Devs need to acknowledge and respect the ESO gamers more

Messy1 · March 2017

From the lowliest noob to the heights of Fengrush (or whoever is considered the pinnacle player of the game at a particular moment) my feeling is that the devs need to acknowledge their gamers more and make better connections with them. Instead of letting information trickle down to the player base through MMORPG.org or Polygon or other outlets, players should get monthly emails from the dev team and players should get any information about changes to the game FIRST!

Then after being informed of potential directions and plans for ESO players should be asked for their input with surveys, questions etc. I think this issue comes down to basic marketing strategy, but also if ESO players feel valued and respected the game will do better.

Every ESO live that I have watched, I get the perception that the Devs are laughing at their player base, then some of the changes that come through in the game are not totally in line with what the majority of players actually wanted to see done. I get it that the game development and vision by the team at ZOS cannot be beholden to every player request, but at the same time I expect more from them especially if they consider ESO to be the premier MMO experience in the gaming world right now.

I have been part of this community from the beginning (whenever you consider that to be). I love the game, I want to see it continue, I want the game to be constantly improved, and I want the devs to listen. There's a lot of suggestion threads on the forums right now i.e.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/332292/why-is-there-no-guild-store-search-bar#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/332273/allow-us-to-hire-guards-for-our-homes#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/332244/token-system-undaunted-chests#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/332288/do-you-enjoy-vma-gameplay#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/331259/what-would-you-like-to-be-done-about-the-bots#latest

So yeah, I would like to see ZOS systematically address every one of these concerns and tell players what is being done, introduce smaller patches, etc.

Thak you for reading
@Messy1

PS I reported 4 bots last night that were parading around Drown Coast Dolemn in Greenshade (NA PC) going from mudcrab to mudcrab collecting rubedo leather and these players seemed like real players who were using botting software to get ahead of the competition so to speak. This behavior is not FAIR to other players and those accounts NEED to be banned.

NewBlacksmurf · March 2017

Just sharing the truth that's ZOS reality

Look at feedback and threads around eso plus and crown store ideas

Gilvoth · March 2017

im-sorry-i-wasnt-listening-the-dude-gif-big-lebowski-sheriff-scene.gif

Balamoor · March 2017

I think I have a unique perspective on this since I'm a gamer and have worked in the industry.

To be frank developers that have such a toxic forum community has little desire to acknowledge or respect people that insult them call for them to be fired or worse. It's easier and more productive to funnel information through fan sites, also to be fair Zenimax does more than most with regular ESO live shows on twitch where they answer questions (some of the links you posted have been discussed) from the community, and their regular attendance at cons like PAX and Quakecon. ZoS's is one of the few companies left where you can contact a moderator, community manager or dev by messaging them through the forum and every time I have done this Iv'e gotten a reply.

So to sum up, don't expect them to wade into this cesspool any time soon and yeah that is why we can't have nice things, and don't expect any dev to dig down tech issues with the fan base, because that time is better used addressing the issues.

I love the game too, I just don't think trying to force the devs into some group think hug-in as a way to solve issues from a openly hostile community is the right choice.

FloppyTouch · March 2017

Balamoor wrote: »

I think I have a unique perspective on this since I'm a gamer and have worked in the industry.

To be frank developers that have such a toxic forum community has little desire to acknowledge or respect people that insult them call for them to be fired or worse. It's easier and more productive to funnel information through fan sites, also to be fair Zenimax does more than most with regular ESO live shows on twitch where they answer questions (some of the links you posted have been discussed) from the community, and their regular attendance at cons like PAX and Quakecon. ZoS's is one of the few companies left where you can contact a moderator, community manager or dev by messaging them through the forum and every time I have done this Iv'e gotten a reply.

So to sum up, don't expect them to wade into this cesspool any time soon and yeah that is why we can't have nice things, and don't expect any dev to dig down tech issues with the fan base, because that time is better used addressing the issues.

I love the game too, I just don't think trying to force the devs into some group think hug-in as a way to solve issues from a openly hostile community is the right choice.

Show me a forum community that's not toxic to the developers XD never been part of an mmo forum that was not full of crying hate talk to the game they play everyday

Balamoor · March 2017

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Balamoor wrote: »

I think I have a unique perspective on this since I'm a gamer and have worked in the industry.

To be frank developers that have such a toxic forum community has little desire to acknowledge or respect people that insult them call for them to be fired or worse. It's easier and more productive to funnel information through fan sites, also to be fair Zenimax does more than most with regular ESO live shows on twitch where they answer questions (some of the links you posted have been discussed) from the community, and their regular attendance at cons like PAX and Quakecon. ZoS's is one of the few companies left where you can contact a moderator, community manager or dev by messaging them through the forum and every time I have done this Iv'e gotten a reply.

So to sum up, don't expect them to wade into this cesspool any time soon and yeah that is why we can't have nice things, and don't expect any dev to dig down tech issues with the fan base, because that time is better used addressing the issues.

I love the game too, I just don't think trying to force the devs into some group think hug-in as a way to solve issues from a openly hostile community is the right choice.

Show me a forum community that's not toxic to the developers XD never been part of an mmo forum that was not full of crying hate talk to the game they play everyday

Lets see, the AC forums were pretty damned civil, as are the LOTRO forums, the FFXIV and FFXI forums aren't what you call toxic, nor are the Marvel Hero forums, that's off the top of my head. Also I'm not saying those forums never had a issue with hate, they just aren't like this special little ranthole. Like my sig says....The LoL and WoW forums had a baby and it's name is Elder Scrolls Online General Discussion.

Messy1 · March 2017

Balamoor wrote: »

I think I have a unique perspective on this since I'm a gamer and have worked in the industry.

To be frank developers that have such a toxic forum community has little desire to acknowledge or respect people that insult them call for them to be fired or worse. It's easier and more productive to funnel information through fan sites, also to be fair Zenimax does more than most with regular ESO live shows on twitch where they answer questions (some of the links you posted have been discussed) from the community, and their regular attendance at cons like PAX and Quakecon. ZoS's is one of the few companies left where you can contact a moderator, community manager or dev by messaging them through the forum and every time I have done this Iv'e gotten a reply.

So to sum up, don't expect them to wade into this cesspool any time soon and yeah that is why we can't have nice things, and don't expect any dev to dig down tech issues with the fan base, because that time is better used addressing the issues.

I love the game too, I just don't think trying to force the devs into some group think hug-in as a way to solve issues from a openly hostile community is the right choice.

That's why I suggested monthly email updates to players in a players first approach. I did not say "please give toxic forum post attention to set things right." I mean I do expet some decorum.

Everstorm · March 2017

Respect is earned, not demanded.

WhiteMage · March 2017

Heh, LotRO forums... I remember back when I played that. Good times...

LotRO once upon a time had a number of developers spread between each class. Some classes had their own developer, others had to share their developer with other classes... until the class overhaul. Some developers would talk a lot, some it was like they didn't even have a forum account lol. It was an incredibly mixed bag with them. This, of course, was years back and it seems they are now under new management. Anyway, I didn't venture much out of the PvP forum there and I can tell you it was full of rage at the developers, and they had earned it (of course there were MANY non-developer related threads too). They hadn't updated PvP in year(s), unlike what they had promised, and they had an official stance of permitting "farming:" killing dummy characters off in some corner of the map to get higher ranks. It took months of complaining and petitions and outrage to finally get them to change their stance, but change they did. We all reacted very positively to that, as anyone would expect.

They took our feedback though (after changing developers) which is very important. You really should take players' input, because they're the ones that play your game.

Messy1 · March 2017

WhiteMage wrote: »

Heh, LotRO forums... I remember back when I played that. Good times...

LotRO once upon a time had a number of developers spread between each class. Some classes had their own developer, others had to share their developer with other classes... until the class overhaul. Some developers would talk a lot, some it was like they didn't even have a forum account lol. It was an incredibly mixed bag with them. This, of course, was years back and it seems they are now under new management. Anyway, I didn't venture much out of the PvP forum there and I can tell you it was full of rage at the developers, and they had earned it (of course there were MANY non-developer related threads too). They hadn't updated PvP in year(s), unlike what they had promised, and they had an official stance of permitting "farming:" killing dummy characters off in some corner of the map to get higher ranks. It took months of complaining and petitions and outrage to finally get them to change their stance, but change they did. We all reacted very positively to that, as anyone would expect.

They took our feedback though (after changing developers) which is very important. You really should take players' input, because they're the ones that play your game.

Thank you for sharing that story!

Messy1 · March 2017

Everstorm wrote: »

Respect is earned, not demanded.

So . . . ESO players need to "earn" the respect of the devs? We're paying customers! Are you insinuating that the devs can sit in their towers and scoff at the player base? No sir, the devs need to do more to embrace the player base.

AlienatedGoat · March 2017

Everstorm wrote: »

Respect is bought, not demanded.

Fixed that for you.

Don't forget to buy the newest Crown Crates and Crown Houses.

kwisatz · March 2017

It's their game; it's their creation.

Of course they can like and pick some good idea here and there, but they are not working for us, they are not our employees and they have zero obligation to develop their game the way we want.

They own the world they created, they conceived and sold a product... It's up to us to decide if we want to buy it, if we want to stay or leave, we have the right to express ourselves and give our opinion or ideas if we want to, but it's not ours to decide what to do or not to do.

And of course respect is due to them. Who are we to judge and condemn and insult people?

Turelus · March 2017

ZOS is using the same marketing ways as Bethesda, give out exclusives to reviews site.

They don't run this like a traditional MMO with DevBlogs and news directly to the community, they run it like a general game with online play.

DRXHarbinger · March 2017

All they need to do is create like 30 ideas put it out to community and let us pick the top 5 to focus on. Given they can change the log on banner at will it's hardly difficult to post it out.

Everstorm · March 2017

Messy1 wrote: »

Everstorm wrote: »

Respect is earned, not demanded.

So . . . ESO players need to "earn" the respect of the devs? We're paying customers! Are you insinuating that the devs can sit in their towers and scoff at the player base? No sir, the devs need to do more to embrace the player base.

You earn respect by voicing discontent in a respectful, constructive manner. Not by throwing temper tantrums and silly REPSECT!!!1!! demands.
Paying for a service does not give you the right to throw abuse.

Messy1 · March 2017

Everstorm wrote: »

Messy1 wrote: »

Everstorm wrote: »

Respect is earned, not demanded.

So . . . ESO players need to "earn" the respect of the devs? We're paying customers! Are you insinuating that the devs can sit in their towers and scoff at the player base? No sir, the devs need to do more to embrace the player base.

You earn respect by voicing discontent in a respectful, constructive manner. Not by throwing temper tantrums and silly REPSECT!!!1!! demands.
Paying for a service does not give you the right to throw abuse.

Well, I think my post was pretty constructive. I shared a trend that I have noticed and asked for some action and revealed that I've done my diligence as a player by reporting behavior detrimental to the game's community. Sorry that you feel I'm throwing a tantrum; I'm just trying to chime in and voice my opinion for the good of the game.

Sausage · March 2017

Respect is earned, not given. This forum is nothing more than a bunch of whining kiddos.

Messy1 · March 2017

Sausage wrote: »

Respect is earned, not given. This forum is nothing more than a bunch of whining kiddos.

I agree with you, this forum has a lot of whining on it, but dismissing everyone as "kiddos" is disengenious and non-constructive. Once again, my primary reason for making a post is to show the devs that they don't have a stagnant "toxic" player base, but that there are actually thoughtfull and passionate people that play this game. Did you not read my postscript on how I've been reporting bots?

A lot of legitimate posts receive comments such as yours on this forum and your dismissive attitude is a form of "toxicity."

Sausage · March 2017

Messy1 wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

Respect is earned, not given. This forum is nothing more than a bunch of whining kiddos.

I agree with you, this forum has a lot of whining on it, but dismissing everyone as "kiddos" is disengenious and non-constructive. Once again, my primary reason for making a post is to show the devs that they don't have a stagnant "toxic" player base, but that there are actually thoughtfull and passionate people that play this game. Did you not read my postscript on how I've been reporting bots?

A lot of legitimate posts receive comments such as yours on this forum and your dismissive attitude is a form of "toxicity."

You forget that "kiddo" is one of the greatest compliment one can give to someone, too. Kiddo is sorta "young-heart". Usually as kiddo its hard to receive respect from anybody.

Turelus · March 2017

Sausage wrote: »

Messy1 wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

Respect is earned, not given. This forum is nothing more than a bunch of whining kiddos.

I agree with you, this forum has a lot of whining on it, but dismissing everyone as "kiddos" is disengenious and non-constructive. Once again, my primary reason for making a post is to show the devs that they don't have a stagnant "toxic" player base, but that there are actually thoughtfull and passionate people that play this game. Did you not read my postscript on how I've been reporting bots?

A lot of legitimate posts receive comments such as yours on this forum and your dismissive attitude is a form of "toxicity."

You forget that "kiddo" is one of the greatest compliment one can give to someone, too. Kiddo is sorta "young-heart". Usually as kiddo its hard to receive respect from anybody.

I would accept kiddo gladly.

A teenager called me "sir" the other day and I realised how old I am now.

Sausage · March 2017

Kiddo from Urban Dictionary.

"Someone who is at least slightly younger than you in age, but so apparently intellectual as to have the best of both worlds; brains and purely cute facial characteristics combined with childish noises that cause her companion to smile with delight. "

Messy1 · March 2017

Sausage wrote: »

Kiddo from Urban Dictionary.

"Someone who is at least slightly younger than you in age, but so apparently intellectual as to have the best of both worlds; brains and purely cute facial characteristics combined with childish noises that cause her companion to smile with delight. "

Oxford English dictionary:

Kiddo: A friendly or slightly condesceding form of address

jircris11 · March 2017

Messy1 wrote: »

Everstorm wrote: »

Respect is earned, not demanded.

So . . . ESO players need to "earn" the respect of the devs? We're paying customers! Are you insinuating that the devs can sit in their towers and scoff at the player base? No sir, the devs need to do more to embrace the player base.

Why embrace a community who honestly has no clue what they want. I have been playing MMOs for years and honestly PvP vs PvE is one of the downfalls. PvP complain about skills causing nerfs then PvE goes on about how useless skills are due to said Nerf. Bottom line is your can't Cater to both.

Messy1 · March 2017

Turelus wrote: »

ZOS is using the same marketing ways as Bethesda, give out exclusives to reviews site.

They don't run this like a traditional MMO with DevBlogs and news directly to the community, they run it like a general game with online play.

Wow, how right you are, they ylshould rethink this approach!

Messy1 · March 2017

Sausage wrote: »

Messy1 wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

Respect is earned, not given. This forum is nothing more than a bunch of whining kiddos.

I agree with you, this forum has a lot of whining on it, but dismissing everyone as "kiddos" is disengenious and non-constructive. Once again, my primary reason for making a post is to show the devs that they don't have a stagnant "toxic" player base, but that there are actually thoughtfull and passionate people that play this game. Did you not read my postscript on how I've been reporting bots?

A lot of legitimate posts receive comments such as yours on this forum and your dismissive attitude is a form of "toxicity."

You forget that "kiddo" is one of the greatest compliment one can give to someone, too. Kiddo is sorta "young-heart". Usually as kiddo its hard to receive respect from anybody.

So you're telling me that this response : "This forum is nothing more than a bunch of whining kiddos." was supposed to be a positive takeaway? In context the comment seems purely negative.

Turelus · March 2017

jircris11 wrote: »

Messy1 wrote: »

Everstorm wrote: »

Respect is earned, not demanded.

So . . . ESO players need to "earn" the respect of the devs? We're paying customers! Are you insinuating that the devs can sit in their towers and scoff at the player base? No sir, the devs need to do more to embrace the player base.

Why embrace a community who honestly has no clue what they want. I have been playing MMOs for years and honestly PvP vs PvE is one of the downfalls. PvP complain about skills causing nerfs then PvE goes on about how useless skills are due to said Nerf. Bottom line is your can't Cater to both.

Open world PvP, then everyone is a PvP player.

Messy1 · March 2017

jircris11 wrote: »

Messy1 wrote: »

Everstorm wrote: »

Respect is earned, not demanded.

So . . . ESO players need to "earn" the respect of the devs? We're paying customers! Are you insinuating that the devs can sit in their towers and scoff at the player base? No sir, the devs need to do more to embrace the player base.

Why embrace a community who honestly has no clue what they want. I have been playing MMOs for years and honestly PvP vs PvE is one of the downfalls. PvP complain about skills causing nerfs then PvE goes on about how useless skills are due to said Nerf. Bottom line is your can't Cater to both.

There are some things that all players (or at least the vast majority) can agree on like: a dungeon finder that works, better guild customization options, better customer support, and better communication.

Gandrhulf_Harbard · March 2017

Balamoor wrote: »

Lets see, the AC forums were pretty damned civil, as are the LOTRO forums

Well the LOTRO forums used to be as toxic as hell - when the Devs clearly didn't give a damn what the Player's concerns were.

The LOTRO Forums are significantly less toxic now that SSG has taken over and is clearly listening to the concerns and wishes of the Playerbase.

Perhaps this forum is as toxic as it is precisely because the Devs don't really seem to listen or care about the concerns of the players.

You seem to think the toxicity of a game's forum is determined ONLY by the players, it isn't.
It is also determined by the Game Company - by how much or how little meaningful interaction there is with the player base; by if they are listening to or ignoring the concerns of the player base.

For example, players have been complaining about the RNG Loot system in this game since day one - in fact it is one of the worst RNG Loot systems of any game I have ever played (the exception being the NGE New Gearing Experience in SWTOR since the last update). And only now, almost 3 years down the line, have I seen a) the Devs acknowledge that fact, and b) hint they may do something about it - sometime in the future (after Morrowind).

This isn't indicative of a company that a) listens to or b) care about the concerns of the Player base.

And is part of the reason these forums are as toxic as they are.

All The Best

Turelus · March 2017

Of all the MMO games I have played the only ones who have ever been super open with their community was CCP Games.

I would imagine that's part of the fact they're a smaller company and maybe the Icelandic friendly way. Almost every Dev there has a Dev twitter (separate from their personal ones) and they tend to be active chatting with the community via that.

I know ESO Devs have twitter accounts but they're all personal ones from my understanding which makes it harder to chat about the game. As I dislike pestering them in their private time.

Duiwel · March 2017

Shouldn't it be LORD Fengrush in the OP?