I'm Surprised More People Don't Play This Game

Derra · December 2016

LeifErickson wrote: »

Yes I know this game has its problems, but I feel like this game offers something very unique, competitive, and fun. I have never played a game with such a fantastic combat system that (balance aside) is highly skill based and competitive. What is it that makes this game so unpopular?

Probably that grinding to even become competetive is just if not more excessive than in some asia grinders?

Who in their right mind would require you to run a Dungeon 350 times on average to get a weapon drop with the correct trait?

Also Lag and Balance. Mainly balancing only every major patch and than not finetuning things but instead implementing a dozen new ones while also altering every other mechanic already in the game.

Edit: Don´t understand me wrong. Out of all MMOs i enjoy this one the most (i would not be playing it otherwise). But this game never lived up to it´s potential in pvp mainly due to development choices.
And on top of that while trying to be casual friendly requires massive (and i mean absolutely excessive) amounts of time or luck when trying to be endgame competetive.

zuto40 · December 2016

My friend I just recently convinced to get the game with the promise I'd hold his hand through it all and help him build his character didn't want to get it because of the bad publicity

God_flakes · December 2016

JDar wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Yes I know this game has its problems, but I feel like this game offers something very unique, competitive, and fun. I have never played a game with such a fantastic combat system that (balance aside) is highly skill based and competitive. What is it that makes this game so unpopular?

This is not the board where you post about how much fun you are having. This is where you point fingers, blame others (ZoS and players alike) and complain pathologically about the game that has made you miserable for all the hundreds of hours that you play it. This board is just one big competition to see how hardcore you can make yourself look by trashing something you enjoy. Try posting this in General Discussion.

The game is fun. I don't know why I keep coming back to this board when so many people have such miserable attitudes.

Ishammael · December 2016

Manoekin wrote: »

Ishammael wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

Ishammael wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Yes I know this game has its problems, but I feel like this game offers something very unique, competitive, and fun. I have never played a game with such a fantastic combat system that (balance aside) is highly skill based and competitive. What is it that makes this game so unpopular?

You are absolutely right.

The problem is/was the first nine months.

The game was heavily advertised around its PvP. It succeeded brilliantly... And failed utterly. It failed for several reasons: absolutely atrocious botting which forced a net code fix which never again delivered the scale and performance from launch. The class balance was horrendous. Skills were broken. And itemization was abysmal.

Despite all of that, players showed up in droves. Cyrodiil was incredible. It still is. All early reviews said it was amazing. Even "angry" Joe.

Except that players realized the veteran rank grind which was so time consuming at the beginning. Then there was craglorn which was a complete joke. And then... Nothing for six months. By the end of 1.5 most of the excitement was gone. Nothing promising was on the horizon. An emergency guild summit was held. Nothing became of it. Does anyone remember that huge Delethereous post basically saying it was all over?

Then the champion point system was introduced. How is an endless grind supposed to attract new players? It wasn't. Then IC came out more than a year.... Supposed to save PvP. Except that it was a PvE zone, not even connected to cyrodiil.

ZoS failed to realize that the excitement of the game is in cyrodiil which they haven't updated in two years.

Guild Summit was all role play and pve guilds. There was only one hardcore pvp guild from NA there, and some of the other "pvp" guilds there weren't active anymore in cyro. The whole thing was more of a show and tell than gathering feedback. Also of note that IC was completed and shown to those players, and this was way before it came out.

You are correct of course. I was being a little loose with the narrative, but the larger point holds.

Wasn't trying to suggest you weren't correct. Just adding context to that fiasco.

Fiasco is a perfect word.

Also, I remember Hova being pissed that he wasn't invited. Whether he should have been or not... Dunno. But it sticks out in my mind.

Also, Atropos and Entropy Rising were one of the highest profile guilds near launch. Lots of beta testing and support. They were also one of the first to quit.

Ghost-Shot · December 2016

Honestly I think its because the game play is just so dull, most MMO players I know are looking for a game where skillful play is heavily rewarded and that just doesn't exist here. When you combine dull game play with stagnant PvP and mediocre at best PvE you aren't going to have a huge following.

Elsonso · December 2016

olsborg wrote: »

Basicly, the devs fail to balance the game, not just a little, but bigtime.

I actually wonder how many players care. I certainly do not.

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Thats what the majority of the 18 million people who bought Skyrim wanted

Actually, I doubt that much more than a fraction of the people who bought Skyrim really wanted a co-op TES game, as you describe. Many may have thought that this is what ESO was intended to be, though.

I would not be surprised to find out that most of the "co-op" games in the neighborhood of something like Skyrim are actually played solo more often than they are played with others.

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Ranking ESO soley as an TES title, its the worst in the series and I have played/own them all from Arena to present.

Oblivion is the absolute worst game of the series. The reason that Shivering Isles is such a great addition is that the main game is so weak. Oblivion is a very... sterile and procedural game. It is like they had some sort of formula they repeated every time they needed to create an area in the game.

Morrowind's strength lies in the game world and how the game is presented. None of the subsequent TES games do it as well as Morrowind. In that game, BGS took the time to create a world that could be believed, and it worked. We played in the game world, and the game world was designed for that. Starting with Oblivion, they began to separate from that and have never really looked back. In ESO, players have more to do outside of the game world than in any other TES title. This is mainly because they introduce the new MMO systems as new system in an MMO game, rather than as a new system in a TES game. Guild traders represent one of the few exceptions where they got the TES portion right.

Skyrim and ESO ripped out the TES character system and replaced it with gimmicks. I can understand this with ESO, being that it is an MMO. With Skyrim, it is like they just wanted to do gimmicks. While Skyrim is not the worst game in the series, it is near the bottom in terms of being a TES game. The same can be said for ESO and the magic-based MMO skill system they tried to create, and are still suffering from as they vainly attempt to make a broken game design work. Update 13 will not fix this problem.

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

all my friends in college were hyped until they found out it was an MMO..... they then had no interest.....

As a counter-point, my friends are almost exclusively MMO players. They are not interested in ESO because it is not an MMO.

BurritoESO · December 2016

I'm not surprised at all at how many people play the game... Terrible balance means that most actually good players left because there's no reason to be good at this game when an intermediate player can be on the same level as an expert player just because of broken gear and broken skills... Some people spent countless amount of hours in vMA trying to get one item and they never did, and that's probably really frustrating... I dont PvE but i doubt PvE'ers have enough content to actually keep them happy because you run the same thing 5 times then what?... Lag is probably the biggest issue that drives people away because sometimes you literally can't play or have to avoid certain places you want to go just to get away from lag... There are almost no guilds or competitive PvP left... And lack of developer transparency and competence leaves people with no hope because the game has gotten consistently worse and skilless, why would people stick around? The only reason I still play is to have fun with friends (and half the time I can't because of lag), and I'm guessing that's the case for most people who stick around

Weast

Manoekin · December 2016

Ghost-Shot wrote: »

Honestly I think its because the game play is just so dull, most MMO players I know are looking for a game where skillful play is heavily rewarded and that just doesn't exist here. When you combine dull game play with stagnant PvP and mediocre at best PvE you aren't going to have a huge following.

You really can't have skillful gameplay with no cooldowns or no combo system. You're rewarded for using your most powerful ability over and over again, only stopping to keep up buffs/debuffs and maybe execute or gap close spam when someone tries to move away from you.

BurritoESO · December 2016

For most people there's no reason to play the game long term, "skillful" PvP and dueling is just about what can line up their one shot before the other person does, if there aren't one shots then nobody dies. and for PvE how many times cam you do those same bosses before it gets stale?

Proc sets, broken gear, poisons, and CP are fun too

Wumbo

Kutsuu · December 2016

The things that made me quit during my previous hiatus from this game were as follows:

1. First one was during the early months - they let the bat swarm and bash stuff go on way too long. I even made builds for people to copy to make it more prevalent in hopes it would get changed more quickly.
2. I came back again for Orsinium, and left within 3 months for 2 reasons. One was the overwhelming lag in Cyrodiil - You could tell that the game would be fun without it, but it was crippled. The other was the insane difficulty of attaining V16 materials at the time.

The things keeping me back for 1T is that there are no overwhelming imbalances, Lag in Cyrodiil is a lot better (not cured), and it's a lot easier to attain gear now. I don't see myself leaving soon unless something really exciting comes out.

bellanca6561n · December 2016

My goodness....the posts certainly became detailed and interesting overnight.

The issue may well be the genre itself.

The MMO as an online game genre is frozen in time. Leveling was not common in early client/server large scale online games but became the standard because World of Warcraft became the standard. If your game didn't share certain key features of WoW you couldn't get funded.

For the first five years after its release it seemed like every studio was working on its "WoW killer." There were NUMEROUS online game systems with no leveling at all but none of them were getting the star treatment needed to make them high profile.

I used to post about my favorite examples of what I regarded as great online games that didn't use leveling or grindy progression systems but people don't want to read about games they never played and can't play.

But the person who noted that his college age friends turn off immediately when they hear the acronym, MMO, is the most telling comment.

I have a nephew in his sophomore year in one of the top 5 game development college programs in the States and that genre is a huge turn-off for him and his friends. What we do agree on is that the best game of the past year was CD Projekt Red's Witcher III, arguably the finest single player medieval fantasy RPG to-date.

Thus medieval fantasy is not the problem. The mechanics of the MMO are. Focusing on ESO specifically may well be missing the larger point here. The genre itself is....tired.

Bashev · December 2016

Kutsuu wrote: »

The things that made me quit during my previous hiatus from this game were as follows:

1. First one was during the early months - they let the bat swarm and bash stuff go on way too long. I even made builds for people to copy to make it more prevalent in hopes it would get changed more quickly.
2. I came back again for Orsinium, and left within 3 months for 2 reasons. One was the overwhelming lag in Cyrodiil - You could tell that the game would be fun without it, but it was crippled. The other was the insane difficulty of attaining V16 materials at the time.

The things keeping me back for 1T is that there are no overwhelming imbalances, Lag in Cyrodiil is a lot better (not cured), and it's a lot easier to attain gear now. I don't see myself leaving soon unless something really exciting comes out.

The bash was fixed within a month after release and the the bat swarm ulti reduction one month later. If ZoS was balancing so fast right now i would be happy. But still the main issue is the performance. It doesnt matter that the game is not balanced if you at least can enjoy it. But average 500ms ping in prime time is not fun for anyone.

Ghost-Shot · December 2016

Manoekin wrote: »

Ghost-Shot wrote: »

Honestly I think its because the game play is just so dull, most MMO players I know are looking for a game where skillful play is heavily rewarded and that just doesn't exist here. When you combine dull game play with stagnant PvP and mediocre at best PvE you aren't going to have a huge following.

You really can't have skillful gameplay with no cooldowns or no combo system. You're rewarded for using your most powerful ability over and over again, only stopping to keep up buffs/debuffs and maybe execute or gap close spam when someone tries to move away from you.

Exactly, proper management of cool downs adds a huge element of skill to a game imo.

Glaiceana · December 2016

I would love it if more people played ESO.

Can't really see a downside to more players, even as many as say the peak numbers that WoW must have had, not including lag of course if that would happen. Would there be anything negative to having that amount of people? (Honest question, and not including the aforementioned lag xD)

Sallington · December 2016

lordrichter wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

Basicly, the devs fail to balance the game, not just a little, but bigtime.

I actually wonder how many players care. I certainly do not.

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Thats what the majority of the 18 million people who bought Skyrim wanted

Actually, I doubt that much more than a fraction of the people who bought Skyrim really wanted a co-op TES game, as you describe. Many may have thought that this is what ESO was intended to be, though.

I would not be surprised to find out that most of the "co-op" games in the neighborhood of something like Skyrim are actually played solo more often than they are played with others.

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Ranking ESO soley as an TES title, its the worst in the series and I have played/own them all from Arena to present.

Oblivion is the absolute worst game of the series. The reason that Shivering Isles is such a great addition is that the main game is so weak. Oblivion is a very... sterile and procedural game. It is like they had some sort of formula they repeated every time they needed to create an area in the game.

Morrowind's strength lies in the game world and how the game is presented. None of the subsequent TES games do it as well as Morrowind. In that game, BGS took the time to create a world that could be believed, and it worked. We played in the game world, and the game world was designed for that. Starting with Oblivion, they began to separate from that and have never really looked back. In ESO, players have more to do outside of the game world than in any other TES title. This is mainly because they introduce the new MMO systems as new system in an MMO game, rather than as a new system in a TES game. Guild traders represent one of the few exceptions where they got the TES portion right.

Skyrim and ESO ripped out the TES character system and replaced it with gimmicks. I can understand this with ESO, being that it is an MMO. With Skyrim, it is like they just wanted to do gimmicks. While Skyrim is not the worst game in the series, it is near the bottom in terms of being a TES game. The same can be said for ESO and the magic-based MMO skill system they tried to create, and are still suffering from as they vainly attempt to make a broken game design work. Update 13 will not fix this problem.

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

all my friends in college were hyped until they found out it was an MMO..... they then had no interest.....

As a counter-point, my friends are almost exclusively MMO players. They are not interested in ESO because it is not an MMO.

/sigh

*reinstalls Morrowind*

RinaldoGandolphi · December 2016

At the end of the day i only log to pvp now and then, but even those are becoming less frequent...the game is broken all around

You have people one shotting folks from stealth, proc set or not, guys like zergbad were insta killing people long before proc sets..that stuff is just broken.....

Then you have Viper...how does something like that even exist...its like having a skill packed into your armor set a 100% chance on a 4 second cooldown...Viper is broken

Then you got Tremorscale....damage and a 70% Snare for 8 seconds, on a 4 second cooldown...are kidding me?

How does this stuff even get past the discussion stage? How does it even get put into the game. Does anyone care at all?

Lets just put an armor set in(Viper) that hits for 7-9k unavoidable damage every 4 seconds on the reg...because that's totally OK and not completely broken at all......

Or the Destro Ultimate lol....lets just promote more stacked zerg AOE fest game play....because the server doesn't lag enough as it is....

We went from softcaps, resource management and skilled gameplay in 1.x to Champion Points, unlimited resources, insta-kills, battle spirit, and proc sets...i mean what else is really left?

I loved the 1.x iterations of this game...I would gladly pay 70 bucks + 20 bucks a month in sub fees for a subscription only 1.5 server with tweaks to DK's and reg bug fixes with all of One Tam ported to 1.5 with no proc sets.....take my money....and i know im not alone on this one either...

FireCowCommando · December 2016

I am actually surprised at the number of players still active in cyrodiil

SneaK · December 2016

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

At the end of the day i only log to pvp now and then, but even those are becoming less frequent...the game is broken all around

You have people one shotting folks from stealth, proc set or not, guys like zergbad were insta killing people long before proc sets..that stuff is just broken.....

Then you have Viper...how does something like that even exist...its like having a skill packed into your armor set a 100% chance on a 4 second cooldown...Viper is broken

Then you got Tremorscale....damage and a 70% Snare for 8 seconds, on a 4 second cooldown...are kidding me?

How does this stuff even get past the discussion stage? How does it even get put into the game. Does anyone care at all?

Lets just put an armor set in(Viper) that hits for 7-9k unavoidable damage every 4 seconds on the reg...because that's totally OK and not completely broken at all......

Or the Destro Ultimate lol....lets just promote more stacked zerg AOE fest game play....because the server doesn't lag enough as it is....

We went from softcaps, resource management and skilled gameplay in 1.x to Champion Points, unlimited resources, insta-kills, battle spirit, and proc sets...i mean what else is really left?

I loved the 1.x iterations of this game...I would gladly pay 70 bucks + 20 bucks a month in sub fees for a subscription only 1.5 server with tweaks to DK's and reg bug fixes with all of One Tam ported to 1.5 with no proc sets.....take my money....and i know im not alone on this one either...

99% sure they skip this stage. Or it's held as a 1 on 1 discussion between a dev and Yeah Yeah from Sandlot.

God_flakes · December 2016

4. As a casual gamer I couldn't care less what some entitled millennial college game designer thinks about this game or who and what elitist gamer considers what is an MMO or not. I game and have since 1995. I love to game. I only play games that entertain me and hold my interest. This game IS fun and continues to hold my interest since beta. It's even fun when when I die, get xv1'd or am the one doing the killing.

5. Can't wait for magblade buff.

6. Love my Friday night pvp parties! It's a wonderful way to wind down from a hectic work week. It's a solid evening of not worrying about RL.

AhPook_Is_Here · December 2016

Knootewoot wrote: »

Kutsuu wrote: »

Honestly the early months of the game reminded me a lot of Age of Conan. There were lots of gamebreaking bugs - the kind of bugs that wouldn't let you progress to veteran levels. There were giant PVP imbalances, gamebreaking pvp imbalances like zero cost bat swarm. AoC also had very similar issues - gem stacking, duping of said gems, and game breaking bugs.

Both games took a HUGE hit in playerbase in those early months. Thankfully Elder Scrolls has such a huge following that this game survived.

Age of Conan also survived. It is still active.

I loved that game, duping a full set of max damage red gems and loading it all up into a suit of heavy, then charging around Tarantia 1 shoting any player you could tab target on your warrior. Camping the Onyx Chamber in Kheshatta with 4 of 5 steps of COS 10 wound up on my barb and 1 shotting anyone zoning in or out. Glitching into walls to fight bosses in dungeons because nobody wanted to do the content when you could just bug it out and get mad loot fast to put your duped gems in. Such fond memories!

I think Anarchy Online is still around too. That game was better imo, and so was the secret world except the pvp was bad.

Rohamad_Ali · December 2016

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Knootewoot wrote: »

Kutsuu wrote: »

Honestly the early months of the game reminded me a lot of Age of Conan. There were lots of gamebreaking bugs - the kind of bugs that wouldn't let you progress to veteran levels. There were giant PVP imbalances, gamebreaking pvp imbalances like zero cost bat swarm. AoC also had very similar issues - gem stacking, duping of said gems, and game breaking bugs.

Both games took a HUGE hit in playerbase in those early months. Thankfully Elder Scrolls has such a huge following that this game survived.

Age of Conan also survived. It is still active.

I loved that game, duping a full set of max damage red gems and loading it all up into a suit of heavy, then charging around Tarantia 1 shoting any player you could tab target on your warrior. Camping the Onyx Chamber in Kheshatta with 4 of 5 steps of COS 10 wound up on my barb and 1 shotting anyone zoning in or out. Glitching into walls to fight bosses in dungeons because nobody wanted to do the content when you could just bug it out and get mad loot fast to put your duped gems in. Such fond memories!

I think Anarchy Online is still around too. That game was better imo, and so was the secret world except the pvp was bad.

Secret World PvP was abysmal but the questing was some of the best I ever experienced . Very intelligently written .

PvP here is not the worst but not the best . All games have issues . I am honest when I say I stay because Elder Scrolls world is my favorite place and has been for years . When PvP gets bad or laggy I can escape in PVE here until fixes but I am more patient then some . Core PvP players have no escape and this is bad for them when performance dips and balance becomes problematic .

sirston · December 2016

Good reason.....

Andohir · December 2016

I have another theory: ESO was released two years too early. Back in april 2014 people who played other mmos at that time their systems were sufficient for, would have had to buy an entire new system only to be able to play ESO. I know lots of people who stayed with Win XP instead and were fine with it playing WoW, Rift or even Guild Wars 2 without any issues. Despite Microsoft ended xp support in april 2014 too, few days after ESO was released, a lot of people waited for Win 10 to buy a new pc to secure max support duration. So it was a strategic management failure, I assume.

MMO players in general know that mmo-gameplay differs from single-player's. So I guess it wasn't really the intention to make all the TES players now play ESO instead. The ones who thought they'd get a TESo but got ESO maybe were disappointed, but the majority knows what to expect and what not to.

Why ESO is not so popular nowadays has other reasons, that were already mentioned above in other answers. E.g. I know of several guild members who were pretty frustrated and quit, because they felt taken on a ride by ZoS (and this is only one bug or bad design): they farmed specific set weapons over several weeks only to find out that one loses the 5th bonus when swapping bars, even when there are set weapons on both bars (there are bonuses where the loss has more impact than others, like additional health which has to be refilled/healed every time one swaps bars).

Preyfar · December 2016

ZOS needs to implement a "Refer a Friend" program that rewards you with Crowns and Crown Gems. I'll gladly promote the hell out of the game in exchange for some virtual toys. =D

Sallington · December 2016

SneaK wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

At the end of the day i only log to pvp now and then, but even those are becoming less frequent...the game is broken all around

You have people one shotting folks from stealth, proc set or not, guys like zergbad were insta killing people long before proc sets..that stuff is just broken.....

Then you have Viper...how does something like that even exist...its like having a skill packed into your armor set a 100% chance on a 4 second cooldown...Viper is broken

Then you got Tremorscale....damage and a 70% Snare for 8 seconds, on a 4 second cooldown...are kidding me?

How does this stuff even get past the discussion stage? How does it even get put into the game. Does anyone care at all?

Lets just put an armor set in(Viper) that hits for 7-9k unavoidable damage every 4 seconds on the reg...because that's totally OK and not completely broken at all......

Or the Destro Ultimate lol....lets just promote more stacked zerg AOE fest game play....because the server doesn't lag enough as it is....

We went from softcaps, resource management and skilled gameplay in 1.x to Champion Points, unlimited resources, insta-kills, battle spirit, and proc sets...i mean what else is really left?

I loved the 1.x iterations of this game...I would gladly pay 70 bucks + 20 bucks a month in sub fees for a subscription only 1.5 server with tweaks to DK's and reg bug fixes with all of One Tam ported to 1.5 with no proc sets.....take my money....and i know im not alone on this one either...

99% sure they skip this stage. Or it's held as a 1 on 1 discussion between a dev and Yeah Yeah from Sandlot.

LOLOLOL

But seriously, I would love to sit in on any meeting where they discuss gameplay, itemization, PvP in general. Just to see what they think, behind closed doors.

danno8 · December 2016

Pirhana7_ESO wrote: »

Cyrodiil is a time filler for most at this point. Most the seige warfare crowd is waiting for Camelot Unchained next year.

Balance has always been an issue. Classes that can use any weapon or armor will always have that issue, especially with no cool down timers. Also the engine was more made for PVE and has problems with large seige battles. CU will have 30 defined classes and a crafter class. Aswell as an engine created to support massive seige battle and PVP only progression

I am getting bad feelings about CU. I mean since last year they have only pulled in an extra $400,000 in pledges. They have 27 people (at least) working on their game, and even with a very modest $50,000 a year salary they would need 1.3 million per year just for that, never mind all the huge operating costs. And everyone who pledged already has a copy of the game as part of the pledge, so they can't count on box sales at launch.

Beta was suppose to be last March, but I don't think it will even be this March 2017 from what I have played.

Hope I'm wrong, but it just feels like it is taking too long and costing too much.

LeifErickson · December 2016

Interesting points brought up in this game. I guess me personally, this game reminds me of BF4. I was a huge fan of that game and played it for a long time. However, the game was riddled with problems and crashed and bugs (but not as much balance), yet I still played it and loved it. I felt it was the best FPS multiplayer experience there was. I feel the same about this game - riddled with problems but the best third person action game multiplayer experience.

Ishammael · December 2016

danno8 wrote: »

Pirhana7_ESO wrote: »

Cyrodiil is a time filler for most at this point. Most the seige warfare crowd is waiting for Camelot Unchained next year.

Balance has always been an issue. Classes that can use any weapon or armor will always have that issue, especially with no cool down timers. Also the engine was more made for PVE and has problems with large seige battles. CU will have 30 defined classes and a crafter class. Aswell as an engine created to support massive seige battle and PVP only progression

I am getting bad feelings about CU. I mean since last year they have only pulled in an extra $400,000 in pledges. They have 27 people (at least) working on their game, and even with a very modest $50,000 a year salary they would need 1.3 million per year just for that, never mind all the huge operating costs. And everyone who pledged already has a copy of the game as part of the pledge, so they can't count on box sales at launch.

Beta was suppose to be last March, but I don't think it will even be this March 2017 from what I have played.

Hope I'm wrong, but it just feels like it is taking too long and costing too much.

Yeah, CU is clearly in trouble.
Especially if you semi-weekly pay attention to their youtube channel. The amount of work they still need to do to get to a workable beta is frightening.... A year after they originally suggested.

marvel_bound · December 2016

You will begin to see it takes time until your eyes are opened and you begin to get tired of the bs

LeifErickson · December 2016

marvel_bound wrote: »

You will begin to see it takes time until your eyes are opened and you begin to get tired of the bs

I play enough to know what the bs is and do get tired of it. That's when I take a break and come back later.