PvE discussion: Why do so many prefer to be Damage Dealers?

Yubarius · April 2017

First character i ever made was a DK specifically for tanking and I liked it a lot, and I just recently started tanking on a sap tank (which omg, is so incredibly fun) and healing on my templar. I like to heal and tank more than DD because with a DD, it's just running the same rotation over and over and over, ok step out of red, and over and over, etc. However with tank and healer, I like that it puts more responsibility on your shoulders, and there is really no "rotation", as they are both more reactionary roles. I would recommend any pure DD players out there to give tanking a good try, as the community seems to be lacking in that department and could use a lot more of them.

Panomania · April 2017

The way I see it is, Tanking and Healing both come with a lot of responsibilities. People this day and age don't seem to like that very much. xD

Thats a no brainer. Its been this way in most MMO's I've played since I started back in '97....was made even more noticable in EQ back before anyone who mattered knew what a night elf was...and was driven home by that snowstorm company's monstrosity. To an extent its because the "look at how big my digital tallywhacker is!" crowd is mostly impressed by those big, pretty numbers scrolling across the screen as they mash the mouse button. For most of these people its their only way of keeping score, since they cannot see past the immediate. Spend 10 seconds in any PVP chat in "modern" mmos and all you hear is "HAH! Look at how hard I hit!" usually followed by inane, moronic slang about their alleged superiority.

I honestly believe they are displacing and compensating for inadequacies elsewhere, but lets try to avoid delving into psychological analysis.

Its funny....you never hear, "Yeah, but look at how little I cared about how hard you hit. Tell ya what.....I'll stand still and give you a free shot just to make you feel better!".....or "Yes, but look at how I erased all that damage with a fast cast. Keep it up, I got more magicka for more heals!" Mostly because I dont think the type person who embraces the 2 pillars of the Trinity (tank, heal, crowd control, by the way.....originally DPS was NOT part of the Trinity) doesnt keep score that way. They see the long game. They understand that its about more than just them when you're doing something truly important in most MMOs.

Sorry, I rambled.....coffee's still brewing :P As to the claims that its an ESO thing because ESO rewards damage done more readily....ok, I can see your point, but its been this way for decades in plenty of other games. I think it boils down to the fact that, as someone pointed out above, most people usually dont blame low DPS for failing most encounters in these type game (timed score runs aside). They do, however, often place blame on poor tanking or healing....and have for a long time. Most of these narrow shouldered mouth breathers cannot handle that type responsibility, which is understandable. They are here to have fun, and for them thats not fun. It takes a special breed of crazy to thrive under such pressure.

MLGProPlayer · April 2017

You can carry as a damage dealer, so it doesn't matter how good or bad the rest of your group is.

The fastest way to complete most vet dungeons is with 4x DPS. Tanks and healers are very rarely needed. CP power creep has made DPS classes nearly invincible while giving them so much damage they can burst down anything.

Panomania · April 2017

Or, to put it another way, lets quote Mr. Balboa....

"But it ain't about how hard ya hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!"

kevlarto_ESO · April 2017

I think the mindset is it is not sexy being a healer or a support class, no good dps class goes very far with out good support classes to back them up in dungeons, plus dps is pretty easy once you get a good rotation and some stats. I play mostly support classes, but I do like to pew pew once in a while

Visigoth · April 2017

Brockahly wrote: »

Visigoth wrote: »

OP:
To me it simply boils down to DMG=Go Faster...
Try Solo leveling with anything besides DPS... (Leveling as a pure Healer... I don't think so, Leveling as a Pure Tank... no way.)
ESO's system rewards doing more damage with a quicker experience. (and just about everyone starts out solo, even if just until they get comfortable/familiar with ESO.)

Level your tank as a mag/stam DK(whatever tank class you chose)
And level your healer as a mag dps, and simply respec later. My main character is a tank which I played for a long time as a new person would play, it wasn't till someone told me how to play I respecced as a tank, as for my healer I grinding as a magicka Templar dps and simply reset skills and changed gear once I reached level 50.

Yep, this was my point.

GreenhaloX · April 2017

Because it feels good to kill things! Well, inside this game, at least. Ha ha

Mayrael · April 2017

1. Mostly because its default setting for every new character.
2. They think that being DD is easier, as they can make a mistake and no one dies or wipes... Which is false.
3. To be good tank or healer you need dedicated gear, which is out of range most casual players.
4. They like to feel power... Which is also false - vCoA II, healer and tank finishing off skoria (10%) after all platforms were destroyed, soloing last bosses in many dungs as a tank (one wipe after another - roll dodge out red circles for some is to hard) in general - DD exists to make things easier, tanks and healers exists to make things possible (except of trials, thats the place where you need one powerful body made of bests of the bests).

ArvenAldmeri · April 2017

I just find playing healer or tank quite boring even tho I have healer and tank I dont like to play them as much. I love dpsing. Rotation, great numbers. And its healer job to provide resources and tank job to what a surprise, tank and pack the mobs so dd can take them down fast. Faster kill = less time to get killed. I highly doubt dps is lazy role. You need to do your rotation, target the most dangerous enemy. Being the hero you say? For me the hero is usually the one doing the best job in the group, often the tank. The fact though is, it takes forever to do dungeon with bad dps so I am 100% sure dps is maybe the most important role (can solo some vet dungeon after all). And being good dps is not easy to do either. Its much easier to tank (as long as your keybinds are not set as stupidly as mine).

STEVIL · April 2017

Zyrudin wrote: »

Now, I know that several group content mechanics can be bypassed with high enough DPS and that other mechanics include a DPS check. However, Damage Dealers rely more heavily on proper Tanking than most of them would like to admit, to lead the enemies into their AoE's, to turn them away from their position to save them dodge time, etc. They also rely on competent Healers to keep them buffed and with enough HOT's for them to focus on one task. So why so few Tanks and Healers?

My assertion about the numbers comes from Vet Group Finder queues, where with a Tank or a Healer I immediately pick up a group, while it takes ages with a DD.

My opinion is that "everyone" wants to be the hero that slays the "dragon", to be in the spotlight - probably a reflection of the times - and so it may be in fashion to build for DPS (even if not competently) instead of opting for one of the support roles of Tank or Healer.

I would like to hear other opinions on the matter.

Also DD is most useful for solo - its what you do - and is faster thru content solo than the others - if you live so many who play anything solo are used to that by the time they are looking at group play.

HarlotsLoki · April 2017

I've always played a DD because I can do all content effectively on a DD, whereas I can't as a healer or a tank.

I've recently started tanking and I'm enjoying it. I like the quick match ups in group finder and I have to tackle content differently, so it's a nice change of pace. It's also more responsibility, which has it's draw backs. You can overcome a bad DD, but a bad tank is going to make everyone's life miserable. This makes me a little hesitant to tank harder content I'm unfamiliar with, but I'll get there eventually.

Runschei · April 2017

To me it seems like everyone starts by becoming a DD. Your first character is the least likely to become a tank or healer because everything you focus on doing is to clear delves and quests therefore you tend to become a damage dealer. Lots of people favor their first character because it is their first and stuff, and therefor they stay as DDs. I myself didn't get my tank and healer until NOW! Three years after playing.

lunawisp · April 2017

Some people like to solo as much as they can and it's going to be very frustrating doing that unless you can deal a respectable amount of damage.

In City of Heroes I preferred a controller because it could actually switch between that support role and damage dealing instantly without have to make any changes to powers, etc. That sort of flexibility doesn't seem to exist in more modern MMO's.

Moiskormoimi · April 2017

It's my preferred play style. I also play ranged exclusively because I like being able to see the fight. If I wanted to be 'the hero', I'd tank. I have no interest in healing.

Flameheart · April 2017

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Most damage dealers are bad. Most don't know their rotations or anything at all, they just think that because they have Force Pulse and Frags, or Jesus Beam and Jabs on their bar, they are a DD.

But yeah, its apparently more fun to deal damage than to tank or support you team mates... Little do they know... DPS is a group effort that is made possible by support from (guess what) Healers and Tanks, and a huge amount of practice and progression from the DPS himself/herself.

So much this.

Wrecking_Blow_Spam wrote: »

Maybe it's a console thing but THERES SO MANY FAKE DPS, I 100% guarantee 90% of the DPS in group finder would struggle to do a self buffed 15k DPS on the test dummy.

I've not pugged for a month or more so maybe it's magically changed but I doubt it, the standard in dungeon finder is appalling. 25k (maintained) self buffed in group finder PUG would be like equivalent of gold dust.

It's gunna be even worse next patch so that'll be fun to watch.

Ive been in vet trails groups and I've seen first hand multiple 600cp stormproofs do DPS test purely self buffed, they barely scratch 20k and GLOATED.

and this.

Btw...there is absolutely no reason - be it stamina or magicka build - to not being able to play at least 2 roles (magicka even all 3) by just doing a simple gear swap with Dressing Room (you don't even have to reallocate your CPs) when it comes to 4-men-content, normal trials and even some vet trials. I play all 4 classes as magicka builds and in all three roles by just doing a simple gear swap. In times of a crafting bag there is even no reason to not craft gear for different roles at least in epic quality (which is sufficient in most cases, maybe weapons for a DD in gold). You might even experience that playing different roles gives variety and fun, besides that it will give you a major insight in game mechanics and might fill tank and healer spots in the LFG tool. At those comments like "I usually play solo / do quests / farm / level and therefore need to play as a DD" I can just laugh. Those playstyles have nothing in common with playing a DD role in a group where you need some serious dps and it's no obstacle at all to play other roles too (see crafting / gear / Dressing Room).

I have seen so called "anchor specialists" with over 600 CP who were thinking standing on 28m and doing hard cast frags and light attacks should be enough. I have seen "tanks", who therefore thought, it's their job to increase their own dps and warhorn, chains, Swarm Mother, Bloodspawn, Warden are bad choices...and not to mention healers beaming on mobs with 70% health, jabbing trash, spamming BoL (instead of Combat Prayer or Healing Circles) and never heard of Elemental Drain, bubbles and warhorn too etc. Maybe some of those tanks and healers have the excuse of having grouped too much with bad DDs, where a Warhorn just goes poof because the dps is fubar.

The best comment I once read in a group chat was: "We won't do it, because tank is doing too less dps..." (Actually the tank did 6k dps and therfore 30% of the group dps).

It's rather depressing how many DDs out there would have a much bigger use with just a taunt on their skill bar while blocking with their twohander / bow.

clocksstoppe · April 2017

Because they faceroll the quest and overland mobs and they think they are actually good at the game but then reality hits them when their teammates rage at their bad skills.

Axoinus · April 2017

Because a lot of people solo. Focusing on damage is the main objective when soloing. Not unique to this game.

randomkeyhits · April 2017

The same thoughts as most others here

damager is the default role
all non group content is designed for damager
most content is ultimately completed by "hitting stuff"
its easy to for a weak damager to hide behind a strong one
tanking and healing require additional effort, gaining appropriate gear and skills
as tank or healer, nowhere to hide
tanks and healers get the blame even though its often damager stupid
in group content use of enrage timers encourages damager stacking

AFAIK, this is standard MMO design 101.

Kept this one back because I'm unsure on it with ESO

Contribution is usually measured by damage so healers/tanks get reduced recognition.

Bam_Bam · April 2017

maybe its just a sad indictment of humanity - people prefer to kill than to heal or save.

SquareSausage · April 2017

Every MMO i've ever played (except UO) my main has been a tank or healer as getting in guilds or groups as DPS is a lot harder.

People who play exclusively DPS I generally have a little disdain for them as although they may be good, its also a little selfish as healing and tanking is more stressful and complicated, and these people dont want to take some of that burden. IMO.

But yea people like seeing big numbers hitting the enemies, more pew pew, more ego.

I guess though if you only play by yourself then you want to be a DD as its quicker to get stuff done.

ofSunhold · April 2017

I have a healer and two DDs (respect to the tanks, I've tried it and was terribad).

DD is easier, more fun, and if you can do the job - one job, kill stuff - nobody gives you any problems.

santos.vellab16_ESO · April 2017

lunawisp wrote: »

Some people like to solo as much as they can and it's going to be very frustrating doing that unless you can deal a respectable amount of damage.

Pretty much this, in my case. If there was a way to kill things by healing I'd switch in a heartbeat. The 1st iteration of Polar Wind looked liked it might allow exactly that, but from what I've read the initial burst damage on cast has been removed, sadly.

Flameheart wrote: »

The best comment I once read in a group chat was: "We won't do it, because tank is doing too less dps..." (Actually the tank did 6k dps and therfore 30% of the group dps).

I can't even begin to understand how this is possible. You can literally pick any class/weapon spammable and do 10k single target DPS in half-decent crafted purple gear, without any weaving, animation cancelling or using anything else.

Artemiisia · April 2017

for me it was quite simple, when I started I wanted to be able to kill solo content fast, and not heal them to death

now I have all 3 roles covered

gangrel206 · April 2017

Talking about end-game content

I've got 10 max cp toons, can do all roles, but I prefer being DD... just cause most of players are not real DDs.
On end game content I found the DD to be the hardest role (specially on stam), you have to pull a lot of damage (perfect rotation, spend expensive tri-pots) and survive, and I guarantee that no healer can heals you from 1 shot.
If you are not tank or healer, you are not automatically a DD, you are just one more in group...

To tank and heal vTrials people just asked my gear and skills, but to be DD I had to run dps tests

Again, talking only about end game content

Hirune · April 2017

I played a lot of MMORPGs and this happens in all of them.

People just want to be that protagonist from other games/movies/comics/cartoon.

Azurulia · April 2017

DPS is fun, but I prefer support roles such as tanking and healing in both PvE and PvP

A strong healer can generally carry a group baddies that have the situational awareness and/or pvp skills of a potato.

Meanwhile a strong tank can carry a group by absorbing the heavy damages like a spongue, allowing the healer mana and time to save the baddie DPS (or rez the dps if a baddie healer.)

Strong DPS can kill stuff fast, sure. Like they say, the best defense if a good offense. However when *** hits the fan, they generally lack the level of mitigation/healing/utility needed to stop an impending train-wreck.

When it all boils down to it, it's simply a matter of personal preference: Make HP bars go down, make HP bars go up, or pray for teammate competence.

Stormwitch2025 · April 2017

You ask people opinions and so you're going get mine...LOL!! Please be gentle I am going shoot straight from the hip.

** The current state of the MMO genre is one of instant gratification rather then, work hard and learning to be the best. It is log on and instantly be the bad arse you have always dreamed to be. This mentality has created mostly inadequate damage dealers as you put it or as we always called it ' DPS ". The holy trinity of the genre has also come under attack by the creators of the newer titles trying to blur the lines between roles under the guise of creating more diversity when in fact it is only creating less stability. I for one will not start going to normal dungeons until I am a Level 50 / 160 champion point character and veterans only once I have maxed out the gear to all legendary set( yellow ) and know my rotations and how to put out the most damage I can squeeze out for my team.

** All that being said players these days are really cruel and unkind to people that are just learning the games. They call them names that are really hurtful and kick them from groups without trying to work with them to help the person become a better player. Tanking and Healing takes practice and long long hours of messing up to learn how to correct your play-style. The only place to really learn this is in dungeons or at the least in groups for world boss runs and delve diving.

**** Players have grown accustomed to the intolerance and ignorance of the community of new players in the genre and join the dungeons regardless of their ability knowing that even being the best at their role will not insure they will not be the victim of the immature ass hats that seem to dominate the genre these days.

HatchetHaro · April 2017

DPS is much more fun than tanking or healing. Often, dealing damage feels more like contributing to the team than tanking or healing does. You get this sense of satisfaction when you pull off perfect rotations and post your 50k parse, like "Hey look at me I'm contributing a lot to the team!"

Another thing is that good tanking and healing really isn't recognized a whole lot. To many people, you're just doing your job, and the most you can do is taunt bosses and stay still or watch the health bar and press a key for BoL.

One more thing is that the tanks and healers have the most responsibilities, especially in vet trials. Tanking vet trials is sometimes pretty stressful for me because I know that one little mistake from me will kill me and wipe the entire group.

AcadianPaladin · April 2017

I can only really speak for my healer. Her nature is very nurturing and this is our first MMO. She quite quickly found her niche as trying to help others and her nature is much more sidekick/support than hero/leader. So the healer roll came naturally.

Happily, the same healing that helps others also allows her to do normal solo content okay with just a very small number of purely offensive skills. Like tanks (I imagine), she can survive fairly scary stuff solo, it just takes her longer to kill things.

She views a world boss fight as her vs the boss but in a very different way. Can she heal her allies better than the boss can hurt them? This involves buffing allies and debuffing the boss of course but that is her focus.

I think support roles are not perceived as sexy or cool like dps and, indeed, I believe in many informal 'groupings' (wb, dolmens) most of my healer's beneficiaries don't even realize why their red bar magically burst from nearly empty to full. So the rewards must come from within. That said, she does sometimes get a 'thx for the healz' and that makes her a happy elf.

My healer is in awe of dps and especially tanks but her job is trying to help them hold or kill the boss. It seems natural that this is not a role for many.

It seems to me that if the game wants more healers and tanks, then the appropriate skills for that need to be maintained or improved, not nerfed. . . .

vyrzeden · April 2017

I solved this on my magsorc by just being a DD and Healer, the only thing I have to swap around are my weapons. Necropotence works real nice for this: v familiar for DPS and matriarch for healing. I've done nothing but PUG vet dungeons and haven't had any issues with either role, other than not knowing mechanics initially.

This is also a bit easier on skill points since I just need 1 armor (LA) and 2 weapons (Destro/Resto).