to do so. I'll continue to challenge them to do what they should be doing.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on May 26, 2017 9:55PM0 -
squinceybones✭✭✭Perhaps if you killed those 4 damage sources instead of tunnel visioning on the boss you wouldn't be getting hit by them.1
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ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭squinceybones wrote: »Perhaps if you killed those 4 damage sources instead of tunnel visioning on the boss you wouldn't be getting hit by them.
They respawn immediately, bud.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0
