Are Taunts broken or just mechanics?

DRXHarbinger · March 2017

So starting to tank now, DPS is getting tiresome doing that all the time.

Can anyone answer if these mechs are as intended or broken.

For instance.

Stonebreaker, randomly turns around and crushes someone and refuses to turn back half the time?

Sellestrix, Doesn't not care about taunts, randomly does the scream attack at anyone and loses taunt afterwards attacking anyone it pleases, and notably will only light attack you and direct most other attacks at the group.

AA Axes, No more than 4 axes can be taunted now? taunt a 5th and one just wanders off, retaunt it and another runs away?

DC1 Final boss, when spinning around it wanders off and applying taunt causes it to go for another player, taunt again and it will go for someone else and generally not you?

Just a few that stand out as glaringly obvious something isn't right.

Loc2262 · March 2017

I don't know about all of your examples, but most (if not all) of what you listed is intended mechanics. There's a lot of random boss attacks that ignore taunts; your Sellistrix and Sentinel (DC1) examples are definitely among those.

Also note that the taunt lasts for 15 seconds, and it can easily happen that you forget to re-apply it in the heat of the battle. If you're on PC, the addon "Untaunted" helps a lot with keeping track of your remaining taunt times per mob.

idk · March 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

So starting to tank now, DPS is getting tiresome doing that all the time.

Can anyone answer if these mechs are as intended or broken.

For instance.

Stonebreaker, randomly turns around and crushes someone and refuses to turn back half the time?

Sellestrix, Doesn't not care about taunts, randomly does the scream attack at anyone and loses taunt afterwards attacking anyone it pleases, and notably will only light attack you and direct most other attacks at the group.

AA Axes, No more than 4 axes can be taunted now? taunt a 5th and one just wanders off, retaunt it and another runs away?

DC1 Final boss, when spinning around it wanders off and applying taunt causes it to go for another player, taunt again and it will go for someone else and generally not you?

Just a few that stand out as glaringly obvious something isn't right.

I cannot recall last time I saw 5 axes. As for other bosses, some cannot be tanked and many have auto attacks where they will attack a random member of the group.

Reverb · March 2017

When I complained about the same thing in AA recently, I was told that it was my imagination, and that I was doing it wrong, so now I have to give the same answer to you

I don't actually believe it, but I'm obligated to tow the party line. You understand.

Dasovaruilos · March 2017

Most bosses will have one or more mechanics that do not respect taunt. Some more, like Sellestrix, some less.

But I do not remember one boss that stays on the tank 100% of the time. It would actually be kind of boring to be honest.

The only one I think is kind of broken is that guy in Vollenfell that summons the gargoyle. He will attack the first player that his him and will not stop until he is dead.

LadyLavina · March 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

So starting to tank now, DPS is getting tiresome doing that all the time.

Can anyone answer if these mechs are as intended or broken.

For instance.

Stonebreaker, randomly turns around and crushes someone and refuses to turn back half the time?

Sellestrix, Doesn't not care about taunts, randomly does the scream attack at anyone and loses taunt afterwards attacking anyone it pleases, and notably will only light attack you and direct most other attacks at the group.

AA Axes, No more than 4 axes can be taunted now? taunt a 5th and one just wanders off, retaunt it and another runs away?

DC1 Final boss, when spinning around it wanders off and applying taunt causes it to go for another player, taunt again and it will go for someone else and generally not you?

Just a few that stand out as glaringly obvious something isn't right.

Some bosses/enemies in general seem to randomly ignore taunt

DRXHarbinger · March 2017

Reverb wrote: »

When I complained about the same thing in AA recently, I was told that it was my imagination, and that I was doing it wrong, so now I have to give the same answer to you I don't actually believe it, but I'm obligated to tow the party line. You understand.

The Axe part is definitely not wrong and 100% this happens. 4 axes is stupidly easy to play with and not lose taunt but they certainly are running off at random when you try and get a 5th.

DRXHarbinger · March 2017

hugocbp wrote: »

Most bosses will have one or more mechanics that do not respect taunt. Some more, like Sellestrix, some less.

But I do not remember one boss that stays on the tank 100% of the time. It would actually be kind of boring to be honest.

The only one I think is kind of broken is that guy in Vollenfell that summons the gargoyle. He will attack the first player that his him and will not stop until he is dead.

Quite a few tbh, Kena, Overfiend, Adjudicator, Flesh Abomination, Flesh Sculptor, Trusty Bloodspawn.

Main reason for asking is so not to be called a scrub lol and in fact it's either buggy as *** or intended.

Dark_Aether · March 2017

Every boss in the game has a random targeting mechanic, tank cannot do anything about them. Some cannot be tanked, like Engine Guardian in DC2. It kind of makes sense cause otherwise every fight would be tank taking boss in a corner while dps blow their load on its back

NewBlacksmurf · March 2017

Carefully responding......

Some of those while taunted, attack others as this game is not set on a typical taunt and remain taunted interaction.....some also could be the case where someone has a frost staff passive (not trying to insult anyone, just that it's a reality)

The other is that ....ppl argue otherwise, but from all the 2016-2017 skill and passive changes, others can draw aggro in specific situations or use of skills in sequence.

I wouldn't worry about it as the way things are going.....it's going to change again in June

Magdalina · March 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

So starting to tank now, DPS is getting tiresome doing that all the time.

Can anyone answer if these mechs are as intended or broken.

For instance.

Stonebreaker, randomly turns around and crushes someone and refuses to turn back half the time?

Sellestrix, Doesn't not care about taunts, randomly does the scream attack at anyone and loses taunt afterwards attacking anyone it pleases, and notably will only light attack you and direct most other attacks at the group.

AA Axes, No more than 4 axes can be taunted now? taunt a 5th and one just wanders off, retaunt it and another runs away?

DC1 Final boss, when spinning around it wanders off and applying taunt causes it to go for another player, taunt again and it will go for someone else and generally not you?

Just a few that stand out as glaringly obvious something isn't right.

Well of those I do know for sure...
Sellestrix does melee attacks to the tank I think but her scream is random yes. It's dumb but it seems intended. Moar springs on top and it should be fine.

Dc1 final boss ignores taunt when spinning around, he just targets random players. Nothing you can do, they should run and you can try to dps or something. Soon as he stops that, he can be taunted again.

The guy-before-gargoyle-boss in Volen is absolutely immune to taunt. Inexperienced people love raging at the tank there but he's just immune to it, let him be and have the person he targets run/shield, it's not that hard.
Final Volen boss, I always forget which one can be taunted, but at least one of them ignores taunt as well, I think red one(same thing with red centurions in vDSA I think).

Some attacks which looks like your average single target heavies are in fact frontal aoes - for example the "forgive me, Ladyyyyyy!" lady in CoS has one, so while she will be targetting you, if someone else is standing next to you, they're gonna get it(and probably die) too. Chudan's heavy in RoM is also like that.

The lizard dude in RoM is exceptionally annoying to tank with his random player charge - gotta stand in his way blocking and (?) retaunt to make him stop, doesn't work sometimes anyway because reasons.

Generally Zenimax seems to be of opinion that random untaunted boss attacks are extremely fun. I'm not so sure about that one but it is what it is.

Dasovaruilos · March 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

hugocbp wrote: »

Most bosses will have one or more mechanics that do not respect taunt. Some more, like Sellestrix, some less.

But I do not remember one boss that stays on the tank 100% of the time. It would actually be kind of boring to be honest.

The only one I think is kind of broken is that guy in Vollenfell that summons the gargoyle. He will attack the first player that his him and will not stop until he is dead.

Quite a few tbh, Kena, Overfiend, Adjudicator, Flesh Abomination, Flesh Sculptor, Trusty Bloodspawn.

Main reason for asking is so not to be called a scrub lol and in fact it's either buggy as *** or intended.

I mean last bosses of dungeons.

Kena will still turn and push other people.

Also, not calling you scrub. I've seen you post hundred of times here. Just saying that most are just mechanics.

The only one I think is bugged is the Vollenfell one. If the AA thing is happening, it might also be a bug.

Kodrac · March 2017

Lots of stuff is broken. Even combat in plain ol' questing some things don't fire off when they're supposed to.

Cryptical · March 2017

Magdalina wrote: »

Generally Zenimax seems to be of opinion that random untaunted boss attacks are extremely fun. I'm not so sure about that one but it is what it is.

I think random untaunted boss actions encourage the rest of the group to put off nap time for later. Pay attention. Stay aware. Do not fall into a rut. The rotation is not autopilot.

The game should not be able to be reduced to a macro, and having entirely predictable scripted sequence of boss actions would make it possible to run your character with a macro.

So, untaunted boss actions = good.

IronCrystal · March 2017

The axes aren't broken. You probably aren't keeping your taunt debuff active 100% of the time on the enemies, or you are spamming it too much (yes this is a thing).

If the taunt debuff ever ends, they are more than likely to leave you since they are attracted to high damaging targets (ie your DPS). If you spam taunt, they will also break taunt. It's intended game mechanics. It takes time to learn how to time your pierce armor.

Sellistrex is one of the few bosses that are intended to have untauntable screams.

Never had a problem with stonebreaker, not sure what the problem is for you.

Don't know anything about DC1 final boss.

Peekachu99 · March 2017

Magdalina wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

So starting to tank now, DPS is getting tiresome doing that all the time.

Can anyone answer if these mechs are as intended or broken.

For instance.

Stonebreaker, randomly turns around and crushes someone and refuses to turn back half the time?

Sellestrix, Doesn't not care about taunts, randomly does the scream attack at anyone and loses taunt afterwards attacking anyone it pleases, and notably will only light attack you and direct most other attacks at the group.

AA Axes, No more than 4 axes can be taunted now? taunt a 5th and one just wanders off, retaunt it and another runs away?

DC1 Final boss, when spinning around it wanders off and applying taunt causes it to go for another player, taunt again and it will go for someone else and generally not you?

Just a few that stand out as glaringly obvious something isn't right.

Well of those I do know for sure...
Sellestrix does melee attacks to the tank I think but her scream is random yes. It's dumb but it seems intended. Moar springs on top and it should be fine.

Dc1 final boss ignores taunt when spinning around, he just targets random players. Nothing you can do, they should run and you can try to dps or something. Soon as he stops that, he can be taunted again.

The guy-before-gargoyle-boss in Volen is absolutely immune to taunt. Inexperienced people love raging at the tank there but he's just immune to it, let him be and have the person he targets run/shield, it's not that hard.
Final Volen boss, I always forget which one can be taunted, but at least one of them ignores taunt as well, I think red one(same thing with red centurions in vDSA I think).

Some attacks which looks like your average single target heavies are in fact frontal aoes - for example the "forgive me, Ladyyyyyy!" lady in CoS has one, so while she will be targetting you, if someone else is standing next to you, they're gonna get it(and probably die) too. Chudan's heavy in RoM is also like that.

The lizard dude in RoM is exceptionally annoying to tank with his random player charge - gotta stand in his way blocking and (?) retaunt to make him stop, doesn't work sometimes anyway because reasons.

Generally Zenimax seems to be of opinion that random untaunted boss attacks are extremely fun. I'm not so sure about that one but it is what it is.

It's a two part attack, so he'll still do another move (conal aoe, usually) at that same player, which makes it look as though he's unaggro'd. But you can tell from the flames on his head and/or addons that he's still taunted.

If they made everything tauntable, it would turn into WoW.

Lieblingsjunge · March 2017

Did you check if your taunt went through the roof? Literally, btw.
Sometimes in AA, especially if youre standing on the rocks, outside the "main" platform, your attacks won't work. Try and use an Energy Orb and it'll be sent straight upwards. FLYING BAAAAAAALLS.

Same thing with your taunt sometimes, for AA's sake, anyway.

paulsimonps · March 2017

Sellestrix will lose taunt A LOT, its mechanics. Other bosses that are similar are these: Last boss of Direfrost can't be taunted. The 2nd boss of Wayrest 1 can't be taunted. The 2nd boss of Volenfell can't be taunted and only one of the 3 Centurions on the last boss of Volenfell can be taunted. Last boss of Darkshade Cavers 2 obviously can't be taunted Last boss of Darkshade 1 is untauntable for most if not all of his attacks. 3rd boss in Fungal Grotto 2, her spiders gets untauntable after a few seconds but can be CC'ed. 4th boss in Fungal Grotto 2, the spider deadra loses taunt a lot.

I might have forgotten some but those are just of the top of my head.

Also if you do Hardmode AA you might see up to 7 or 8 Axes. Basically you don't retaunt them really you just do a bit of damage to them with some AoE abilities and that keeps them on you, just make sure no one throws you shards or does Abilities close to them. I've Tanked 5 axes without using the AoE strat and actually retaunt so 4 axes is totally doable.

d8rmir · March 2017

Loc2262 wrote: »

If you're on PC, the addon "Untaunted" helps a lot with keeping track of your remaining taunt times per mob.

I may have found my new favourite addon, thanks!

Rickter · March 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

AA Axes, No more than 4 axes can be taunted now? taunt a 5th and one just wanders off, retaunt it and another runs away?

I have maintained 6 axes on me. I run a lot of Trials First Timers (every wednesday)

The issue is the axes swing side to side and it is VERY easy to retaunt an axe even though you think you have taunted another.

Pull them in, then turn them to the side, this will put axes in "a row" making it easier to retaunt them and not overlap.

Magdalina · March 2017

Cryptical wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Generally Zenimax seems to be of opinion that random untaunted boss attacks are extremely fun. I'm not so sure about that one but it is what it is.

I think random untaunted boss actions encourage the rest of the group to put off nap time for later. Pay attention. Stay aware. Do not fall into a rut. The rotation is not autopilot.

The game should not be able to be reduced to a macro, and having entirely predictable scripted sequence of boss actions would make it possible to run your character with a macro.

So, untaunted boss actions = good.

To a point I agree, it's silly if everyone can just stand in one place mashing their perfect rotation like a stationary turret, however I strongly object to mechanics making tank be useless. Like last DC1 boss or the pre-gargoyle one in Volen, what is a tank even supposed to do there? Pull their amazing 4K dps? Try to help heal whoever they target? These fights are not hard in any way long as dps/healer don't have the "100% stationary turret" mindset, they're not worth changing to dps gear(if you got any as a tank), they're simply annoying.
I also find ROM lizard guy charge very annoying but it could partially be because it feels so buggy to me - at least 1/3 of the time he'll happily run through blocking me and after whoever it was he decided to hug this time, making me feel like I failed when in fact I did all I could.

I'm all for environmental mechanics like portals on Warden(for the love of the eight though, their number needs to be fixed....), all the stuff on Veli fight, aoes, Malubeth's grab, Planar fight, Nerien's big skull throw etc, but the "oh I'ma just drop taunt here" ones are simply annoying imho.

Sordidfairytale · March 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

When I complained about the same thing in AA recently, I was told that it was my imagination, and that I was doing it wrong, so now I have to give the same answer to you I don't actually believe it, but I'm obligated to tow the party line. You understand.

The Axe part is definitely not wrong and 100% this happens. 4 axes is stupidly easy to play with and not lose taunt but they certainly are running off at random when you try and get a 5th.

Five axes:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=siXG4MyMofc

DocFrost72 · March 2017

Some bosses have absolutely no taunt able attacks too. That irks me: what is my use as a tank if I can't even keep the boss' standard "light and heavy" attacks taken care of? This includes:

Quintus in Volenfell
Selistrix (sp?) In Arx
Investigator Garren (sp?) In Wayrest sewers I
Drodda the Ice Witch in Direfost

And likely more. I'm getting tired of assuring new tanks that the reason the healer's dead because the boss is slapping them around isn't their fault.