Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

AlexDresden87 wrote: »

I find all of those who placed a vote for "Too High" a little absured. Then again that is my personal belief. I'm speaking from experience of playing other games that charge compared to this game. To me the cost of the manor for example far cheaper than what I expected ($100-$200 worth of crowns). I say this because if your looking at this game as just for pricing stand point compared to lets say Warcraft. This game is asking hardly much. I used to play warcraft and I had purchased a special mount in the game that costed almost $30. And here, you can practically own a decent size house for a single player that can do whatever the hell they want with it for just about the same price....

WoW also has account wide skin changes (not just the costumes but armor as well) , exp gear which last forever to basically hit max level, being able to purchase your sub in game with in game currency (p2w imo).

Sure they differ alot but I believe WoW has many more features atm than ESO does though.

I wonder why. Not because it's been out for 12 years as compared to 3, surely?

Or maybe perhaps they listened to the community more as well, not sure.

Perhaps we're both right. They listened to their community for 12 years rather than for 3 years ?

Well at the given rate, ESO won't survive that long tbh if they don't do something.

I see no evidence of the game falling in popularity, on the contrary it becomes more populated with each update and I can only see that trend continuing with the housing update.

Well take a look at Swtor for example, ever since the CM came out tons of people flocked back to the game, yet 6 months later the game was a ghost town again, and has been for the past 2-3 years.

Really? Perhaps in NA, I wouldn't know. I still play in the EU and don't see it as a ghost town. However, I'll judge the success of this game by how well populated it is rather than by how well populated other games are.

Just saying its going the same route as Swtor is, so not looking to good atm

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that, given that we aren't in agreement on the state of SWTOR let alone the direction ESO is going in and its rising popularity notwithstanding all the doomsayers and gloom-mongers, quite apart from the entitlement brigade who want all the best stuff for next to nothing.

Its still a buy to play with a nearly necessary sub, so its not entitlement. Its one thing if the game was made as a free to play game from jump street. It wasnt. We critics said EXACTLY what was going to happen with this game and we have been correct at nearly every turn. Other than it went F2P a few months earlier than we predicted.

We said it would release as sub, milk money from people who wanted that next big thing game and then after a year or so go F2P. Well they didnt go full free to play but they went buy to play (with a fire sale price) about 9 months after release.

The the crown store comes in and it has gotten more and more ridiculous with no rhyme or reasoning to prices. I have said that when you give currency away as a sub incentive it will affect prices somewhat but there still should be some scale to HOW they price things. 4K for some mounts, 6k for motifs, 400 for cups and saucers and plates? Absolutely zero correlation as to why those prices are what they are and why some things are 1500 or 500.

Storage is the end all be all in most MMOs, and ZoS was very smart putting the crafting bag (the number one reason why people dont have bag space to begin with) behind a sub wall. So its a catch 22 they can sell more 'permanent' storage space and negate the need for people to sub or they can continue to 'rent' the unlimited bag. One obviously has a much larger upside to their bottom line. even if they sold 100 slots for 100 dollars it would still be cheaper (in the long run) for people to buy that and stop subbing, especially if the major reason they were subbing in the first place was that crafting bag, which is more than likely is for most people. Add in the outrageous price of storage upgrades in terms of in game gold and that make storage even more precious. But thats why they sell 10 slots for 1000 crowns I suppose.

Now theyre adding furniture and more crafting 'crap' which is going to diminish space even more, especially if youre not a sub and dont have the craft bag.

Storage or lack thereof I am sure is the biggest complaint people have with this game, and is probably a reason why so many stop playing altogether. You grind (with limited space) to sell crap to buy more space and its a never ending cycle. And even then you still have what 200 max personal bag space? And you have to upgrade it on each and every toon. Thats why the craft bag is so 'valuable' its bottomless and its shared.

In the end you have to look at all this from an OBJECTIVE point of view not as a fan or a critic. What is a 'normal' person going to think of it. Fans will pay just about anything until they wont, then theyre critics and pissed off and then they wont pay at all. The scorched earth approach has never worked for any game. Sure it might keep one that is on life support going for a little while longer but it surely wont make it grow, get old players back, or attract new people.

I know got a little off topic there but it all stems from the same argument.

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

AlexDresden87 wrote: »

I find all of those who placed a vote for "Too High" a little absured. Then again that is my personal belief. I'm speaking from experience of playing other games that charge compared to this game. To me the cost of the manor for example far cheaper than what I expected ($100-$200 worth of crowns). I say this because if your looking at this game as just for pricing stand point compared to lets say Warcraft. This game is asking hardly much. I used to play warcraft and I had purchased a special mount in the game that costed almost $30. And here, you can practically own a decent size house for a single player that can do whatever the hell they want with it for just about the same price....

WoW also has account wide skin changes (not just the costumes but armor as well) , exp gear which last forever to basically hit max level, being able to purchase your sub in game with in game currency (p2w imo).

Sure they differ alot but I believe WoW has many more features atm than ESO does though.

I wonder why. Not because it's been out for 12 years as compared to 3, surely?

Or maybe perhaps they listened to the community more as well, not sure.

Perhaps we're both right. They listened to their community for 12 years rather than for 3 years ?

Well at the given rate, ESO won't survive that long tbh if they don't do something.

I see no evidence of the game falling in popularity, on the contrary it becomes more populated with each update and I can only see that trend continuing with the housing update.

Well take a look at Swtor for example, ever since the CM came out tons of people flocked back to the game, yet 6 months later the game was a ghost town again, and has been for the past 2-3 years.

Really? Perhaps in NA, I wouldn't know. I still play in the EU and don't see it as a ghost town. However, I'll judge the success of this game by how well populated it is rather than by how well populated other games are.

Just saying its going the same route as Swtor is, so not looking to good atm

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that, given that we aren't in agreement on the state of SWTOR let alone the direction ESO is going in and its rising popularity notwithstanding all the doomsayers and gloom-mongers, quite apart from the entitlement brigade who want all the best stuff for next to nothing.

Well I never did say next to nothing, but I mean 40$ (For manor) for something you can produce infinite amount of times seems like a pretty good deal imo.

I've never spent that much on a whole game. Eeeeech. My maths is terrible so help me work this out somone. So a mansion is 10K crowns or almost 4 million in game gold. So in comparison would make the dro'Mathra motif equate to how many million in game gold? Am I looking at this right? If I try to convert the currency then 2.5K crowns equates to approx 1mill gold putting the dro'Mathra motif at over 2 million in game gold value. Perhaps I'm confused but something doesnt add up in my little brain hah.

UrQuan wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

10000 crowns. That is 60 euros. 60 euros pay for half of my monthly heating cost. Or a week of food. Or a month of unlimited mobile phone usage.

The players paying this amount of cash for an ingame gadget without any use (the rightfully claimed use like dummy, craft stations, etc. has to be acquired separately!) have a very serious lack of common sense.

Sadly, Z0$ will once again get away with this. People will pay this and more. It's a sad world we live in.

It's less than I'd spend on a single night out with friends. Let's be realistic here, for time spent playing vs. total cost, ESO is an incredibly cheap hobby, especially as there's nothing in the crown store that you need to buy. It's definitely the cheapest hobby I have by a long shot.

Edit: for the record, I'm not saying that there aren't crown store items that are overpriced. There definitely are. Every crown store motif that can be obtained in-game is overpriced, and that's been the case since they first started selling them for crowns. It's crazy that so many people are out of joint over the price of the Dro'mAthra motif, when it's the same price as every other "exotic" motif once you factor in the mimic stones you get with it. But even with these overpriced items, ESO is still a very cheap hobby.

60 euros for a night out? We go to different kinds of venues then.

Or I drink more than you do during a night out lol

Leandor wrote: »

That aside, it is of course personal preference on how each spends his money. That does not change the fact that this kind of money does have a tangible cost if compared to real life.

So does spending 60 bucks on a night out. With a night out, you have at least the next day hang over to remind you of what you did.

The bold part is exactly the point, and it invalidates what you said earlier about people spending this amount on something they enjoy in a game having "a very serious lack of common sense." That's just you being judgemental about people who find that the enjoyment they get out of something in-game that you consider to be "without any use" (when for most people who want housing the "use" is being able to have a place of their own in-game that they can decorate and set up the way they like it) is worth the price.

Compared to almost any hobby, the amount an average player spends on ESO in any given year is really very low (yes, you could make it high by buying everything in the crown store, but you can do basically the same thing with almost any hobby). Look at how much it costs to play golf, or play hockey, or boating, or skydiving, or go-carting, or paintball, hell even going to the movies regularly. The point is that whether something for entertainment is worth spending the money on has nothing to do with whether someone has "a very serious lack of common sense" as you so insultingly claim, it has to do with how much the person will enjoy it, and whether that specific person considers it to be worth the cost on that basis.

And the part on common sense is still valid for me. There is a difference between "uuhh, a bit costly, that (night out/sports equipment/ingame gadget/etc.)" and "oh really". 10k crowns, 60 euros. A six months sub is 64 euros. The house has the same value as 6 months playing?

No. As offensive as it may sound, the prices given are beyond common sense. Especially since the furnished island retreat is probably twice that amount.

I am not representative but I like that they are expensive. Everyone can get an apartment but not everyone can own a manor. Kind of like real life eh?

I did some basic maths to work out the value gold vs crowns and it seems that the bigger the homestead the better the value.

Apartment 1,000 Crowns 13,000 Gold = 1:13
Small 4,000 Crowns 70,000 Gold = 1:18
Medium 6,500 Crowns 325,000 Gold = 1:50
Large 8,500 Crowns 1,300,000 Gold = 1:153

I will probably buy the four apartments with in game gold and then buy a Medium or Large house with crowns. $30 is a lot for a cosmetic item but as I add things to it, it will get better and better.

Also as a cash to Gold exchange they seem interesting.
Assuming you can get 1,000 Crowns for $5 this gives us the following:

Apartment $5 exchanging at a rate of 2,600 Gold per $1.
Small $20 exchanging at a rate of 3,500 Gold per $1.
Medium $32:50 exchanging at a rate of 10,000 Gold per $1.
Large $42:50 exchanging at a rate of 30,488 Gold per $1.

so basically upto about £40 for a house with zero functionality or storage that costs nearly as much as the base game on launch but gives less content than hearthfire... i think i'll pass for now.

UrQuan wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

10000 crowns. That is 60 euros. 60 euros pay for half of my monthly heating cost. Or a week of food. Or a month of unlimited mobile phone usage.

The players paying this amount of cash for an ingame gadget without any use (the rightfully claimed use like dummy, craft stations, etc. has to be acquired separately!) have a very serious lack of common sense.

Sadly, Z0$ will once again get away with this. People will pay this and more. It's a sad world we live in.

It's less than I'd spend on a single night out with friends. Let's be realistic here, for time spent playing vs. total cost, ESO is an incredibly cheap hobby, especially as there's nothing in the crown store that you need to buy. It's definitely the cheapest hobby I have by a long shot.

Edit: for the record, I'm not saying that there aren't crown store items that are overpriced. There definitely are. Every crown store motif that can be obtained in-game is overpriced, and that's been the case since they first started selling them for crowns. It's crazy that so many people are out of joint over the price of the Dro'mAthra motif, when it's the same price as every other "exotic" motif once you factor in the mimic stones you get with it. But even with these overpriced items, ESO is still a very cheap hobby.

60 euros for a night out? We go to different kinds of venues then.

Or I drink more than you do during a night out lol

Leandor wrote: »

That aside, it is of course personal preference on how each spends his money. That does not change the fact that this kind of money does have a tangible cost if compared to real life.

So does spending 60 bucks on a night out. With a night out, you have at least the next day hang over to remind you of what you did.

The bold part is exactly the point, and it invalidates what you said earlier about people spending this amount on something they enjoy in a game having "a very serious lack of common sense." That's just you being judgemental about people who find that the enjoyment they get out of something in-game that you consider to be "without any use" (when for most people who want housing the "use" is being able to have a place of their own in-game that they can decorate and set up the way they like it) is worth the price.

Compared to almost any hobby, the amount an average player spends on ESO in any given year is really very low (yes, you could make it high by buying everything in the crown store, but you can do basically the same thing with almost any hobby). Look at how much it costs to play golf, or play hockey, or boating, or skydiving, or go-carting, or paintball, hell even going to the movies regularly. The point is that whether something for entertainment is worth spending the money on has nothing to do with whether someone has "a very serious lack of common sense" as you so insultingly claim, it has to do with how much the person will enjoy it, and whether that specific person considers it to be worth the cost on that basis.

And the part on common sense is still valid for me. There is a difference between "uuhh, a bit costly, that (night out/sports equipment/ingame gadget/etc.)" and "oh really". 10k crowns, 60 euros. A six months sub is 64 euros. The house has the same value as 6 months playing?

No. As offensive as it may sound, the prices given are beyond common sense. Especially since the furnished island retreat is probably twice that amount.

It's offensive because you're assuming that just because you don't consider it to have enough entertainment value for the price, that means that anybody who does feel that it has enough entertainment value for the price is wrong. Although, to be honest the only conclusion that can be drawn from that is that you're incapable of conceiving that other people could enjoy different things than you do, and that other people could therefore place different values on things than you do. And that just makes me very very sad for you.

That's your prerogative to do, as it is mine to have an opinion, even though it is not a whitewashed, politically correctly expressed and sensitive opinion.

As I have written before, I very well know there will be people that buy them and justify this as reasonable price since they will have years of fun with it.

I just exercise my right to have and voice an opinion on them, same as you calling me sad for having it.

EDIT: Also, this is dangerously approaching an "arguing on the internet..." situation. Let's just leave it at having a different opinion on the issue and a lack of understanding of the other's opinion.

UrQuan wrote: »

It's offensive because you're assuming that just because you don't consider it to have enough entertainment value for the price, that means that anybody who does feel that it has enough entertainment value for the price is wrong.

Yes, I think you are wrong.
But as you think the opposite I must conclude you think I am wrong.

I have no intention of giving offence by stating my opinion, and I will not take offence because you choose to think differently to me. So why is it you feel that a statement of fact about my opinion is offensive to you?

I once had a very eye opening conversation with a man, whose personal and familial history meant that he had much more cause than most to be offended by others' opinions. He said this: "Very few people actually set out to give offense by their opinions, but far too many are far too eager to take offence. And if you can't accept their right to an opinion different to your own you have no right to demand an opinion different to theirs." Because I knew a little of this man's history that comment had a huge impact on my outlook on life.

All The Best

More useless fluff to suck money out of your wallet, i used to buy fluff items, i like cosmetic stuff, however the more i feel squeezed and leaned on to spend my money the more and more i will resist, yes im one of those buy no crates people and i wont bother with crowns for a house, im not even buying any fashion anymore.

Less dev time on fluff, more on fixing issues and content, then i will start spending again.

Don't forget they said that homes are going to be getting a lot of improvements. They said they were limited to how much they could do at launch. And that they planned on adding much more as far as features in the future. And to be honest I was expecting the crown store exclusives to be 20k crowns. They DO plan on adding storage space eventually so having those large homes will have an advantage. I haven't seen mannequins yet but I'm betting that's going to be coming too.

the price are way to high it is crazy anyone who buys those is stupid a furnished island or cavern homes crown home exclusive shouldn't be more than 5.5k.
anyone who pays that much is stupid. this is capitalism if people stop buying all the over priced crap in crown store and crown crates they will stop over pricing them. I will never buy a mount over 2.5k crowns or a costume over 2k crowns.

basically only thing you buy with real money now in store is eso+ that's worth buying

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

IndyWendieGo wrote: »

BigBragg wrote: »

....just like whoever is coming up with the Crown Store prices.

^This.

And for those saying "You can get them in game with gold!" They've already said that there's going to be Crown Store exclusive homes as well. So no. No matter how many times I try to throw my gold that way, it's not going to matter for those houses.

And why does it matter if they have cs exclusive homes? I've never understood why people feel the need to have everything others have. Buy what you can afford and what you like. Why would I be mad at someone else for buying a Ferrari if I can only afford a Chevy? They got the money for it, more power to em.

Not trying to start an argument I am genuinely curious as to why people think everything need to be equal.

Maybe those CS exclusive houses are the only one(s) they like? If you re read his/her comment nowhere does s/he state s/he has to have something because others have got it. Don't let that get in the way of your car analogy though. If all else fails, you could also bring up how useless the Mona Lisa is. Oh wait ... that's already been stated. Admitably, your car analogy was better than that particular one so I'll give you that.

Ok but again it is available if he/she wants to buy it am I right? If he/she can't afford it, they can save to get it. If they miss out, well that's life. As of yet I haven't seen the exclusive homes, and I'm sure they will be priced high. Personally I'm ok with it, if it's out of my range so be it.

Some have legitimate complaints based on a perceived value. Value is subjective from one individual to the next. For some 10k crowns with no storage is over the top. For me I'm fine with it, I don't want a furnished house, I want to craft my own stuff, decorate my own way. To me this is something I will personally enjoy, so to me there is value. We don't know what will be added in the future so storage may come later.

The poster that I was commenting on doesn't even know what those houses will be. He/she is mad because he/she won't be able to buy the with gold. Well there were 2 motifs that were exclusive, where is the outrage about those? And this brings it back to everything being equal, I have crowns and bought the motifs, he/she had the same opportunity to purchase crowns and buy the motifs. No different then a craft bag for subs, I pay a fee every month and have access to things that others do not. Why is that a bad thing?

Violynne wrote: »

Then there are those in between not subbing and not paying, which is where the majority of us sit. We pay every so often, but only on what we really want.

I suspect that ESO Plus subscribers are on the order of half of the active players, with the majority of those who do not subscribe being new players that may, or may not, stick around. While I have no idea how many subscribers there are, or how many active players there are, or even if the number of subscribers is "enough", I have to think that ESO Plus is doing fairly well.

duckrustlerb16_ESO wrote: »

I see these houses as a springboard to be able to get the player to spend money and to encourage people to do things in game to earn furnishings from achievements etc. With these prices they want their cake, and eat it, and get the consumer to bake it for them as well as buy all the ingredients!

yeah absolutely thats why there are free housing in the game as well as cheap gold housing at several levels also in game cost gold for people to use as a "springboard" to getting crown purchases.

Obviously ZoS figured out putting "springboard" or "starter" things cheap and easy to get in the game world is the key for getting folks to instead fork over massive crown pric

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

It's offensive because you're assuming that just because you don't consider it to have enough entertainment value for the price, that means that anybody who does feel that it has enough entertainment value for the price is wrong.

Yes, I think you are wrong.
But as you think the opposite I must conclude you think I am wrong.

Just a note here - As a default, i assume that folks who disagree with me are not wrong, merely that they are applying different priorities or preferences or have differing circumstance to take into account in their judgements to reach a different conclusion - they assign the variable different values to arrive at different scores than i do and base their position on that.

if i say i am willing to pay the extra 7 bucks to see the imax 3d versions of Doctor Strange and my buddy says no way he will wait and see it for 2 bucks on the second run theater... i dont think "you are just wrong" just that he prioritizes things differently.

there are times to be sure when i see someone is just wrong, that their logic or conclusions or premises are flawed in an objective sense etc - but those "faulty math" are far more rare than the "different scores" is.

IMX around this forum and this kind of game - far far more of the "we dont agree" is of the "different score" and less of the "faulty math"

So for me...this... not gonna be the must conclude i think you are wrong - just different.

Considering the gold cost, 10k crowns is a lot cheaper than I expected. For all the pissing and moaning about it, $80 isn't much.