Content in Morrowind and PvE endgame

Nelson_Rebel · May 2017

How long do we have until this content becomes stale to?

This is not a salt post or ESO is dying post.

I want a discussion about the longevity of endgames plight.

We are getting 1 new trial, battlegrounds, 2 dungeons and some new quests.

Is this enough to keep endgame relevant and engaging? Are we going to be stuck with just this for another 7 months like MoL?

MotokoKusanagi34 · May 2017

A new trial can probably entertain mid tier - high end guilds for 3+ months so it's barely enough PVE content until the next (big) DLC comes out, which I hope would consist of 4-8 new dungeons + 3 trials. I feel like trials have to come out on a more regular base because doing those 4 trials for years isn't fun at all. At some point you earned all gear, cleared the hardest content several times and everything else is too easy and offers no incentive/gear to play.

I'm looking forward doing some quests, earning a couple of titles and costumes but let's not fool ourselves: They didn't add a lot of longevity into the game, content-wise. We take what we get but I hope they consider their hardcore fanbase more and do something about the drought of good PVE endgame content.

You'd think from the absurd amount of money they make with ESO plus (almost every month in the top PSN sales charts), they could afford pumping out more dungeons and trials on a regular base. Just to give you an idea how successful ESO is in NA:

PS4 Add-ons (Top Downloads: 2016 (Full Year))
1 Call of Duty: Black Ops III – Awakening
2 Destiny: Rise of Iron
3 The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited – ESO Plus
4 Call of Duty: Black Ops III Season Pass
5 Call of Duty: Black Ops III – Eclipse
6 Call of Duty: Black Ops III – Descent
7 Black Ops III – The Giant Zombies Map
8 Call of Duty: Black Ops III – Salvation
9 Rocket League – Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Car Pack
10 STAR WARS Battlefront Season Pass

It outsold most CoD passes, Battlefront, Battlefield and what not. In EU it was 12th in 2016 (full year) down from #1 (!) in 2015. Don't tell me that game doesn't have an absolute hardcore fanbase carrying it, since the game gets almost no promotion compared to FF XIV.

Mojmir · May 2017

Aside from the trial,maybe some new sets,no

Better homes and gardens people and Rp'ers will be most happy

HugeMuffin · May 2017

So I have to ask because the MMO's that I have really played into before ESO were UO and GW1. End-game content wasn't really crystalized into anything back when I played UO, and GW1 was always criticized as lacking end-game content. So, (and please don't say "end game content is what you play when you're fully leveled and geared") what exactly is end-game content that folks are looking for?

MotokoKusanagi34 · May 2017

tinbromide wrote: »

So I have to ask because the MMO's that I have really played into before ESO were UO and GW1. End-game content wasn't really crystalized into anything back when I played UO, and GW1 was always criticized as lacking end-game content. So, (and please don't say "end game content is what you play when you're fully leveled and geared") what exactly is end-game content that folks are looking for?

Any challenging, new, worthwhile (desirable gear, achievements, skins) and hopefully long term content for players who completed most other game content. ESO PVE endgame consists of 4 trials and about 4 Vet DLC dungeons and Maelstrom arena if you consider this grindfest to be entertaining. So naturally we want more of that or something which is giving us something from the above mentioned points. A reason to stick with the game when you don't do quest because you gain nothing from it anymore. Even housing can be considered endgame content to some extent but that's personal preference.

HugeMuffin · May 2017

MotokoKusanagi34 wrote: »

tinbromide wrote: »

So I have to ask because the MMO's that I have really played into before ESO were UO and GW1. End-game content wasn't really crystalized into anything back when I played UO, and GW1 was always criticized as lacking end-game content. So, (and please don't say "end game content is what you play when you're fully leveled and geared") what exactly is end-game content that folks are looking for?

Any challenging, new, worthwhile (desirable gear, achievements, skins) and hopefully long term content for players who completed most other game content. ESO PVE endgame consists of 4 trials and about 4 Vet DLC dungeons and Maelstrom arena if you consider this grindfest to be entertaining.

But what about other games? I'm hearing that ESO end-game is boring or limited. Surely there has to be a game out there with good end-game content otherwise it's just complaining that some unobtainable ideal hasn't been obtained yet.

MotokoKusanagi34 · May 2017

tinbromide wrote: »

But what about other games? I'm hearing that ESO end-game is boring or limited. Surely there has to be a game out there with good end-game content otherwise it's just complaining that some unobtainable ideal hasn't been obtained yet.

Well the truth is that ESO endgame isn't that boring but definitely limited. Most MMOs use trials as endgame. Completing challenging trials is the end of the progression system. Guild Wars 2 is being considered the best MMO when it comes to endgame as it's a mix of PVP, cosmetics, raids, events. So ESO is a good mix of both, even though dyes and cosmetics are not really being celebrated in ESO or regarded as important or even desirable. ZOS did a good job with making titles and skins very desirable (like in GW2) but like I said, playing 3-4 trials for years is hardly entertaining for good guilds. Releasing about 3 per year (including unlockable cosmetics) would definitely ensure enough content for any type of guild. Leaderboards are fun - it would be even better if exclusive items would drop when ranked... there are lots of possibilities to make me and others constantly playing PVE.

LorDrek · May 2017

Need balance old content.

Sakiri · May 2017

People want FFXIV style content updates.

Won't happen. New trial every three months? Pfft.

DPShiro · May 2017

The new dungeons are not actually dungeons, but delves/public ones so they don't don't, since you can go in naked, spam one button and be done.

Nelson_Rebel · May 2017

DPShiro wrote: »

The new dungeons are not actually dungeons, but delves/public ones so they don't don't, since you can go in naked, spam one button and be done.

Well damn. So really just the trial and battlegrounds then for endgame?

Questing seems to be all that's enjoyable anymore

Dapper Dinosaur · May 2017

Honestly, the best way for Zenimax to add an absolutely limitless amount of PVE content into the game would not be to add any new trials or dungeons, but to spend that dev budget designing a Dungeon Maker for the playerbase, with voting systems for difficulty, length, number of bosses, number of players, etc. That way, the playerbase could design a literally endless supply of unique dungeons with different lengths, difficulties, enemy variety, and group size, even doing unprecedented numbers like 2, 5, or 9 players. The only thing I see being particularly challenging about this is the landscapes eventually becoming stale, but what dungeon environment in this game doesn't already do that once you've been through it a few times?

They could very easily put a giant disclaimer on it saying that there will not be any drops except maybe a gold pile at the end of the dungeon after it has been played enough times (hundreds/thousands) to estimate the average clear time and calculate the amount of gold rewarded based on that and the dungeon difficulty, or they could even make it where literally every single dungeon set in the game drops inside so people COULD get the gear they need, but it would be extremely impractical to run a player-made dungeon trying to get it instead of the real drop spot, preventing players cheesing the intended drop spots.

As an example, I could choose to make a dungeon with all of the game's hardest bosses from 4-player dungeons in it in a row with no trash adds between boss rooms, and use it as practice for clearing the actual dungeons.

I could make a training dungeon with just one big room with a doorway leading to all of the bosses in one particular dungeon like Mazzatun, and use that to see if the group I'm with has any hope of clearing the dungeon.

I could make a dungeon with only a final boss and just a bunch of trash adds of different types to check my (or someone elses') class strengths and weaknesses for DPSing/Tanking/Healing.

Just those three examples would be exceptionally welcome tools for the playerbase to have, and there are dozens if not hundreds of other things people could use it for, and it would completely solve all replayability problems because you could just pick a new player-made dungeon to run if you're bored with existing content.

Code2501 · May 2017

My idea of pve end game does not involve trials or forced group grind, so unless they have an equivalent of MA or radiant style quests my endgame will get stale once the story and quests are done.

Anlaemar · May 2017

Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

Honestly, the best way for Zenimax to add an absolutely limitless amount of PVE content into the game would not be to add any new trials or dungeons, but to spend that dev budget designing a Dungeon Maker for the playerbase, with voting systems for difficulty, length, number of bosses, number of players, etc. That way, the playerbase could design a literally endless supply of unique dungeons with different lengths, difficulties, enemy variety, and group size, even doing unprecedented numbers like 2, 5, or 9 players. The only thing I see being particularly challenging about this is the landscapes eventually becoming stale, but what dungeon environment in this game doesn't already do that once you've been through it a few times?

They could very easily put a giant disclaimer on it saying that there will not be any drops except maybe a gold pile at the end of the dungeon after it has been played enough times (hundreds/thousands) to estimate the average clear time and calculate the amount of gold rewarded based on that and the dungeon difficulty, or they could even make it where literally every single dungeon set in the game drops inside so people COULD get the gear they need, but it would be extremely impractical to run a player-made dungeon trying to get it instead of the real drop spot, preventing players cheesing the intended drop spots.

As an example, I could choose to make a dungeon with all of the game's hardest bosses from 4-player dungeons in it in a row with no trash adds between boss rooms, and use it as practice for clearing the actual dungeons.

I could make a training dungeon with just one big room with a doorway leading to all of the bosses in one particular dungeon like Mazzatun, and use that to see if the group I'm with has any hope of clearing the dungeon.

I could make a dungeon with only a final boss and just a bunch of trash adds of different types to check my (or someone elses') class strengths and weaknesses for DPSing/Tanking/Healing.

Just those three examples would be exceptionally welcome tools for the playerbase to have, and there are dozens if not hundreds of other things people could use it for, and it would completely solve all replayability problems because you could just pick a new player-made dungeon to run if you're bored with existing content.

So much this!

Very rarely I do dungeons / pledges for the drops. Adding a system were players can make dungeons would add so many years to this game by itself.