Hey Templar Healers...What's Up with not using your best skills?

Shimmer · December 2016

Im not understanding every other healers objection to this. We dont just heal health bars, we heal stamina bars which is pretty nice.

Like I said I tank/heal/dps in our dungeons, so I just taunt and spam breath of life for heals and use my puncturing sweep to self heal unless someone in group is standing in stupid, then throw a breath of life and then repent replenish their stamina as well as mine from blocking and dodge rolling out of stupid. You arent supposed to be heavy dps, they are, so help them be the best they can be.

For bosses its also nice to have free stamina available when I run out.

Stopnaggin · December 2016

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Since I have started tanking with my DK I really notice a lot of Templar Healers that really don't understand their best and most basic group skills or don't care. I am absolutely shocked that the majority of Templars don't even bother to run with repentance or throw shards. This is not only low level players either, I have run into plenty high CP Templars that don't run these basic skills.

Maybe I am telling you how to play, but two abilities that help the group so much and you don't run them? Really ? Do you realize how bad other classes would love to have those two skills for healing?

My main is a Templar healer and I have been running shards and repent since I acquired the skills. Templar Healer is all I used to play so I never saw any other healers and what skills they ran or didn't run. I just assumed they all ran these two abilities. Who wouldn't use an instant free heal that also fills your group with STA ? Are you kidding me ?

Come on!

It isnt that surprising. It isnt needed for like 95% of the game. So i guess it isnt surprising that no one get use to using it.

There is zero reason not to use repentance, sorry man. Not one reason to NOT have that ability slotted. Only reason would be that someone else is using it.

Not one reason, then you give one reason. Lol

You know what I mean .... but yeah, lol

I don't heal on my templar but I use repentance if no one else is. Also shards, I love when they spam shards.

Kutsuu · December 2016

exeeter702 wrote: »

Sorry but this is ridiculous. Why on earth would i set up a trail healing loadout for some crap 4 man vet dungeons? If my tank is so terrible that he/she cannot manage their resources then i will simply take over their job with a single swap out for inner fire. It literally becomes counter productive when you are providing utility to players that shouldnt need it when you can do their job while still healing the group, they literally become dead weight.

Likewise, if your dps are solid and on point they absolutley wont need resource utiltiy because nothing in 4 man dungeons last long enough for it to even matter ffs. And most smart, rotation tight dps players have their builds doen to a T anyways. And if the dps is abyamal or simply under par? Why on earth would i dump shards or repentence their way when i can setup a bar that provides far more dps to the group via my own rotations than any amount of resource return, life on hit or any other overkill utility for vet dungeons could ever hope provide them?

meeting your group half way is one thing. Setting up a templar healer with utility suited for healing a trial group and running ver dungeons just feels embarassing and a waste of effort.

Come on you're hugely overreacting here. Shards is a solid spammable AOE DPS skill outside of even caring about the synergy. I like running repentance on mine just for the passive regen - filling resources during/after fights is just a bonus. You're claiming these two skills are "trial healing loadouts" - jeez... they're just good abilities.

Karius_Imalthar · December 2016

When I was playing as a healer I almost always ran repentance not only for the tasty no-cost group heal and stam boost but you get the constant passive regen from it for your skills.

I normally didn't run shards though unless the tank asked for it or obviously needed it. It costs time (casting and targeting the aoe) and magicka to keep shards going out when I often had to keep heals going. Shards are definitely useful and necessary at times but I would often be annoyed with a lot of tanks that have no concept of sustain. They think "tanking" is just taunt and hold block. What about your stam regen? What about your abilities to regain stam? What about weaving in medium or heavy attacks? What about NOT holding block nonstop so you can actually regen some stam? As the healer the first job is to heal and not always spoon feed stamina to the tank.

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iStock_000007261950Small_master_4x3.jpg?width=520

MilwaukeeScott · December 2016

Repentance is my main heal. Shards is a MUST HAVE. It does decent damage and a stun.

I don't like or use Healing Springs. Mutagen to proc Spell Power for the win.

gard · December 2016

Running those skills + orbs is a given in trails.

Followup question:

Why would a dps create a build that can't sustain itself for a non-coordinated group?

me_ming · December 2016

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Nax wrote: »

olivesforge
Try using Repent instead of Radiant on Kena. Or the tree-minder. Or Nereineth. 3 good reasons right there.

I would think most reasonable pepole would understand that "always have Repentance on your bar" also implies "...in situations with multiple enemies, not a single boss." Lol

Qbiken wrote: »

Even worse is when u get a healer in your group that doesn´t use healing springs.....

In my opinion, as a templar healer, healing springs is only needed in a couple of vet dungeon situations, depending on the group you run with. Trials are of course another animal all together. If I'm pugging and I see that the group likes to camp in red poop, then I'll slot it. But when running with my friends, rapid and ritual of retribution are all the healing we need. HoTs mean I can spend the time I would've spent using Healing Springs to do other things to benefit the group, like buffing, debuffing and doing damage.

Agreed on HS, it's a great ability though. If I am in a very good high DPS group I basically only need to use repent through trash. Many boss fights only need extended and repid regen with combat prayer or BoL sprinkled in and of course ele drain . Otherwise I throw shards and DPS as I can.

Advice for New Templar Healers:

Use Healing Springs and use it A LOT. You won't have problems with mana and it's tremendous healing with cleansing ritual up. It will also teach you to focus on the fight rather gimp yourself with BoL. It will teach you good habits so use it.

Be sure to set your targeted AoE to automatic to make it even better.

Healing Springs is inefficient on bosses in vWGT, vICP, vRoM, vCoS and even in most vet dungeons. lol.

Healing Springs is best in trials NOT 4-man dungeons.

THEDKEXPERIENCE · December 2016

Trials are one thing. If you're doing one everyone should be fully aware of who can do what and who needs what.

As for a 4 man dungeon? C'mon. I almost never do dungeons but simply due to the complaints on this forum I wanted to see if I could solo Normal Fungal Grotto. Zero death run in about 20 minutes last night. I'm sure vet would be more challenging but there is still no reason to run a build where you have zero responsibility for your own resources.

Next time I run a normal dungeon and someone complains I'm just going to leave them dead and do it by myself.

Poss · December 2016

It's Tanks who demand a shard and complain they can't pick it up because you can only use them once every 30 seconds that make me laugh

Jeremy · December 2016

MilwaukeeScott wrote: »

Repentance is my main heal. Shards is a MUST HAVE. It does decent damage and a stun.

I don't like or use Healing Springs. Mutagen to proc Spell Power for the win.

If Repentance is your main heal then I'm glad I play healer and don't have to depend on your Templar to keep me alive.... because Repentance is one of the most unreliable heals in this game. It requires a fresh corpse ready and waiting - which is assuredly not always the case, especially on many boss fights where it could be argued healing is most important. Not only that - it consumes all corpses in the area every time you use it - so you had better not get hit hard again right after its used.

These two abilities are the most over-rated abilities in the game. Yes - they can be useful in some situations (so can dozens of other abilities) but for anyone to suggest that they are mandatory or MUST HAVE or even our best are being ridiculous - especially for four man dungeons. There are many other ways to play an effective Templar Healer without spamming these two abilities.

It seems the real issue here is that some players need to improve on their resource management instead of depending so heavily on other players to do it for them. Because I frequently play with great groups who melt through dungeons like a hot knife through butter without needing either of these abilities.

Mic1007 · December 2016

To be honest, I keep forgetting to actually use Repentance on my Healer. It's on my bar, I assure you. The problem is purely between the chair and the keyboard in this case.

Kutsuu · December 2016

Mic1007 wrote: »

To be honest, I keep forgetting to actually use Repentance on my Healer. It's on my bar, I assure you. The problem is purely between the chair and the keyboard in this case.

Lol my friends *** at me all the time when I'm on my DPS magplar and keep forgetting to repent - this is usually during duo/trio vet dungeon runs with no real healer or tank so we tend to actually need the support.

NewBlacksmurf · December 2016

exeeter702 wrote: »

Sorry but this is ridiculous. Why on earth would i set up a trail healing loadout for some crap 4 man vet dungeons? If my tank is so terrible that he/she cannot manage their resources then i will simply take over their job with a single swap out for inner fire. It literally becomes counter productive when you are providing utility to players that shouldnt need it when you can do their job while still healing the group, they literally become dead weight.

Likewise, if your dps are solid and on point they absolutley wont need resource utiltiy because nothing in 4 man dungeons last long enough for it to even matter ffs. And most smart, rotation tight dps players have their builds doen to a T anyways. And if the dps is abyamal or simply under par? Why on earth would i dump shards or repentence their way when i can setup a bar that provides far more dps to the group via my own rotations than any amount of resource return, life on hit or any other overkill utility for vet dungeons could ever hope provide them?

meeting your group half way is one thing. Setting up a templar healer with utility suited for healing a trial group and running ver dungeons just feels embarassing and a waste of effort.

Thank you....

I still say just ask us tho but this is exactly how I think of this

SneaK · December 2016

If they queued up or told you they're a healer, then yea shame on them. But if you're assuming since they are a Templar they are supposed to heal you, shame on you.

Rev Rielle · December 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Honestly....while I have shards but I have a different morph instead of repentance, you have to think about the flak we get

Consider that everyone isn't playing the roles the same and moreso in dungeons, the only role other than dps is a healer who often is required to dps to finish content.

Good or bad, nothing should be assumed as no one can inspect another. Ask if you want it but there's also a reality that if you're build is 90% or more dependent upon shards or repentance....there's a real problem as all healers aren't Templars.

I'd say you shouldn't consider it required or a pre-requisite

(You'll also hear the exact opposite as people will all have their opinions)

I can tell you tho, it's not suppose to be expected.
If you get it and want it....it's a bonus to your intended gameplay choices.

I agree with @NewBlacksmurf. It's one thing to expect these things when in an organised regular group you run with, but when joining randoms it simply just can't be expected. It's random, therefore expecting and relying on anything to be constant is just setting yourself up for problems.

I try to use Repentance, Blazing Spear, as well as Elemental Drain and Siphon Spirit, when healing in a group. But if the group i'm with is just having trouble staying alive, basically those skills becoming limited in their usage, and it's dominated by Healing Springs and Combat Prayer.

I think other than the basics: Tank to tank, dps to deal damage, and healer to healer, none of us should expect anything more or extra from a random group. However, when/if those extras come enjoy it!

exeeter702 · December 2016

Kutsuu wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Sorry but this is ridiculous. Why on earth would i set up a trail healing loadout for some crap 4 man vet dungeons? If my tank is so terrible that he/she cannot manage their resources then i will simply take over their job with a single swap out for inner fire. It literally becomes counter productive when you are providing utility to players that shouldnt need it when you can do their job while still healing the group, they literally become dead weight.

Likewise, if your dps are solid and on point they absolutley wont need resource utiltiy because nothing in 4 man dungeons last long enough for it to even matter ffs. And most smart, rotation tight dps players have their builds doen to a T anyways. And if the dps is abyamal or simply under par? Why on earth would i dump shards or repentence their way when i can setup a bar that provides far more dps to the group via my own rotations than any amount of resource return, life on hit or any other overkill utility for vet dungeons could ever hope provide them?

meeting your group half way is one thing. Setting up a templar healer with utility suited for healing a trial group and running ver dungeons just feels embarassing and a waste of effort.

Come on you're hugely overreacting here. Shards is a solid spammable AOE DPS skill outside of even caring about the synergy. I like running repentance on mine just for the passive regen - filling resources during/after fights is just a bonus. You're claiming these two skills are "trial healing loadouts" - jeez... they're just good abilities.

No im not, im simply saying that it is ridiculous to chastise a templar healer for not slotting them in content that does not require it, like they are being lazy or inefficient healers.

There are plenty of posts here stating how great it is to run ele drain and siphon spirit and what not. Shards and repentance are hardly trial exclusive skills, but they are hardly mandatory in 4 man dungeons.

THEDKEXPERIENCE · December 2016

#breathoflifespam

Yolokin_Swagonborn · December 2016

Attention Tanks and Healers:

As a DPS, I want to run the glassiest of glass cannons with 15k health, max damage and zero sustain. So I am going to need YOU, (in addition to healing and/or tanking to keep the boss from one-shotting my 15k booty), to run as many utility spells and gears as possible so that I can do max DPS and constantly spam group chat with my DPS numbers after every fight.

Thank you,

-Every LEET 15k+ DPS ever.

P.S.Here are all the skills you should run.

Healers aka Utility buff maids:

Must run combat prayer to boost my DPS (even though its annoying and positioning sucks)
Must spam BOTH shards (since my stam DPS has no sustain) and mystic orb (since my buddy's magicka build also has no sustain) but make sure you have enough magicka left after that to spam Breath of Life for 10 casts in case I decide to /sitchair in a red circle or fight the banished cells boss without purging the runes off me, or fight the CoA1 boss while ignoring the 45k burning embers dot.
Must run repentance even if you are not a templar. Just slot it anyway.
Must wear spell power cure and combat physician again to boost DPS and give me a damage shield so I dont get oneshot cuz im running green max stam food but still have enough sustain to do that aforementioned BOL spam.

Tanks: Aka Utility meat shields

Must run Tava's and Ebon to bring my 15k health to 16K so I don't get oneshot by the Tempest Island boss that agro-dumps and 1bangs me for 22k. By the way, why did you lose aggro on her? Please taunt her more.
Must keep warhorn up at all times.
Must run around like a chicken with its head cut off and individually taunt every mob in the trash pack because even one hit from an archer and my max DPS is gone for the rest of the fight.

All hail the new ESO holy trinity:

LEET DPS 1
LEET DPS 2
Utility Maid 1 that heals occasionally
Utility Maid 2 that tanks occasionally.

N0TPLAYER2 · December 2016

I main a healer, and use repent. I repent before they hit the floor lol. Constantly, not just at the end of battle.

I don't however run shards. A good tank should be fine without my shards, repent is good enough.

It's my own fault for not switching out repent for shards, and I've been trying to force myself to remember to skill swap before trial bosses.

Nothing worse than a tank with bad recovery that blames the healer tho, we can not force feed you a ton of shards throughout the fight, some of that is your responsibility too.

DRXHarbinger · December 2016

Repentance is useless in boss fights. Nothing to repent means it's wasting a slot. Shards...Tbh l2tank. Proper tanks don't need shards spammed over at them. Think of it as learning curve. If you get me a healer, I won't let you die but I'm not one for carrying and wearing my fingers out, chucking shards left right and centre. You chose the hardest role now live with it. Use a proper set up that focuses on high max stam and high magika recovery and just spam igneous for stam back. Simple really, use an ulti and bomb. Back to full stats. Outside of trials and Mazzatun there are not fights to worry about where you should be running out of stam as a tank.

Heck S&B ulti + dragon guard + tavas= constant uptime and you won't even need to block and taunts are free.

Artemiisia · December 2016

vanillexhope wrote: »

Constructive feedback is useful. I'm leveling a Templar right now. My ultimate goal is to heal, but I'm not ready for that yet. So threads like this are helpful. Thank you.

Skills to obtain to become an epic lowing healer:

Magicka orbs
Aggresive Warhorn
Repentance
Shards
Healing springs (your main heal)
Power of the light

Destrostaff for 2nd weapon to get these skills:
Siphon spirit
Elemental drain

Brutusmax1mus · December 2016

I don't remember when the last time i ran a dungeon with a healer was. 3dps 1 tank ftw for ever

Delta1038 · December 2016

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Attention Tanks and Healers:

As a DPS, I want to run the glassiest of glass cannons with 15k health, max damage and zero sustain. So I am going to need YOU, (in addition to healing and/or tanking to keep the boss from one-shotting my 15k booty), to run as many utility spells and gears as possible so that I can do max DPS and constantly spam group chat with my DPS numbers after every fight.

Thank you,

-Every LEET 15k+ DPS ever.

P.S.Here are all the skills you should run.

Healers aka Utility buff maids:
Must run combat prayer to boost my DPS (even though its annoying and positioning sucks)

Must spam BOTH shards (since my stam DPS has no sustain) and mystic orb (since my buddy's magicka build also has no sustain) but make sure you have enough magicka left after that to spam Breath of Life for 10 casts in case I decide to /sitchair in a red circle or fight the banished cells boss without purging the runes off me, or fight the CoA1 boss while ignoring the 45k burning embers dot.

Must run repentance even if you are not a templar. Just slot it anyway.

Must wear spell power cure and combat physician again to boost DPS and give me a damage shield so I dont get oneshot cuz im running green max stam food but still have enough sustain to do that aforementioned BOL spam.

Tanks: Aka Utility meat shields
Must run Tava's and Ebon to bring my 15k health to 16K so I don't get oneshot by the Tempest Island boss that agro-dumps and 1bangs me for 22k. By the way, why did you lose aggro on her? Please taunt her more.

Must keep warhorn up at all times.

Must run around like a chicken with its head cut off and individually taunt every mob in the trash pack because even one hit from an archer and my max DPS is gone for the rest of the fight.

All hail the new ESO holy trinity:
LEET DPS 1

LEET DPS 2

Utility Maid 1 that heals occasionally

Utility Maid 2 that tanks occasionally.

Wow, I almost feel kinda bad because I literally do not use any of the suggestions you made for a healer. I don't use combat prayer, shards are occasional (still debating back and forth on that), never use repentance, and the gear I have is usually crafted until I find a set that I like. To be fair though I build myself off of things I have found to be effective and on trial and error methods in dungeons and whatnot.

IronCrystal · December 2016

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Attention Tanks and Healers:

As a DPS, I want to run the glassiest of glass cannons with 15k health, max damage and zero sustain. So I am going to need YOU, (in addition to healing and/or tanking to keep the boss from one-shotting my 15k booty), to run as many utility spells and gears as possible so that I can do max DPS and constantly spam group chat with my DPS numbers after every fight.

Thank you,

-Every LEET 15k+ DPS ever.

P.S.Here are all the skills you should run.

Healers aka Utility buff maids:
Must run combat prayer to boost my DPS (even though its annoying and positioning sucks)

Must spam BOTH shards (since my stam DPS has no sustain) and mystic orb (since my buddy's magicka build also has no sustain) but make sure you have enough magicka left after that to spam Breath of Life for 10 casts in case I decide to /sitchair in a red circle or fight the banished cells boss without purging the runes off me, or fight the CoA1 boss while ignoring the 45k burning embers dot.

Must run repentance even if you are not a templar. Just slot it anyway.

Must wear spell power cure and combat physician again to boost DPS and give me a damage shield so I dont get oneshot cuz im running green max stam food but still have enough sustain to do that aforementioned BOL spam.

Tanks: Aka Utility meat shields
Must run Tava's and Ebon to bring my 15k health to 16K so I don't get oneshot by the Tempest Island boss that agro-dumps and 1bangs me for 22k. By the way, why did you lose aggro on her? Please taunt her more.

Must keep warhorn up at all times.

Must run around like a chicken with its head cut off and individually taunt every mob in the trash pack because even one hit from an archer and my max DPS is gone for the rest of the fight.

All hail the new ESO holy trinity:
LEET DPS 1

LEET DPS 2

Utility Maid 1 that heals occasionally

Utility Maid 2 that tanks occasionally.

While I can definitely see the problems with people "needing" others to run these sets, some of these are standard trials setups so it doesn't hurt to get these sets

.

If a dps is only hitting 15k and not having any regen whatsoever, they have serious build/rotation problems.

If you are referring to the people I mentioned before, I'm talking about people who consistently pull 30-35k+ and its much more beneficial to the whole group to buff them rather than attempting to dps myself.

Also, on "most" dungeons, 16k health is more than enough as experienced people learn how to avoid damage or self heal (all classes have good self heal). I will say there are some dungeons with untauntable attacks that will deal more than that (as you mentioned Tempest Island).

As far as tanks needing stamina, the only time they would run out of stamina is if they are holding down block the whole time. Other than bosses in vet trials such as the warrior and Ra kotu who do continuous damage (and even then there are breaks), they should be light and heavy attacking for both stamina and ultimate regeneration.

In addition, DK tanks will generate all stats whenever they use an ultimate, greatly helping with stamina. Tanks of all people especially DK tanks should have zero stamina problems in a 4 man dungeon.

The one thing that comes to mind where stamina would help a tank is if you don't have enough dps for CoA II and your team is "cheesing" on the ledge where the tank has to stand on a lava covered island.

Silver_Strider · December 2016

Honestly, the main reason I hate running Templar healer is that you are pretty much delegated to being a resource battery. All I hear from PUGs is "Shards, shards, shards." and it gets so annoying that I just prefer to heal on my NB to completely eliminate that possibility out of the equation.

Now, if you're a decent DPS, I don't mind helping out with an occasional shard/orbs/etc. However, if your DPS is so bad that I'd be better off just doing it myself, do not expect ANY support from me as I've most likely removed those skills for more DPS skills.

AzuraKin · December 2016

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Since I have started tanking with my DK I really notice a lot of Templar Healers that really don't understand their best and most basic group skills or don't care. I am absolutely shocked that the majority of Templars don't even bother to run with repentance or throw shards. This is not only low level players either, I have run into plenty high CP Templars that don't run these basic skills.

Maybe I am telling you how to play, but two abilities that help the group so much and you don't run them? Really ? Do you realize how bad other classes would love to have those two skills for healing?

My main is a Templar healer and I have been running shards and repent since I acquired the skills. Templar Healer is all I used to play so I never saw any other healers and what skills they ran or didn't run. I just assumed they all ran these two abilities. Who wouldn't use an instant free heal that also fills your group with STA ? Are you kidding me ?

Come on!

a good tank only needs shards in very specific instances (like the mage boss in aa). if you in a 4 man dungeon and need shards, you suck at tanking.

humpalicous · December 2016

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Since I have started tanking with my DK I really notice a lot of Templar Healers that really don't understand their best and most basic group skills or don't care. I am absolutely shocked that the majority of Templars don't even bother to run with repentance or throw shards. This is not only low level players either, I have run into plenty high CP Templars that don't run these basic skills.

Maybe I am telling you how to play, but two abilities that help the group so much and you don't run them? Really ? Do you realize how bad other classes would love to have those two skills for healing?

My main is a Templar healer and I have been running shards and repent since I acquired the skills. Templar Healer is all I used to play so I never saw any other healers and what skills they ran or didn't run. I just assumed they all ran these two abilities. Who wouldn't use an instant free heal that also fills your group with STA ? Are you kidding me ?

Come on!

Tell me about it, I don't even need them to heal my Stam Sorc, just need Templar healers to throw in a shard or two so that it helps my sustain a bit.

Is that asking too much or something?

Buffler · December 2016

People still use healers in 4 man content??

Cryptical · December 2016

gard wrote: »

Why would a dps create a build that can't sustain itself for a non-coordinated group?

And there is the prime question. Why do they set themselves up in a manner they cannot stand on their own feet?

Buffler wrote: »

People still use healers in 4 man content??

Some need it. Just ran the daily on normal for a quick key, 2 lowbees and a fool tank that ran away from me into the full crowd of mechs in ds2 and died, then when we rezzed he waited till he turned solid and brought the whole crowd to us. I'm expected to heal and shard that nut? He left and the 3 of us did it like sane people, no issues.

nexxus_ESO · December 2016

Heals
Buffs
Resources
DPS

You may Pick 3, max. Healers don't get 20 slots on their bars.

Healers aren't mind readers, so if you can't be arsed to communicate your needs, you get what they choose to give you. Likewise, if you need shards/bubbles in a fight, it helps if you say so; healers can only see your health bar.

Healers don't typically have much Stamina, so if you constantly streak/run/sprint ahead, you're likely missing out on any pre-flight buffs you might have otherwise gotten.

The heals land in front of the healer, not behind.

The tank (where applicable) is priority #1.

That puddle of red poo is not going to automagically stop hurting you just because the healer casts BoL. Your rotation does not prevent you from moving your damn feet! The healer cannot dodge roll, or block for you. (There are exceptions to this, there always are, which is why it's important to have a way to communicate with your group!)

If you're especially squishy, let the healer know ahead of time. (I don't personally mind this if I have warning. I'm happy to keep an extra close eye on you but I am not infallible, and I am not a miracle worker.)

If you're stage 4 vamp, the healer reserves the right to let you stay dead. (Seriously, don't do this s**t.)