Player Housing Player Caps

notimetocare · January 2017

Disagree, the current caps are fine!

Bladerunner1 wrote: »

I'm not buying the performance excuse for any number smaller than 24. They can set the number where they want, the caps of 2 for an inn, 4 for a dungeon and 6 for an apartment show that the increment can be fine tuned, and the large homes are pretty close in physical size to the manors. People who want housing for social things will be inclined to pass up large homes for medium if they both stay capped at 12 players.

Each instance of a house takes resources. They could easily support 100 people in a small house, the issue is likely 'how much resource should be spared for X crowns/gold'

snakester320 · January 2017

bigmamajama wrote: »

I think you guys are over-estimating your in-game popularity and the desire for hordes of people to visit you. The numbers seem reasonable to me.

THIS..
spot on player housing will be dead in 2-3 months after releases ..is there any real activitys released for housing .. NO
Ffxiv has air ships that you can send on voyages to gather stuff for mats raritys and so on but I might go to my house well the 9 that I own get the goods send them off and leave my houses past that there's no real reason to hang around there and eso housing will have none of that so you will go there once in a blue moon eventually ...
While one of my main reason to play mmos is for housing systems like this and same in ffxiv ( I love to design homes and interiors) but it's fluff nothing more and will be a waste in 2-3 months after release once you furnish it and sit in there for like 10 minutes you will be off farming doing trials grinding out stuff etc there will be no time really spent doing anything at your lovely home you spend 3mill gold on or threw crowns at!!!
I can imagine that with instanced housing such as this they couldn't make it hold to many ppl it would break the system having say even 50 ppl per instanced housing the server space required would be to much!!

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

notimetocare wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

In my opinion, it should be 12 for medium houses, 18 for large houses and 24 for manors.

In MY opinion ALL those numbers should at least be doubled! LOL

If opinions were food the world would never starve...

Care to detail why exactly the cap needs raised?

Myself and many others have detailed that over and over but sure, why not? Guilds hold up to 500 people. My friends list alone is maxxed and that's 100 people. My RP guild is over 50 active members. I belong to 3 other RP guilds, some a little smaller, some considerably larger. Guild housing has almost no game mechanics functionality. The whole point of it was for the social aspect. Even with the largest cap of 24, that's a fraction of what most guilds have and, for many people, a fraction of the people they interact with. Since roleplayers are constantly trolled and griefed within the game itself we were all really looking forward to being able to hold at least some RP events and regular RP in general in a place where we would finally be free of that constant abuse and disruption. RP events routinely draw well over 24 people.

Many other guilds would like to be able to practice large scale PvP tactics with the practice dummies. Or put Trials groups together and measure group damage with various group composition.

Additionally, the banks in Daggerfall, Belkarth, Wayrest and many other locations in the game are constantly filled with far more than 24 people, many of them spamming spells and abilities, with no loss of performance. So most of us are completely baffled at being told more than 24 players causes "performance issues" and that is why the caps are so low.

24 is too low. Anything even lower than that is unacceptable.

naatokb14_ESO · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

Hmmn.

I wonder if the houses in the fully customizeable player cities in Conan Exiles will have player caps.

Oh, wait. Survival game sandbox vs wanna-be-WOW MMO. Unreal Engine vs modified HeroEngine.

ZoS, the only thing you have that keeps me here and subbed is the Elder Scrolls Lore (Thank Bethesda), and the wonderful people in my RP guild.

To keep me after the end of this month you are going to have to start doing two things:

1. Fix your broken code
2. Start SERIOUSLY listening to your players

That is all.

Krainor1974 · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

naatokb14_ESO wrote: »

Hmmn.

I wonder if the houses in the fully customizeable player cities in Conan Exiles will have player caps.

Oh, wait. Survival game sandbox vs wanna-be-WOW MMO. Unreal Engine vs modified HeroEngine.

ZoS, the only thing you have that keeps me here and subbed is the Elder Scrolls Lore (Thank Bethesda), and the wonderful people in my RP guild.

To keep me after the end of this month you are going to have to start doing two things:

1. Fix your broken code
2. Start SERIOUSLY listening to your players

That is all.

Boy is Zos going to lose subscribers and money when this game hits stores, it's going to be the biggest game out there for sure.

Mic1007 · January 2017

MornaBaine wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

In my opinion, it should be 12 for medium houses, 18 for large houses and 24 for manors.

In MY opinion ALL those numbers should at least be doubled! LOL

How about asking your video card and internet router how it feels about that? ESO is graphics heavy, and the system requirements are pretty lenient, meaning some people are running ESO on potatos.

naatokb14_ESO · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

Krainor1974 wrote: »

Boy is Zos going to lose subscribers and money when this game hits stores, it's going to be the biggest game out there for sure.

Conan Exiles will likely be my last foray into multi-player online RPGs.

I'm done with people, and the organizations they breed that range from disappointing to despicable, who focus more on their bottom line than their products/services.

Lesson #1 in Free Market Capitalism:
1. Focus your attention on your products and making them better, according to what your CUSTOMERS want and you won't have to worry about the bottom line. It will be taken care of automatically.

It isn't like they are incapable of doing this. The whole reason I am here in ESO at all is because ZoS managed to provide something I wanted, that no one else could or would. They just don't seem willing or able to follow through.

And if that doesn't change, why should I continue to throw money at a product, half of the draw of which has nothing to do with their product at all, but the other players I share love with of the fantasy genre the game world is based on?

Every update to this game breaks some code functionality and/or increases latency that takes ZoS months, if not years to fix.
Every update to this game breaks my freaking heart because its content falls short of what is advertised, my reasonable expectations, and way short of what I KNOW this company is capable of based on what they do manage to accomplish.

altemriel · January 2017

Other, and I would like a sweetroll for my poll participation!

any response from ZOS about this issue?

Bladerunner1 · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

notimetocare wrote: »

Bladerunner1 wrote: »

I'm not buying the performance excuse for any number smaller than 24. They can set the number where they want, the caps of 2 for an inn, 4 for a dungeon and 6 for an apartment show that the increment can be fine tuned, and the large homes are pretty close in physical size to the manors. People who want housing for social things will be inclined to pass up large homes for medium if they both stay capped at 12 players.

Each instance of a house takes resources. They could easily support 100 people in a small house, the issue is likely 'how much resource should be spared for X crowns/gold'

Their issue is the X crowns people won't be spending on large houses plus the 300-600 pieces of furniture that would go inside.

After checking around with RP people I know, I really don't know anyone who'll be spending gold or crowns on a large house, it doesn't make sense to them anymore. The servers will have lots of spare resources as less time is spent rendering large houses and the 600 pieces of furniture. We'll be inside the medium houses primarily.

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

altemriel wrote: »

any response from ZOS about this issue?

Nope. Are we surprised? Nope. This pretty much tells me they have no intention of correcting the issue. Perhaps they are counting on the fact that most players don't read the forums and will buy the houses blind, not knowing what the player caps are. Even if they end up issuing refunds in some cases they'll still make an initial killing due to consumer ignorance. I'm hoping I'm wrong about that by the way and that ZOS will have the integrity to list the player cap on the Preview when this goes live so people actually know what they will be getting for their money.

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

Mic1007 wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

In my opinion, it should be 12 for medium houses, 18 for large houses and 24 for manors.

In MY opinion ALL those numbers should at least be doubled! LOL

How about asking your video card and internet router how it feels about that? ESO is graphics heavy, and the system requirements are pretty lenient, meaning some people are running ESO on potatos.

Actually, my rig will handle it just fine most likely. It's rather a beast and I'm about to upgrade it again to handle the highest specs for Conan Exiles. It's just a fact that as games advance so do the requirements to run them well. Companies need to not dumb down games to play on grandma's toaster, it never works out well and the end result is that no one is happy.

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

At this point, I'd almost rather have them work on housing for another year and get it right than release it as is.

Krainor1974 · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

MornaBaine wrote: »

At this point, I'd almost rather have them work on housing for another year and get it right than release it as is.

Most players I think would wait to have housing done right, there's so many of us willing to buy several houses and now prolly one if they lucky.
Well it's zos' doing and lost, I was one of many to buy multiple houses with crowns.

altemriel · January 2017

Other, and I would like a sweetroll for my poll participation!

any response from ZOS about this issue?

idk · January 2017

Disagree, the current caps are fine!

If your attempting to provide feedback on the PTS this is the wrong forum section.

If the capacity of large homes were increased to 24 them manors should be able to accommodate 48 players at one time. Maybe more wind they are a premium.

I see the current as ok since large homes get much more space than medium as it is and not that much more cost wise.

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

snakester320 wrote: »

bigmamajama wrote: »

I think you guys are over-estimating your in-game popularity and the desire for hordes of people to visit you. The numbers seem reasonable to me.

THIS..
spot on player housing will be dead in 2-3 months after releases ..is there any real activitys released for housing .. NO
Ffxiv has air ships that you can send on voyages to gather stuff for mats raritys and so on but I might go to my house well the 9 that I own get the goods send them off and leave my houses past that there's no real reason to hang around there and eso housing will have none of that so you will go there once in a blue moon eventually ...
While one of my main reason to play mmos is for housing systems like this and same in ffxiv ( I love to design homes and interiors) but it's fluff nothing more and will be a waste in 2-3 months after release once you furnish it and sit in there for like 10 minutes you will be off farming doing trials grinding out stuff etc there will be no time really spent doing anything at your lovely home you spend 3mill gold on or threw crowns at!!!
I can imagine that with instanced housing such as this they couldn't make it hold to many ppl it would break the system having say even 50 ppl per instanced housing the server space required would be to much!!

It is indeed likely that "housing will be dead in 2 to 3 months" .....because of the low player caps. We're not so vain that we think people will be knocking on our pixel doors night and day. But RP guilds often have well more than 24 players and when they hold events easily more than 50 people can show up. That's why we wanted housing in the first place.

CombatPrayer · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

Krainor1974 wrote: »

naatokb14_ESO wrote: »

Hmmn.

I wonder if the houses in the fully customizeable player cities in Conan Exiles will have player caps.

Oh, wait. Survival game sandbox vs wanna-be-WOW MMO. Unreal Engine vs modified HeroEngine.

ZoS, the only thing you have that keeps me here and subbed is the Elder Scrolls Lore (Thank Bethesda), and the wonderful people in my RP guild.

To keep me after the end of this month you are going to have to start doing two things:

1. Fix your broken code
2. Start SERIOUSLY listening to your players

That is all.

Boy is Zos going to lose subscribers and money when this game hits stores, it's going to be the biggest game out there for sure.

If the keep with some of the recent things they have been doing and things we know are coming from PTS, they will shoot themselves in the foot so often that they will eventually die from bleeding out.

notimetocare · January 2017

Disagree, the current caps are fine!

MornaBaine wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

In my opinion, it should be 12 for medium houses, 18 for large houses and 24 for manors.

In MY opinion ALL those numbers should at least be doubled! LOL

If opinions were food the world would never starve...

Care to detail why exactly the cap needs raised?

Myself and many others have detailed that over and over but sure, why not? Guilds hold up to 500 people. My friends list alone is maxxed and that's 100 people. My RP guild is over 50 active members. I belong to 3 other RP guilds, some a little smaller, some considerably larger. Guild housing has almost no game mechanics functionality. The whole point of it was for the social aspect. Even with the largest cap of 24, that's a fraction of what most guilds have and, for many people, a fraction of the people they interact with. Since roleplayers are constantly trolled and griefed within the game itself we were all really looking forward to being able to hold at least some RP events and regular RP in general in a place where we would finally be free of that constant abuse and disruption. RP events routinely draw well over 24 people.

Many other guilds would like to be able to practice large scale PvP tactics with the practice dummies. Or put Trials groups together and measure group damage with various group composition.

Additionally, the banks in Daggerfall, Belkarth, Wayrest and many other locations in the game are constantly filled with far more than 24 people, many of them spamming spells and abilities, with no loss of performance. So most of us are completely baffled at being told more than 24 players causes "performance issues" and that is why the caps are so low.

24 is too low. Anything even lower than that is unacceptable.

I responded to someone else. Resource vs cost. 50+ in a bank is part of a large instance. Each housing area needs its own instance, more resource is needed for more instances.

"Many other guilds would like to be able to practice large scale PvP tactics with the practice dummies. Or put Trials groups together and measure group damage with various group composition" You must not play the game then. 12 is trial cap, there are no tactics that require dummies.

As to RP, you need large instances because you cant handle a bit of trolling?

notimetocare · January 2017

Disagree, the current caps are fine!

naatokb14_ESO wrote: »

Hmmn.

I wonder if the houses in the fully customizeable player cities in Conan Exiles will have player caps.

Oh, wait. Survival game sandbox vs wanna-be-WOW MMO. Unreal Engine vs modified HeroEngine.

ZoS, the only thing you have that keeps me here and subbed is the Elder Scrolls Lore (Thank Bethesda), and the wonderful people in my RP guild.

To keep me after the end of this month you are going to have to start doing two things:

1. Fix your broken code
2. Start SERIOUSLY listening to your players

That is all.

Have you ever played a survival MMO like Conan? ARK is a heavy inspiration for the building in Conan. Fully 'customizeable' is hardly the way I would describe block based building.

Which players should they listen to? Guarantee your requests are not the same as people who actually play the game

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

notimetocare wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

In my opinion, it should be 12 for medium houses, 18 for large houses and 24 for manors.

In MY opinion ALL those numbers should at least be doubled! LOL

If opinions were food the world would never starve...

Care to detail why exactly the cap needs raised?

Myself and many others have detailed that over and over but sure, why not? Guilds hold up to 500 people. My friends list alone is maxxed and that's 100 people. My RP guild is over 50 active members. I belong to 3 other RP guilds, some a little smaller, some considerably larger. Guild housing has almost no game mechanics functionality. The whole point of it was for the social aspect. Even with the largest cap of 24, that's a fraction of what most guilds have and, for many people, a fraction of the people they interact with. Since roleplayers are constantly trolled and griefed within the game itself we were all really looking forward to being able to hold at least some RP events and regular RP in general in a place where we would finally be free of that constant abuse and disruption. RP events routinely draw well over 24 people.

Many other guilds would like to be able to practice large scale PvP tactics with the practice dummies. Or put Trials groups together and measure group damage with various group composition.

Additionally, the banks in Daggerfall, Belkarth, Wayrest and many other locations in the game are constantly filled with far more than 24 people, many of them spamming spells and abilities, with no loss of performance. So most of us are completely baffled at being told more than 24 players causes "performance issues" and that is why the caps are so low.

24 is too low. Anything even lower than that is unacceptable.

I responded to someone else. Resource vs cost. 50+ in a bank is part of a large instance. Each housing area needs its own instance, more resource is needed for more instances.

"Many other guilds would like to be able to practice large scale PvP tactics with the practice dummies. Or put Trials groups together and measure group damage with various group composition" You must not play the game then. 12 is trial cap, there are no tactics that require dummies.

As to RP, you need large instances because you cant handle a bit of trolling?

The point is being able to get all your guildies in and practice and observe. The skeletons have limited utility but they are all we have presently. There are still a lot of ways to use them. Even if it makes no sense to have more than 12 attack the skelly, your guildies should be able to be in the instance to observe.

And obviously you have no idea how bad the trolling and griefng gets.

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

notimetocare wrote: »

naatokb14_ESO wrote: »

Hmmn.

I wonder if the houses in the fully customizeable player cities in Conan Exiles will have player caps.

Oh, wait. Survival game sandbox vs wanna-be-WOW MMO. Unreal Engine vs modified HeroEngine.

ZoS, the only thing you have that keeps me here and subbed is the Elder Scrolls Lore (Thank Bethesda), and the wonderful people in my RP guild.

To keep me after the end of this month you are going to have to start doing two things:

1. Fix your broken code
2. Start SERIOUSLY listening to your players

That is all.

Have you ever played a survival MMO like Conan? ARK is a heavy inspiration for the building in Conan. Fully 'customizeable' is hardly the way I would describe block based building.

Which players should they listen to? Guarantee your requests are not the same as people who actually play the game

Everyone who logs in plays the game. They just may have a different playstyle than yours. But I guarantee Zeni likes getting money from all of us. As to which they should listen to? All of us.

snakester320 · January 2017

MornaBaine wrote: »

snakester320 wrote: »

bigmamajama wrote: »

I think you guys are over-estimating your in-game popularity and the desire for hordes of people to visit you. The numbers seem reasonable to me.

THIS..
spot on player housing will be dead in 2-3 months after releases ..is there any real activitys released for housing .. NO
Ffxiv has air ships that you can send on voyages to gather stuff for mats raritys and so on but I might go to my house well the 9 that I own get the goods send them off and leave my houses past that there's no real reason to hang around there and eso housing will have none of that so you will go there once in a blue moon eventually ...
While one of my main reason to play mmos is for housing systems like this and same in ffxiv ( I love to design homes and interiors) but it's fluff nothing more and will be a waste in 2-3 months after release once you furnish it and sit in there for like 10 minutes you will be off farming doing trials grinding out stuff etc there will be no time really spent doing anything at your lovely home you spend 3mill gold on or threw crowns at!!!
I can imagine that with instanced housing such as this they couldn't make it hold to many ppl it would break the system having say even 50 ppl per instanced housing the server space required would be to much!!

It is indeed likely that "housing will be dead in 2 to 3 months" .....because of the low player caps. We're not so vain that we think people will be knocking on our pixel doors night and day. But RP guilds often have well more than 24 players and when they hold events easily more than 50 people can show up. That's why we wanted housing in the first place.

As you should be able to have 500 guild members be in the house but the reality is like I've said it starts to get really laggy when you have so many ppl in one area and there will be problems but it's a catch 22 make the houses instanced with low pop allowances or open up specific districts that can hold thousands of ppl say Gold Coast but with houses only.. that also takes up huge server space then your stuck with houses that will have a limit causing ppl to miss out!!!

notimetocare · January 2017

Disagree, the current caps are fine!

MornaBaine wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

In my opinion, it should be 12 for medium houses, 18 for large houses and 24 for manors.

In MY opinion ALL those numbers should at least be doubled! LOL

If opinions were food the world would never starve...

Care to detail why exactly the cap needs raised?

Myself and many others have detailed that over and over but sure, why not? Guilds hold up to 500 people. My friends list alone is maxxed and that's 100 people. My RP guild is over 50 active members. I belong to 3 other RP guilds, some a little smaller, some considerably larger. Guild housing has almost no game mechanics functionality. The whole point of it was for the social aspect. Even with the largest cap of 24, that's a fraction of what most guilds have and, for many people, a fraction of the people they interact with. Since roleplayers are constantly trolled and griefed within the game itself we were all really looking forward to being able to hold at least some RP events and regular RP in general in a place where we would finally be free of that constant abuse and disruption. RP events routinely draw well over 24 people.

Many other guilds would like to be able to practice large scale PvP tactics with the practice dummies. Or put Trials groups together and measure group damage with various group composition.

Additionally, the banks in Daggerfall, Belkarth, Wayrest and many other locations in the game are constantly filled with far more than 24 people, many of them spamming spells and abilities, with no loss of performance. So most of us are completely baffled at being told more than 24 players causes "performance issues" and that is why the caps are so low.

24 is too low. Anything even lower than that is unacceptable.

I responded to someone else. Resource vs cost. 50+ in a bank is part of a large instance. Each housing area needs its own instance, more resource is needed for more instances.

"Many other guilds would like to be able to practice large scale PvP tactics with the practice dummies. Or put Trials groups together and measure group damage with various group composition" You must not play the game then. 12 is trial cap, there are no tactics that require dummies.

As to RP, you need large instances because you cant handle a bit of trolling?

The point is being able to get all your guildies in and practice and observe. The skeletons have limited utility but they are all we have presently. There are still a lot of ways to use them. Even if it makes no sense to have more than 12 attack the skelly, your guildies should be able to be in the instance to observe.

And obviously you have no idea how bad the trolling and griefng gets.

I do RP from time to time, but I have thick skin (dealt with harassment that actually caused physical injury in my life) and the ability to ignore. Trolling never bothers me.

Trust me, there is no functional use for trial groups or pvp in the housing that isnt better in those environments.

notimetocare · January 2017

Disagree, the current caps are fine!

MornaBaine wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

naatokb14_ESO wrote: »

Hmmn.

I wonder if the houses in the fully customizeable player cities in Conan Exiles will have player caps.

Oh, wait. Survival game sandbox vs wanna-be-WOW MMO. Unreal Engine vs modified HeroEngine.

ZoS, the only thing you have that keeps me here and subbed is the Elder Scrolls Lore (Thank Bethesda), and the wonderful people in my RP guild.

To keep me after the end of this month you are going to have to start doing two things:

1. Fix your broken code
2. Start SERIOUSLY listening to your players

That is all.

Have you ever played a survival MMO like Conan? ARK is a heavy inspiration for the building in Conan. Fully 'customizeable' is hardly the way I would describe block based building.

Which players should they listen to? Guarantee your requests are not the same as people who actually play the game

Everyone who logs in plays the game. They just may have a different playstyle than yours. But I guarantee Zeni likes getting money from all of us. As to which they should listen to? All of us.

With all respect to how Rpers play, logging in to play storytime is not the same as logging in to play the game. Limitations are what you can imagine, not what the game gives you.

Axoinus · January 2017

Probably will be upgradeable via crowns.

Sinolai · January 2017

Other, and I would like a sweetroll for my poll participation!

This has been pointed out in PTS section of formus by many role players and guild leaders.
The cap is low becouse of performance issues.

Cyrediath · January 2017

Disagree, the current caps are fine!

I dont think someone is social enough to fit 24 people at the same time in a house other than famous people or guild leaders.

makeyurself · January 2017

Other, and I would like a sweetroll for my poll participation!

I'll be honest and say I am more wishing our other characters were able to placed inside the homes/grounds walking around doing stuff like NPCs.

GeneralPardon · January 2017

Other, and I would like a sweetroll for my poll participation!

No opinion, now give me my sweetroll.

MornaBaine · January 2017

Agree, large houses should have a 24 player cap!

Please remember that the main point of this thread is not the too low player caps overall or whether or not housing is "functional." The point is that the Large houses are as large as the Notable Homes (Daggerfall Overlook, Ebonhart Chateau and Serenity Falls Estate) yet hold HALF as many players. They are well over twice the cost of the Medium homes and hold the same low amount of players. There's no technical reason they should NOT have a 24 player cap as that is well within Zeni's capabilities.