KochDerDamonen wrote: »

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

KaiVox22 wrote: »

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

Tirps wrote: »

It is all about how good the player is.. Bad ones are bad even if the class is good.

I agree but if sorc is as godmode OP as all of the anti sorcs claim. Then logically a bad player would be able a keep pace with a pro player, if not surpass them. Because the class is god mode overtuned. However this is not the case with sorcs to include pet sorcs.

Yet people just hate on sorcs just to hate on them. Because they are mad they got beat by one. Same story with the StamBlades to be honest. It's funny classes are nearly equal in terms of collective power. Yet people want to just nuke sorcs out of the game.

If this is going to be the acceptable norm by the classist community....

Then.

- Make templar have gimped healing ability..
- Make DKs have gimped tanking ability
- Make Wardens have gimped support ability.

Lets gut all of these classes and put them on the same level that people want sorc and NBs to be on.

That sound outrageous now don't it? But that's what yall are doing to sorcs. When other class are close in terms of damage, however outside of NB are beyond super effective with their primary rolo....[Tank or Healer]

Sorc should be 2-3k dps ahead of the other classes, not 10k+

Then by your logic. Sorcs should also be acceptable tanks and healers in trials. But they are not even close. And now yall keep campaigning to take away the only thing that sorc has going for it, damage. I'm sorry but you just sound like the other anti sorc players that just want the class deleted from this game.

@FearlessOne_2014 I would be quite happy if their dps came down in-line with other classes and they were viable for support roles. Every class can dps in any content, but tanking and healing is off limits once one hits vet trials?

You know, if you think about the game's history... (forgive me if I'm in error, this is my perspective as someone who join when B2P started)

First, the original dev team created 4 classes basically mirroring the ideal 4-man group composition: 2 DPS, 1 Tank, 1 Healer. (Still required for queing in the activity finder)

Then, the first Trials were relatively easy burn-fests. Most of the community wasn't even that involved in running them, so the demand for tight balance and all build comparison being based on a vet Trial environment didn't exist.

With Maw and vet modes of the old trials, the bar for completing hard group content in ESO rose dramatically, leading to much more strict guidelines for what was acceptable in the various roles of trials groups.

As time has gone on, with the addition of the target skeleton, the voice of the trials-based community has grown stronger, so that players are thinking almost exclusively in terms of trials effectiveness rather than solo or small group viability. In this environment, the discrepancies between the classes stand out starkly. And now as we enter into Battlegrounds there will be a more structured way to compare the classes from a PvP prespective as well (and with no CP, for that matter).

I mention all of this because I think it's helpful to keep in mind that it has only been since recently (from a development standpoint) that these issues have become so precisely quantifiable, and so significant to the community at large.

Honestly, it will probably take another year to fully unpack everything that has changed in today's ESO vs. the launch version, to get us to a place that would truly be considered balanced between all classes in all roles in both PvE and PvP. Less work is needed to bring all classes into a similar damage dealing range, and it makes sense that this is the first priority, now that the community is much more able to track dps by using the target skeleton.

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

lunalitetempler wrote: »

Takes zero skill to play sorc they are stupidity OP they need a serious rebalance and some seriously strong nerfs. Its going to happen.

Yes. But it is good that they are easy to play. It is that ease in autopilot that raises the floor. My stamina templar, pulling 46k dps is a different story. It takes a huge understanding of the class, and mechanics to make it so god damn good. I want to make it clear, that this class has a very very very high ceiling. Did you know that (at least from my tests in non bis gear) that caltrops lowers my dps? I balamce for both survive and dps so I either must choose between caltrops or potl on my bar. using caltrops ,y dps is 30k. same bar no caltrops 38k. Sub potl 46k. Do the numbers make sense? NO WAY IN HELL. But then again, my dw is *** trait and im usimg spriggan.

Sorcs, sorcs are perrrrfect for people that want good dps, but hate sving to have a near perfect understanding of their class, situational mechanics, AND a solid rotation. Despite being my most hated form of gameplay, sorcs usher in a great group role, and some play how ya want ba;ance. I love to micromanage my buffs, and love mele mechanics. So stamina templar is my personal flavor.

If you saw my templar, you'd csll it broken.

Can we see a combat metrics report of your templar?

Wait, hold the phone.. you said spriggan? That is such a dps loss in group instances.

When I can take over as a Tank in a dungeon and main dps because the other players died , that says something about how incredibly versatile Sorc is . When I don't need a healer on top of all that , that's a sign . Now if I walk into PVP and survive most every assault by 3 or 4 players at a time , ya , Sorc is a little OP . I can't do that on my other toons half as easily .

I don't know why you think stamina nightblades are over powered. All classes surpasses us in trials and dungeons, and in pvp we're just a little fart running around in the shadows ganking. If I make one mistake in pvp, I'll be dead.

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

KaiVox22 wrote: »

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

Tirps wrote: »

It is all about how good the player is.. Bad ones are bad even if the class is good.

I agree but if sorc is as godmode OP as all of the anti sorcs claim. Then logically a bad player would be able a keep pace with a pro player, if not surpass them. Because the class is god mode overtuned. However this is not the case with sorcs to include pet sorcs.

Yet people just hate on sorcs just to hate on them. Because they are mad they got beat by one. Same story with the StamBlades to be honest. It's funny classes are nearly equal in terms of collective power. Yet people want to just nuke sorcs out of the game.

If this is going to be the acceptable norm by the classist community....

Then.

- Make templar have gimped healing ability..
- Make DKs have gimped tanking ability
- Make Wardens have gimped support ability.

Lets gut all of these classes and put them on the same level that people want sorc and NBs to be on.

That sound outrageous now don't it? But that's what yall are doing to sorcs. When other class are close in terms of damage, however outside of NB are beyond super effective with their primary rolo....[Tank or Healer]

Sorc should be 2-3k dps ahead of the other classes, not 10k+

Then by your logic. Sorcs should also be acceptable tanks and healers in trials. But they are not even close. And now yall keep campaigning to take away the only thing that sorc has going for it, damage. I'm sorry but you just sound like the other anti sorc players that just want the class deleted from this game.

And they are also making sorcs acceptable healers in trials, now that orb restores both stamina and magicka.

FoulSnowpaw wrote: »

Honestly the classes are fine.
People complain about every class being "OP" simply because they don't put as much effort as those stronger players.
"Templar heal too much" (healers will heal)
"Sorc aoe spam" (that's what mages do)
"DK infinite sustain too op" (tanky for you, but they're not invincible)
"NB assassination too op" (they're an assassin bro)
If you feel your character is weak, then that's not the playstyle you seek.

People keep whining simply because they want easy mode for "their" character.
No more nerfs it only makes dungeons and trials waste more time, and make the game harder. CP nerf is hard enough.

L2P whining people. Get better gear, respect, experiment.

Honestly the classes are not fine.

Templar healing will be nerfed hard.
DK infinite sustain will not exist in Morrowind.
NB assassination is virtually non-existent already, and will take a further hit with removal of stealth damage.

Only sorc AoE spam remains unaffected in the current meta and in the patch notes released to date, hence the need for sorc nerfs.

Banana wrote: »

More nerfs for sorcerers please

The problem with mag sorcerer is simple:

If you go full DPS build technically you should be sort of a glass cannon (Ultra high dmg but not that good defence). But with sorcerer it is a different story. If you go full dps and you have only like 10K health... you can still use "Conjured Ward" (stack-able shield) So it adds like 20 - 25K DMG shield to your health bar. This shield is not affected by penetration and crits.
No other class in game can do that....

In PvP - Let me put it this way: In order to kill a sorcerer you need to deal at lest 25K "true" dmg (with no crits and penetration) fast enough to even "reach" the health bar. You have to do it fast enough so your enemy will not have a chance to "stack" more shield.
So you focus on destroying that shield while sorcerer throws "Haunting Curse" at you (un-dodge-able, un-block-able instant that explodes twice on you and even pulls you out of stealth 2x (even thou there is nothing like that in skill description).

And in the end when you finally managed to get rid of that shield and start doing dmg to health bar what does the sorcerer do ? Either stuns you with Streak & kills you or just escapes faster than sprinting mount....

In PvE - in addition to a DPS class being way more tanky than let's say a NB going full tank build you also have pets that take aggro form enemies making sorc a class that can solo even some group vet dungeons....

LOL If you didn't zoom in so far, maybe you'd be able to solo it like all classes have done already

After the nerfs to siphoning strike night blades are pretty much dead. And from what it seems like nightblades are suppose to be the counter to sorcs as they can stay invis and jump on them etc. And hopefully pop them before they can react which is not the case. So main reason i think sorcs are consider op atm they have no real counter class to deal with and keep them in check.

Not to mention most people are angry from the patch notes. Dk's got screwed insanely hard for pvp with major mending just being ripped away and given a buggy half arsed attempt at a balance nerf.

Nightblades got gutted even when they were the worse performing class in the game. With arguably the most insane nerf to hit while they also had global sustain being nerfed. You can't argue that they got hit with an necessary nerf. They relied on that and still under performed even with infinite sustain, now that should tell you something about the class and how bad of a spot it is. It's just *** sad as hell to think about...

Templars got some major buff removed and got a lot of changes, most claim they are dead i have no comment as i didn't follow them. However a big youtuber left because of the nerfs and even made a video burying his templar so they must of been pretty drastic. I do give him props probably the most passive aggressive way to leave a game and say fu to the devs, but in a funny and entertaining way, to bad it's sad when you think about how many hours he spent on that char and how many others have as well.

Then look at what sorcs got for a nerf, a simple 20% damage reduction on volatile imp. Big whoop.

So yeah i can understand their anger most classes got hit with game changing removal of skills. And very harsh removal, in a time keep in mind where sorcs were still favored in the meta for pvp and some consider over performing then. People were expecting sorcs to get the axe, or have a vital skill be completely changed and killed off like siphoning strike or ig shield. But instead they walked away clean, you can see the envy and hatred for it easily.

Now do i think sorcs should be killed or well nerfed? I do honestly feel they should be weaker than the other classes in terms of dps like many have stated. Range is a huge bonus, and should be weaker for that range.

But i would rather other classes be buffed and have those changes that happened this last patch be reverted. But as i and many other have seen, that just won't happen so instead everyone wants sorcs to be nerfed as it's easier to nerf a class than buff several under performing classes, not to mention cheaper.

So yeah most of the forums and people in general don't have much love for sorcs at the moment but it's understandable disdain and hatred/envy.

brandonv516 wrote: »

My NB tank grouped with 3 sorcs last night for CoH2. All 3 of them died at least once where I made it out unscathed.

So basically NB is overpowered and sorc is not.

NERF NBS! /sarcasm....

Way too many people would rather run to the forums screaming "NERF!!!!" than actually spend time and effort Learning to Play so they can Adapt and Overcome

Nerfs are bad mmmkay

And screaming for nerfs only makes a person look really silly

Rikkof wrote: »

Basically, a hater thread XD
Nothing to see here,c arry on ppl
Sorcs wont get nerfed, the rest of u L2P (op included)

IT WILL BE THE NB AND TEMPLARS WHO GETS NERFED, FOR THEIR ONE SHOT CYRODIIL TACTICS
0/10
Sorc will never get nerfed because no reasons to do so
NB and templar = GUARANTEED NERFED IN MORROWIND because one shoting players in pvp
Cry more

@Rikkof leave that horse alone, Champ. You have been spouting this nonsense for a while now, and I assume there is still no one else sharing your opinion.
If everybody disagrees with you, maybe you're wrong...